Thread: Airline News

CNN's "layman's" description of the AF crash (brief advert lead in):

CNN.com International - Breaking, World, Business, Sports, Entertainment and Video News

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

PARIS (Reuters) - A French airliner plunged out of control for four minutes before crashing into the Atlantic in 2009, investigators said, in a report raising questions about how crew handled a "stall alarm" blaring out in the cabin. Information gleaned from black boxes, and recovered almost two years after the disaster killed 228 people, confirmed that speed readings in the Airbus cockpit had gone haywire, believed to be linked to the icing of speed sensors outside the jet.

Nothing that wasn't speculated on before in minute detail on PPRuNe - frozen pitot tubes, over reliance on computers.
Four minutes is a long long time to free fall in a spinning doomed plane. Gawd how I mistrust Airbus even with the tubes replaced

Originally Posted by KAPPA

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

PARIS (Reuters) - A French airliner plunged out of control for four minutes before crashing into the Atlantic in 2009, investigators said, in a report raising questions about how crew handled a "stall alarm" blaring out in the cabin. Information gleaned from black boxes, and recovered almost two years after the disaster killed 228 people, confirmed that speed readings in the Airbus cockpit had gone haywire, believed to be linked to the icing of speed sensors outside the jet.

Nothing that wasn't speculated on before in minute detail on PPRuNe - frozen pitot tubes, over reliance on computers.
Four minutes is a long long time to free fall in a spinning doomed plane. Gawd how I mistrust Airbus even with the tubes replaced

Who said it was spinning?

I don't see that anywhere.

Wow, a set of guidelines. Not even the US has federal guidelines for delayed flights, they leave it up to the airlines to determine that.

compensation is required by law only when you are "bumped" from a flight that is oversold

Originally Posted by drawp

Wow, a set of guidelines. Not even the US has federal guidelines for delayed flights, they leave it up to the airlines to determine that.

That's because the airlines lobby Washington.

In Europe, compensation rules are quite clear cut.

Slumped at the controls, a trainee pilot lay unconscious for 55 minutes while his light plane flew itself for 250km towards the Australian city of Adelaide, an investigation has revealed.

A report released during the week by the country's Transport Safety Bureau has revealed that the young pilot - who has been suspended from flying - woke to find he had overshot Parafield airport and was heading out to sea.

The Middle Eastern man, who studied with Flight Training Adelaide for a year on an Emirates Airlines scholarship, has returned home after the incident ended his career.
The pilot lapsed into unconsciousness in his single engined Tornado, below, after taking off from Mildura and was heading out to sea before he woke up and landed the plane

The pilot lapsed into unconsciousness in his single engined Tornado, below, after taking off from Mildura and was heading out to sea before he woke up and landed the plane.

The transport watchdog's report said the man, who was in his early 20s, left Parafield for a solo training flight to Mildura and back on December 27, arriving in the town in the state of Victoria for lunch, according to Australian website News.com.

He refuelled, ate and rehydrated, before boarding the plane to head home.

It was while flying over Renmark that the pilot reported feeling hot and sweaty.

'He stated that the sun was directly in his eyes and he found it difficult to look out of the windscreen due to the sun glare,' the report said.

The man, who was not named in the report, decided to climb to an altitude of 6,500ft (1,980m) in an effort to cool the cabin but blacked out soon after.

'(He) regained consciousness about 55 minutes later over the water and uncertain of his position,' the report detailed.

In fact, the plane had missed Parafield entirely and was on its way out to the open waters of the Great Australian

'The plane would have kept going until it ran out of fuel if he hadn't regained consciousness,' bureau spokesman Dan O'Malley said.

Originally Posted by khang

Originally Posted by KAPPA

Gawd how I mistrust Airbus even with the tubes replaced

I do too. I distrust Airbus in general. Not to the point that I will not ride an Airbus, but to the point that, if given a viable choice, I will choose flights using Boeing aircraft. Especially the 777. To date, IMO, the best long-haul product on the market. And I have no plans to ride that shrapnel-geyser of a plane, that A380, anytime soon. And sorry to say, the shame is on RR. Sad, that. SHAME, that. I admire the technology that went into that plane, but the product is still shaky.

Airbus have had too many inflight failures. When that tail fell off (yeah, yeah, vertical stabilized detached) departing KJFK back on 2001, and the industry tried to pawn it off on pilot error, I said, BULLSHIT. What kinda glue are you fools using on those planes?

Not to mention the crash at the Paris airshow .... back in the late 80's when that A320 mowed down 200 hectares of trees and exploded. And then the fvckin' French government covered it up. Little wonder, that. The government has a vested interest in the company.

I'm no fan of the US government, or US products, but for planes, let me have the Boeing.

That's fucking comical, given the number of design faults and other crap that have brought Boeings down over the years.

Like the Lauda Air 767 that deployed a thrust reverser mid flight.

Or numerous 747s that have been brought down by wiring problems.

Or even the B737 crashes due to a known PCU fault fucking up the rudder.

Don't make me laugh. A fairly catastrophic engine failure on an A380, which survived the incident, would have brought down any Boeing.

They've got away with blue murder over the years due to the amount they spend "lobbying".

Added: Oh, and the Bergenair 301 crash was down to pitot tubes, so if you're frightened of them, don't fly on the Boeing 757 either.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Don't make me laugh. A fairly catastrophic engine failure on an A380, which survived the incident, would have brought down any Boeing.

You an aeronautical engineer, are you? Somehow, I think not. Don't let your mouth promise what your ass cannot cash, oh wee one.

Originally Posted by khang

You an aeronautical engineer, are you? Somehow, I think not.

Are you?

Originally Posted by khang

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Don't make me laugh. A fairly catastrophic engine failure on an A380, which survived the incident, would have brought down any Boeing.

You an aeronautical engineer, are you? Somehow, I think not. Don't let your mouth promise what your ass cannot cash, oh wee one.

And clearly, from the conversation coming out of yours, it's had to pay out a fair bit then.

Originally Posted by khang

Don't let your mouth promise what your ass cannot cash, oh wee one.

I'd bet that the only control stick you have ever held was your boyfriends

I always think of the fully loaded China Airlines 747 that survived several aerobatic maneuvers due to the incompetence of the pilot.
Boeing has more accidents- perhaps because it's been around longer?
I don't trust ALL computer in high turbulence situations,
which is why I prefer Boeing.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Bergenair 301 crash was down to pitot tubes,

Are you a fan of Aircrash Investigation, too? I love that show but man it makes me a nervous flyer now.
Bergenair was because of a wasp mud nest, right? That was ground crew fault for not checking them , or covering them up as plane sat for some time awaiting a charter.

That airshow was due to a bad chart, pilot error. ( according to AirCrash Investigation )

Originally Posted by KAPPA

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Bergenair 301 crash was down to pitot tubes,

Are you a fan of Aircrash Investigation, too? I love that show but man it makes me a nervous flyer now.
Bergenair was because of a wasp mud nest, right? That was ground crew fault for not checking them , or covering them up as plane sat for some time awaiting a charter.

That airshow was due to a bad chart, pilot error. ( according to AirCrash Investigation )

There was an AeroPeru flight where the maintenance guy taped over the pitot to wash the plane and forgot to remove the tape when he finished. That brought the aircraft down. The crew were getting tons of misleading and contradictory information from the computer, and ended up flying it into the sea. That was a Boeing as well.

Great little smuggling story here from PPrune. What a clever bastard. But obviously didn't do a very good job of replacing the panels.

MUMBAI: Parminder Singh, arrested by the directorate of revenue intelligence (DRI) for smuggling branded Swiss watches and white gold in an Air India aircraft toilet last month, faces more charges. Now, DRI wants Air India to take action against him for damaging the aircraft's roof panel.
Singh was caught by the DRI on April 15, when he arrived by a domestic flight from Delhi. Officers recovered 21 packets of chemicals used for cancer treatment, 60 white gold finger rings and 20 diamond-studded Franck Muller watches from him.
The DRI officials also found him carrying spoons and knives. Sources said he would return from abroad by hiding contraband in the aircraft toilet. "He would pretend to go to the toilet, break open electrical sockets or roof panels of the aircraft, using forks and knives, hide the contraband there, and walk through the green channel without fear. He would then wait for that aircraft to come into operation in the domestic sector. Once he knew the flight's detailed schedule, he would book a domestic flight to any destination. On the flight, he would open the panel of the aircraft toilet where he had hidden the contraband and then walk out with it," an officer said.

Bangkok Post : Boeing woos THAI with aggressive pricing

Boeing woos THAI with aggressive pricing

Firm battles Airbus for huge jet orders

• Published: 6/06/2011 at 12:00 AM
• Newspaper section: Business

Boeing says it has adopted a very aggressive pricing approach in the contest with rival Airbus to deliver 75 jets to Thai Airways International.


Boeing believes its B787 (top) offers superior value for money because of its fuel efficiency, while the 747 is still the best long-haul option.

While the US planemaker is gearing up to secure 100% of the orders in one of the largest fleet renewal plans in the world, it reckons this would be too ambitious.

"We would love to win 100% of the THAI business, but realistically that is probably not the way it is going to transpire," John Wojick, vice-president for Asia-Pacific sales of commercial airplanes, told the Bangkok Post.

"We would be very disappointed if we got less than 50% of the business. Airbus is a tough competitor though."

Competition brings out the best from both Boeing and Airbus, Mr Wojick noted.

Boeing believes its aircraft, including the state-of-art B787 "Dreamliner", offer value, especially fuel efficiency to serve THAI's long-term strategic business plan.

If all 75 aircraft were bought new from Boeing, the value could be in the region of US$9 billion (270 billion baht).

The Boeing team, led by Mr Wojick, was in Bangkok last week to advance the negotiations with the Thai flag carrier for the aircraft procurement deals that are expected to close in the next two months or so.

THAI is moving speedily to finalise deals with plane manufacturers and lessors as part of its fleet renewal that spans the next 12 years after securing cabinet approval last April.

The acquisition will come in two batches: 37 in the first phase between 2011 and 2017 with a budget of 210.6 billion baht, plus spare engines worth 5.47 billion baht, for a total of 216 billion baht, and another 38 from 2018-22 with a budget of 229 billion baht, plus spare engines worth 11.98 billion baht, for a total budget of 241.05 billion.

The first lot will be leased because new aircraft are not available directly from planemakers and THAI needs them sooner.

For instance, THAI needs to deploy 11 new narrow-body jets, either Boeing B737-800s or Airbus A320,s and part of the first batch in 2012 and 2013.

Because of the longer lead time, aircraft in the second batch will be purchased.

THAI has informed suppliers that it would decide on the first phase in the next few weeks and the second batch in 2-3 months.

Boeing is offering four types of aircraft: the single-aisle 737-800 for short-haul flights, the wide-bodied 777-300ER, the 787 and B747-8 jumbo for regional and long-haul flights.

Mr Wojick said Boeing was working with leasing firms such as International lease Finance Corp (ILFC) and GE Capital Aviation Services Ltd (Gecas) to make aircraft available to THAI.

At the same time, it is working with the US Export-Import Bank and many banks in this region to provide financial support for the purchases.

Asked whether he sees political impact arising following July 3 election on THAI's procurement plan, the American executive said there might be some. "But the good news is that THAI has approval to do this transaction and that is hopefully outside the political situation. It is more a business decision than political one."

Thai-ASEAN News Network

Thai Airways Pushes for Less Govt Shareholding

UPDATE : 9 June 2011

The Finance Ministry said Thai Airways has demanded scaling down its state ownership for a more efficient operation and to increase the company's competitiveness.

Finance Ministry Permanent Secretary Areepong Bhoochaoom presided over a State Enterprise Committee meeting to announce the ministry's guideline for supervising state enterprises and new innovations to improve efficiency and transparency.

Participants at the meeting included representatives of state enterprises in the energy, communication, transportation and public services sectors.


Areepong said it is essential for all state enterprises to seek alternative energy sources as the Thai nuclear power plant construction plan has been delayed after the recent nuclear accident in Japan.

He said Thai Airways International has demanded a cut in the government's holding of its shares to increase the company's flexibility in doing business overseas.

He said it is up to the next government to decide whether the Finance Ministry will reduce its stake in the national carrier or not.

State Enterprise Policy Office Director Somchai Sudjapong said agencies overseeing state enterprises are required to report to the office every three months problems in their operation while work progress has to be reported every six months for more efficient management.

Originally Posted by KAPPA

I don't trust ALL computer in high turbulence situations, which is why I prefer Boeing.

You need to see the AIMS cabinet on a B777 then.............

Originally Posted by Thai Pom

Originally Posted by KAPPA

I don't trust ALL computer in high turbulence situations, which is why I prefer Boeing.

You need to see the AIMS cabinet on a B777 then.............

Don't ever get on the Dreamliner then.

I don't trust a plane for which Boeing has outsourced so many components, it's almost like slapping a Boeing logo on someone else's aircraft.

And yes, it's *very* computerised and, like the B777, fly by wire.

I wonder if it can really beat the A380 for economy of scale.

New Zealand plane in 'bird strike' drama

Air New Zealand said there was no visible damage to the engine
Continue reading the main story Related Stories

• Qantas flight in engine shutdown

A passenger plane has been forced into an emergency landing at Auckland airport in New Zealand, after flames spewed from one of its engines.
Passengers on the Air New Zealand Boeing 767 said they heard loud bangs and saw flames shortly after take off.
The airline said the incident might have been caused by an engine bird-strike.
The plane was heading to Perth in Australia with more than 200 passengers on board.
"We were right near the wing so we saw the flames. I thought … what's going on?'' one passenger, Maria McCarthy, told the New Zealand news website Stuff.
The website quoted an Air New Zealand statement as saying the captain of the flight had shut down the left-hand engine and briefed the passengers on board.
He explained that "any flames seen from the engine is not unusual when it is shut down in flight".
The airline said there appeared to be no visible damage to the engine, and engineers were now examining the plane.

http://www.travelmole.com/stories/1148023.php


10 June, 2011

Thailand’s airports to receive a facelift

Bangkok’s Don Mueang airport will include a free trade zone as the Airport Authority of Thailand moves ahead with the expansion of its airports in the country.

AOT operates six international airports in Thailand, including Bangkok’s Suvarnabhumi airport, whose capacity is being increased to 60 million passengers per year to cope with demand.

Don Mueang will become an aviation services centre focusing on general aviation, official state and government aircraft, charter flights and point-to-point domestic commercial flights.

Phuket international airport is also receiving a facelift with new terminal facilities lifting capacity from today’s 6.5 million passengers to 12.5 million.

AOT has also approved a new two-year incentive scheme to attract more airlines and passengers to Suvarnabhumi airport by discounting landing fees for aircraft and offering extra bonuses for airlines who exceed their passenger target numbers.

AOT is taking a number of steps to improve the green credentials of the airport. These include a requirement for airside vehicles to use biofuel or electric cars, and use of a solar farm to generate 20 percent of the electricity used by Suvarnabhumi.

Mass brawl at 30,000 feet sees 76-year-old passenger arrested over 30-minute fight on Virgin flight to Barbados
By DAILY MAIL REPORTER
Last updated at 3:49 PM on 11th June 2011

A man aged 76 and two members of his family were arrested after a ‘vicious’ punch-up on a plane that took cabin crew 30 minutes to break up.
Derek Edmond, his daughter Zoe King and her husband Martin were on a Virgin Atlantic flight from Gatwick to Barbados when a Danish family sitting nearby accused them of being too noisy.
Police said Mrs King, 46, was celebrating her birthday and she and her family had been drinking for much of the eight-hour flight.
After the Danes complained, other passengers watched in horror as Mr King, 49, and his wife allegedly swapped punches with a family sitting in front of them as flight crew tried to pull them apart.
The pilot radioed ahead for the flight to be met by police and the Kings and Mr Edmond were arrested when it landed at Grantley Adams Airport.
Passenger Elsa Brandford, 70, said: ‘It was unbelievable, it was like something out of a movie. I saw a woman shout, “You swore in front of my child”. She said it about six times, each time louder than the last one. She said, “And it’s my birthday”.
‘I heard more and more voices getting involved. There was about five minutes of shouting while people gathered around and before I knew it they were throwing punches and jumping on each other.
‘Most of the people were standing on their seats while throwing punches.
‘It was vicious. It was frightening. There were punches going off in all directions.
‘But as it went on people came round to try to split them up and about half an hour later they had it under control.’ More than a dozen officers met the plane carrying 280 passengers on Thursday afternoon and ten people, including crew, were taken for questioning.
Mrs King left the plane with her arm in a sling, while her husband had a black eye.
Inspector David Welch, of Barbados police, said: ‘There appeared to be a birthday celebration that got too noisy. A Danish national on the flight complained and the fracas started from there.’
The Kings and Mr Edmond appeared in court yesterday charged with disruptive behaviour on an aircraft. They face two years in prison or a fine if convicted.