New Zealand Cops Kill ISIS Supporter Who Stabbed Six in Grocery Store

**DC101** · 04-09-2021, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by taxexile

.... and its liberal shite like that .... a known islamic extremist, followed around for years by a police force hamstrung by the type of lefty protocol that is regularly spouted out by educationalists, social media whores and the parliamentarians of western democracies as they seek to pander to the whims of the wok .... that make western society a laughing stock in the eyes of the eastern and middle eastern dictatorships that are slowly but surely on the way to becoming the worlds power brokers, both militarily and economically as our influence disappears down the toilet.

the man should have been incarcerated in 2016.

you know how it is

**happynz** · 04-09-2021, 11:20 AM

In this case he doesn't.

**panama hat** · 04-09-2021, 12:27 PM

Well, there is actually a bill before parliament . . . but it hasn't been passed yet. This begs the question as to why it takes the government literally three days to pass bill that will guarantee them more seats . . . but this is taking the usual time - months or years.

A very interesting article which makes the judiciary look foolish and the cops quite good. Let's also not forget that judges work within the parameters of sentencing guidelines handed them.

New Zealand counter-terrorism legislation outdated - law experts

The LynnMall terrorist attack started a nationwide conversation about New Zealand's counter-terrorism laws.
There is legislation currently before Parliament that would make planning a terrorist attack an offence.
The Counter-Terrorism Legislation Bill was introduced earlier this year as part of the ongoing response to the Christchurch mosque attacks, including a new definition for what constitutes a 'terrorist act'.

A man, on a terror watchlist, injured six shoppers with a knife at Countdown in LynnMall. He was shot dead by police soon after. There are six people in hospital, three in critical condition.
The man's name suppression has been revoked, but his name cannot be published yet, as the High Court is giving his family at least 24 hours to seek further suppression orders.
Today, on RNZ's special coverage of the attack we heard from law experts, a politician, the Muslim community and witnesses from the scene of the attack.
Otago University law professor Andrew Geddis told Kim Hill on the show that if the proposed bill were to pass, it would be "quite an expansion of New Zealand criminal law".
"It would be saying you are guilty for thinking about doing something not actually going out and starting to do it, but even just thinking about doing it will be an offence for which you could go to jail for up to seven years."

The law

Geddis said proposed legislation would not have necessarily made a difference in this case.
Otago University law professor Andrew Geddis. Photo: RNZ / Claire Eastham-Farrelly

"The key point though is with regards to this argument that, 'oh if we only had this 'preparing for a terrorist offence' offence on the books, we could have stopped him' - that's not the case."
He said the man was also already convicted on more serious charges that carried a longer sentence of 10 years, than the proposed law which carries a sentence of seven years.

Geddis said the man was put under a sentence of supervision and a whole series of conditions to try to break him from the path he was going down, but police decided independently to surveil him.
"It's not quite the case that the law was unable to deal with this guy, he was caught, he was charged, he was convicted of actually a more serious offence.
"It's just that at sentencing [in July 2021] the judge decided that it was important to try to rehabilitate him and gave a sentence of supervision - that's the reason he was out in the community.
"The police then independently assessed him as being such a high risk that they put him under this very heavy surveillance. As it turned out, he was."

John Battersby, a specialist on terrorism and counter-terrorism at Massey University, said New Zealand's terror laws were outdated.
He said no law was guaranteed to stop attacks like yesterday's, but laws should make it as difficult as possible to carry out such attacks.
Battersby said New Zealand was averse to making laws about terrorism going back to the Rainbow Warrior attack.
"We're definitely a reluctant legislator when it comes to terrorism."
He pointed out the laws had not been changed more than two years on from the Christchurch attacks.

National Party ready to move terrorism bill with urgency

Judith Collins said she texted the prime minister to say National would support getting the terrorism bill that was "stuck in select committee" through the House.
"You find out there's a gap once you have a situation like this. This man, he won't be the only person that authorities are keeping a very close eye on.
"Thank goodness the special tactics group were following him because there could have been even more people injured or killed in this situation."
Collins also wants a law change to strip people of their New Zealand citizenship or residency if they commit a violent crime in the country.

New Zealand counter-terrorism legislation outdated - law experts | RNZ News

**panama hat** · 04-09-2021, 01:21 PM

Latest News is that he came to NZ in 2011 on a student visa.

Up to 30 cops were engaged in tracking him on a daily basis.

Undercover police didn't want to be too close to him so as not to antagonise him.

He was Muslim.

This is so screwed up in so many ways, seriously.

**havnfun** · 04-09-2021, 01:31 PM

"It's just that at sentencing [in July 2021] the judge decided that it was important to try to rehabilitate him and gave a sentence of supervision - that's the reason he was out in the community.

Maybe if parliament passed a law put Judges in threat of being responsible for who they let out this type of thing won't happen. How many times do they let a crim out on supervision and the crim kills his ex?

**panama hat** · 05-09-2021, 03:30 AM

Name suppression has been lifted:

Auckland terror attack: Ahamed Samsudeen, the man behind Isis-inspired stabbings
Catrin Owen

23:20, Sep 04 2021

Ahamed Aathill Mohamed Samsudeen came to New Zealand in 2011 seeking a new life free from attack and torture. Ten years later, he stabbed five people and injured two others in an Isis-inspired terror attack. He was shot dead by police bringing an end to months of constant surveillance and years of growing concern over his extremist views. Catrin Owen reports.
Samsudeen, 32, arrived in New Zealand in 2011 from Sri Lanka on a student visa.
A Tamil Muslim, he came seeking refugee status claiming he and his father had experienced serious problems with Sri Lankan authorities due to their political background.

He was accepted, and his refugee status was granted on December 20, 2013, after a tribunal found he had a well-founded fear of facing harm if he returned to Sri Lanka. It also accepted he had been attacked, abducted, physically mistreated and humiliated in the past.
But on May 31, 2018, the Refugee Status Branch served Samsudeen notice of its intention to cancel his refugee status – meaning he would be deported back to Sri Lanka – after a string of incidents in which he posted extreme videos and pictures online.
Police first started investigating him in March 2016 when he shared videos and pictures of graphic war-related violence, and comments advocating violent extremism. He also posted comments in support of terrorists involved in other attacks.

He was formally warned by police in April and May 2016, and he apologised and closed down his social media account.
That account was reactivated in the July, and in October 2016, police were again alerted to his postings of extreme and violent material towards Muslims.
In 2017, he was arrested at Auckland Airport, where he was in possession of a one-way ticket for Singapore, after he told a person at an Auckland mosque he wanted to go to Syria “to fight for Isis”.
When police searched his home they found a large hunting knife under a mattress and further “fundamentalist material”. There was also a photograph of the man posing with a firearm and links saved on his computer to where firearms, crossbows and other military equipment that could be bought online.

When his refugee status looked set to be revoked in 2018, Samsudeen protested that decision, saying: “I’m very afraid of returning to Sri Lanka because I’m afraid of the authorities there, and the same risks and fears [that] I had when I left my country are still there in Sri Lanka. Also, young Tamil men face serious problems in Sri Lanka.
“We face arrest, detention, mistreatment and torture as we’re always under suspicions by the authorities because of the [Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam].”
At the same time, Samsudeen was before the courts charged with possessing Isis propaganda - charges he denied - but was later convicted of.
At the beginning of those court proceedings in 2018, Justice Edwin Wylie made a ruling under the Immigration Act 2009, prohibiting the publication of Samsudeen’s identity and status as a refugee due to his concerns about his safety if he was deported.
Later that year, he admitted charges of distributing material but an offensive weapon charge was dropped.

In September 2018, Justice Wylie sentenced Samsudeen to supervision on two representative charges of knowingly distributing restricted material. He was remanded in custody due to new offending while out on bail.
A month prior, he had been arrested for possession of a knife and possessing objectionable material - again Isis propaganda.
His Google searches and computer bookmarks from July and August 2018 included: Islamic State dress, New Zealand prison clothes and food, improvised explosive devices, heroes of Isis and an Isis-issued booklet on how to avoid being detected by Western security.
He also searched for a hunting knife and sought out the shop where he eventually bought it.

The shop assistant who sold him the knife told his High Court trial he entered the shop, which was usually by appointment only, and picked out a hunting blade.
He asked if it was sharp and if it rusted before examining it and asking for the $39 knife to be couriered to his home. The knife was never sent as he was arrested a short time later.
Samsdueen claimed he had always owned a knife for protection, and a similar hunting knife was seized in May 2017 after his first arrest.
During his offending on bail, a number of nasheeds (chants) and videos were accessed, all containing Islamic State material.
He also searched for articles referencing Imran Patel – the first person in New Zealand to be jailed for posessing Isis material.

At his latest trial in 2021, Samsudeen claimed his internet searches and videos were not evidence he supported Isis.
Some videos included a soldier killing a civilian, a soldier killing a 13-year-old child, and people being bound and burnt.
He again claimed the material was not objectionable and also told the prosecutor he could not remember if he had watched the videos, despite them being bookmarked on his computer.
“I told you … I have seen worse than that,” he said while referencing a video of people being decapitated.

Google searches of “Captive by the enemies of Allah” were only searched to check his spelling, he claimed.
“You put me in jail because I am a Muslim and you don’t like my religion. That makes you an enemy. Allah says you will be punished,” he said.
A jury found him guilty of possessing two nasheeds - which showed a single still image of a figure carrying a machine gun and the Isis flag with the lyrics referencing violent acts, including decapitation and terrorism.

The second explicitly encouraged terrorist attacks on other belief systems.
He was acquitted of possessing another objectionable publication - a seven-minute video showing people being killed - and found not guilty of possessing a knife without lawful authority.
The Crown originally sought to charge him under the Terrorism Suppression Act, but that application was declined on the grounds the law did not cover the planning of terrorist acts.
Justice Sally Fitzgerald sentenced him to 12 months’ supervision after finding he had an “operative interest” in a terrorist organisation, and a report writer concluded he “had the means and motivation to commit violence in the community”.

The High Court judge also set a number of special conditions which included him living at a West Auckland mosque, and restrictions on him owning and using devices with internet access.
He was directed to live at a West Auckland mosque, where the president “confirmed its willingness to help and support you on your release”.
Among his conditions was an order of a psychological assessment but, despite being in the community for almost two months, Stuff understands he was yet to be assessed.
He was also still on bail facing charges over the alleged assault of Corrections officers in June 2020, while on remand awaiting trial at Mt Eden Corrections Facility.
It is understood he got into an argument with Corrections officers, which resulted in one of them suffering a broken jaw.

He was granted bail awaiting trial for that offence, after authorities exhausted every legal power available to them under current law.
At his bail hearing, Judge Peter Winter removed a condition giving police the ability to directly monitor Samsudeen’s online activity.
His lawyer, Kieran Raftery QC, argued Samsudeen had an anti-authoritarian stance towards police as he believed they were partly responsible for his lengthy remand in custody.
Raftery QC said Samsudeen believed if police had the ability to directly monitor his activities rather than a probation officer, it would be “setting him up to fail”.
A “culturally appropriate” probation officer was assigned to Samsudeen to try to ensure he was not aggravated by official intervention, “... with a view to giving the remaining aspects of his sentence of supervision an opportunity to succeed, and therefore to rehabilitate the defendant”.

Despite his history of offending and repeated links to extremist Isis ideologies, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said the only option open to police after he was granted bail was constant monitoring by specialist police teams.
She said the Government had sought to hurry changes to the terrorism laws in the months after the man was released into the community, and the justice minister made a phone call to make that happen the day the attack happened.
A bill to strengthen to the law has been in the select committee process in recent months, and a MPs had been hearing public submissions on how it should be written.
She said she now hoped to expedite that process and have law changes in place by the end of the month.
“The public have had their say, and now Parliament must act,” she said.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/cri...ired-stabbings

Originally Posted by panama hat

A “culturally appropriate” probation officer was assigned to Samsudeen to try to ensure he was not aggravated by official intervention, “... with a view to giving the remaining aspects of his sentence of supervision an opportunity to succeed, and therefore to rehabilitate the defendant”.

Well-intentioned and typical NZ-style bending over backwards to assist to squeeze every ounce of possible positive potential out to help . . . and it ends like this.

Makes you angry at the person, not necessarily the system.

**baldrick** · 05-09-2021, 06:24 AM

Originally Posted by taxexile

dictatorships

seems to be what you are wishing for - woe betide you if you live long enough for when they start to come for the old online ranters

**Saint Willy** · 05-09-2021, 06:40 AM

Originally Posted by Cujo

If he was enough of a threat they needed to have 2 armed offenders squad officers following him at all times (at what cost?) surely he was enough of a threat to be detained or deported

So no need to follow laws then?

**sabang** · 05-09-2021, 06:46 AM

Laws are designed to serve and protect the People. What about when they fail to do so?

**Norton** · 05-09-2021, 07:02 AM

Originally Posted by panama hat

He said no law was guaranteed to stop attacks like yesterday's, but laws should make it as difficult as possible to carry out such attacks.

And he is, of course, correct. Any law in a free society must carefully consider the right of privacy and freedom of expression against the safety of it's citizens.

Cross the line and you have an Orwellian situation.

**Saint Willy** · 05-09-2021, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by sabang

Laws are designed to serve and protect the People. What about when they fail to do so?

Change the law or is that not something you really care about anymore?

**sabang** · 05-09-2021, 07:40 AM

Oh, but I do. I am a great believer in the rule of law- but I guess the flipside is that I am hypercritical when I see them abused, or used as a tool to protect the privileged &/or criminal, or they act to stultify anything resembling effective action to serve and protect the People.

It's a rather large topic actually- Jurisprudence.

**tomcat** · 05-09-2021, 07:48 AM

Originally Posted by sabang

I am hypercritical

...is this a recent development?...

...

**tomcat** · 05-09-2021, 07:49 AM

Originally Posted by panama hat

This is so screwed up

...what is the artwork above the TV?...

**sabang** · 05-09-2021, 07:56 AM

^^ Erm, No. Should I just be accepting of everything, instead?

Like a good Citizen.

**Grumpy John** · 05-09-2021, 08:07 AM

If normally peaceful countries start letting in shitbag parasites from the Middle East you have to expect there will be problems in the future. For Australia and New Zealand it can only get worse.

**AntRobertson** · 05-09-2021, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by Grumpy John

If normally peaceful countries start letting in shitbag parasites from the Middle East you have to expect there will be problems in the future. For Australia and New Zealand it can only get worse.

The deadliest terror attack in NZ history was carried out by a white Australian.

Don't let that stop your causal racism though.

**sabang** · 05-09-2021, 08:14 AM

^ true that. And the worst mass murder in Australia (Pt Arthur) was committed by a home grown nutter.

**panama hat** · 05-09-2021, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by Grumpy John

If normally peaceful countries start letting in shitbag parasites from the Middle East you have to expect there will be problems in the future.

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

The deadliest terror attack in NZ history was carried out by a white Australian.

Originally Posted by sabang

^ true that. And the worst mass murder in Australia (Pt Arthur) was committed by a home grown nutter.

Originally Posted by Grumpy John

If normally peaceful countries start letting in shitbag parasites from the Middle East you have to expect there will be problems in the future.

What an utter racist moron you are

Originally Posted by Norton

Any law in a free society must carefully consider the right of privacy and freedom of expression against the safety of it's citizens.

Cross the line and you have an Orwellian situation.

Absolutely right.

**Barty** · 05-09-2021, 09:13 AM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

The deadliest terror attack in NZ history was carried out by a white Australian.

Originally Posted by sabang

^ true that. And the worst mass murder in Australia (Pt Arthur) was committed by a home grown nutter.

Clearly we need to round up all the Australians and isolate them in a large island in the Pacific.

**Backspin** · 05-09-2021, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by Neverna

The March 2019 Christchurch mosque shootings were carried out by a right-wing, white supremacist.

Christchurch mosque shootings - Wikipedia

What does this have to do with anything ? You can choose your immigrants. You cant choose your native citizens.

**panama hat** · 05-09-2021, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by Backspin

What does this have to do with anything ?

Read the posts carefully before making a fool of yourself again and again, please

Originally Posted by Backspin

You can choose your immigrants.

Originally Posted by Backspin

You cant choose your native citizens.

It's almost painful to read.

**panama hat** · 05-09-2021, 10:15 AM

The mother of the LynnMall attacker says he was brainwashed by neighbours from the Middle East.Ahamed Aathill Mohamed Samsudeen, a 32-year-old refugee originally from Sri Lanka, was shot dead by undercover police after stabbing six people inside Countdown in LynnMall on Friday.
His mother, Ismail Fareeda, has told a TV channel in Sri Lanka that neighbours from Syria and Iraq radicalised Aathil Samsudeen when he was injured in a fall in 2016.
She said her son then started posting radical views on social media
.

The timeline doesn't add up, though . . .

**Edmond** · 05-09-2021, 10:46 AM

I wonder if they ever catch their beards in their zipper, when zipping up their hoodies.

**koman** · 05-09-2021, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by Barty

Clearly we need to round up all the Australians and isolate them in a large island in the Pacific.

Obvious that something must be done. Australia is far too close for comfort and NZ is clearly
surrounded by enemies..😊

Thread: New Zealand Cops Kill ISIS Supporter Who Stabbed Six in Grocery Store

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