Thread: Russias Navalny in coma in ICU after alleged poisoning

Like casting pearls before swine, but anyway:-

Novichok, Navalny, Nordstream, Nonsense

183

September 3, 2020 in Uncategorized by craig

---

Once Navalny was in Berlin it was only a matter of time before it was declared that he was poisoned with Novichok. The Russophobes are delighted. This of course eliminates all vestiges of doubt about what happened to the Skripals, and proves that Russia must be isolated and sanctioned to death and we must spend untold billions on weapons and security services. We must also increase domestic surveillance, crack down on dissenting online opinion. It also proves that Donald Trump is a Russian puppet and Brexit is a Russian plot.

I am going to prove beyond all doubt that I am a Russian troll by asking the question Cui Bono?, brilliantly identified by the Integrity Initiative’s Ben Nimmo as a sure sign of Russian influence.

I should state that I have no difficulty at all with the notion that a powerful oligarch or an organ of the Russian state may have tried to assassinate Navalny. He is a minor irritant, rather more famous here than in Russia, but not being a major threat does not protect you against political assassination in Russia.

What I do have difficulty with is the notion that if Putin, or other very powerful Russian actors, wanted Navalny dead, and had attacked him while he was in Siberia, he would not be alive in Germany today. If Putin wanted him dead, he would be dead.

Let us first take the weapon of attack. One thing we know about a “Novichok” for sure is that it appears not to be very good at assassination. Poor Dawn Sturgess is the only person ever to have allegedly died from “Novichok”, accidentally according to the official narrative. “Novichok” did not kill the Skripals, the actual target. If Putin wanted Navalny dead, he would try something that works. Like a bullet to the head, or an actually deadly poison.
“Novichok” is not a specific chemical. It is a class of chemical weapon designed to be improvised in the field from common domestic or industrial precursors. It makes some sense to use on foreign soil as you are not carrying around the actual nerve agent, and may be able to buy the ingredients locally. But it makes no sense at all in your own country, where the FSB or GRU can swan around with any deadly weapon they wish, to be making homemade nerve agents in the sink. Why would you do that?

Further we are expected to believe that, the Russian state having poisoned Navalny, the Russian state then allowed the airplane he was traveling in, on a domestic flight, to divert to another airport, and make an emergency landing, so he could be rushed to hospital. If the Russian secret services had poisoned Navalny at the airport before takeoff as alleged, why would they not insist the plane stick to its original flight plan and let him die on the plane? They would have foreseen what would happen to the plane he was on.

Next, we are supposed to believe that the Russian state, having poisoned Navalny, was not able to contrive his death in the intensive care unit of a Russian state hospital. We are supposed to believe that the evil Russian state was able to falsify all his toxicology tests and prevent doctors telling the truth about his poisoning, but the evil Russian state lacked the power to switch off the ventilator for a few minutes or slip something into his drip. In a Russian state hospital.

Next we are supposed to believe that Putin, having poisoned Navalny with novichok, allowed him to be flown to Germany to be saved, making it certain the novichok would be discovered. And that Putin did this because he was worried Merkel was angry, not realising she might be still more angry when she discovered Putin had poisoned him with novichok

There are a whole stream of utterly unbelievable points there, every single one of which you have to believe to go along with the western narrative. Personally I do not buy a single one of them, but then I am a notorious Russophile traitor.

The United States is very keen indeed to stop Germany completing the Nord Stream 2 pipeline, which will supply Russian gas to Germany on a massive scale, sufficient for about 40% of its electricity generation. Personally I am opposed to Nord Stream 2 myself, on both environmental and strategic grounds. I would much rather Germany put its formidable industrial might into renewables and self-sufficiency. But my reasons are very different from those of the USA, which is concerned about the market for liquefied gas to Europe for US produces and for the Gulf allies of the US. Key decisions on the completion of Nord Stream 2 are now in train in Germany.

The US and Saudi Arabia have every reason to instigate a split between Germany and Russia at this time. Navalny is certainly a victim of international politics. That he is a victim of Putin I tend to doubt.

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archi...ream-nonsense/g.

Originally Posted by Backspin

Lololololololololol I sorta forgot about Nord Stream 2. That's what this one is about

One month ago 3 US senators asked the Germany to stop the project - wasn't it also here? However, many German MP's were outraged over telling them what they should do.

So, this is the next step for those who do not believe that the dangerous Mr. Putin will inject Novichok into the pipeline...

Originally Posted by Klondyke

So, this is the next step for those who do not believe that the dangerous Mr. Putin will inject Novichok into the pipeline...

Of course he would if he so wishes . . . as for your Nord Stream issue . . . why don't you discuss that with socal

Originally Posted by panama hat

I can see that you've referenced and cited a man called Craig Murray . . . and his blog . . . and I guess you've decided that he is far more credible than anyone else in this regard. Fair enough - you are entitled to your opinion.
Interestingly enough he also opines on the following catchy title:

Craig Murray is a disgraced former civil servant who was sacked, and spends all of his time kissing Putin arse and slagging off the West.

He probably has a bank account in Cyprus into which a sum of rubles is deposited every month.

His writing his worthless shit. You only have to look at who posts it.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Craig Murray is a disgraced former civil servant who was sacked, and spends all of his time kissing Putin arse and slagging off the West.

He probably has a bank account in Cyprus into which a sum of rubles is deposited every month.

His writing his worthless shit. You only have to look at who posts it.

No. He couldn't support the narrative after the fake Syria chemical weapons attacks. That's basically when I flipped too.

Those Syria attacks were blatant false flags.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

He probably has a bank account in Cyprus into which a sum of rubles is deposited every month

Wondering why all the people who do not quite believe fairy tales about the Little Red Riding Hood are so fortunate to have a fat account in rubles (and not in US$)...

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

His writing his worthless shit. You only have to look at who posts it.

It's not important what's written, but who has written...

Originally Posted by Klondyke

Wondering why all the people who do not quite believe fairy tales about the Little Red Riding Hood are so fortunate to have a fat account in rubles (and not in US$)...




It's not important what's written, but who has written...

If Harry accuses a nerd like Craig Murray of being an agent of Putin, then he will do it with anyone. Nobody on earth can make a legit grievance on the part of Russia because Russia has zero legitimacy.

Harry is genocidal. This wholesale loathing of one country and people, is genocidal.

I was wondering before why Teakdoor seems to attract so many crazies and tinfoil hatters like Backspin, Pinky and Perky and their ilk; I don't think I've ever come across another website quite like it.

Any idea why this is the case?

Originally Posted by hallelujah

I was wondering before why Teakdoor seems to attract so many crazies and tinfoil hatters like Backspin, Pinky and Perky and their ilk; I don't think I've ever come across another website quite like it.

Any idea why this is the case?

They've probably been booted off everywhere else for being witless fucks.

Fortunately the thread is more readable when you skip past the

This message is hidden because

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

They've probably been booted off everywhere else for being witless fucks.

Fortunately the thread is more readable when you skip past the

This message is hidden because

Nope. Its quite common on all forums. The Anglo empire's media propaganda doesn't stick like it used to.

Here's a hidden message

go fuck yourself

^^ You have half a point regarding the impact of the media, Backspin. Prior to the Internet you were just the neighbourhood weirdos shouting at clouds who your mum warned you to stay away from.

Now, with a collective voice for your online fuckwittery, its like the rest of us have on demand access to the local loony bin, albeit with lower IQ levels.

Originally Posted by Backspin

Our governments do in fact, create false flags.

You realise this now . . . and you're in your thirties/forties?

Originally Posted by hallelujah

I was wondering before why Teakdoor seems to attract so many crazies and tinfoil hatters like Backspin, Pinky and Perky and their ilk; I don't think I've ever come across another website quite like it.

Originally Posted by hallelujah

Any idea why this is the case?

I think it's due to the lax moderation here. People spouting bullshit is nothing new but to constantly do it at every turn isn't tolerated elsewhere . . . not that I have a lot of experience elsewhere.
Show me where on other forums BS, chico, JackOff, The Fat Belgian and to a lesser extent OhOh and Klondyke would be 'roaming free' as they do here - they'd be or have been chucked and TD takes them in, gives them goodness knows how many chances, jails them, bans them and then still accepts them under an old or new guise.

It all comes down to moderation. Correct me if I'm wrong but this forum is not half as aggressive without chico, JackOff, FatBelgian etc... posting.
You'll always have the
Luigi-Ed/Dill
LatinKaren/everyone except chico and Tax
FatBelgian/PH
Tax/Ant
chico/everyone bar Karen and BS
Hal/Klondyke
Harry/whoever disagrees with him
SA/Brits

etc.... but some just take it to ridiculous levels . . . and I'm looking straight at the likes of chico/JackOff/FatBelgian who do nothing but post aggro shit and then disappear for a while.

Originally Posted by Backspin

Harry is genocidal. This wholesale loathing of one country and people, is genocidal.

He is an agent provocateur engaged by the TD owners.
Otherwise it's here a bore and waiting just on exciting news that another falang jumped from 8th floor in Pattaya... (or what Trump said 2 years ago...)

Originally Posted by Klondyke

He is an agent provocateur engaged by the TD owners.

I tried finding a gif that would suit your utter idiocy . . . but nothing was descriptive enough

Originally Posted by panama hat

Originally Posted by Klondyke
He is an agent provocateur engaged by the TD owners.

I tried finding a gif that would suit your utter idiocy . . . but nothing was descriptive enough

Unlike harry, pa-hut doesn't need to be hired. A voluntary useful idiot commenting on anything - no matter it does not matter...

Originally Posted by Klondyke

A voluntary useful idiot commenting on anything

Except you're not 'useful' in any way, shape or form

Originally Posted by Klondyke

Unlike harry, pa-hut doesn't need to be hired. A voluntary useful idiot commenting on anything - no matter it does not matter...

My dear klondyke you dont appear to understand that your constant defence of Putin and all things Russian has made you an object of derision and certainly not someone who is to be taken seriously as an objective poster. We all have our likes and prejudices and seek to substantiate our own world political view to a greater or lesser degree but we sometimes have to recognise that facts may prove that view wrong, or at least flawed and an objective person will come to acknowledge this and adjust his view accordingly.
Th U.S President has been pilloried on here by pro western posters many times even by those who aren't on the far left. To my knowledge you have never criticised Putin even once.
No world leader gets through a term without criticism let alone a President who has been in power for 24 years. To do so would infer they never make mistakes, an area only populated by the most ardent sycophant.
So there you sit, an otherwise intelligent man, incapable of objective reasoned debate, only the defence of the (at times) indefensible. Unfortunately this counts for nothing when your credibility lies in tatters. I say unfortunate because it is possible to be a pro Russian poster that people take seriously but you are missing that one required trait, objectivity.

Oh Oh is the same. The only things I can think of is that they're on the payroll, or they still worry about the long arm of authoritarian rule for not toeing the party line.

Originally Posted by Hugh Cow

My dear klondyke you dont appear to understand that your constant defence of Putin and all things Russian has made you an object of derision and certainly not someone who is to be taken seriously as an objective poster. We all have our likes and prejudices and seek to substantiate our own world political view to a greater or lesser degree but we sometimes have to recognise that facts may prove that view wrong, or at least flawed and an objective person will come to acknowledge this and adjust his view accordingly.
Th U.S President has been pilloried on here by pro western posters many times even by those who aren't on the far left. To my knowledge you have never criticised Putin even once.
No world leader gets through a term without criticism let alone a President who has been in power for 24 years. To do so would infer they never make mistakes, an area only populated by the most ardent sycophant.
So there you sit, an otherwise intelligent man, incapable of objective reasoned debate, only the defence of the (at times) indefensible. Unfortunately this counts for nothing when your credibility lies in tatters. I say unfortunate because it is possible to be a pro Russian poster that people take seriously but you are missing that one required trait, objectivity.

My dear Hugh Cow, I am afraid that you got it all wrong. It's not a "constant defence of Putin and all things Russian", it's just to call the things by their right names. Or should I speak by "doublespeak"?

"to be taken seriously as an objective poster" - that is to be left to everybody. Or do you think that everybody thinks as you do?

"you have never criticised Putin" - If there is something to criticise I will do. As a matter of fact, I really do not know a thing that needs to be criticise. Do you know? Then please tell me.

That he has been "in power for 24 years"? I am not entitled to criticise that, that belongs to criticise only to Russia's citizens, whether they think it is good for them and the country or not. BTW, there are few other world leaders at helm quite a long, it does not disturb us when they do not disturb us. BTW, Angela Merkel has been also quite a long in power. In USA the leaders are changing, however, the system behind them has not been changed for decades, no matter who keeps the office (and make the announcing).

Whether my "credibility lies in tatters"? Who cares, I do not persuade anybody to believe me if he does not believe the facts. Or do you think that I should applaud to the "factual" ranting of e.g. harry's? "Truth over facts"? (Few links on facts I have given here this week were democratically made disappeared within minutes)

Or what to remark to something like here below?
"Oh Oh is the same. The only things I can think of is that they're on the payroll"
People who like to emphasize that they are the only ones living in a "democratic" world but never allow to others the right on another opinion or a mentioning of facts.
(If he is not brainwashed as we are, he has to be "on the payroll"...)

^ He hasn't been in power for 24 years. Dmitri Medvedev was head of state from 2008-2012

^And not to speak about some who is in politics over 50 years (or 47?)... And another 4 - 8 years in front of him. Won't he get into Guinness?

This one is blatantly transparent- heck, it was even on breakfast TV here. They're trying to drive a diplomatic wedge between Germany and Russia, specifically to prevent completion of the Nordstream 2 natural gas pipeline (which conveys enormous economic benefits to Germany). Thus, Europe including Germany will remain reliant on more expensive natural gas shipped from Nth America and the ME.

Shame it wasn't Vlad, but even shadowy illusions to 'The Regime' or 'the Kremlin' will do the trick with the sort of numpties who don't need to be convinced, because they were already convinced. I suppose the real question is whether the Merkel administration will fall for it, or be bullied into it. We'll see- my impression thus far is she is not such an idiot, or weakling.