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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    Read the fucking OP. They are blaming their daughters death on the fact that she had access to material on the internet
    Unlike you I read past the second paragraph.
    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    it's censorship
    Of course it is. You act like you think censorship is 100% bad. What kind of person thinks there is no need whatsoever for any kind of censorship? Are you a child porn distributor or producer of snuff movies?

    As has been pointed out ad-nauseam they are only being asked to do what every other publisher already has to do.
    The Above Post May Contain Strong Language, Flashing Lights, or Violent Scenes.

  2. #27
    Excommunicated baldrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    As has been pointed out ad-nauseam they are only being asked to do what every other publisher already has to do
    every other offline publisher vets their drivel before it is published - how is that going to be achieved with the current generation of online social networks - answer it is not , this is just another kneejerk waste of resources which will not fix the underlying issue

    the evolution of social drivel will change things faster than the silly old duffers drafting these ideas can change their incontinance pants

    suicide may be the leading cause of teenage death , but blaming it on the internet is just shock jock click baiting

    it has been trending down - https://www.samaritans.org/about-sam...s-and-figures/ - and teens are not those with the highest rates

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    how is that going to be achieved with the current generation of online social networks
    Not to be outdone by Farcebook or Youlube we have,

    https://teakdoor.com/thailand-the-royal-family/

    All prevetted.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    every other offline publisher vets their drivel before it is published - how is that going to be achieved with the current generation of online social networks - answer it is not
    Of course it is. Social media networks already employ tens of thousands of moderators to vet content AFTER it has been reported. Inserting a delay between posting and publishing will allow vetting of content before posting, much illegal content can already be automatically detected and flagged for verification by a human. It's not an issue. If more moderators are required for this I am sure the tax-dodging multi-billion profiting companies can find the cash somewhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    suicide
    Am I the only person on this forum to have read the ENTIRE original post?

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    the silly old duffers drafting these ideas can change their incontinance pants
    This is not your grandfather's internet. Internet access is now highly centralised and the silly old duffers have their fingers on the buttons. Those silly old duffers are the hackers who built the modern commercial internet in the first place.You seem to live in some EFF wet dream that has had no relation to reality for over a decade, are you still planning to apply for LoD membership?. The company I work for alone provides nearly 25% of the world's internet access. The network infrastructure is owned by only a few companies the data centres that host the fictional structure known as the cloud are also under the control of only a few companies. Often these companies are in fact one company. The distributed, uncontrollable Internet died even before Jon Postel did and the perverts and paranoiacs havens of tor and its ilk (which still, btw, are controllable even if not readable) don't even begin to provide the kind of services people want.
    Last edited by DrB0b; 11-04-2019 at 06:17 PM.

  6. #31
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    the evolution of social drivel will change things faster than the silly old duffers drafting these ideas can change their incontinance pants
    So Bob's pissed himself then.

  7. #32
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    This is not your grandfather's internet. Internet access is now highly centralised and the silly old duffers have their fingers on the buttons. Those silly old duffers are the hackers who built the modern commercial internet in the first place.You seem to live in some EFF wet dream that has had no relation to reality for over a decade, are you still planning to apply for LoD membership?. The company I work for alone provides nearly 25% of the world's internet access. The network infrastructure is owned by only a few companies the data centres that host the fictional structure known as the cloud are also under the control of only a few companies. Often these companies are in fact one company. The distributed, uncontrollable Internet died even before Jon Postel did and the perverts and paranoiacs havens of tor and its ilk (which still, btw, are controllable even if not readable) don't even begin to provide the kind of services people want.

    Poor old Bob has delusions of grandeur.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    Poor old Bob has delusions of grandeur.
    I'm currently an ops director at comcast. That stuff is my daily work and has been for over 30 years.

  9. #34
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    I'm currently an ops director at comcast. That stuff is my daily work and has been for over 30 years.
    The phrase "so fucking what" springs to mind.

  10. #35
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    There's so much here that drones like you just don't get Bob.

    No one doubts the harm done by child sexual abuse or terrorist propaganda online, but these things are already illegal. The difficulty there is enforcement, which the white paper does nothing to address. Effective enforcement would demand a great deal of money and human time, which neither the government nor the tech companies wish to spend. The present system relies on a mixture of human reporting and algorithms. The algorithms can be fooled without too much trouble: 300,000 of the 1.5m copies of the Christchurch terrorist videos that were uploaded to Facebook within 24 hours of the crime were undetected by automated systems. Meanwhile, detection of the great majority of truly offensive material relies on it being reported by human beings. The problem there is incentives: the people most likely to see such things will have sought them out deliberately, and so they have no reason to report them.


    Beyond that, there is a conceptual problem. Much of the harm done on and by social media does not come from deliberate criminality, but from ordinary people released from the constraints of civility. It is here that the white paper fails most seriously. It talks about material – such as “intimidation, disinformation, the advocacy of self-harm” – that is harmful but not illegal yet proposes to regulate it in the same way as material which is both.

    Even leaving aside politically motivated disinformation, this is an area where
    much deeper and clearer thought is needed.


    There is no doubt that some forms of disinformation, such as anti-vaccination propaganda, do serious harms both to individuals and to society as a whole. But does the government really want fines levied on the executives of
    YouTube when the platform promotes conspiracy theories or anti-vaxx videos? Regulating the internet is necessary, but it won’t be easy or cheap. Too much of this white paper looks like an attempt to find cheap and easy solutions to really hard questions.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/08/the-guardian-view-on-online-harms-white-paper-grey-areas

  11. #36
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    And why would you think I disagree with that? She spoke with us before writing it. What I disagree with is your ridiculous cries of "censorship" and the fact that your type constantly complain but make no attempt to help in finding solutions.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    The phrase "so fucking what" springs to mind.
    Perhaps it does. The what is that I have input into what's going on and an effect on policy while you're just a whiner. The reason I have an effect is that I have spent my entire adult life in bringing the Internet, arpanet as it was when I started, to you, the punters. What have you done to make a difference? You are a luser, as we old farts who have accidentally ended up being the decision makers think of you, and lusers deserve larts.
    Last edited by DrB0b; 12-04-2019 at 12:06 AM.

  13. #38
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    And why would you think I disagree with that? She spoke with us before writing it. What I disagree with is your ridiculous cries of "censorship" and the fact that your type constantly complain but make no attempt to help in finding solutions.
    Sorry?

    It IS censorship. And I've told you the solution.

    It's simply a kneejerk response to an inherently solvable issue, neatly summed up by this tech writer talking about the ludicrous "porn ban" that they have had to take back to the drawing board:

    Evidence-based policymaking this is not. Instead, it seems more like a politically-motivated moral crusade, based on some weird sense that the internet is scary and bad and dangerous, and things would be so much better if only we could go back to the good old days, when porn magazines was safely tucked away on the top shelf of your local newsagents, where they’re meant to be.

    https://www.wired.co.uk/article/porn...wired-explains
    If you don't want your kids to see nasty stuff on the internet, don't let them on the internet unsupervised. It's not fucking rocket science. Don't allow kids unsupervised on the Internet like they aren't allowed into a cinema to watch an adult film.

    Same way there are "18" stickers on games and DVD's, they are there for a reason.

    Any nanny-state government solution to this will be a shit show and just one great big grab bag of censorship.

    Either you accept that there are shit parents breeding shit kids and it's part of life and always has been, or you try and use a sledgehammer to crack a nut, which is even more stupid.

    As many people rightly point out, if you try and "edit" the mainstream, people will start looking elsewhere, and there is far more dangerous shit on the dark web than there is on Facebook or Twitter.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    I've told you the solution
    And you are? Sad though it is for people like you it's people like me who make these decisions, not teflers in China.

  15. #40
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    And you are? Sad though it is for people like you it's people like me who make these decisions, not teflers in China.
    People like you can make all the decisions you like. They really aren't worth the endless three hour meetings drones like you spend coming up with them.

    And it isn't teflers in China you should be worried about, but the nation states and organised crime syndicates that continually run rings around your feeble attempts to stop them.

  16. #41
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    Ummm. OK. Breathe into a paper bag for a while and you'll be fine.

  17. #42
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    Ummm. OK. Breathe into a paper bag for a while and you'll be fine.
    Oh I'm quite relaxed Bob. How could I not be with such hilarious pomposity to entertain me.

    "I'm a middle-management corporate drone and I make all the big decisions" blah blah blah


  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    Oh I'm quite relaxed Bob. How could I not be with such hilarious pomposity to entertain me.

    "I'm a middle-management corporate drone and I make all the big decisions" blah blah blah

    Whatever. You keep on with your impotent whinging. I'll carry on having an effect.

  19. #44
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    Whatever. You keep on with your impotent whinging. I'll carry on having an effect.
    Yes sir, thank you for letting me use the internet sir, you're very kind sir.


  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    Yes sir, thank you for letting me use the internet sir, you're very kind sir.

    I'm not kind. You're paying for it.

  21. #46
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    I'm not kind. You're paying for it.
    Now you're being silly Bob.


  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post

    They are blaming their daughters death on the fact that she had access to material on the internet
    Rather than admitting that as parents they bear some responsibility for not being aware of their daughter"s mood swings which at 14 her mother probably experienced as well? Hormones and stuff. Maybe they could ban hormones.

    Eocognizing that as a group the female of the species is not very nice to her "sisters" and needs support form close friends and family.
    Better to think inside the pub, than outside the box?
    I apologize if any offence was caused. unless it was intended.
    You people, you think I know feck nothing; I tell you: I know feck all
    Those who cannot change their mind, cannot change anything.

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