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  1. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Boon Mee
    It means that Americans can keep firearms w/out a big government approval.
    Define well-regulated militia in the context of private gun ownership as it is presently
    Quote Originally Posted by Boon Mee
    Hate to break it you but that's not gonna change in your lifetime
    Couldn't give a rat's arse, really - you people want to kill yourselves . . . go for it if you (not you personally) are stupid enough to keep doing it
    Militia is by definition made up of privite citizens. And defending one's self againt a tyrannical govt is the premise of the 2nd Amendment. is I'm not seeing a govt that could not be described as tryrannical. Not yet but I am hopeful. Making citizens completely defenseless will not help bring it around.

    America suffers from a culture where males cannot handle anger. It isn't as extreme as other cultures, but is worse than many. Canada has just as many guns per capita , yet practically no such attacks.
    Let's solve the disease, not the symptoms.

    First step would be to force news media to stop with hyper-partisan reporting. There used to be a law about fair and balanced reporting ( guess who overturned it - Reagan ) This was just before cable, and it was relevant to the airwaves but no reason cable cannot be subjected to it.

  2. #177
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  3. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOrlov
    Militia is by definition made up of privite citizens
    'Made up' are the important words here. A militia is an organisation, a regulated militia is a well regulated organisation.

    How does this correspond with every moron being able to buy a gun, worse - carry it openly in many states - into shopping centres, restaurants etc...

    How does this correspond to a 'well regulated militia'?

  4. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOrlov
    Militia is by definition made up of privite citizens. And defending one's self againt a tyrannical govt is the premise of the 2nd Amendment.
    so where in the Constitution does it say what a millita is? judging from how millitras were used before and after the constution they formed a non-standing armed force for the defense of the state.

    So it seems quiet simple to me. you want a gun join the army reserves and make yourself available for the defense of the nation. (NB this might involve traveling to the arm pits of the world and getting shot at, ask TD's davis for more information).

    After all 'rights' come with 'duties' and 'obligations'
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  5. #180
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    https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...e0e_story.html

    Dylann Roof, who is accused of killing nine people at a church in South Carolina three weeks ago, was able to purchase the gun used in the attack only because of lapses in the FBI’s background-check system, FBI Director James B. Comey said Friday.
    Comey said Roof should have been prevented from buying the .45-caliber weapon used in the shooting, which authorities have said was motivated by Roof’s racist views. The political repercussions of the June 17 massacre at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in
    Charleston led South Carolina to remove the Confederate flag from its statehouse grounds Friday. “This case rips all of our hearts out,” Comey said. “But the thought that an error on our part is connected to this guy’s purchase of a gun that he used to slaughter these good people is very painful to us.”
    The breakdown was a result of errors not only by the FBI but also apparently by local law enforcement, and Comey said he has ordered a 30-day review to examine the procedures that led to the failure and to see if the process can be tightened. The errors came to light as investigators examined a gun purchase Roof made two months before the shooting.
    Roof had been arrested for possession of narcotics in February, a felony charge that alone did not disqualify him from buying a gun. But Comey said Roof’s subsequent admission of the drug crime would have triggered an automatic rejection of his gun purchase if the information had been properly recorded in criminal-record and background-check databases.


    Instead, Comey said, the data was not properly entered in databases of criminal records that are submitted by state, local and federal law enforcement agencies, and in records kept by the bureau. As a result, an FBI examiner assigned to review Roof’s purchase never saw his admission to the narcotics charge. The examiner runs checks under the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS), which relies on these databases and the bureau’s own records.
    Comey’s disclosure to reporters who were summoned to the bureau’s headquarters Friday amounted to a heartbreaking admission by the FBI director that the attack on a Bible study group might have been averted.
    The failure to block Roof’s gun purchase is likely to renew scrutiny of a federal background-check system that also allowed troubled individuals to acquire firearms before previous shootings.
    On Capitol Hill, Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Charles E. Grassley (R-Iowa) promptly sought to head off any effort to tighten gun-control laws. “It’s disastrous that this bureaucratic mistake prevented existing laws from working and blocking an illegal gun sale,” he said in a statement. “The facts undercut attempts to use the tragedy to enact unnecessary gun laws. The American people, and especially the victims’ families, deserve better.”
    The Center for American Progress, meanwhile, used the case to call for tightening the law on background checks. “Like the Virginia Tech massacre, the Columbine massacre, and countless every day shootings, gaps in our gun background check system contributed to the Charleston attack,” said a statement from Arkadi Gerney, senior vice president at the center. “The answer is simple: all records of prohibited individuals need to go in the FBI system and every gun sale needs to go through a background check.”
    Gabrielle Giffords, the former Arizona congresswoman who was seriously wounded in a gun attack in 2011, and her husband, Mark Kelly, said they were “deeply troubled to learn details of the failures” and called for a full investigation.
    Comey said Roof’s transaction began when he went to a gun store in West Columbia, S.C., on April 11. The dealer submitted his biographical information to the NICS, which handles background checks for gun purchases in about 30 states, including South Carolina.


    Under the law, the FBI has three business days to deny or approve a purchase. If a decision is not made in that time frame, the law permits the dealer to complete the sale.
    On April 13, a veteran FBI examiner who routinely handled 15 or more cases a day pulled up Roof’s request. Checking his criminal record, she saw a record of the narcotics arrest, which erroneously listed the arresting agency as the Lexington County Sheriff’s Department. She faxed a request for information to the sheriff’s office and to the county prosecutor. But officials at the sheriff’s office told her they were not handling the case and referred her to the Columbia Police Department.





    The fact that the Columbia police handled the arrest — not the sheriff’s department — was not reported in the NCIC, which relies on the agency in question to submit information.
    “It’s not clear why that happened,” Comey said of the error, “but it made a big difference.”
    The sheriff’s department, which unlike the Columbia Police Department has a jail, booked Roof, and that might have led to the confusion.
    Had the examiner been able to see the Columbia police report that Roof admitted to possession of a drug, or had the county prosecutor gotten back to her and told her of the report’s existence, “that transaction would have been denied,” Comey said. The prosecutor’s office never replied to her query.
    The examiner’s effort was further tripped up by a geographic irregularity that the FBI did not reflect in its system.
    Only a small part of the city of Columbia is located in Lexington County, with most in neighboring Richland County. The FBI’s system did not account for that jurisdictional split, and the examiner contacted only the West Columbia Police Department, which reported no record of Roof’s arrest.


    On April 16, after the mandatory three-day waiting period lapsed with no adverse ruling from the FBI, Roof got his gun — a .45-caliber Glock pistol. There is no requirement for a dealer to notify the bureau when it has sold a gun, bureau officials said.
    “There were a combination of things; one could say highly improbable events came together in this circumstance,” Comey said. “But the one we are definitely accountable for is not having reflected the geography of South Carolina on our contact sheet.”
    Comey said he had spoken to the examiner and described her as “heartbroken,” but he said she had followed proper procedures.
    FBI agents in South Carolina met Friday with the families of the victims to explain what happened, he said.

  6. #181
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    if the 2nd amendment had intended to give private citizens the unencumbered right to own guns then the comment about a well regulated militia would have been redundant. And the American constitution is notable for its general lack fluff, if the words are there... they are there for a reasons.

    So explain what are the 'well regulated militia' obligations of a citizen to excersie their right to arms. At the very least it means being a member of a well regulated militia... and can you show anything in the conitution that would allow anyone other than the government to do the regulating.

    hence you want a gun, its your right when you join the army reserve; and forfill your obligations and duties that entails.

  7. #182
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Was Charleston Shooting a Hate Crime or Terrorism?


    This undated photo taken from Lastrhodesian.com allegedly shows Dylann Roof. The website, which surfaced after the murder of nine parishoners at an African American Church in Charleston, SC, also included a white supremacist manifesto.



    On Thursday, a South Carolina judge set a July 11, 2016 start date for the trial of a white man accused of killing nine people at an African American church in Charleston last month.

    Dylann Roof, 21, will face state murder charges in that trial. But federal authorities are still investigating the killings as a possible act of domestic terrorism, as well as a hate crime.

    After more information surfaced about Roof's white supremacist ideology, civil rights activists want the terrorism label to be used.

    Cornell Brooks, head of the country's oldest civil rights organization, the NAACP, was one of the first people to call the shooting an act of terror.

    "A person can be prejudiced, can be biased, can look down on people of other ethnicities with disfavor, but not allow their bias and bigotry to drive them to the point of violence..." he told VOA. "What's different about this crime in Charleston is this was a crime where the victims were intended to go far beyond the people in that bible study."

    What is terrorism?


    By the FBI definition, a domestic terror attack must:

    Involve acts dangerous to human life that violate federal or state law
    Appear intended (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population; (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination. or kidnapping
    Occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the U.S.
    Rights activist Marc Morial of the National Urban League believes the Charleston killings match that definition.

    More here: Was Charleston Shooting a Hate Crime or Terrorism?

  8. #183
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    Why cannot a crime be both a hate crime and an act terrorism at the same time?

  9. #184
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    Judge: Defendant in Charleston Church Shooting Competent to Stand Trial

    A judge has ruled that Dylann Roof is competent to stand trial for the killing of nine black worshippers at a South Carolina church.

    Judge Richard Gergel made the ruling Friday after a two-day hearing behind closed doors earlier this week. The hearing was needed after Roof's attorneys questioned earlier this month whether he could help them on the eve of jury selection in his death penalty trial.

    Gergel says jury selection will begin Monday.

    Gergel sealed his reasons for finding Roof competent, saying that information could keep him from having a fair trial.

    The 22-year-old white man is charged in federal court with hate crime, obstruction of religion and other counts for the deadly June 2015 attack at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston.

    Judge: Defendant in Charleston Church Shooting Competent to Stand Trial

  10. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskit
    deadly June 2015 attack
    18 months and trial not even started. System is broken. The bastard should have been fried within 6 months.

  11. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    Considering Obama has done such a good job , I cannot see any arguments against ammending the seppo constitution

    " only blacks and hispanics can become POTUS " - or should that be niggers and spics so the majority trailer trash can understand
    That's them dum arsed trailer trash don't know nuthink about electing a POTUS
    Last edited by wasabi; 05-12-2016 at 03:36 AM.

  12. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norton View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by misskit
    deadly June 2015 attack
    18 months and trial not even started. System is broken. The bastard should have been fried within 6 months.
    Agreed.

    And to insult to the evil tragedy, I assume this will cost taxpayers a million by the time all of these appeals are finished.

  13. #188
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Charleston Gunman Will Not Use Mental Health to Avoid Death Penalty

    Convicted murderer Dylann Roof will not ask jurors to take his mental health into consideration next month during the death penalty phase of his trial for killing nine black churchgoers in Charleston, South Carolina.

    In a handwritten note filed in a South Carolina federal court on Friday, Roof, an avowed white supremacist, wrote, "I will not be calling mental health experts or presenting mental health evidence."

    Roof was found guilty on Thursday of 33 charges of federal hate crimes after a six-day trial featuring harrowing testimony about the night of June 17, 2015, when he attended Bible study at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church before opening fire on the parishioners.

    He spent months scouting potential sites for the attack, which he confessed to carrying out, and wrote a journal and online manifesto filled with hatred toward Jewish and black people.

    Roof's decision not to call mental health experts or present mental health evidence came after he called the field of psychology a "Jewish invention" in his journal, part of which was read aloud at his trial earlier this month.

    "I am morally opposed to psychology. It is a Jewish invention that does nothing but invent diseases and tell people they have problems when they don't," Roof wrote.

    The jury is scheduled to begin hearing evidence on Jan. 3 in the second phase of the trial, which will determine whether Roof faces execution.

    Roof is acting as his own lawyer in that proceeding.

    He still faces a trial next year on state charges in connection with the church killings. South Carolina prosecutors have said they intend to seek the death penalty as well.

    Charleston Gunman Will Not Use Mental Health to Avoid Death Penalty

  14. #189
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    He wanted to be the "Arab Spring" spark for US...

  15. #190
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    So here we are 18 months after the murders.

    The trial took six days and jurors deliberated for three hours before finding him guilty of the nine murders.

    Now it goes onto sentencing to see if the State will allow Dylann Roof to die for his crimes without inflicting physical pain or mental anguish. Oh well...
    (What ever happened to hanging?)

  16. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeeCoffee View Post
    (What ever happened to hanging?)
    Still available in New Hampshire and Washington.

  17. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOrlov View Post
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...e0e_story.html

    Dylann Roof, who is accused of killing nine people at a church in South Carolina three weeks ago, was able to purchase the gun used in the attack only because of lapses in the FBI’s background-check system, FBI Director James B. Comey said Friday.
    Comey said Roof should have been prevented from buying the .45-caliber weapon used in the shooting, which authorities have said was motivated by Roof’s racist views. The political repercussions of the June 17 massacre at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in
    Charleston led South Carolina to remove the Confederate flag from its statehouse grounds Friday. “This case rips all of our hearts out,” Comey said. “But the thought that an error on our part is connected to this guy’s purchase of a gun that he used to slaughter these good people is very painful to us.”


    On April 16, after the mandatory three-day waiting period lapsed with no adverse ruling from the FBI, Roof got his gun — a .45-caliber Glock pistol. There is no requirement for a dealer to notify the bureau when it has sold a gun, bureau officials said.
    “There were a combination of things; one could say highly improbable events came together in this circumstance,” Comey said. “But the one we are definitely accountable for is not having reflected the geography of South Carolina on our contact sheet.”
    Comey said he had spoken to the examiner and described her as “heartbroken,” but he said she had followed proper procedures.
    FBI agents in South Carolina met Friday with the families of the victims to explain what happened, he said.
    Uh-huh...ooops.
    Doing it by the book. Aww, just a little glitch in the system...(thankfully it was only a handgun eh.)

    Thank you for posting that, Y0rlov.

  18. #193
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Charleston Shooter Won't Submit Evidence at Penalty Phase of Trial

    Dylann Roof, who is facing the death penalty for killing nine black worshippers in a hate crime at a Charleston, South Carolina church, has told a judge he does not plan to call any witnesses or present any evidence during the penalty phase of his trial.

    Roof said Wednesday he still plans to act as his own lawyer when that phase starts next week. The judge, Richard Gergel, says Roof can still change his mind.

    Roof is now acting as his own lawyer after letting go of his defense attorneys after a jury convicted him of 33 counts of hate crimes and obstruction of justice earlier this month.

    Roof's lawyers say they think he got rid of them because they wanted to present what Roof thought was embarrassing evidence seeking to get the same jury to spare his life.

    Charleston Shooter Won't Submit Evidence at Penalty Phase of Trial

  19. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by PeeCoffee View Post
    (What ever happened to hanging?)
    Still available in New Hampshire and Washington.
    Yup.

    They still let 'em swing once in a while.

    The people they hung certainly deserved it. Unspeakable crimes. But as usual in the US system it can take decades and over $1 million dollars before it finally gets done.

  20. #195
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Dylann Roof Sentenced to Death in Slaying of 9 Black Church Members


    CHARLESTON, S.C. —
    An unrepentant Dylann Roof was sentenced to death Tuesday for killing nine black church members during Bible study, the first person to face execution for federal hate crime convictions.

    A jury deliberated his sentence for about three hours, capping a trial in which Roof did not fight for his life or show any remorse. He was his own attorney during sentencing and insisted that he wasn't mentally ill, but he never asked for forgiveness or mercy, or explained the crime.

    And he threw away one last chance to plead for his life on Tuesday, telling jurors: "I still feel like I had to do it.''

    Every juror looked directly at Roof, 22, as he spoke for about five minutes. A few nodded as he reminded them that they said during jury selection they could fairly weigh the factors of his case. Only one of them, he noted, had to disagree to spare his life.

    "I have the right to ask you to give me a life sentence, but I'm not sure what good it would do anyway,'' he said.

    When the verdict was read, he stood stoic and showed no emotion. Several family members of victims wiped away quiet tears.

    Roof told FBI agents when they arrested him after the June 17, 2015, slayings that he wanted the shootings to bring back segregation or perhaps start a race war. Instead, the slayings had a unifying effect, as South Carolina removed the Confederate flag from its Statehouse for the first time in more than 50 years and other states followed suit, taking down Confederate banners and monuments. Roof had posed with the flag in photos.

    Roof specifically picked out Emanuel AME Church, the South's oldest black church, to carry out the cold, calculated slaughter, Assistant U.S. Attorney Jay Richardson said.

    The 12 people he targeted opened the door for a stranger with a smile, he said. Three people survived the attack.

    "They welcomed a 13th person that night ... with a kind word, a Bible, a handout and a chair,'' Richardson said during his closing argument. "He had come with a hateful heart and a Glock .45.''

    The gunman sat with the Bible study group for about 45 minutes. During the final prayer - when everyone's eyes were closed - he started firing. He stood over some of the fallen victims, shooting them again as they lay on the floor, Richardson said.

    The prosecutor reminded jurors about each one of the victims and the bloody scene that Roof left in the church's lower level.

    Nearly two dozen friends and relatives of the victims testified during the sentencing phase of the trial. They shared cherished memories and talked about a future without a mother, father, sister or brother. They shed tears, and their voices shook, but none of them said whether Roof should face the death penalty.

    Jennifer Pinckney testified about huddling under a desk with her 6-year-old daughter, her hand clasped over the girl's mouth to keep her quiet, as Roof started firing.

    Not knowing for certain if the danger had passed, Pinckney dialed 911 and breathlessly told an operator she had heard shots inside the church.

    "I think there's been a shooting. I'm in the closet, under a desk,'' Pinckney told the operator. "Please hurry.''

    On the call, Pinckney tries to comfort her daughter Malana, who had been watching cartoons in her father's office as he participated in Bible study.

    "Daddy's dead?'' Malana says.

    "No, baby, no,'' the mother says. But at that moment, Pinckney said she knew her husband, church pastor Clementa Pinckney, had been killed.

    The prosecutor reminded jurors that Clementa Pinckney, the church pastor and a state senator, would be remembered for singing goofy songs and watching cartoons with his young daughters. In a sign of perhaps how important that testimony was, jurors re-watched a speech by Pinckney in which he talks about the history of Emanuel and its mission.

    The jury convicted him last month of all 33 federal charges he faced, including hate crimes.

    Roof did not explain his actions to jurors, saying only that "anyone who hates anything in their mind has a good reason for it.''

    Roof had the opportunity to present evidence that he had possibly suffered from mental illness, but he did not call any witnesses or present any evidence.

    In one of his journals, he wrote that he didn't believe in psychology, calling it "a Jewish invention'' that "does nothing but invent diseases and tell people they have problems when they don't.''

    His attorneys said he didn't want to present any evidence that might embarrass him or his family.

    After he was sentenced, Roof asked a judge to appoint him new attorneys, but the judge said he was not inclined to because they had performed "admirably.''

    A judge will formally sentence him during a hearing Wednesday.

    The last person sent to federal death row was Boston Marathon bomber Dzhokhar Tsarnaev in 2015.

    Dylann Roof Sentenced to Death in Slaying of 9 Black Church Members

  21. #196
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    Now how long is the legal system going to take before it can declare with specific action, "lights out" ?

  22. #197
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    ^A decade or more. Death penalty more like two decades. If Bubba doesn't kill him first.

  23. #198
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    Not a bad outcome.

    Up to 20 years of misery time for him to think about what he's done, with the sure knowledge that at some time in the future some one's gonna put his lights out.....with a grin.

  24. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by ENT View Post
    Up to 20 years of misery time for him to think about what he's done
    Can't imagine he'll have a shred of remorse. Real nutcase, this guy.

  25. #200
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    It is obvious to anyone of the meanest of intelligence that this boy, for that is what he undoubtedly is in emotional and intellectual terms, is mentally challenged but in the fullness of time he may well come to realise the sheer futile stupidity of his crimes and as a consequence redemption and rehabilitation is likely - in short he will no longer be the person that committed those murders.

    But America is a fucked up place, badly governed and populated by imbeciles whose sanctimonious self righteous hypocrisy is a tool with which they construct what passes for their often quite cruel and irrational society.

    Twenty years incarceration culminating in judicial murder, and absolutely nothing will be gained.

    Septics really are cvunts but it's their bovine stupidity which is perhaps most depressing. The election of an old pig for POTUS merely demonstrates their penchant for imbecility knows no bounds.

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