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  1. #1
    Lord of Swine
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    California cops kill boy, Andy Lopez, 13, who had fake gun

    CALIFORNIA sheriff's officials and family members say deputies shot and killed a 13-year-old boy who was carrying a replica assault weapon.
    Two Sonoma County deputies saw the boy walking with the replica weapon at about 3pm local time on Tuesday in Santa Rosa.
    Lt. Dennis O'Leary says they repeatedly ordered him to drop what appeared to be a rifle before firing several rounds.
    The boy fell to the ground. Deputies handcuffed him and began administering first aid, but he was pronounced dead at the scene. Lt. O'Leary says deputies also found a plastic handgun in his waistband.
    The boy's father, Rodrigo Lopez, told the Press Democrat of Santa Rosa the victim was his 13-year-old son, Andy.
    “I told him what I tell him every day,” he said in Spanish. “Behave yourself.”
    The boy's mother, Sujey Annel Cruz Cazarez, was grief-stricken.
    “Why did they kill him? Why?” she said.
    The deputies have not been identified but both had been placed on administrative leave..

    California cops kill boy, Andy Lopez, 13, who had fake gun | News.com.au

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    Another senseless death, but hey, we've got to protect that 2nd amendment and clearly this 13 year old was part of a well regulated militia...

    That's America for ya- more guns and more gun deaths than any other developed country in the world.

    RIP Andy, the NRA doesn't care how many innocents get killed as long as they are still raking in the $$$ from the gun industry.

  3. #3
    Philippine Expat Davis Knowlton's Avatar
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    Saw a picture of it in the news. A very accurate replica of an AK-47. Kids that age have shot and killed teachers twice this week. That said, cops do appear to be getting quicker on the trigger lately. Thankless job, that - guess right and you live; guess wrong, and you live with having killed a kid with a toy.

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    Thailand Expat VocalNeal's Avatar
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    Two cops. One covers the boy, other fires in air to convince the boy they are serious? Boy moves suspiciously then...but chances are he would put the gun down?

  5. #5
    Member Bettyboo's Avatar
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    Obviously the police were nervous, perfectly understandable in the current climate - who wants to be blasted away by an AK47? And, it is their job to protect society. I wouldn't assign blame to the police in this instance.

    Society however, when a kid thinks he can walk around with an AK47 (replica or not), especially the same week as kids his age have been shooting and killing schoolchildren and scoolteachers, is very fuked up indeed.

    & the not so funny thing is, all these pointless deaths will continue because the folks that run America seemingly hate Americans and just use them as a feeding bed; feeding for $$$... When will the American people wake up and take their country back???

    (& no, America is not alone in having these problems)
    How do I post these pictures???

  6. #6
    Lord of Swine
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    ^^ Cops only fire warning shots on TV.

    Here's a bit more detail and a pic of the gun. Looks real enough to me.



    (Reuters) - A 13-year-old California boy carrying a replica of an assault rifle to a friend's house was shot and killed by a sheriff's deputy who believed the gun was real, authorities said.

    The incident took place in Santa Rosa, Northern California,

    on Tuesday, a day after a 12-year-old boy killed a teacher at a Nevada middle school with a gun he also used to take his own life.

    The Santa Rosa boy's father said his son, Andy Lopez Cruz, a middle schooler who played the saxophone and liked basketball and boxing, was shot while on his way to a friend's house with a pellet gun left at the family home over the weekend.

    "It's not right what they did to my son," said the father, Rodrigo Lopez, as he sat with friends and family on Wednesday outside Santa Rosa City Hall in a quiet protest.

    Lieutenant Paul Henry, who is investigating the incident for the Santa Rosa Police Department, said two Sonoma County Sheriff's deputies had been patrolling a street near the boy's home on Tuesday when they saw him walking with what appeared to be an assault weapon in his left hand.

    One of the deputies, who did not immediately realize that the person he was seeing from behind was a child, shouted twice: "Put down the gun," according to Henry and a police statement.

    "The subject turned toward the deputies, and as he was doing that the barrel of the weapon was rising toward the deputies," Henry said. The deputy then fired rounds, killing the boy.

    The incident took place against a backdrop of growing concern about officer-involved shootings in California, where a spate of such incidents in the city of Anaheim, southeast of Los Angeles, prompted protests in 2012. Concern over seven fatal officer-involved shootings in three years in Sonoma County prompted calls in 2000 for a civilian review board, but none was established.

    REAL OR FAKE?

    Displaying a real AK-47 next to the plastic one recovered from the scene, Henry pointed out the similarities in their appearances. The pellet gun was shorter, and lacked a bright orange piece meant to mark it as a toy.

    Pellet guns, which use compressed air or other gases to fire pellets or spherical balls, are sometimes made to resemble assault weapons. Police also found a plastic handgun tucked into the boy's pants.

    "It's a tragic event," Henry said. "It's tragic for the family, the community and the deputies."

    According to friends and family, Andy Lopez had a good sense of humor and liked to tease his friend Luis' older sister, Ana.

    But he also appeared to have had some difficulties. According to his father, he was expelled from Lawrence Cook Middle School in Santa Rosa. On Tuesday, he had been sent home early from his new alternative school, for what his parents described as lingering too long at a local store during a break.

    Later in the afternoon, his father said, Andy took the pellet gun, which had been left by another child, and made plans to see his best friend, Luis Diaz. When Andy did not return home later in the day, the family called the Diaz home and learned that he had not arrived there.

    Rodrigo Lopez said he then stepped outside, saw the police cars and commotion and eventually realizing that the unmoving body on the ground was that of his son.

    The officers involved in the shooting have been placed on administrative leave, which is standard procedure, and the incident is being investigated by the Santa Rosa Police Department and other law enforcement agencies, officials said.

    (Reporting by Ronnie Cohen; Writing and additional reporting by Sharon Bernstein; Editing by Cynthia Johnston and David Brunnstrom)

  7. #7
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    I came across a few vids yesterday which look at the problems with 'Open Carry' gun laws in the US

    Either the police aren't aware of their powers or citizens are simply challenging that knowledge.


    Even the NRA have displayed caution relating to 'open carry' regulations which implies that something is seriously wrong.












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    Philippine Expat Davis Knowlton's Avatar
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    The ease with which Americans can get carry permits, either open carry or concealed, scares me. I mean, these are the same people who vote, right? I can't imagine what it's like for a cop to know every other Walmart shopper is carrying a 14-round semi-automatic handgun. Insanity.

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    I don't know barbaro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99 View Post
    CALIFORNIA sheriff's officials and family members say deputies shot and killed a 13-year-old boy who was carrying a replica assault weapon.
    It's happened before.

    If a stranger is carrying something that looks like a real gun - it will be considered a real gun.

    No time to sit and ponder.

  10. #10
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    You're a cop, you see kid with a gun and he acts suspicious...I suppose the right thing to do is back off and call for social services in case it's not a real gun or he doesn't actually intend to use it, and not a problem if that's wrong because your family will get lots of sympathy and your pension.

    Fcuking career halo polishing handwringers!

  11. #11
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    Looking at the initial news report of the incident and indeed if it's accurate then one has to say that police shouldn't be shooting at anyone just for 'carrying'. The fact that he failed to respond to instructions is again not enough to warrant shots being fired.

    There has to be an immediate danger to life. i.e. the weapon has to be pointing in someone's direction and the threat must be real. It matters not whether the firearm is incapable of discharging a round if the officers are unable to identify it as such.

    There is also little point in wasting time handcuffing someone who is drawing their last breath.

    Like DK mentioned, being a US cop is a risky business and for me just doesn't pay enough. e.g. Attending a domestic knowing that those people probably have access to firearms and may not be police friendly is a no-win.

    There are simply far too many incidents involving firearms in the US, even the loopy 'open carriers' are destroying their argument of 2nd Amendment rights when armed officers need to respond to every sighting.

  12. #12
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    Just a sad situation all round.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Lick

    Like DK mentioned, being a US cop is a risky business and for me just doesn't pay enough. e.g. Attending a domestic knowing that those people probably have access to firearms and may not be police friendly is a no-win.

    There are simply far too many incidents involving firearms in the US, even the loopy 'open carriers' are destroying their argument of 2nd Amendment rights when armed officers need to respond to every sighting.
    Our NRA friends will be along soon to set you right Mr Lick .................

    More guns for ALL Americans .

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99
    "The subject turned toward the deputies, and as he was doing that the barrel of the weapon was rising toward the deputies," Henry said. The deputy then fired rounds, killing the boy.
    If this is what happened then they had little choice than to shoot him. The boy has only himself to blame for not putting the weapon down when instructed.

  15. #15
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    It is truly a sad situation, but those air-soft guns made to look like real guns have a bright orange cover at the end of the barrel. This one did not.

    Didn't quite read the report there did you "Mr Lick"?
    Per the news report says the police shouted twice: "Put down the gun," but he didn't. That's two clear commands to throw down the weapon.

    The next sentence tells the whole story; "The subject turned toward the deputies, and as he was doing that the barrel of the weapon was rising toward the deputies..." That's it, there's no ambiguity in that. Is it a tragedy, sure and it will haunt that officer the rest of his days.

    I agree with "barbaro" if it looks like a real gun it will be considered a real gun.

    I wonder what scares "Davis Knowlton" about America having the most well armed populace of any developed country? I think that's a good thing, in fact I think it's a great thing.

    I think if you google statistics about violent crimes in states with concealed carry you will see they are lower than ones who don't allow it. Criminals don't know who's got a gun under their coat.

    Remember "when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns", and as Charleton Heston said, "I'll give you my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead hands".. Then again I'm a lifetime member of the NRA, so very pro gun.
    "Whoever said `Money can`t buy you love or joy` obviously was not making enough money." <- quote by Gene $immon$ of the rock group KISS

  16. #16
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    Gave up playin with toy guns when i was about 3 yrs. old.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by toddaniels
    Didn't quite read the report there did you "Mr Lick"?
    Yep, guilty of not reading the more detailed report, just the initial one so thanks for setting the record straight.

    Quote Originally Posted by toddaniels
    Remember "when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns",
    If Charleton Heston said that he obviously forgot that the US have an armed police force, unless he also considered them as 'outlaws' in which case he should have been placed in a padded cell long before he expired.

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    Quote Originally Posted by toddaniels View Post
    I think if you google statistics about violent crimes in states with concealed carry you will see they are lower than ones who don't allow it. Criminals don't know who's got a gun under their coat.
    You think? Or you know? Or you're just guessing?

    As a NRA gun nut do you believe "more guns" will make us all safer?

    Consider before answering the sorry fact that the US already enjoys more gun deaths than any other developed country in the world.

  19. #19
    Thailand Expat terry57's Avatar
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    Cant see what age has anything at all to do with this story.

    With the lax gun laws in America its not a smart thing to do as to not put a weapon down when instructed by a cop who is in confusion whether this might or might not be a a real weapon.

    I'm 100 % with the cops on this and that stupid kid has more than likely traumatized the cop forever.

    I mean the poor cop will be stuck with this forever that he killed a stupid fuking kid.

    Why should the cop have to live with that ?

  20. #20
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    very sad

    watched the last vid of the three, the cops want his name, and he won't give it, so why don't the cops just ask to see his licence for the firarm.
    Last edited by Yasojack; 24-10-2013 at 09:05 PM.

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    What part of " you point some thing that looks like a gun at a cop" their reaction will be to shoot first ???????????

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yasojack View Post
    very sad

    watched the last vid of the three, the cops want his name, and he won't give it, so why don't the cops just ask to see his licence for the firarm.

    They spent too much time on the sidewalk arguing the toss with him. The cops were responding to calls from people who were concerned that a guy was walking around with a loaded weapon in their neighbourhood. He stated it wasn't his job to make it easy for them and he refused to provide his personal details.

    That would seem enough to inform him that he was being detained for the purpose of establishing his identity and the legality for him to 'open carry' He wanted to watch the 49ers game, he would probably have complied given the option of attending at a police station.

    An attention seeking (look at the size of my weapon) whore

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    I would guess the boy didn't speak English, or else he would have dropped the gun (replica or not).

    In today's climate of gangbangers and drivebys, coupled with the revolving door of prisons, cops don't take chances. It's shoot first or risk getting killed.

    A shame the kid was shot and killed, though.


    RickThai

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Lick

    Like DK mentioned, being a US cop is a risky business and for me just doesn't pay enough. e.g. Attending a domestic knowing that those people probably have access to firearms and may not be police friendly is a no-win.

    There are simply far too many incidents involving firearms in the US, even the loopy 'open carriers' are destroying their argument of 2nd Amendment rights when armed officers need to respond to every sighting.
    Our NRA friends will be along soon to set you right Mr Lick .................

    More guns for ALL Americans .
    ....beat me to it, mate.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by terry57
    what age has anything at all to do with this story.
    true terry, sad indeed for all concerned
    RIP to Andy.

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