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  1. #1
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    It's true: British women make up their PMT

    As a new international study draws a surprising conclusion, we ask... What makes British women have the worst menopause?



    By Jane Feinmann
    Last updated at 11:56 PM on 14th June 2010


    Whatever most of us might have thought, menopause symptoms are far from universal. In the U.S., women complain of headaches, aching joints and fatigue. In Japan, the main symptoms are constipation and backache.
    But it is women in the UK who do particularly badly, suffering everything from upset stomachs and shortness of breath to irritability and depression. a major new study published last week put British women at the top of the league for unpleasant menopausal symptoms.

    Researchers quizzed 1,000 British women aged 45 to 55 and compared the results to similar groups in Japan, China, Canada and the U.S. the British women fared worse in all but one of the 15 symptoms - Chinese women beating Brits with a higher score for irritability.

    Symptoms: Many menopausal women complain of night sweats and hot flushes

    Two out of three British women suffer from tiredness, while more than 50 per cent complain of hot flushes. This compares with just one in 20 Japanese women suffering from tiredness and one in eight from hot flushes.
    So, what could account for these variations in experience? The controversial study, published in Climacteric, the journal of the International Menopause Society, says it is down to being an older woman in different cultures. The researchers say that only two of the 16 symptoms reported by women in the study had anything to do with the menopause - hot flushes and night sweats.



    More...


    'Only these can be classed as common menopausal symptoms internationally and clearly attributable to the menopause,' says the study's lead researcher, Dr volker Scheid of the Department of Integrated Health at Westminster University.
    That view is backed by experts in the field. 'This study will trigger a great deal of professional debate at a time when HRT is no longer the panacea for menopausal symptoms that it was until ten years ago,' says David Sturdee, president of the International Menopause Society and a gynaecologist at Solihull Hospital.
    'It adds to evidence that many symptoms widely regarded as being menopausal are totally unrelated. This study tells us as much about the quality of life of older women as it does about the clinical signs of menopause.'


    There is a growing suspicion that the status of older women in the community is, at least partly, the key to understanding the menopause. And the solution may not be hormones - but talking therapies.
    However, the research did appear to confirm one widely-held belief - that a diet high in natural oestrogens provides protection against hot flushes. Certainly, the Japanese and Chinese women scored lowest on physiological symptoms, thanks to their soy-rich diet.
    Yet the researchers point out this belief has no scientific foundation - the low rate of hot flushes among women in China and Japan may have a very different cause.
    Mr Sturdee says: 'The best way to predict how severely a woman will be affected by the menopause is to look at her mother's experience.
    'We will soon have a much better understanding of what genes are involved.
    'It seems likely that in countries where menopause is less of a problem there are good genes. But it's also clear that these countries tend to be matriarchal societies where older women are revered for their wisdom.
    'Compare that to Britain, where older women often feel lonely and abandoned,' says Mr Sturdee.

    His comments came as an ICM survey last week showed that half of older British women feel they 'become invisible' over the age of 50. The stress of growing older in such an environment worsens the impact of hot flushes, says Myra Hunter, Professor of Clinical health Psychology at King's College, London.
    'There are negative images of the menopause, largely influenced by cultural views of older women in a society where youthful beauty is prized so highly,' she says.
    'It's hardly surprising that women leading a busy inner city life find their self-esteem plummets as they approach the menopause.' Tackling this stress could help minimise hot flushes. Indeed, preliminary research by Professor hunter suggests cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT) can reduce the impact of hot flushes by 50 per cent.
    She is directing two trials of CBT as a treatment for hot flushes in women with breast cancer and those living in pressured environments. These initial findings do not surprise Marian van Eyk McCain, a former psychotherapist and founder of The Elderwoman website.
    She says the current enthusiasm for older women hanging onto their youthful looks has a downside.
    'The whole thing about 60 being the new 40 means that women make greater effort to stay fit and eat well,' she adds. 'That's good, but it can also bring a lot of unhealthy denial.

    'And there's subtle ageism in the compliments that older women get - about playing sports when you're 75 or "looking good for your age". I say: "This is what 75 looks like."'

    Stress: The sudden drop in oestrogen during menopause can cause psychological as well as physical symptoms (posed by model)

    Dr Marilyn Glenville, nutritionist, psychologist and author of the Natural Health Bible For Women, agrees. 'It's not just women in traditional cultures that celebrate older women,' she says.
    'In the U.S., women talk about "power surges" rather than hot flushes and there's a new feeling there that as they get older, women gain wisdom and authority.' This, she says, is reflected in the study's better results for American women.
    But the study is contentious. 'It's simply not true that hot flushes are the sole menopausal symptom,' says Charles Kingsland, a gynaecologist at the Liverpool Women's Hospital and a spokesman for the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists.
    He says: 'There is evidence that the sudden drop in oestrogen during menopause can cause psychological as well as physical symptoms. One of the most unpleasant, though fortunately easy to treat, is vaginal dryness.'

    However, he agrees that low self-esteem in middle age will aggravate symptoms. He says: 'Whether or not she is stressed, I would recommend that any woman suffering menopausal symptoms try HRT.'
    Yet for women who are unconvinced about HRT, the new study offers the promise of another treatment - talking therapies.
    'We are optimistic that CBT could soon be offered to help women deal with hot flushes and the stress in their lives,' says Professor Hunter.
    'There's no doubt that hot flushes are physiological.
    'But there are huge benefits in learning to dismiss the negativity around menopause and allow symptoms to flow over you.'

  2. #2
    better looking than Ned
    Rigger's Avatar
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    Yep when the wife is on the rag, you have to tread lightly around the house, best if I go fishing or a long ride as she can be a right little beast. But she does know that she gets that way and gives me some warning to get out her way. Nothing real bad just has a short temper and I really know how to push her buttons

  3. #3
    Gohills flip-flops wearer
    withnallstoke's Avatar
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    PMT or menopause? I'm confused.

  4. #4

    R.I.P.


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    ^So is teddy

  5. #5
    My kind of town
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    No headaches, irritability or any PMS symptoms at the Chitown Mansion 365 days a year.

    The missus thinks that PMS is psychosomatic.

    Lucky for me.

  6. #6
    R.I.P.
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    PMT and menopause are two different things....

  7. #7
    Philippine Expat Davis Knowlton's Avatar
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    Asked the Missus about this. Answer: Total bullshit. Case closed.

  8. #8
    R.I.P.
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    Just goes to show, some men have no knowledge of women. PMT can last from when a woman first has her period at thirteen until she stops having them.

    Menopause happens in older women who have stopped their periods - this usually happens around 50. When they cannot concieve anymore.

    Shit, and you all think you know everything about women and hormones and ages for having kids.

    Get a fucking book and read it. Or google is your friend.... Learn about women and their bodies.

    It might to you and them some good.

    I do not regret posting this thread,

  9. #9
    Thailand Expat nedwalk's Avatar
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    [QUOTE="patsycat"] Learn about women and their bodies.[/QUOT

    i am doing my best!!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by patsycat View Post
    Just goes to show, some men have no knowledge of women. PMT can last from when a woman first has her period at thirteen until she stops having them.
    yes we know, 365 days of the year too!


    Shit, and you all think you know everything about women and hormones and ages for having kids.
    I think us guys will happily admit to knowing fuck all about women and that we will never understand them

    Get a fucking book and read it. Or google is your friend.... Learn about women and their bodies.
    Nah why bother, Its different for each and every one of you, how's a guy suposed to keep up with it all.


    I do not regret posting this thread,
    Niether do I, it's always fun watching a woman trying to rationalize her gender
    It wasn't me!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedwalk View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by patsycat
    Learn about women and their bodies.
    i am doing my best!!
    Keep at it Ned, If you get through enough of em you just might figure it out

  12. #12
    Thailand Expat nedwalk's Avatar
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    2weeks outa 4 my missus ain,t home 1 week outa those 2 i leave home cause a monster moves in..so 1 week of happiness out of 4..i like the odds

  13. #13
    Out there...
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    [quote=nedwalk;1471576]
    Quote Originally Posted by patsycat
    Learn about women and their bodies.[/QUOT

    i am doing my best!!
    Me too mate.

    I do feel my sample size is too small at this point though.

    I will report back when i reach 4 figures.

    However, early indications seem to point to a total inability of men to understand women (and vice versa).

    Also PMT varies enormously from women to women.

    My last gf became a psychotic, possessed, demonic type of a person for 1 week in 4. I barely survived the relationship. Current hole seems unaffected. I'm unable to explain these vast differences.

    The research will continue.
    "Slavery is the daughter of darkness; an ignorant people is the blind instrument of its own destruction; ambition and intrigue take advantage of the credulity and inexperience of men who have no political, economic or civil knowledge. They mistake pure illusion for reality, license for freedom, treason for patriotism, vengeance for justice."-Simón Bolívar

  14. #14
    Gohills flip-flops wearer
    withnallstoke's Avatar
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    Bad news for the chaps. Pmt is merely a forewarning of the shit you will put up with when it gives way to menopause.

  15. #15
    Out there...
    StrontiumDog's Avatar
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    Thanks for the heads up.

    My intention is never to stay with a lady long enough to find out

    Good advice there mate. Cheers.

  16. #16
    Member Cenovis's Avatar
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    Now at least the Brits found something where they are still leading the world.

  17. #17
    The cold, wet one
    November Rain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sdigit
    Niether do I, it's always fun watching a woman trying to rationalize her gender __________________
    What is she trying to rationalise? She's pointing out that Teddy (& some others it seems) is too stupid to realise pms/pmt and menopause are entirely different things.

    A little lengthy perhaps. My version would have been a little more concise:

    Teddy you're a tedious, misogynistic clown who doesn't know his arse from his elbow

    but Pats isn't nearly as rude as me.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by patsycat View Post
    Just goes to show, some men have no knowledge of women. PMT can last from when a woman first has her period at thirteen until she stops having them.

    Menopause happens in older women who have stopped their periods - this usually happens around 50. When they cannot concieve anymore.

    Shit, and you all think you know everything about women and hormones and ages for having kids.

    Get a fucking book and read it. Or google is your friend.... Learn about women and their bodies.

    It might to you and them some good.

    I do not regret posting this thread,
    Geez, next you'll be telling us that they can have organisms too...

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rigger View Post
    Yep when the wife is on the rag, you have to tread lightly around the house, best if I go fishing or a long ride as she can be a right little beast. But she does know that she gets that way and gives me some warning to get out her way. Nothing real bad just has a short temper and I really know how to push her buttons


    I am with you Rigger I go into hiding there no way that I will stay home 1 week before the big red sign starts, f-ck that.

  20. #20
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by November Rain
    Teddy you're a tedious, misogynistic clown who doesn't know his arse from his elbow
    On the evidence of this thread that could be the least of his problems: he could well have difficulty discerning the difference between female genitalia and an elbow.

  21. #21
    R.I.P.
    patsycat's Avatar
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    I just HATE it that men seem to think that when we have a bit of a hissy it is all down to the fact that we are either a bit this or that.

    Can it not be down to fact that we are fed up? And would like to be treated nice for once?

  22. #22
    R.I.P.
    patsycat's Avatar
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    I have seen men have hissy fits also, so it is not only a female trait.

    They dance around, stamping their feet like little boys having a tantrum. My thing thing thingy...

  23. #23
    The cold, wet one
    November Rain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntRobertson
    he could well have difficulty discerning the difference between female genitalia and an elbow.
    Or his own genitalia and his elbow. Actually that would explain both his lack of success with women & his bitterness towards them.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by November Rain View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sdigit
    Niether do I, it's always fun watching a woman trying to rationalize her gender __________________
    What is she trying to rationalise? She's pointing out that Teddy (& some others it seems) is too stupid to realise pms/pmt and menopause are entirely different things.
    As I'm sure you know I was talking in jest, nothing I said was was meant in any malicious way and I have nothing but the greatest respect for women and the trials they must endure as a result of their gender.
    .
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    Jeez chicks are testy when they're on

  25. #25
    R.I.P.
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    Take a flying leap

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