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  1. #1
    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    Get Lost, Mate. Australia's slide from being the Lucky Country

    This week's edition of Time Magazine has a very interesting article on the back page about the changing face of Australia . . . no, not the visual change of immigrants from across the globe but the change to nationalism bordering on Xenophobia.

    I used to like that Aussies didn't really give a flying one about the flag, the monarchy, politicians and who your next door neighbour was as long as he was a good bloke. I mean, we have so many Greeks, Italians, Vietnamese, Chinese, Yugoslavs, South Americans, Brits, Irish, Germans etc . . . in the country that the whole mish-mash was kind of good.

    Then a couple of years ago I noticed a change in attitude . . . Aussies were becoming more vociferous in their mis-placed nationalism. I had only ever seen one racially motivated incident in all my years there . . . two skinheads beating the living daylights out of a Vietnamese kid . . . and bystanders stopped the fight.

    Then the Cronulla shit-fest really blew me away . . . what a bunch or arrogant, ignorant, thick bunch of fuckwits to waltz around beating up people . . . draped in the FLAG! I'm not saying some of the antagonists were not Lebanese or wherever from the Middle East . . . but have a fight and then leave it . . .

    When I went to Sydney and the South Coast in January for a few days the feeling of unease on the part of white Australians was palpable . . . mind you, it was a matter of 'spot the Aussie' in Sydney.

    I don't completely agree with the writer, I believe she overemphasises the importance of Pauline Hanson and paints her in the light from the viewpoint of someone who sees any mention of immigration restriction as a slap in the face, but many things have changed in our sleepy little piece of dirt far away from anywhere, except our dag-cousins New Zealand.

    Anyway, I believe this is pretty much confined to Sydney . . . interestingly also the main station where immigrants get off the planes and boats.

    I know there will be posts about 'fuckin' wogs, Muzzies, slopes etc...' but I find it a shame that this is happening . . . especially since whiteys have only been there a few generations themselves.

    Get Lost, Mate


    By Sharon Verghis Thursday, May. 14, 2009

    It was on one of those blue-sky, Sydney summer afternoons early last year when I first realized something had gone awry with the Australian flag. The date was Jan. 26, 2008 — Australia Day. I'd just returned to Sydney as a freelance journalist after some years in New York City and was having lunch at a pub in the beachfront suburb of Newport when an uneasy, skin-prickling moment dawned.

    Around me were hundreds of young white men and women, many of them drunk, chanting the national war cry — "Aussie, Aussie, Aussie, oi oi oi!" Almost all were sporting the Australian flag. It was painted on cheeks, tattooed on backs and chests, worn as a sarong, bikini top, scarf or bandana, wrapped around shoulders and emblazoned on T shirts and baseball caps.

    I'd never seen so many manifestations of it. Was this a new fashion accessory, or some kind of political statement?


    My husband, a white Australian who grew up in Sydney in the 1970s, was bemused. It would have been "absolutely unthinkable" for him, or any of his friends, he said, to have gone out to a pub wearing a flag or chanting nationalist slogans as young men. I knew what he meant.

    I grew up in Sutherland Shire, in Sydney's south, where my family — South Indians from Malaysia — had settled after immigrating in 1988. And although the Shire, as it's called, is one of the most Anglo-Saxon regions of the country, it was like the rest of Australia in its laid-back attitude to national sentiment. Sure, it was good to be Australian, but the rest of that stuff — the flag-waving, the chest-thumping — was the province of those jingoistic Yanks.



    When I was a teenager, the flag fluttered benignly on national holidays. There were occasions on which it flew prolifically, such as the 1988 national bicentenary celebrations or the 2000 Sydney Olympics. But generally it was not hawkishly displayed on front lawns, from cars or on bare flesh.

    My husband asked one of the revelers why he was wearing the flag. He grinned and drawled, "Why? Because we're Australians, mate. We're proud of it, and we're not afraid to say it."


    Australians never used to have to say it. Pride in the country was largely unmentioned, taken for granted. In recent years, however, there's been a surge of racially tinged nationalism, particularly among the young and coalescing around the Australian flag, which has become the symbol of a new tribe of όber-patriots up and down the land. In 1997, anti-immigration politician Pauline Hanson draped herself in an Australian flag for one of the country's most notorious campaign photos — a testament to her "Australianness," and specifically her white Australianness.



    In December 2005, during the infamous Cronulla Beach race riots, thousands of youths draped in flags rampaged against nonwhites; just a few weeks later, at a large music festival in Sydney, flag-waving revelers were at it again, harassing nonwhites and prompting the event's organizer to decry the "racism disguised as patriotism" that such behavior represented.


    On Australia Day this year, for the fourth time in a row since Cronulla, violent nationalism came to the fore. The flag — my flag — was the emblem of choice for drunken nationalist outbursts across the nation; in Wollongong, south of Sydney, Australia Day violence was the worst police had ever seen, with mobs of drunken, flag-clad teenagers brawling in the streets. In Manly, in north Sydney, an 80-strong flag-waving mob harassed and assaulted nonwhite passers-by and shop owners, jumped on cars and chanted "Aussie pride."


    In the few years away, I'd missed this rise of ultra-nationalism and somehow not noticed the way the Australian flag had become embedded with a silent message for nonwhite Australians: "You're out, and we're in." It's a message that affects a large proportion of the country.

    Since the removal of the last vestiges of the White Australia Policy in 1973, Australia has become markedly multiracial. The 2006 census showed that of a 20 million – strong population, over 40% were either born overseas or have at least one parent born overseas. After English, the most common languages spoken are Italian, Greek, Cantonese, Arabic and Mandarin.


    That hot afternoon at Newport showed a far different Australia: not a rainbow mosaic, but the monochromatic world of the John Howard generation. These white youths had grown up during the decade of the former Prime Minister's conservative administration — they had witnessed the tacit acceptance of Hanson and her divisive politics, and had been caught up in the panicky xenophobia that swept the nation in response not only to the arrival of asylum seekers from Afghanistan, Iraq and elsewhere, but also to the growing visibility and affluence of Australia's nonwhite communities.



    All this went through my mind as I watched them dance, sing and wave their new battle standard in the sea breeze.
    Get Lost, Mate - TIME

  2. #2
    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    yes - has been growing for years

    along with media corps watching the cash roll in while they peddle the limpics or some other steroid sucking frenzy.

    whats wrong with just wearing an aussie jersey to the cricket or rugby and telling the kiwis they are a bunch of cnuts.

    television is turning oz into a bunch of pseudo seppos lapping up the worst of the franchised culture.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    After Gibberish, the most common languages spoken are Italian, Greek, Cantonese, Arabic and Mandarin.
    Corrected.

  4. #4
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    I'm with this sheila and I find the flag wearing drips quite sickening too. I reckon a lot of the old diggers would be rolling in their graves on Anzac day watching pissed idiots celebrating with flag capes and 18 schooners under their belts.

    Flags are meant to be flown and there are there is a etiquette for the Australian flag as there is for the flags of other nations.


    It is generally not desirable to fly the flag outdoors when the weather is particularly inclement because exposure to severe winds and rain may damage the flag or pole on which it is displayed.
    Never in any way should disrespect be shown the Australian National Flag.
    • The Australian National Flag should never be dipped to any person or thing with the sole exception of the Sovereign. Regimental colours, State flags, and organization or institutional flags may be dipped as a mark of honour.

    The Australian National Flag should never be displayed with the Union down except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property.
    The Australian National Flag should never touch anything beneath it - ground, floor, water, or merchandise. When the flag is lowered, no part of it should touch the ground or any other object; it should be received by waiting hands and arms. To store the flag it should be folded neatly and ceremoniously.
    The Australian National Flag should never be carried horizontally, but it should always be aloft and free.
    • Always allow the Australian National Flag to fall free - never use the Australian National Flag as wearing apparel, bedding or drapery, festooned, drawn back, nor up in folds.

    The Australian National Flag should never be fastened, displayed, used, or stored in a manner which will permit it to be easily torn, soiled or damaged in any way.
    Never use the Australian National Flag as a covering or drape for a ceiling.
    • Never place anything on the Australian National Flag.
    The Australian National Flag should never have placed upon it, or on any part of it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture or drawing of any nature.

    Never use the Australian National Flag for receiving, holding, carrying or delivering anything.
    • The Australian National Flag should not be embroidered on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs and the like, printed or otherwise impressed on paper napkins or boxes or anything that is designed for temporary use or discard.

    Advertising signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the flag is flown.
    Never use any part of the Australian National Flag as a costume or athletic uniform. A flag patch may be affixed to uniforms of military personnel, firemen, policemen and members of patriotic organizations.
    Never display the Australian National Flag from a float except from a staff, or so suspended that its folds fall free as though staffed.

    The flag should be cleaned and mended when necessary.

    • When the Australian National Flag is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, it should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning, privately.

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    Sad but also half true.

    It sickens me when I see it but it really is a very very small minority but as Baldrick mentions, the media seems to make a habit of covering these sorts of things.

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    For those that actually want to read what was written...

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Longprong
    It is generally not desirable to fly the flag outdoors when the weather is particularly inclement because exposure to severe winds and rain may damage the flag or pole on which it is displayed. Never in any way should disrespect be shown the Australian National Flag.

    * The Australian National Flag should never be dipped to any person or thing with the sole exception of the Sovereign. Regimental colours, State flags, and organization or institutional flags may be dipped as a mark of honour.

    The Australian National Flag should never be displayed with the Union down except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property. The Australian National Flag should never touch anything beneath it - ground, floor, water, or merchandise. When the flag is lowered, no part of it should touch the ground or any other object; it should be received by waiting hands and arms. To store the flag it should be folded neatly and ceremoniously. The Australian National Flag should never be carried horizontally, but it should always be aloft and free.

    * Always allow the Australian National Flag to fall free - never use the Australian National Flag as wearing apparel, bedding or drapery, festooned, drawn back, nor up in folds.

    The Australian National Flag should never be fastened, displayed, used, or stored in a manner which will permit it to be easily torn, soiled or damaged in any way. Never use the Australian National Flag as a covering or drape for a ceiling.

    * Never place anything on the Australian National Flag. The Australian National Flag should never have placed upon it, or on any part of it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture or drawing of any nature.

    Never use the Australian National Flag for receiving, holding, carrying or delivering anything.

    * The Australian National Flag should not be embroidered on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs and the like, printed or otherwise impressed on paper napkins or boxes or anything that is designed for temporary use or discard. Advertising signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the flag is flown.

    Never use any part of the Australian National Flag as a costume or athletic uniform. A flag patch may be affixed to uniforms of military personnel, firemen, policemen and members of patriotic organizations. Never display the Australian National Flag from a float except from a staff, or so suspended that its folds fall free as though staffed.

    The flag should be cleaned and mended when necessary.

    * When the Australian National Flag is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, it should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning, privately.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Longprong
    I'm with this sheila and I find the flag wearing drips quite sickening too. I reckon a lot of the old diggers would be rolling in their graves on Anzac day watching pissed idiots celebrating with flag capes and 18 schooners under their belts.
    yup. spot on.


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    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick
    whats wrong with just wearing an aussie jersey to the cricket or rugby and telling the kiwis they are a bunch of cnuts.
    Ah, the way the world should be!

    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick
    along with media corps watching the cash roll in while they peddle the limpics or some other steroid sucking frenzy.
    And that's the point, isn't it. The media 'glorifies' this kind of behaviour while decrying it . . . and that becomes infectious.

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent_Smith
    Corrected
    Prick!

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Longprong
    I'm with this sheila and I find the flag wearing drips quite sickening too. I reckon a lot of the old diggers would be rolling in their graves
    Yes, indeed.

    Quote Originally Posted by MeMock
    Sad but also half true.
    More than half, I'd say.


    I was taking the girls to the playground about two weeks ago and met another whitey, turns out he's Australian from Sydney's northern suburbs, married to a Malaysian Malay, working here, and we started discussing this issue. It was uncanny but he said pretty much what was in the article . . .

    Aussie Pride? Yes, I think Aussies are proud, but not to the extent of this flag-waving, 'we are Aussies' kind of shit.
    I like the fact that we can wear our hearts on our sleeves without sounding boorish . . . except at the cricket or rugby!

    Another things I like is what we see on this thread . . . we can decry this kind of nationalism where others wouldn't, we don't go on about how we're the best yadda yadda yadda . . .

    We can't stand our politicians, right or left or in the middle - there are no extremes in our political landscape and no extremists for one side or the other . . . just look at what the bastard system did to Peter Garrett!!!!!

    . . and we can openly criticise our country without being ostracised and called Un-Australian.

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    God forbid. You can't get much worse than that.

    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick
    television is turning oz into a bunch of pseudo seppos lapping up the worst of the franchised culture.

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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    . . and we can openly criticise our country without being ostracised and called Un-Australian.
    positively UN-AUSTRALIAN not to criticise our country!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingwilly
    positively UN-AUSTRALIAN not to criticise our country!
    Guess that makes everybody Australian then

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    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    Agent Smith is cruising for a bruising . . .

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    I see nothing wrong with being proud of one's country, and waving the flag. Especially since it was a special day to be proud. The young people, may be more proud, possibly because they have never been out of the country?

    Canadians are very proud, and talking about flag waving (the Americans are worse). Nothing wrong with being a little proud.

    Multiculturalism is something to be proud of, and should also be celebrated. I know a few Canadians who are living in Australia, and were happily sponsored to become citizens.

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    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    That's hardly the point of the OP nor the discussion, though, PB.

    I remember my backpacking days when Aussies only had a little toy koala or 'roo hanging off their backpacks . . . and that was sufficient to foster an identity, there was something friendly to it.

    We're not talking about Australia Day only and I would argue against your assertion that only people who have never been out of their country display overt nationalism. Australians are generally a travelled bunch, usually after high school or Uni . . . we're off for a while to explore.

    Multiculturalism is a fact that has developed our nation, nothing to be proud about that, it is a fact . . . nationalism raises its ugly head and forgets that it is exactly these people who developed Australia into a modern country . . . which it was NOT even in the 70's. It was a backward place.

    Here's an interesting article from the Time archive:

    Asians, Keep Out!

    Friday, Dec. 20, 1963

    Underpopulated Australia spent $30 million in 1963 to attract new citizens, since war's end has increased its population from 7.5 million to a mere 11 million. That adds up to fewer inhabitants than Pennsylvania has, in an area 66 times larger.



    Nonetheless, Australia clings to some of the world's most restrictive immigration laws, has traditionally discriminated against Asian and other nonwhite immigrants in order to preserve what Immigration Minister Alexander Downer has described as "an Anglican European community embodying all that is best of the Old World and the New."


    Australia's "immigration apartheid" dates from the latter half of the 19th century, when 50,000 Chinese flocked there to work farms and gold mines; white colonists, fearful that the newcomers would depress wage levels, clamored for restrictive laws. Today fewer than 80,000 Asians live permanently in the country, and experience little racial discrimination, but only a few "distinguished and highly qualified Asians" are ever granted residence permits.


    Whim Creek. The White Australia policy is often carried to absurd, esoteric extremes. Recently, five Japanese technicians employed by a Japanese-controlled mining concern—at, of all places, Whim Creek in Western Australia—were convicted of violating an obscure 1904 law specifying that "no Asiatic or African alien shall be employed in any capacity whatever in or about any mine claim." As a result, Western Australia's state legislature last week repealed the law, but virtually negated its action by adopting an amendment specifying that Asians must still get government permits to work in the mines.


    There is even less hope for liberalization of national immigration policies, whose principal victims are the parents and children of mixed marriages. One typical case this month involved an Indian couple who came to Australia in 1962 to live with their two sons, both of whom are married to Australian girls, only to be ordered out of the country. Said the father: "I've found hell in Australia."


    Skeptical Neighbors. Critics of the White Australia policy, including leading churchmen and educators, object that only through selective Asian immigration can the government hope to attract all the skilled citizens it needs. Moreover, they argue, Australia can never realize its potential as a leader of Southeast Asia so long as its neighbors are convinced that Australians are white supremacists.



    Prime Minister Sir Robert Menzies in fact ordered more liberal interpretation of immigration policy, but he insisted during the recent election campaign that he would never permit any basic reform in the law. To do so, said he, "would create in Australia the kind of dreadful problems they now have in other countries."
    Asians, Keep Out! - TIME

    The White Australia Policy was only 'abolished' in 1966

    Australia used to be a place where four cities, thousands of miles apart, operated fairly independently of one another, then a type of fusion started based on immigration . . . and for the same reason, magnified, it is starting to turn us into a backwater yet again due to the xenophobic attitudes of what amounts to nothing more than thugs.

    My wife won't live in Australia, and I can't blame her, so for us it's either being expats for the rest of our lives or go back to . . . . . . . New Zealand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    That's hardly the point of the OP nor the discussion, though, PB.

    I remember my backpacking days when Aussies only had a little toy koala or 'roo hanging off their backpacks . . . and that was sufficient to foster an identity, there was something friendly to it.

    We're not talking about Australia Day only and I would argue against your assertion that only people who have never been out of their country display overt nationalism. Australians are generally a travelled bunch, usually after high school or Uni . . . we're off for a while to explore.

    Multiculturalism is a fact that has developed our nation, nothing to be proud about that, it is a fact . . . nationalism raises its ugly head and forgets that it is exactly these people who developed Australia into a modern country . . . which it was NOT even in the 70's. It was a backward place.

    Here's an interesting article from the Time archive:

    Asians, Keep Out!

    Friday, Dec. 20, 1963

    Skeptical Neighbors. Critics of the White Australia policy, including leading churchmen and educators, object that only through selective Asian immigration can the government hope to attract all the skilled citizens it needs. Moreover, they argue, Australia can never realize its potential as a leader of Southeast Asia so long as its neighbors are convinced that Australians are white supremacists.



    Prime Minister Sir Robert Menzies in fact ordered more liberal interpretation of immigration policy, but he insisted during the recent election campaign that he would never permit any basic reform in the law. To do so, said he, "would create in Australia the kind of dreadful problems they now have in other countries."
    Asians, Keep Out! - TIME

    The White Australia Policy was only 'abolished' in 1966

    Australia used to be a place where four cities, thousands of miles apart, operated fairly independently of one another, then a type of fusion started based on immigration . . . and for the same reason, magnified, it is starting to turn us into a backwater yet again due to the xenophobic attitudes of what amounts to nothing more than thugs.

    My wife won't live in Australia, and I can't blame her, so for us it's either being expats for the rest of our lives or go back to . . . . . . . New Zealand.
    Interesting article. I was referring to the first article, because she was referring to Australia Day as her example. She also mentioned that she noticed the Nationalism in the young people, hence my opinions, and part of my questioning.

    I kind of agree with the Sceptical neighbors of 1963. Xenophic attitudes continue to exist, and exist in many countries. I think of SK, which was once a hermit state, and only allowed missionaries to enter the country. Talking about a nationalistic country.

    I read that there are many Asians living in Cairns area of Australia. My cousin is married to a Japanese girl, and they have migrated to Cairns, and are now full fledged citizens. It will be interesting to hear their point of view on this subject, when I visit them in August.

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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    That's hardly the point of the OP nor the discussion, though, PB.
    she good at that...

    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    Australians are generally a travelled bunch, usually after high school or Uni . . . we're off for a while to explore.
    In some ways yes, in some ways no. Many an Australia will scoff at the idea of travelling overseas... "why mate, plenty to see here first!"

    I've met Australians who have never travelled interstate, let alone overseas...

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    I think the trick for most if not all Western countries is to find the difficult balance between liberal and uncomplicated issueing of Working Visas and very restrictive laws on illegal entry and rapid, unbureaucratic extradition in case of any criminal involvement. Possibility of permanent stay if a: employed b: language fluency and c: no criminal record.
    The principle is that those who do well should be rewarded, those who don't get harshly punished.
    This should help getting a better image for foreign workers among the "moderate and concerned citizens" and isolates the nationalistic and xenophobic idiots who dream of a "pure" Australia..

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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    or go back to . . . . . . . New Zealand

    gasp....are you a fcukin kiwi ???


    Quote Originally Posted by phuketbound
    they have migrated to Cairns
    no beach in cairns

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    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    or go back to . . . . . . . New Zealand

    gasp....are you a fcukin kiwi ???
    My part of the relationship is NOT a KIWI!!!! (Thank Mrs Hat for that distinction)

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    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat
    (Thank Mrs Hat for that distinction)
    is there something you are not telling us ?


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    ^^ Keepin' up the ANZAC relations ther PH.

    I hadn't relly thought about this before but, yes, it does seem that we are losing our identity both here an OS.

    When I was a kid our school band played the national anthem ( first the Queen thingy and later Advance Australia Fair) and had a flag ceremony.

    I am fairly sure that is now highly illegal as some one from some country somewhere, who now lives squarely in OZ, would be highly offended and would expect the flag and anthem of their country to be played also. (Ok, not the kids, they would be happy with anything, but the parents)

    But, hang on a minute, you aren't in your country any more coz it's fucked and you and your people fucked it and we happily invite you to beautiful Oz and watch as they fuck our country in exactly the same way they fucked theirs.

    I don't expect everyone who comes here to abandon their heriteage and adopt an ocker twang but I do expect people nto respect the country in which we live.

    Many countries in the world have it as law but we just hope they will try.

    Rant over............................


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    said it before will say it again, the shit that happened in sydney had been brewing for a long time and it exploded, when migrants set up their own little enclaves and don.t assimilate into their host culture there will always be prejudices on both side of the fence, where igrew up as did davearn we had mates from all colours of the world from the immigration of the sixties all here cutting cane and helping getting this great place up and running, now we bring all of the refos in and place them in one little place all together, nothing wrong with wanting to retains one heretige but leave your fucking politics in the country you escaped from and RESPECT the country that opend its arms to you! i ferking love this land and am fiercely proud, but i love takeing the piss too

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    farm4.static.flickr.com


    biggest load of garbage I've seen in a long time

    comment belongs to pic posted NOT OP
    .

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    Proudest Aussie on the planet and ain't shy to say so.

  25. #25
    Thailand Expat
    Marmite the Dog's Avatar
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    08-09-2014 @ 10:43 AM
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    The issue of immigration is a thorny one in nearly every 'white' country at the moment, for a variety of reasons, but with regard to Australia, it seems that they are so desperate to attract skilled and even semi-skilled workers, they've basically opened the doors to anyone.

    Why is this? I'd say it's because the current citizens of Australia aren't pulling their weight and are either poorly educated or just bone-idle. It's all good and well enjoying the fruits of your labour, but you have to do the labour first; not just rest on the laurels of your forefathers.

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