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  1. #1
    Thailand Expat Backspin's Avatar
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    10 reasons why Thailand is tired of western tourists

    I agree with this. Western tourists are annoying. Ten reasons why Western foreign tourists are not wanted as badly by the Thai Tourism Ministry versus Indians, Chinese, Russians, Koreans, etc. - Pattaya Unplugged

    These are in no specific order of importance. By the way, the author is a Western American and is guilty of most of these reasons himself before anyone alleges bias, etc. Also, keep in mind by no means do the reasons sum up every Western Foreigner, as many don’t fall into these categories or is how I feel, but rather how they are seen by the powers that be.


    Here we go:



    1. Western foreigners tend to complain more online, troll, write negative reviews and feedback and bicker among themselves in general. If you are bilingual or read comment threads and forums, it is mostly Western foreigners from England, America, Australia and Scandanavia complaining. In native language forums for India and Southeast Asian countries there is significantly less complaining and open infighting. This extends not only to forums but in person which brings me to number two….


    2. Western foreigners are more demanding in person in general. If something goes wrong, especially Americans like myself, we complain loudly, long and demand a resolution, to talk to managers, etc. Many of the other tourist demographics will not make mountains out of molehills and or get upset over relatively minor issues. There is a reason why most news articles about a foreigner being attacked are usually Westerners, with the odd Korean and Russian here and there. The sad thing here is that for those from a Western customer service upbringing they understand that a complaint is an opportunity to fix a problem and generally a customer who cares. Because of the face issue with many SEA nationals, they see a complaint as a personal attack or an insult, when it is not.


    3. Westerners have in general more of a sense of entitlement than many other countries. Everyone wants to feel important but many Westerners, including myself, want to feel the most important. For someone from a society with billions of people or a social structure that values the group over the individual like the Japanese or parts of India, this isn’t as big of an issue and you get less of the first items, complaining and more demands.


    4. Westerners often want to do something their way, and not go with the flow. I am very guilty of this. We are used to things how we like it and if it isn’t just the way we like it, to hell with everyone else. Folks from some societies and cultures are often used to things not going their way, the government running everything and not having the freedoms we often do. Therefore, they tend to go with the flow easier and not complain, demand, etc. This can extend to minor things like demanding off menu items or services that aren’t on the menu and getting upset about it.


    5. We often don’t spend as much as people think. There is a myth, and it is a myth, that no Russians, Chinese, Indians etc. Spend money on vacation. There are plenty of frugal and cheap Charlie’s in every country and there are also big spenders in every demographic. Some of the cheapest cost cutting people I have met in Thailand were my fellow Westerners. Some of the largest spenders I have met were from the above demographics. It is mostly true, however, that most of the Chinese, Russians and Indians don’t spend their money at bars and gogos. There is a lot more to Pattaya then the bar scene.


    6. There are simply more of them then us. Thailand is focused on a McDonald’s style business, called capital turns, in which they are focused on amount of customers and how many times they can turn over a dollar vs. single high spenders. Many people don’t understand the amount of Chinese and Indians that are growing into middle class and traveling for the first time. With less complaints, demands, entitlement and drama focusing on numbers, which add up over time. If only one percent of this countries nationals spend good money, that’s larger then many other Western countries.


    7. They still like package tours. Most of us westerners grew out of package and group tours decades ago. The Chinese, the Indians and some Russians have not. This makes them easy to bring from one high profit tourist attraction to another. They are brought to markets and malls where items are significantly higher than local markets but since they don’t know any better they spend here. Many of these businesses are sometimes called scams by long standing westerners here but they aren’t really scams, just higher priced businesses. The Chinese especially tend to spend a lot at these places, especially gold and trinket shops at temples they visit.


    8. Even if they don’t spend money on pre-booked tours, the little money they did spend goes back to the Thai economy at various levels. It is a myth that the money doesn’t go back into the local economy. It is obvious a lot of folks commenting and reading on forums and social media groups know little to nothing about macro and micro economics. Regardless if the company is Chinese owned, and if the tour was booked and paid for in China or India at a heavy discount, the local attractions are all staffed with thousands of Thai Nationals, many who are struggling right now with the Chinese group tour ban due to the Coronavirus. These Thais depend on the attractions for their salary and livelihoods. The alcohol, licenses, gas for the buses, sheets and furniture for the hotels, the handymen, the seafood, the electric and water, etc etc are all Thai and go right back to Thailand. Even if the cheapest tourist comes on a package tour that includes, say, the Sanctuary of Truth, and spends nothing, his initial ticket helps support the local Thai workers, builders, food vendors, gas for his bus, etc. Contrary to belief, spending money at a bar is not the sole way to judge a tourist who spends good money. It is true, however, that in many cases this does not help the mom and pop style Thai businesses and rather helps the giant tourist attractions that are already raking in dough.


    9. It is simply closer and more affordable for them. For me as an American to come here from the East Coast it is nearly thirty five hours door to door and a very expensive ticket. A flight from India can be a few hours and found for very cheap for a few nights. Bringing large amounts of tourists from these countries is simply easier due to the distance. Malaysian tourists have been increasing steadily in Thailand recently due to successful tourism promotions and offers and is also very close.


    10. Most are not here for the red light district. I saved the best for last, but it’s true. This fact angers many of the long standing visitors and fans of the red light district but it’s true. Most Russians and Chinese have zero interest in the red light district and come with families. Some Indians have interest but middle class and business visitors are becoming more common. This pleases the powers that be due to showing the tourist attractions, architecture, religious temples, culture and other items. Sure, they might walk through the district but spending money in bars is a completely different matter. Some western foreigners would prefer to come and sit in a bar for two weeks shitfaced and never go anywhere else or see any of the country. I fall into this guilty category as well. The tourists coming here for family activities and business are generally wanted much more then the bar-stool crowd.


    Now, of course, these are general reasons and there are exceptions to every rule. But this is what is most often seen and discussed as to why the powers that be go after other countries then Western foreigners. There are more reasons but this is a good beginning. Thank you for taking the time to read this.

  2. #2
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    In general, I have to agree with these points. I'm 'suffering' here in Luang Prabang because my favorite morning cafe has closed (lack of tourists). Rather than spending a peaceful 60 minutes nibbling my tasty baguette, whilst listening to 2 old French guys chatting quietly, I now have to put up with the raucous foreign NGO types at the remaining open cafe - mostly from the USA, 'lecturing' the local Lao staff on how to do this and that, especially " That's not how it's done in the USA, you have a lot to learn" blah blah blah. Fcuking annoying. I didn't move to south-east Asia to be bombarded with this crap! (I've fulfilled your point 1 ==> bickering amongst themselves...)
    Groping women when you're old is fine - everyone thinks you're senile

  3. #3
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    I think the title should be "10 reasons why Teakdoor is tired of skidmarks bullshit".

  4. #4
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon43 View Post
    raucous foreign NGO types
    So not tourists then.

  5. #5
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Lot of white man's guilt, there.

    Hope he feels better offloading some of it, but what a tedious piece.

  6. #6
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    Simon43's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    So not tourists then.
    Nope, no tourists in Laos - the borders are still closed

  7. #7
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    Personally, if it were not for those western oriented hotels, restaurants and air-conditioned bars and the company of English speaking fellow expats, and the not entirely insignificant fact my wife is Thai, I would have fucked off some years ago. Modern SE Asia has no cultural interest of its own except for the folkloric and one soon tires of their food which is limited and only interesting in the use of ingredients most might reasonably consider as inedible or repulsive, and while the scenery might have entranced at one stage even that becomes a bore with the never changing ubiquitous tropical rainforests, jungle clad hills, scrubby flatlands, rice paddies and mountains sweltering in the same muggy heat giving way to provincial towns and villages in varying states of squalor.
    Generally speaking if you can drink the water there is a free press and I don't think anywhere here in SE Asia qualifies which pretty much means nowhere is civilised and that's a bore.

  8. #8
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    Double whammy insurance requirements face more expats abroad.


    By Barry Kenyon

    February 10, 202108328

    Life isn’t getting any easier for retirees wanting to return to Thailand.

    Thousands of expats aged over 50 face additional hurdles if they leave Thailand and wish to return. Thai embassy websites worldwide have confirmed that foreigners requesting a non-O visa abroad, based on retirement, will need two kinds of insurance before the certificate of entry can be granted. The latest ruling also applies to expats who have a one-year retirement extension granted by Thai Immigration and based on a non-O visa, and wish to return to Thailand using a valid re-entry permit.



    The first compulsory insurance requirement – for every single foreigner wishing to enter Thailand – is cover of at least $100,000 for Covid-related illnesses. The policy is available online from a cartel of Thai companies under the aegis of The Thai General Insurance Association at Home - Covid 19 Insurance Costs vary according to the country of departure and length of stay, but the age of the applicant (up to 99 years) is irrelevant. A 12-months’ policy for travellers coming from UK is 43,200 baht or 12,160 for three months. The cover must be for the entire stay of the visa, or the period of reentry validity.

    The more difficult insurance, for some, is the separate requirement to have cover for general medical treatment (unrelated to Covid) for at least 400,000 baht for inpatient treatment and 40,000 baht for outpatients. Until recently, this requirement has been limited to retirees with 0/A (one year) and 0/X (10 years) visas granted by Thai embassies in the home country. It is also mandatory for those applying for the Special Tourist Visa (STV) which can be extended up to 270 days for long stay leisure travellers.


    Returning Elite visa holders need less insurance than retirees with a one year permit.
    Such insurance is readily available from several Thai companies online, but typically has an age cut-off point for new entrants of 70 or 75 years. In this regard, it is quite unlike the Covid insurance. Older expats may find it very difficult to obtain general medical cover or receive endorsed policies which exclude any claims. Some embassies, moreover, are insisting on a policy issued by a Thailand-based company and are said to be refusing foreign ones or ones that don’t specifically meet the small print of the above regulations.



    It is stressed that the above regulations apply only to those requesting a non-O visa, based on retirement, from Thai embassies abroad and to those requesting entry based on a re-entry permit. The requirement does not currently apply to retirees applying to Thai Immigration for an annual extension of stay based on an original non-O visa. They will meet the new requirement only after they leave the country and need a certificate of entry from their local Thai embassy.

    All other categories of foreigners entering Thailand are unaffected by the double whammy and need only Covid-19 insurance as described. In other words, work permit holders, tourists, permanent residents with a police red book, Elite card holders, business travellers, certain property owners, students and foreigners holding family or marriage visas need only insurance of at least US$100,000 in case they need coronavirus-related treatment. Fuller details of the documentation needed to enter Thailand are available at Thai embassy websites.

    Eleanor Dawson, a UK travel consultant said, “Thailand’s entry requirements are amongst the most complex in the world, with similar categories having quite different rules.” Asked when she thought matters might get back to normal, she added, “I think we are years away from international travel requiring only a passport and an air ticket. Perhaps never.”

    Visa agents in Thailand are suggesting that the expansion of double health policies for retirees may have various consequences. It may make the Elite visa more attractive as it provides multi-entry cover and needs only Covid cover to return to Thailand. A five year Elite visa costs 600,000 baht. Some retirees abroad may choose to enter Thailand with a tourist visa or visa exempt stamp – neither requiring the general medical insurance – and then apply at Thai Immigration for a new non-O visa and an annual extension based on it.

    Double whammy insurance requirements face more expats abroad - Pattaya Mail
    if this article is to be believed and the insurance requirements are mandated then life will indeed be difficult and many westerners will be rethinking their plans for retirement.

    my retirement visa has now expired and when i return later this year it will be on an extendable tourist visa, this will enable me to both run down the 800,000 that has been sitting in a bank account for 15 years and to avoid the yearly visit to immigration for visa renewal, with all its paperwork and associated forelock tugging dealing with those upstart goons was a procedure i detested.

  9. #9
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    The logic of course is beyond any reason except it seems to a Thai whose powers of cognition are recognised to lie somewhere between a chicken and a tree,

    Quite why they cannot simply state that any and all residences in Thailand attract a compulsory health insurance policy is mystifying.

    I have posted elsewhere that these policies represent poor value for the premiums which can vary of course depending on age. The only provider I could source, vide my post on visa thread, was the Kasikorn bank offering a policy at around 60,000 baht but this was limited to retirees already in Thailand and married to Thai spouses.

    Tax is right, essentially, once you hit the big 70 then forget it. A proper health insurance policy provider issuing indemnity for any new written business for anyone over 65 living in Thailand will want £4-6,000 per annum but at least it will pay for costs from £1 million upwards. In reality, the 400k + 40k baht insurance cover is simply a visa application fee. The Ksikorn policy was self declaratory and required no medical exam. but was limited to <70 year olds.

  10. #10
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    But of course only those not married to a Thai need 'forget it', assuming this does come into force.

    The rest of us will just go for the visa based on marriage.

  11. #11
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    And one surmises that even these morons will realise the absurdity of the anomaly and then impose the mandatory Thai health insurance policy, a policy so shite it costs over £1,500 to buy a pissing measly cover of £8,000 in-patient costs, on spouses seeking extensions to their Non-immig O spouse visa.

    Truly, these people are a piece of work.

  12. #12
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    Ukan Kizmiaz's Avatar
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    I thought package tourism was crap for the locals - vertical integration. Fly in on a russian airline, stay at a russian hotel, go on russian tours, buy russian trinket junk .

    evidence - I stayed at a Nai yang hotel a few years ago - full of russians and the gai yang seller out the front was russian - WTF!.
    Eating at the food cheap charlie food court at Swampy and there were a couple of tables of young uniformed russian tourist guide chickies sitting next to us. (they were wankingly hot too - the missus none too impressed as I 'lingered' over the som tum).


    post script - I understand why they dont like western tourists in thailand - who does!

  13. #13
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Suggesting commonality in the conduct of Japanese and Indian tourists, though?

    That's a bit of a stretch.

    I reckon the writer will feel more at ease after losing his virginity.

  14. #14
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    I have just checked Kasikorn and it seems they have reduced the premiums considerably. 500,000 inpatient + 50,000 opd now costs 18500 baht if no prescription cover is requested or 30,000 if you do. It's still not good value but better than before - the COVID insurance is of course a scam ....43,000 baht premium for a bug that only hospitalises <2% of the infected is fucking outrageous.

    I omitted to say that the Kasikorn policy is limited to foreigners who are: either WP holders with 6 months left on their stay, or who are resident in Thailand married to Thai with leave to remain endorsed in their passports showing a stay of a year and who intend to remain longer, and who can produce a marriage certificate and their partner's tabien baan.
    Last edited by Seekingasylum; 15-02-2021 at 07:28 PM.

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