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    It's VE day.

    Never heard of it to be honest but apparently it's the day the Brits celebrate giving the hun a damn good thrashing.
    What a waste of life. Pity someone didn't do Hitler in earlier and save everyone a lot of trouble.

    The Prince of Wales is to lead the nation’s two-minute silence to mark the 75th anniversary of the ending of the second world war in Europe.


    Prince Charles and the Duchess of Cornwall will pay their respects from Scotland at 11am on a day of celebration and commemoration that also includes an address by the Queen and a national singalong of the wartime classic We’ll Meet Again.


    Charles will later read extracts from the diary of his grandfather, George VI, written on 8 May 1945, to be broadcast on BBC One during the afternoon. The entries describe events including the royal family’s famous appearance on the balcony of Buckingham Palace.


    It's VE day.-veday-jpg

    Winston Churchill joins the royal family on the balcony of Buckingham Palace, London on VE Day. Photograph: AP


    While plans for VE Day 75 were cancelled due to Covid-19, national events have been adapted. A physically distanced wreath-laying will take place at Westminster, while the government is encouraging those in lockdown to join in from gardens, doorsteps and living rooms to celebrate Victory in Europe.

    Events include a National Toast and, instead of the planned street parties, 1940s-style tea parties in homes and gardens across the UK.

    VE Day 75 timetable: Prince Charles to lead event with two-minute silence | VE Day | The Guardian
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    Victory in Europe: proclamation to-day8 May 1945


    The war in Europe has ended with Germany’s unconditional surrender. Victory will be announced officially by the Prime Minister in a broadcast at three o’clock this afternoon and the King with broadcast at 9 pm.


    To-day will be regarded as VE Day, and both to-day and to-morrow will be public holidays.


    Explanation of the delay in making the official announcement lies in the importance attached to a simultaneous announcement in London, Washington and Moscow. The first news of the surrender came from German sources. At 2 pm yesterday the Danish radio announced that the German forces in Norway had capitulated and at 2.30 the German Foreign Minister, Count von Krosigk, announced the “unconditional surrender of all fighting German troops.”


    It's VE day.-veday2-jpg

    Nations rejoice at victory
    8 May 1945


    Scenes of rejoicing at the United Nations’ victory over Germany were last night reported from many countries.


    Rome: bells rang
    The great bells of St Peter’s and those of a hundred other Rome churches rang out in jubilation soon after the news that the European war had ended reached the city. Sirens, which had last were heard as a warning of the approach of Allied ‘planes, also sounded for ten minutes.


    Berne: two alerts
    In Switzerland, Allied flags were unfurled and crowds jammed the streets of Geneva to celebrate VE Day, but at Berne, where two air raids sounded yesterday, demonstrations were withheld until the official announcement is made.




    Brussels: high spirits
    At first people were quietly jubilant, but along the sunlit boulevards, where hundred of British and American soldiers mixed joyously with the crowd, spirits rose to a high pitch.


    Sweden: King’s hope
    King Gustav of Sweden expressed “warmest congratulations to Denmark and Norway now that our Nordic neighbours have one again become free and independent nations.” A second-floor restaurant in Stockholm last night hung six magnums of champagne out of the windows on ropes for passers-by to help themselves.


    Dublin: “battle” of flags
    About 3pm passers-by in the centre of the city were surprised to see students of Trinity College hoisting the Union Jack and the Red Flag over the main entrance to the university.


    Paris bewildered
    Shortly before six o’clock the newspapers began to come out announcing Donitz had capitulated. The sirens did not sound, however, and the crowd was puzzled, not knowing whether to believe the news.


    VE Day, The Guardian, 8 May 1945.
    Editorial: First light




    8 May 1945


    If peace be indivisible, this is not peace. Even at this moment we dare not forget that war still rages over a quarter of the globe, that British, Americans, and Chinese are being wounded or killed every hour of the day, and that many of the men who have won this victory in Europe will have again to screw their courage to the sticking-point and risk their lives in the Far East. And that is not an easy thing to do. Yet when all is said it remains a moment of immense deliverance. It is not only that for the first time for five and a half long years Europe no longer hears the sound of guns, and our ships can sail Western waters without fear of mine or submarine. It is not only that never again need women in London – or Berlin – start at the sound of the telephone because they fear the siren. It is rather the knowledge that children are playing on swings in the camp at Belsen and that all over Europe the slave workers of Germany, the prisoners, and the persecuted are trudging homewards, weary, broken, but free. We have solved nothing. We are no nearer the Golden Age. But at least we have stopped the onrush of evil. We have won the right to hope.




    Bishop Butler of the Analogy would walk for hours in his garden at Bristol on the darkest nights pondering the narrow line which divides the rational from the insane. On one such occasion he stopped short and exclaimed to his companion


    Why might not whole communities and public bodies be seized with fits of insanity as well as individuals! Nothing but this principle, that they are liable to insanity, can account for the major part of those transactions of which we read to history.


    It is tempting to-day to explain away the events of the past ten years in some such terms. (Is not Himmler himself reported to have said that Germany was now a vast lunatic asylum?) But this will not do. We may not know the answer to the troubles of mankind but at least we know some of the causes. We have learnt, or should have learn, how dangerous is the spirit of nationalism when harnessed to the fact of power. We have seen what can happen to a great nation which surrenders to its leaders the freedom of thought and speech and conscience. We have ourselves felt the terrible power of destruction which man has acquired through science uncontrolled by wisdom. We have learnt (at what a cost!) that the platitudes of Geneva were the urgent truth, and that the brotherhood of man, the unity of nations, and the indivisibility of peace are facts which we can no longer ignore. But knowledge is not enough. Fear, hatred, nationalism and the like are not rational states but emotions which for a long time will continue to govern human behaviour and which will be fed by the chaos and misery in Europe. Hunger and unemployment are not the best schools for reason and tolerance, but they will have many pupils.


    Over wide areas of Europe the bridges are broken; there is no link with the past But the past was not all bad, and we must nurse the embers of our civilisation until it can blaze again as it did after other great European catastrophes – after the age of the Barbarians and the long night of the Dark Ages, and after the Thirty Years War. To-day, the people of Europe want above all peace, security, and a decent living. But they also want again that sense of freedom, progress, and enjoyment of life which gave meaning to the nineteenth century. In spite of all that has happened, in spite of our failures and hesitation, the majority still look to the West. But if we fail them again, if we do not help them by our policy and example, they will turn to the East, accepting the loss of their individual freedom as the price of security and social progress. We must prove that just as liberal democracy is a match for dictatorship in war, so in peace it can provide for its people all and more than is offered by Communism and National Socialism. But it will not be easy. If the war has tried our courage and endurance, the peace will test our wisdom and our faith.
    This is an edited extract. Read the article in full.


    The War’s Official End
    9 May 1945


    The war against Germany officially came to an end at one minute past midnight this morning after a day of victory rejoicings by the people of Britain and her allies all over the world.


    Mr. Churchill’s broadcast declaration that the war had ended and that we might allow ourselves “a brief period of rejoicing” set the seal on celebrations which were already under way. The victory holiday will continue to-day before, as the King said in his broadcast to the nation last night, “we turn, fortified by success, to deal with our last remaining foe.”t


    The last act of the enemy’s surrender was arranged to be staged in Berlin yesterday. The Premier announced that the agreement ratifying the surrender instrument would be signed by Air Chief Marshal Tedder, General Lattre de Tassigny, and Marshal Zhukov for the Allies, and by Field Marshal Keitel and the Army, Navy, and Air Commanders-in-Chief for the Germans.


    Mr Churchill leads the crowd in song: floodlit Whitehall scenes
    9 May 1945


    Buckingham Palace and Whitehall were the centres of the great VE Day demonstrations here to-day. The Royal Family made several appearances on the balcony of the Palace and on one occasion were accompanied by Mr Churchill.


    The two Princesses, escorted by Guards officers, left the Palace after nightfall to mingle with the great crowds outside. The Prime Minister twice appeared on the balcony of the Ministry of health, and addressed a large crowd in Whitehall. On his second appearance, made just after 10 30 p.m. when the Houses of Parliament were floodlit, he conducted the singing of “Land of Hope and Glory.”


    Manchester’s victory day celebrations
    9 May 1945


    Manchester entered on its Victory in Europe rejoicings a little diffidently and the day was physically suited to the mood. It was at the outset grey and then, before all the flags in the city and suburbs had blossomed out, the clouds released a soft, warm rain that fell too generously for several hours.


    But it did not spoil the decorations and it did not unduly damp the spirits of the young, who were the chief merrymakers and who poured from the outskirts into the city centre in their jubilant though somewhat aimless thousands we in time for the one local ceremony that served as a common focus and cue – the broadcasting of the Premier’s message from before the Town Hall.
    Continue reading.




    Editorial: past tense




    11 May 1945


    The war in Europe has ended, but just how or when may well puzzle the historians. The German Government surrendered unconditionally at 2 41 am. (French time) on the morning of Monday, May 7, when General Jodl signed the Act of Military Surrender at Rheims. This Act laid down that all operations would cease at 11 1 pm. (Central European time) on the evening of Tuesday, May 8, although, as Mr Churchill said in his broadcast, “in the interests of saving lives the ceasefire began yesterday (May 7) to be sounded all along the front.” But Mr Churchill also said that “hostilities will end officially at one minute after midnight to-night, Tuesday, May 8”… or, to be strictly accurate, on the morning of Wednesday, May 9.


    This difference of an hour can, of course, be explained by the difference between Central European time and British time, but it does not alter the curious fact that “officially” the war ended for Germany at 11 pm on Tuesday, May 8, and for us at one minute after midnight on the morning of Wednesday, May 9. If this were all, the matter would be simple enough. It has, however, been further complicated by the Russian insistence on a second ceremony in Berlin. The reason for this is plain. There was nothing wrong with the surrender at Rheims, but the Russians felt that it would impress their defeat more strongly on the German people if the ceremony took place in Berlin, their capital, and if the document were signed by Field Marshal Keitel himself, the Chief of the German High Command and the best known of the Nazi generals. There was also the fact that, surrender or not, the Germans were still resisting the Red Army in Czechoslovakia.


    But it was one thing to agree on a second surrender and another to keep the first a secret. The Associated Press has been blamed (a little unjustly) because its correspondent at Supreme Allied Headquarters revealed the news to Britain and America. The correspondent may have been at fault, but it is clear that even if he had not sent the message the news would still have got out.
    Continue reading.






    The transition period: danger of spheres of influence
    From our Diplomatic Correspondent
    11 May 194
    London, Thursday
    While the last German units are laying down their arms all over Europe the rapid drama of events that led to their surrender gives place to a period of waiting upon political and diplomatic developments.


    In the liberated countries the change over from war to the transition period should not be technically difficult in theory, though the national and international problems are enormous everywhere. Elaborate preparations have been made for this transition by the Great Powers, the Governments in exile, and their resistance movements at home. The time has now come to apply these plans. In practice the application of the blue-print seems to bring its difficulties, and, even technically, some rather delicate situations have arisen in almost every count, in East and South-east Europe, Poland, Czechoslovakia, and Yugoslavia especially.


    Future of Trieste
    The Government of the new Yugoslavia is violently opposed to the occupation of Trieste by Western Allied troops. It may be that a free port and international status for the town, with Italian sovereignty in cultural questions, would best serve the Allied and European cause, especially during the years of transition. If this cannot be, then there is a case for its return to Italy because an overwhelming majority of its inhabitants are Italian.




    With that view even the Italian Communists concur, although their desire for good relations with Yugoslavia is sincere, and they are prepared to make generous concessions. They admit that Yugoslavia has a just claim to the hinterland of Trieste and that a solution must be found in a partition between town and hinterland.


    In other zones, Norway, Denmark, and Holland notably, the change over from the war has gone more smoothly. Fears lest Norwegians should be unable alone to handle their transition period have proved to be unfounded and there has been no need to call on Sweden for the peaceful kind of assistance that she was prepared to give. Through effective organisation between the exiled Government and its delegates in Norway, the Norwegian underground movement was able to take over Government departments and local administration from the moment the war ended.


    In the conquered territories, Austria especially, difficulties again seem to be in the forefront. Although it was decided at Yalta that the control of Austria should be a joint one, with Russian, British, American, and French zones of occupation and a central Allied Control Commission sitting in Vienna, no British, American, or French representative of the Commission has yet arrived in Austria.


    Allies and Germany
    Whether or not there can still be a technical explanation of the delay in Austria is comparatively unimportant. The serious question is whether there is to be a united Allied policy in Europe or whether one of the Great Powers is going to prejudice this hope by a one-sided power policy towards Austria and perhaps towards Germany too. Were there disunity of purpose and policy towards Germany, then, of course, the test case for all Allied unity would be lost.


    The problem is not one of experiment or compromise but of principle. The way it is handled will decide not only the future of Germany and Austria but whether there is to be real co-operation and agreement between the Allies. Will there be one Austria reorganised under the supervision of one Power and four Germanys with separate lives in the different zones of occupation.


    Such a solution would play directly into the hands of the Germans, and there are still amongst them a majority who even in defeat are thinking in terms of power policy alone. It would be not only a solution against the new forces in Europe, but the best guarantee of the continuation of Germany’s imperialist consciousness which would concentrate first on the demarcation lines between the different Germanys.


    During the past few weeks there has been a clear and dangerous move towards creating spheres of influence within liberated Allied and conquered enemy territory. Such weight upon Europe would stunt her natural development as a variegated but harmonious whole. All history and not least that of the immediate past has shown that the Continent cannot be dominated by one force or ideology. This was so before Hitler and remains so after him.
    VE Day: 'We have won the right to hope' - archive, May 1945 | VE Day | The Guardian

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    It would have been very interesting times immediately after.

    From the archive, 8 May 1945: VE Day - two German cruisers await surrender
    The naval commander of the German warships finds no one to surrender to in Copenhagen, as the world celebrates victory in Europe
    It's VE day.-veday3-jpeg

    German troops on a midget tank retreat through the Town Hall Square in Copenhagen after VE Day.


    German troops on a midget tank retreat through the Town Hall Square in Copenhagen after VE Day. Photograph: Hulton Archive/Getty Images
    Copenhagen, May 7.
    Germany’s last two seaworthy big warships, the cruisers the Prinz Eugen and the Nuremberg, are lying in the north port here with their German crews aboard, having apparently made no attempt to flee when Denmark was liberated.


    With them are various anti-submarine craft and 54 German merchant ships aggregating some 150,000 tons.


    Crowds greet Field Marshal Montgomery, Copenhagen, May 1945.
    FacebookTwitterPinterest Crowds greet Field Marshal Montgomery, Copenhagen, May 1945. Photograph: Keystone/Getty Images
    The entrance to the docks where the ships lie is still guarded by German soldiers armed with tommy guns and rifles, and in streets around the dock area German soldiers come and go pretty much as they please, brushing shoulders with British paratroops; the Germans ostentatiously ignore their ex-enemy’s presence, but the British and Danes are in a position to find the whole situation ridiculous.


    Meanwhile discipline in some of the German warships has suffered in a fashion reminiscent in a small way of what happened in October, 1918. On the deck of a minesweeper I saw a crowd of German sailors gathered drinking, singing, and playing an accordion.


    When they caught sight of me they started cheering and yelling “Hullo, Tommy,” “Good old Tommy, come and have a drink.” I walked over to their ship and started to talk to them from the quayside when a petty officer appeared on deck with a tommy-gun in his hand which he pointed at me whilst ordering the men below.


    A small, pale, harassed-looking German naval commander had driven up to the Hotel Angleterre in a Volkswagen and announced to the hall porter and to me that he had come to discuss the surrender of the German warships with the competent British officer.


    NO INTEREST IN SHIP
    This officer was not in the hotel at the time, so that for a while there was to be observed the ridiculous spectacle of a German officer roaming through the corridors of the hotel from room to room trying to find someone competent to receive him.




    For five years the British Navy and the R.A.F. had been hunting the Prinz Eugen, and under and above the seas hundreds of lives had been lost. Now suddenly there was just no interest in the ship at all.


    All this business of the German crews remaining in the ships and the German troops in Denmark retaining their arms is part of a very complicated situation rising out of the fact that there are 300,000 German troops in the country and very few British to whom they can surrender.


    Considerations of prestige, they say, forbid them to surrender to the Danes though when they leave the country they have agreed to leave behind their heavy weapons. Neither the Danes nor the British are much interested in German ideas of prestige and have only one concern – to get the Germans put out of the country as quickly as possible.


    If this can be done by allowing the Germans to march out armed until they reach the British lines where the weapons can be collected they are willing to agree.
    VE Day - two German cruisers await surrender: from the archive, 8 May 1945 | World news | The Guardian

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    Thailand Expat tomcat's Avatar
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    ...the fog of war continues even in defeat...

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomcat View Post
    ...the fog of war continues even in defeat...
    As the romancing and championing of militarism, war and empire continues still.

    Siwilai.
    Last edited by HuangLao; 08-05-2020 at 07:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    apparently it's the day the Brits celebrate giving the hun a damn good thrashing
    Yea, the Brits with help from 100+ other nations including NZ, Mongolia, Costa Rica and the Iroquois Nation in the US . . . alone they could have done sweet fuck all
    (and the Soviet Union, the US, France etc...)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    Pity someone didn't do Hitler in earlier and save everyone a lot of trouble.
    True, it was tried many times but the prick had nine lives

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomcat View Post
    ...the fog of war continues even in defeat...
    Maybe they should just kick off a new war somewhere for the sake of it.

    And then lose that one.

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    The commemoration of VE day this year in England has been exaggerated beyond the usual vacuous nostalgia-fest and has been manipulated by the Tory government to bolster the morale of the population reeling from the COVID disaster and to deflect criticism that BoJo's rabble has been responsible for the unnecessary death of thousands.

    It's actually cringeworthy in its mawkish emotionalism but the English lower end lap it up in the misguided and increasingly absurd belief they as a people are somehow a superior race because of the propaganda they vanquished the Hun, which is of course quite, quite wrong. The Nazis were only defeated because the Russian army steamrollered over a hundred divisions of the Wehrmacht using sheer grit, determination, courage and extraordinary self sacrifice in an onslaught involving oceans of blood and iron.

    The English contribution to VE-day was peripheral and almost incidental in historical terms, in truth Britain never won a significant battle under its own banner after Alamein, but for me the truly significant statistic that focuses one's attention on the reality of the struggle against Nazism was the fact that more died in the siege of Leningrad than all the war dead of the US and Britain combined.

    This queasy faux jingoism prevailing in England as it festoons itself in stupid union jack bunting and replays newsreels of 1945 is nothing more than a country deluding itself into thinking it is something it is not - a self indulgent, third rate nation wallowing in debt and increasingly insignificant as it recedes further into a daft parochialism and isolation that is the celebration of Brexit.

    It's even got its very own cod, ersatz Churchill pontificating piffle-waffle drivel as he blunders and bumbles about in an orgy of self-congratulatory nationalism.

    Fighting spirit indeed, more have died because of this Tory rabble's incompetence than perished in the Blitz.

    Har, har.

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    Thailand Expat Dillinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    It's VE day.
    Never heard of it to be honest but apparently it's the day the Brits celebrate
    Comemmorate is the word.






    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    Yea, the Brits with help from 100+ other nations including NZ, Mongolia, Costa Rica and the Iroquois Nation in the US . . . alone they could have done sweet fuck all
    (and the Soviet Union, the US, France etc...)
    How did your Grandpa with his white flag in 1940 help?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    How did your Grandpa with his white flag in 1940 help?
    No idea, he was still fighting . . . how's your knowledge of actual history instead of populist BritProp and how was your GrandPa hiding behind American skirts?

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    Thailand Expat Dillinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    he was still fighting
    Against the Allies doesn't count mate

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    The Fool on the Hill bowie's Avatar
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    Sprichst du Deutsch?
    Gut, warum nicht?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    Pity someone didn't do Hitler in earlier and save everyone a lot of trouble.
    Why? When it had taken quite an effort to get him in power...

    Just briefly his growth:

    -1920's in defeated Germany, huge inflation and misery (well described in books of E.M.Remarque) - world in deep financial crisis, black Friday 1929, Hitler with help of good friends living in luxury in Munich, buying villa in Obersalzberg, last models of Mercedes, organizing new party NSDAP

    - 1923 Beer Putsch in Munchen, dispersed by police, Hitler fled, attempting a suicide, allegedly talked out of it by American wife of his rich friend Ernst Hanfstaengel (who later relocated to USA, aid to Roosevelt), in prisoned for a year writing his famous book "Mein Kampf"

    -in 1928 election his NSDAP got only 2.6%

    -few months later hundreds thousand members in fashie uniforms was driven to Munich - where all the money come from?

    -1932 election already 33%, Hitler becoming chancellor, even if not reaching 51%, even if not of German citizenship

    -in next years taking back territories lost by Versailles Treaty, did not pay reparations, building army with huge armaments, all against Versailles Treaty, no objections from the Allies, nor from League of Nations

    -within 5 years becoming a leader of Europe, other big guys (please no names here) bowing before him...

    So what was expected from him?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    Against the Allies doesn't count mate
    One for, one against . . . Both count.

    Quote Originally Posted by bowie View Post
    Sprichst du Deutsch?
    Gut, warum nicht?
    Natürlich, das dürfte spaßig sein wenn wir uns auf Deutsch unterhalten.



    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    Pity someone didn't do Hitler in earlier and save everyone a lot of trouble.
    Quote Originally Posted by Klondyke View Post
    Why?
    Good God, you're such an utter arsehole . . . justifying his bringing death on tens of millions by giving a rundown of his path to power? Yea, you're simply an idiot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    Never heard of it to be honest but apparently it's the day the Brits celebrate
    Comemmorate is the word.
    commemorate is the spelling.

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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    How did your Grandpa with his white flag in 1940 help?
    No idea, he was still fighting . . . how's your knowledge of actual history instead of populist BritProp and how was your GrandPa hiding behind American skirts?
    reminds me of this...


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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    Yea, the Brits with help from 100+ other nations including NZ, Mongolia, Costa Rica and the Iroquois Nation in the US . . . alone they could have done sweet fuck all (and the Soviet Union, the US, France etc...)
    PH are you that thick, its Victory In Europe, its was not solely a Brit thing and was never glorified as such. You jump on any and every opportunity to take a pop and its becoming pathetic - it was celebrated across Europe but it continues as a date in the UK calendar.

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    ^ actually there a big PS required.

    VE day then was a celebration and relief if you will but its really been a commemoration since, a reflection on sacrifice and lives lost - not just Brits, all countries involved.

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    Just passed here...Wonder if PH's favourite shoemaker knocked out Jackboots



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    Quote Originally Posted by NamPikToot View Post
    PH are you that thick, its Victory In Europe
    Quote Originally Posted by NamPikToot View Post
    VE day then was a celebration and relief if you will but its really been a commemoration since, a reflection on sacrifice and lives lost
    Talk about thick, you really didn't get the flow, did you:

    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    it's the day the Brits celebrate giving the hun a damn good thrashing.
    To not be an utter hypocrite you'll now be giving cujo and Dill a good telling off, right?

    and:
    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    How did your Grandpa with his white flag in 1940 help?


    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    Just passed here.
    I'll donate so you can afford some next time you pass

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    Dilly's grandad deserted from the catering corps and ended up in Colchester.

    Another "hero".

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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    Talk about thick, you really didn't get the flow, did you:
    You were the one who decided to steer the good ship VE into a Brit tirade and belittling session - you know you really need to get some shoulder pads for your surrender monkey chip

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    Quote Originally Posted by NamPikToot View Post
    You were the one who decided to steer the good ship VE into a Brit tirade and belittling session - you know you really need to get some shoulder pads for your surrender monkey chip
    Incorrect. Dill decided to steer that ship first - and I responded.

  24. #24
    I'm in Jail

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    OK let peace break out, tiz Friday after all

  25. #25
    Thailand Expat Dillinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seekingasylum View Post
    Dilly's grandad deserted from the catering corps and ended up in Colchester.

    Another "hero".
    One was an Irish sailor that I've never met. Nor did my dad actually
    My dad was in the Falklands...after it all finished. He shot a few penguins

    Born a squaddie brat overseas, the only legacy World War 2 left me was having fukking Germany stamped on all my passports and driving licences.

    It could be worse though. It could be Chickenheadland, like PH .

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