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  1. #1
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    The coup now is actually logical at the end

    having a coup now seems a bit odd, above all after the successful Martial Law as a light version,

    but why now ? it seems that a coup was planned anyhow for this year because a certain event is bound to occur this year,

    so why wait ? if it was done after the fresh election in August or a bit a later after, it would have been a huge disaster, a blatant injustice to Democracy that could have led to civil war or at least some violent demonstration

    now was the best time, they had the excuse for it, the 2 sides being so distant and no solution in sight, so might as well go for it.

    I am sure the Army was not looking forward to it, but did they really have any choice ? it seems that the stubbornness of the 2 sides forced their hand early

  2. #2
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    Yes, its clearly been very well planned in advance, so why ponce around.

    They have to work through the succession, then when that's all done, people can have their vote back.

    The succession is too opaque to be allowed to operate under the codes of transparent democracy.

    Of course it shouldn't be that way,.... the latter should inform the former, but given the anachronistic laws it has to be vice-versa. If the relevant laws had been repealed it would have been more satisfactory. Politicians should have addressed that if they wanted a modern country - in a perverse way, they must blame themselves.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog
    Politicians should have addressed that if they wanted a modern country - in a perverse way, they must blame themselves.
    Jut out of interest, Moog, can you tell me how any politicians could have got rid of the LM laws and the army empowerment laws without the senate and army stopping it? You may remember that the last government, perfectly correctly, tried to amend the constitution and they were all banned as a result. You can't have it both ways, mate...
    How do I post these pictures???

  4. #4
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    There seems to be a lot of bewailing western concepts of 'fairness'.

    And of course, what has happened is not fair. It is Asian values writ large.

    The irony with what you mention BB is that had the politicians aligned their followers succession wishes by having an open discussion about adequacy and inadequacy of certain parties, they might have been able to avoid inconveniencing the soldiers having a coup to deliver precisely the same outcome.

    In other words, if the soldiers had let them raise the issue, they'd have the leader they preferred

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog View Post
    Yes, its clearly been very well planned in advance, so why ponce around.

    They have to work through the succession, then when that's all done, people can have their vote back.

    The succession is too opaque to be allowed to operate under the codes of transparent democracy.

    Of course it shouldn't be that way,.... the latter should inform the former, but given the anachronistic laws it has to be vice-versa. If the relevant laws had been repealed it would have been more satisfactory. Politicians should have addressed that if they wanted a modern country - in a perverse way, they must blame themselves.
    indeed, a necessary evil that was planned because no other options were possible

    you mention some controversial article that BB sent you, can you send it to me by email ? I would be interested into reading it,

    my PM here is blocked,

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bettyboo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog
    Politicians should have addressed that if they wanted a modern country - in a perverse way, they must blame themselves.
    Jut out of interest, Moog, can you tell me how any politicians could have got rid of the LM laws and the army empowerment laws without the senate and army stopping it? You may remember that the last government, perfectly correctly, tried to amend the constitution and they were all banned as a result. You can't have it both ways, mate...
    BB, I hate to say it again, and not that it is an excuse for the LM laws, but the poor habit of using LM laws to silence opposition was no longer in use after 1997 until a certain PM in 2002 started to use them again against certain journalists critical of his leadership style (the Far East Review scandal with 2 western journalists being kicked out of Thailand for it).

    Of course, the others doing it afterward by example wasn't an excuse.

    If a certain PM was to return, do you really believe he will stop using that powerful authority leverage ? of course not, nobody in his right mind would.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog
    The irony
    there is a lot of irony here in Thailand,

    a former authoritarian PM with a poor record on Human Rights, Vote Buying and Democratic transparency fighting to return in the name of Democracy

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog
    In other words, if the soldiers had let them raise the issue, they'd have the leader they preferred
    except that someone had veto power over that decision, a legal and legitimate veto power. There is a reason why that transfer didn't happen, and we are seeing the effects now of that lack of decision.

    There would be no fear of Thaksin or Democracy if a strong leader was at the top.

  9. #9
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    The coup thailand had to have.




  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog
    In other words, if the soldiers had let them raise the issue, they'd have the leader they preferred
    But, they wouldn't let them because that wold undermine the entire fake/constructed/conventional discourse that empowers the army and the people that control the army.

    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly
    If a certain PM was to return, do you really believe he will stop using that powerful authority leverage ?
    How many terms is one PM allowed? I think Thaksin has done his terms already, so not in the equation, imho.

    The coups, however, and the dem government, and the 'interim' governments, are all controlled by the same group of old men; how many terms 'in office' are they allowed???

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bettyboo
    The coups, however, and the dem government, and the 'interim' governments, are all controlled by the same group of old men; how many terms 'in office' are they allowed???
    that's not what the 2 articles you sent to Moog said, maybe you haven't read them carefully

  12. #12
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    Thanks Moog for the articles, one is particularly informative and a nice update on the Palace situation

    what an amazing story, could be made into a movie at the end

    someone should start writing the script

  13. #13
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    BF how is the big event 'bound' to be this year? could be several away.
    Last edited by xanax; 23-05-2014 at 05:11 PM.

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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by xanax View Post
    BF how is the big 'bound' to be this year? could be several away.
    the situation there is even more "bleak" than we might perceive on the ground, and let's be honest, the Army must be shitting their pants because the top is virtually gone and there is no clear plan for a new order. I would be very nervous if I were in their shoes. A bit like a corporate merger, you don't know if your job would still be there next year.

    It's interesting to note that No.1 is now in support of No.2, and that the real problem is getting more dramatic each year because of the changing of weak allegiance, with individuals who have no vision or real leadership.

    A military coup might be the only option, the necessary evil, so that all parties, including Thaksin, can discuss freely about what to do next.

  16. #16
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    Nice to see all the astute posts. This plan has obviously been in place for a while and it will be interesting to see how it all sorts out in the end. Some of the key players are likely named in this 6 month old article......

    Powerful forces revealed behind Thai protest movement | Reuters
    Press On Regardless

  17. #17
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    Norton seaches for referenced article. It must be in the basement. I'll go look.
    Last edited by Norton; 23-05-2014 at 05:21 PM. Reason: edited due to slow typing.

  18. #18
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    Just when I thought I was understanding things, The Economist throws out a new article, 50 minutes old (edit.. scratch that...time stamp error as it is from yesterday.)
    Last edited by thailazer; 23-05-2014 at 06:05 PM.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by thailazer
    Nice to see all the astute posts. This plan has obviously been in place for a while and it will be interesting to see how it all sorts out in the end. Some of the key players are likely named in this 6 month old article...... Powerful forces revealed behind Thai protest movement | Reuters
    Powerful forces revealed behind Thai protest movement | Reuters
    Thanks for the link. Amazing how it makes sense of what's happening today when it was written so long ago.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog View Post
    Yes, its clearly been very well planned in advance, so why ponce around.

    They have to work through the succession, then when that's all done, people can have their vote back.

    The succession is too opaque to be allowed to operate under the codes of transparent democracy.

    Of course it shouldn't be that way,.... the latter should inform the former, but given the anachronistic laws it has to be vice-versa. If the relevant laws had been repealed it would have been more satisfactory. Politicians should have addressed that if they wanted a modern country - in a perverse way, they must blame themselves.

    I believe they have become so proficient at these activities that the models of coups and military intervention should be the standard worldwide for all aspiring others. The leader of coups, military take-overs, etc.

    Thailand should be busting with pride.

  21. #21
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    is it safe to say that Suthep won ? it was a long shot but he made it, quite amazingly

    poor Y, she felt into every traps, didn't have the "political smart" to avoid them

    Even Chalerm as her sidekick didn't help,

  22. #22
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    Could this be the first Coup leader to be executed for high treason, after the dust has settled?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly View Post
    is it safe to say that Suthep won ? it was a long shot but he made it, quite amazingly

    poor Y, she felt into every traps, didn't have the "political smart" to avoid them

    Even Chalerm as her sidekick didn't help,
    Not amazing at all. Sure he won, check out his supporters, but not too high if you value your freedom.

  24. #24
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    Thailand lost. I ain't seeing any smiles, and the petulant cutting off of all international media shows you the international reaction, and the lost face felt in thailand. Domestic concerns, even higher. Ain't such a long way from the penthouse to the shithouse, I suppose.

    So, Suthep hasn't been detained? I really don't know. Doesn't seem he's got his 'Peoples council' anyway.
    probes Aliens

  25. #25
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    Reading Aljazeera's opinion piece yesterday, it looks like this thing is just getting started.

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