Thread: What I Dislike About Thailand

Most Farang in residence.

^Impressive post, very long and I suppose says something relevant?

Can't be bothered to read anything that takes so much of a person's time to scribe that its obvious they don't have a real life.

Editor please....

Originally Posted by ltnt

^Impressive post, very long and I suppose says something relevant?

Can't be bothered to read anything that takes so much of a person's time to scribe that its obvious they don't have a real life.

Editor please....

So that's why you are the way you are.

We learned in uni IQ results are not accurate cross culturally. They might be somewhat valid in the nation where they were written. And the language in which they are written means everything. In America years ago some academic rebels wrote the Ghetto IQ Test. Inner city Black kids scored way higher than Whites. I never have been sure what intelligence is, but I know what it isn't .. it isn't a number score from a written exam.

Yup, that's a fact, different strokes for different folks and one size don't fit all.

I saw some IQ tests designed for street kids and their results a while back,
Street kids scored higher than straights.

Same with tests designed for bush folk, bush folk out-scored ol' whitey.

If IQ tests are culturally loaded towards say, a certain national or a cultural background, those not of that background inevitably scored lower.

Tests I've seen these days are not of the "one size fits all" type, but are fitted to ethnic and cultural backgrounds that are vectored in to the test, so that an individual's results more accurately displays his/her ability to cope with information input and use it realistically.

A far cry from the old standard un-modified Weschler, where Eurocentric standards of knowledge and sources of information were expected to be easily assimilated by non-Euros, or even Marians for that matter.

Originally Posted by RickThai

Although, I really like Thailand, there are a few things that I dislike and would like to see change. They are:

1) Government corruption (tea money). At almost every level Thais and falongs have to pay off someone in authority to speed up paperwork, land jobs, or avoid traffic fines.

2) Double Pricing. For falongs you wind up paying two, three, or even more multiples of the basic Thai price for things. If you read Thai and speak a little, you can generally (but not always) get vendors to come down to the Thai price. Still it is irritating.

3) Extreme Poverty. In spite of hard work, many Thais do live right at the edge of survival. The gap between rich and poor is much greater than it should be.

4) Substance abuse. Alcohol abuse and yaa baa are destroying the lives of way too many Thais. In some areas, stores no longer sell alcohol before 5 pm. This is a good start IMO.

5) Prostitution. Thailand is world famous as a "sex tour" destination. I would really love to see a strong local and national government effort to halt this epidemic.

6) Caste System. Thailand has a very real caste system. This is slowly being eroded by younger Thais and I hope this trend continues.

7) Westernization. The growing middle-class has enthusiastically embraced consumerism. Although many labor-saving devices have made life easier, many Thais are becoming deeply in debt, trying to buy the latest and greatest gadgets. This puts increased pressure on bringing in more money, and is eroding many of the traditional Thai values, as they compete for jobs and baht.

8) Political instability. Thailand needs to become less violent in their approach to partisan politics. Let the Thai people decide who will be the prime minister and let it go at that. Using the military and violence to overthrow elected officials raises a red flag to any country wanting to invest in the Thai economy.

That's my list of things I dislike about Thailand.

Santi,

RickThai

my main dislike is older men..mainly pommes..who whinge about beer prices, music, food, etc then when they get crook they want the thai govt to pay for their medical.

Originally Posted by ENT

Yup, that's a fact, different strokes for different folks and one size don't fit all.

I saw some IQ tests designed for street kids and their results a while back,
Street kids scored higher than straights.

Same with tests designed for bush folk, bush folk out-scored ol' whitey.

Probably questions about cheapest lager / highest alcohol content, benefits claims, easiest door locks to jemmy, or the best stereos to chisel out of car dashboards?

That could well be the sort of questions asked.
IQ tests are pretty much designed and re-designed according to need, but there are standards to follow so that no one is tested and judged unfairly.

How results are interpreted and how the data is used and manipulated is another issue, which is why most ethical clinicians insist on interpreting test results themselves and try to have an overview on how the data is used in social contexts.

Originally Posted by Koojo

So that's why you are the way you are.

What's that? Intolerant of folks who write long meaningless scrolls that never go any place except the round file? If I want to read a book, I'll buy one. Keep it short and to the point.

Originally Posted by ltnt

Originally Posted by Koojo

So that's why you are the way you are.

What's that? Intolerant of folks who write long meaningless scrolls that never go any place except the round file? If I want to read a book, I'll buy one. Keep it short and to the point.

It's called "reading" for a reason. Most people seem to be able to do it at a sufficient speed to get thru even the longest posts...

However, I rest my case about the foreigners here seeming to come from the "shallow end of the gene pool"..

Now that I think about it, this is the perfect place for 'em, they fit in so well with the natives...

Originally Posted by toddaniels

Originally Posted by ltnt

Originally Posted by Koojo

So that's why you are the way you are.

What's that? Intolerant of folks who write long meaningless scrolls that never go any place except the round file? If I want to read a book, I'll buy one. Keep it short and to the point.

It's called "reading" for a reason.

LOL. Those of us with an attention span longer than that of a goldfish actually read your post. Interesting and provocative. Note sure I agreed with everything, but certainly some points worth discussing at a later point.

Good contribution.

Originally Posted by nidhogg

Originally Posted by toddaniels

Originally Posted by ltnt

Originally Posted by Koojo

So that's why you are the way you are.

What's that? Intolerant of folks who write long meaningless scrolls that never go any place except the round file? If I want to read a book, I'll buy one. Keep it short and to the point.

It's called "reading" for a reason.

LOL. Those of us with an attention span longer than that of a goldfish actually read your post. Interesting and provocative. Note sure I agreed with everything, but certainly some points worth discussing at a later point.

Good contribution.

The thing that cracks me up, is that they don't have 30 seconds to read a long post, but they'll spend 30 minutes running around the forum making posts such as "That was too long I didn't read it"

It's a special kind of person that actually goes out of his way on a forum, to let other people know that he didn't read their post.

As for Mr Daniels, the jury is out for me. He's clearly an intelligent man, but I can't even begin to grasp the logic in his philosophies.

Originally Posted by Gravesend Dave

Originally Posted by RickThai

Originally Posted by Gravesend Dave

Just a couple from me!

The smell of the drains can be a bit overpowering at times!!!

Actually that is one I forgot to include. The sois (and markets) can be unbelievably filthy! That's one thing I always liked about Germany and Switzerland. The streets and sidewalks were spotless!

Most Thais (that I know) keep really clean homes, it's just the public areas that are so dirty.

RickThai

You got nippers Rick?
Them hawkers or even shop staff need a lesson on the art of sales!
It should be skillfully directed at adults only!!!

All Falang are not easily lead people who will buy everything their child takes an interest in!
In my case I would need an Island so far for cheap imported Chinese toot!!

My son is now 33 years old, and has never lived in Thailand, so that was never a problem for me. My Thai BIL has an 8-year old and a 12 year old. They are spoiled rotten (this is his 3rd set of children with 3 different wives), so I can see your point.

RickThai

Originally Posted by Camel Toe

The dirty movies dirty movies touts at Pan Thip. They don't care if you're with your mum.

Three or so years ago, I visited Myanmar with a bunch of Thai relatives. This included a 5 year old girl and a 9 year old girl. As we were walking around in a group, some Burmese (Myanmarese??) guy kept following me around with a bunch of porno DVD's with hardcore explicit sex photos on the covers. No matter how many times I said no and go away, the guy kept at it until the girls' father (a Thai police Captain) finally read him the riot act. The father (my BIL) had been posted on the Thai-Myanmar border for a couple of years and spoke their language a bit. The guy finally left us alone after that.

RickThai

Originally Posted by quimbian corholla

Originally Posted by RickThai

Another "prissy little Missy" post IMO.

RickThai gets to use the family neuron on Mondays apparently..

Miss Prissy,

You surely have your panties in a bunch (or is it that time of the month?).

Santi,

RickThai

Originally Posted by Aberlour

Originally Posted by RickThai

I prefer falong as it is more phonetic

Your ears work differently to mine then. I've never heard it sound any different to Farang or Falang at a push. The "ong" sound at the end is 100% wrong. I have no idea how you think you are hearing that.

No doubt everyone's ears work a little differently, especially with tonal languages for a non-tonal language speaker.

If you can tell consistently tell the difference between a Thai saying "ahng" and "ohng" your ears are much better than mine. Again, my Thai-English dictionaries show the transliteration as "farung". How do you explain that??

Santi,

RickThai

Originally Posted by Aberlour

The thing that cracks me up, is that they don't have 30 seconds to read a long post, but they'll spend 30 minutes running around the forum making posts such as "That was too long I didn't read it"

It's a special kind of person that actually goes out of his way on a forum, to let other people know that he didn't read their post.

As for Mr Daniels, the jury is out for me. He's clearly an intelligent man, but I can't even begin to grasp the logic in his philosophies.

God how he tries so hard to seem like a normal sane concerned person. All the while what's left of his grey matter is begging for mercy as death nears.

Originally Posted by RickThai

Originally Posted by Gravesend Dave

Originally Posted by RickThai

Originally Posted by Gravesend Dave

Just a couple from me!

The smell of the drains can be a bit overpowering at times!!!

Actually that is one I forgot to include. The sois (and markets) can be unbelievably filthy! That's one thing I always liked about Germany and Switzerland. The streets and sidewalks were spotless!

Most Thais (that I know) keep really clean homes, it's just the public areas that are so dirty.

RickThai

You got nippers Rick?
Them hawkers or even shop staff need a lesson on the art of sales!
It should be skillfully directed at adults only!!!

All Falang are not easily lead people who will buy everything their child takes an interest in!
In my case I would need an Island so far for cheap imported Chinese toot!!

My son is now 33 years old, and has never lived in Thailand, so that was never a problem for me. My Thai BIL has an 8-year old and a 12 year old. They are spoiled rotten (this is his 3rd set of children with 3 different wives), so I can see your point.

RickThai

Living in Thailand with small children would change a lot of the opinions of members who are not in this situation I am sure.
Glad you seem to know where I'm coming from with this.

As for your bil Rick he sounds like he following a Thai tradition many have laid out before him.
Put a bird in the club and move on!
Not having a pop but I wonder if he supports the kids let alone sees them.
Third time lucky!!

Originally Posted by Zooheekock

Originally Posted by RickThai

The average IQ of the people of Thailand is somewhere in the high 80s. Just slightly below that of most European (and the US) countries.

Just like you've got an IQ of 140, eh Rick. Actually, the latest figure for a national average is 98.6. That figure is pretty much the same as America and somewhat below most European nations though since IQ is a load of bollocks - America, with its history of eugenics and racial psychology, is somewhat unusual in still caring about it - this doesn't actually mean anything much at all.

The data source for my number was an article citing the results of country-wide means taken several years ago. Like any statistic, if you handpick the sample size in order to skew the results, it is quite possible to get different results (i.e. take the average IQ of University students as opposed to the average IQ of elementary students).

An individual's IQ varies somewhat over time, but is generally statistically viable and consistent throughout their lifetime (barring dementia and/or other mental issues).

There is an interesting book "The Bell Curve" that was written a few years old. It shows distinct correlations between crime and low IQ, among other things.

My IQ has consistently tested out at between 136 and 142 over a period of 10 years, so I would think 140 is a valid number.

I am curious, have you ever had an IQ test? If so, what was your results? Post it if you dare.

RickThai

Originally Posted by ENT

Originally Posted by Zooheekock

Originally Posted by RickThai

The average IQ of the people of Thailand is somewhere in the high 80s. Just slightly below that of most European (and the US) countries.

Just like you've got an IQ of 140, eh Rick. Actually, the latest figure for a national average is 98.6, which is pretty much the same as America and somewhat below most European nations though since IQ is a load of bollocks - America, with its history of eugenics and racial psychology, is somewhat unusual in still caring about it - this doesn't actually mean anything much at all.

The figure you're quoting comes from 2011 stats published in Wikipedia.
Another 2011 set of figures published by
National IQ Scores - Country Rankings

gives a Thai average IQ level of 91 with UK and China at 100, Italy at 102 and Singapore at 108!

This site
American Intelligence – IQ statistics
Has Thais ranking top at 119.

Thai ministry of health states that the Thai national average is at 98.59 in 2011, but in 2013 Thai IQ level is rated at 85.3 by the World Bank.

Another group that accepts that the Thai IQ = 91 is;
The International Council for the Control of Iodine Deficiency Disorders (ICCIDD)
ICCIDD Global Network - Sretta Thavisin receives 2013 Hetzel Award

This group points out that as a result of iodine deficiency, Thai IQ levels are anything up to 13 IQ points lower than optimum.

Because of nationalistic trumpeting and negative bias, both extreme sets of figures are just plain wrong, and I'd estimate that the average rural IQ level in Thailand to be around the 85 < 90 mark, and that the urban IQ level is around 95 at best with Thai university level IQs at around 100, as Thais in Western universities struggle to get through a degree course which need an IQ level of 110 minimum.

If Thai students had 1Qs of 119 as declared by mt,iq-test.eu.stats, above, Thais would all be rocket scientists,

Very informative post with a lot of references. Well done!

Perhaps the 119 refers to Thais that are living in the US to attend schools?


RickThai

Originally Posted by RickThai

No doubt everyone's ears work a little differently, especially with tonal languages for a non-tonal language speaker.

If you can tell consistently tell the difference between a Thai saying "ahng" and "ohng" your ears are much better than mine.

The difference between "ahng" and "ohng" has nothing to do with tones. They are two complete different sounds, not the same sound with different tones.

It's like you're pronouncing Cat as Cot and saying it's hard to tell the difference. My ears are the same as everybody else's, which is why I'm confused as to why you hear Falong and not Farang/Falang.

Originally Posted by RickThai

Again, my Thai-English dictionaries show the transliteration as "farung". How do you explain that??

I can't explain that. I would suggest getting a different dictionary though.

Originally Posted by toddaniels

Sorry, but I believe you're mistaken in the actual number of "real" countries in the world.

Even a cursory look at Google yields a number between 193 (the number of countries in the UN) or 195 the number including Vatican City and Kosovo. If you count Taiwan as a "real" country instead of a piece of China, it would appear there are at last count 196 countries in the world today. That’s a few short of the “more than 200” you quoted. Remember Google is your friend, use it…

Believe me, after I retired, I "tried" 3 or 4 other countries on for size, pulling between a 1 and 2 year stint in each. Most were at least as developed as Thailand; meaning the big cities had good infrastructure and outside them it was just the rural countryside.. Then I was invited here by a friend of my Uncle. He was one of those guys who never left S/E Asia after Vietnam. In fact as far as I can tell, he's never ever left Thailand since he got here a jillion years ago! I came here for 6 weeks and toured the country extensively. I thought, well, it ain't the best I've seen, but it ain't the worst by a long shot.. So I came here and more than 8 years later I'm still here.

I don't despise the the place or the people, I'm just very vocal in my opinions. Now I am reluctant to leave it; mostly because after investing 5 years learning to speak/read/write this language, I know I wouldn't get ANY value out of it anywhere else in the world. Face it these people make up less than a single percent of the world's population; so outside of this country, you really hafta search 'em out.. So here I stay...

FWIW: I've got great Thai friends I work with and routinely hang out with Soi side. I've met their wives, kids, been on vacation with them, been to their homes up country, etc. They're real stand up guys, just tryin' to pay the mortgage, car payments, put their kids thru school, etc. I'd call 'em "blue collar" or "working class" in the US. I have far more Thai people I’d call ‘friends’ than I do foreign ones that's for sure.

I like to think of my life here as not an "epic fail" but as an epic success. I decided to move here, I've managed to live here 8+ years without morphing into one of those "sheep-like, sock-puppet, wanna-b-thai foreigners" I routinely meet here. I can converse with the indigenous natives in their language about almost any topic which strikes my fancy. I volunteer part time at the local police station as an interpreter, I shepherd foreigners thru Thai Immigrations for their visas, I consult for a successful remodeling /renovation business and a truck for hire business. In my spare time I write online reviews about Thai language schools in Bangkok, along with my trials and tribulations learning Thai. I do that because I honestly believe, if you're gonna live here, learn to speak Thai.. Truly “I’m a legend in my own mind”…

I've also put a TON of time into understand Thai culture, and the framework which Thais operate and interact within here. Not because I give two shits about the culture; but because by understanding it to the degree I do, I can manipulate these people. By using their "cultural rules of engagement" I can back them into a corner where the only way out for them "culturally" is to do what I want. I mean you can't fault someone for understanding people to the degree where you can manipulate them by using their culture, can you?

Incredibly insightful to discern I live alone. Honestly, if I had to spend more than a couple of hours with the "typical Thai gurl" I see foreigners with here; I'd join the “Bangkok Flying Club” and leap off Baiyoke Tower.

Actually, I live with two Thai gurls who are twins! They look so much alike I sometimes can’t tell one from the other. Collectively they understand English to a higher degree than the majority of the Thais I've met here during the last 8 years! Oh, sorry, forgot to mention; those Thai gurls are CATS... But hey, they're Siamese cats; so they're Thai, that hasta count for something right?

While I voice my ambivalence for the place in a mostly negative, caustic, acerbic and cynical manner, I see it more as a coping mechanism than anything else. I complain, because I can, plain and simple. I knew full well when I moved here that: "We're not in Kansas anymore Toto.."

Please believe me when I say, "I NOT talking down to you.. I'm tryin' to talk to you on your level.. Gimme your hand, I'll pull you up here to mine..." Or if that's too tough to stomach, how about; "It's not that I look down on you, it's just I have such a high opinion of myself."

Hope I answered your questions; if you have more feel free to ask. I’m not sayin’ I’ll answer ‘em, but don’t let that stop you from asking….

Glad my post garnered so much interest, I almost didn't post it...

If your main goal to learn about Thailand, its culture, and its people was to better manipulate Thai people, than I really feel sorry for you.

If you want a greater challenge perhaps you should move to New York City or Paris and try to manipulate a more sophisticated group of people.

Or conversely, you could move to the Congo and study how to best manipulate more primitive people.

On your death bed, I wonder if you will ever have any second thoughts about how you chose to live your life?

Chok dee!

RickThai