Thread: Golf-Mickelson among 17 golfers suspended by PGA Tour for playing LIV event

Originally Posted by ludwig

Golf has escaped scrutiny untill now.
It has been happily stuck in the stone ages which has contributed to its purity / success.
Once the media sink there teeth in to it , you're guaranteed the mediocrity , destruction of what you once took for granted.

Golf the last bastion (sic )

Like motor racing. No tobacco ads, no grid girls. Politically correct garbage has damaged its identity.

I must admit, topless birds taking the flags out of the holes would help me give a shit about golf.

Originally Posted by pickel

It will be impossible for the Saudis to recoup the money they've poured into this.

The thing is, they don't need to and wouldn't expect to either. The LIV tour is minuscule part of Saudi Arabia's Public Investment Fund who have mega-billions (600++) invested in different ventures in every corner of the globe and are owned by the Saudi Gov't, the same Gov't that's pulling in about $1.3 billion a day in oil revenues right now. Money is not a problem.

Anyway let's see how this pans out, my prediction is there's going to be a lot more PGA players wanting to play on both tours and the PGA will be forced into seeking out some sort of an agreement or compromise before they get sued into oblivion.

Originally Posted by pickel

As for Norman saying the players legal expenses will be covered to fight their ban from the PGA, I'll believe that when I see it.

Maybe they could seek public funded legal aid or set up a gofundme for donations. After this massive restraint of trade by the PGA they'll be hard-pressed to keep their jets/ superyachts in fuel. The PGA has effectively thrown the 'unfortunate 17' out onto struggle street.

Fuck - they're only taking the Saudi blood money for the good of the game!

Originally Posted by Headworx

The thing is, they don't need to and wouldn't expect to either. The LIV tour is minuscule part of Saudi Arabia's Public Investment Fund who have mega-billions (600++) invested in different ventures in every corner of the globe and are owned by the Saudi Gov't, the same Gov't that's pulling in about $1.3 billion a day in oil revenues right now. Money is not a problem.

So it's sportswashing then, right? As for your earlier comments about America and the CIA, guantanamo, etc. Well, the US government and the CIA aren't funding the PGA. The PGA is a non profit organization that donates $200mil to charity annually. How much will the headchoppers give to charity?

Anyways, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree and see how it plays out.

Originally Posted by pickel

As for your earlier comments about America and the CIA, guantanamo, etc. Well, the US government and the CIA aren't funding the PGA.

True, but they're still playing in a country that actively commits and finances that sort of thing both at home and on foreign shores every day of the week since forever so if we're going to get all sentimental about having anything to do with countries with black marks against their names or skeletons in their closets...

Look, I've got no love for the Saudi's and know a bit about the country/people (worked there for years for Aramco) but my previous post saying nobody would ever get to play anywhere in the world if morals come into it stands.

Originally Posted by pickel

The PGA is a non profit organization that donates $200mil to charity annually.

Which is raised by people watching the very players they're now dictating terms to. And being a "non profit" organisation with what's thought to be billions in investments and yearly revenue, we'll never know their real financial situation because they don't pay tax and don't get audited. I guarantee you they're doing better than break-even though and the $200mil is a single drop in their overflowing bucket! Did you know all PGA tour events are considered to be charity events? Cha-ching.

Originally Posted by pickel

How much will the headchoppers give to charity?

We don't know yet as their tour is 2 days old but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it turns out to be more than the PGA do, way more. After all, this is first and foremost a giant PR excercise with no set budget.

Originally Posted by pickel

Anyways, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree and see how it plays out.

For sure. I just want to see the players get the best possible treatment and deals they can, they're the stars of the show with all the talent not Joe Monahan.

I suppose for a player like Stenson, the honour of captaining Europe's Ryder Cup team pales in comparison to stuffing his snout in a trough full of Saudi petrodollars.

Henrik Stenson set to be stripped of Ryder Cup captaincy and join LIV Golf Invitational Series

Another one shoves his snout in the MBS trough.

Bubba Watson: Two-time Masters champion the latest player to join LIV Golf Invitational Series | Golf News | Sky Sports

^
So far it's been all the pga players I don't like. I'm starting to think I'm a good judge of character. But then I realized I'm posting this on Teak door.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Who do these greedy fuckers think they're kidding? If just one of them said "I'm never going to earn that sort of money anywhere else, so fucking hard luck", I might at least respect their honesty.

Of course it's about the money, combined with a far lighter schedule. But to put the money into perspective, Cam Smith has had a successful career in the 5 or so years he's been on the PGA tour with 6 wins including a Major, enough to make him the current World #2. His total prize money is roughly 25 million in total and the LIV tour are reportedly offering him 100 million just to sign on.

I'd be gone in a heartbeat, it'll be interesting to see what he decides to do...

Originally Posted by Headworx

Of course it's about the money, combined with a far lighter schedule. But to put the money into perspective, Cam Smith has had a successful career in the 5 or so years he's been on the PGA tour with 6 wins including a Major, enough to make him the current World #2. His total prize money is roughly 25 million in total and the LIV tour are reportedly offering him 100 million just to sign on.

I'd be gone in a heartbeat, it'll be interesting to see what he decides to do...

As I said, I wouldn't fault them if they were at least honest about it and said they are doing it to extract a shitload of cash from Saudi coffers.

But this "for the love of the game", to "help develop players" and the rest of the fucking shit?

Give it a rest.

It's like when players join the plastics

Originally Posted by Headworx

Of course it's about the money, combined with a far lighter schedule. But to put the money into perspective, Cam Smith has had a successful career in the 5 or so years he's been on the PGA tour with 6 wins including a Major, enough to make him the current World #2. His total prize money is roughly 25 million in total and the LIV tour are reportedly offering him 100 million just to sign on.

I'd be gone in a heartbeat, it'll be interesting to see what he decides to do...

What do you think is more important to him? Winning more majors? Or money?

If it's the lighter schedule they want , why are they so upset about not being able to play the pga or dp tours?

They're full of shit. It's all about the money.

Originally Posted by pickel

What do you think is more important to him? Winning more majors? Or money?

You missed the 3rd option which has many parts to it including being seriously set for life no matter what happens in the future, loss of form spiralling players out of contention each week (see Jason Day's crash to mediocrity from being World #1 as just one example), career ending injury, simply tiring of the grind of being a touring Pro, having a family and not wanting to be away from home for a sizeable slice of the year anymore, and so on. And as far as I can tell at this time, the LIV players can still play all the Majors as none of them are ran by the PGA so they've got no say in the matter.

But yes, and again, I agree totally it's ultimately all about the money. What isn't?! Let's put this week's events into perpective:

PGA tour: Rocket Mortgage Classic.
Total prize money is 8.4 mill, 156 players in a 4 day tournament of which half of them will get cut meaning they earn nothing, in fact they'll be digging into their own pockets for airfares, hotels, caddy wages, etc. 1.5 mill to the winner.

LIV tour: Bedminister Invitational.
Total prize money is 20 mill, 48 players in a 3 day tournament with no cut, 4 mill to the winner and 120k to last place, 3 mill to be divided equally among the winning team of 4.

Maybe because I've spent so long as a freelance contractor and consultant working for whoever's paying the most (including Saudi's) I'm looking at this through different eyes, but there comes a point where you realise that the first person you need to take care of in the life is yourself. And that's exactly what these LIV ship-jumpers are all doing.

Originally Posted by Headworx

You missed the 3rd option which has many parts to it including being seriously set for life no matter what happens in the future, loss of form spiralling players out of contention each week (see Jason Day's crash to mediocrity from being World #1 as just one example),

The LIV tour only has 48 players, so it's even more likely to happen.

Originally Posted by Headworx

career ending injury, simply tiring of the grind of being a touring Pro, having a family and not wanting to be away from home for a sizeable slice of the year anymore, and so on

So why are they whining about not being able to play on the PGA and DP tours then.

Originally Posted by Headworx

And as far as I can tell at this time, the LIV players can still play all the Majors as none of them are ran by the PGA so they've got no say in the matter.

That will change.

Originally Posted by Headworx

Maybe because I've spent so long as a freelance contractor and consultant working for whoever's paying the most (including Saudi's) I'm looking at this through different eyes, but there comes a point where you realise that the first person you need to take care of in the life is yourself.

Pulling dinosaurs out of the ground cannnot be compared to the legacy and honor involved in winning on the PGA tour. So, like i said, it's about the money. Why can't they admit it?

Originally Posted by pickel

So why are they whining about not being able to play on the PGA and DP tours then.

Simple, there'd be tournaments and courses they really enjoy playing that they no longer can. More so for the foreign players who can't play in their home country events any more, for example Schwartzel and Oostheizen no longer being able to play the SA Open, Garcia being unable to play the Spanish Open, Kaymer no longer being able to play the BMW, and so on. But, and I really believe this, I think a lot of them publicly stating how much they'd like to play on the PGA tour or DP tour (owned by the UAE Royal family who are squeaky clean on all fronts LOL) is part of what will come out in court once the suing starts. If they said they couldn't give a fuck about playing PGA or DP events anymore, which is very likely the case for many of them, that wouldn't help the law suits that I'm sure are brewing.

Originally Posted by pickel

So, like i said, it's about the money. Why can't they admit it?

Oh I dunno, for the same reason guys like Rory won't admit they know about how companies like Nike operate around the world as long as they keep paying him tens of millions a year in sponsorship money each year perhaps? Or do you think Rory has no idea about the human rights issues and sweat-shops in Nike manufacturing countries and facilities? And while we're talking Rory, he's demanded (and got) more in appearance fees than the total prize pool of tournaments around the world before but he's critical of guys chasing money? Yeah right..

Originally Posted by pickel

Pulling dinosaurs out of the ground cannnot be compared to the legacy and honor involved in winning on the PGA tour.

Of course not, but if you think money and taking care of themselves as a priority is irrelevant to PGA players you need to put the pipe down.

^
Gimme a break. Garcia openly admitted on camera in a pga tournament he couldn't wait to be done with the pga. Fuck him.

And the UAE doesn't own the DP tour, they are a sponsor.

If you want to attack Rory for being with Nike go ahead, nothing to do with the subject.

How do you think the players that commited to LIV feel after they've been booted due to the the 48 player limit?

Still no broadcast deal. The sheiks will get bored throwing away money soon. How's that for growing the game?

It's all about the money and I'm not surprised the players I dislike have jumped ship.

Good luck in court when they've already admitted they like the shorter, easier schedule.

The pga tour owes them nothing. Good luck in court

Originally Posted by pickel

And the UAE doesn't own the DP tour, they are a sponsor.

So the UAE's Royal Family are the money behind the DP tour, just as the Saudi Gov't are the money behind the LIV tour, but this is ok because the UAE Royal Family are as pure as driven snow? GTFO of here

Originally Posted by pickel

If you want to attack Rory for being with Nike go ahead, nothing to do with the subject.

It's everything to do with the subject, he's accepted insane amounts of money (more than any LIV players and by a fucking long way) from a corporation with appalling human rights issues including child-labour and modern slavery if you want to search that and educate yourself, yet here he is throwing stones in a glass house. I really like the guy and always have but he's become the self-appointed voice against the LIV tour starting a few months ago when he said it was dead in the water and nobody would be leaving the PGA tour to play on it. He'd now be wondering who's next to go, just as the rest of us are, and hopefully thinking it's time to shut his mouth on the topic.

Originally Posted by pickel

How do you think the players that commited to LIV feel after they've been booted due to the the 48 player limit?

They'll wipe their tears away with $100 bills from the millions of dollars they wouldn't have otherwise, I wouldn't be too worried about that.

Originally Posted by pickel

Still no broadcast deal.

Was watching it live on tv last night, don't recall which of the sports networks that cover golf I've got stored in favourites it was on though. Possibly Supersports.

Originally Posted by pickel

The sheiks will get bored throwing away money soon.

I really don't think you've got any form of a grip on just how much money they've got and make from their worldwide investments, their oil revenues alone are currently way over a billion dollars a day and their aren't enough zeros in existence to come up with numbers of what they'll make in the foreseeable future. The PGA have stated they know they cannot compete financially, obviously, but we'll never know how wide the gap is as the PGA are a tax free charity organisation who don't disclose their finances

Originally Posted by pickel

It's all about the money

Again, what fucking isn't? Do you think politicians want to get elected and climb political ladders because they feel duty-bound to serve their electorate? Do you think Ronaldo went back to Man U because of his connection to the club? Do actors do movies they know will be shit because they want to be in shit movies? Do you go to work each day doing whatever you do because you really want to? Does anyone?! Do people who want the world to be emissions free own shares in oil and gas companies? Of course it's all about the fucking money, everything is!

Originally Posted by pickel

The pga tour owes them nothing.

It's been an arrangement where the players supply the talent, while the PGA own the sole rights to it and could dictate all terms. Till now.

Originally Posted by Headworx

It's been an arrangement where the players supply the talent, while the PGA own the sole rights to it and could dictate all terms. Till now.

The PGA doesn't just run Golf tournaments.

It has an entire organisation dedicated to promoting Golf, education, training, standards, junior development, etc.

It's done more for Golf than a bunch of dismembering Saudis and a few big prize tournaments will ever do.

Although I suppose you could argue it's supporting elderly Golfers in the twilight years of their career, but the Senior Tour does that as well.

Amazing what some people will do for money isn't it? Just say NO to that $100,000,000 sign-on payment that enables them to tell the world to get fucked at any time of their choosing from that moment on because nobody, but especially sportsmen, care about money and they all just do it for the love of the sport