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  1. #26
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    @mendip - I don't know the situation in TH, but in PI, there's no legal issue with homeschool until Junior High (Grade 10, around 16 y.o.). I'm not sure if the kids have to enroll the 2 years of Senior High (Grades 11 & 12) in a physical school.

    I have a colleague who home-schooled her kids for a time (she was jobless, the husband was sole earner). To my understanding, the kids had to be enrolled in a govt approved Home School Program (e.g. XYZ Home School Inc). They paid for some fees, got books & materials from the school. She (the parent) administered the tests. They sent the test results to the school. The kids also had a 1x/ month session at the school - to meet other kids and for the teacher to monitor progress. The kids are issued a report card at the end of the school year. The elder kids were able to enter university here. (The youngest kid had to go to a normal school, since the mom resumed work.) The eldest kid has graduated from uni and has a good entry-level job, which was related to her field of study. So in this case, home schooling was OK for them. Hope that helps in some way.

  2. #27
    Thailand Expat jabir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mendip View Post
    ^^ Is that in Thailand? I ask because my daughter's school year finishes at the end of June, so those dates would suggest no proper lessons again until the next school year.

    And to be fair to the school, I've assumed that the majority of maintenance/security/catering/maids staff have been laid off... I could be wrong but knowing how hard-nosed this school is I'd be surprised if they're being paid.
    Yes Thailand, UK curriculum but not an international school, holidays March, April and October.

  3. #28
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    Mendip's Avatar
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    ^ Thanks Jabir... I was actually asking qwerty but the number of ^ got out of sync!

  4. #29
    Thailand Expat TheRealKW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mendip View Post
    ust the school's savings on catering alone must be far in excess of this. Not to mention catering staff, security staff, nanny's etc, almost all of whom I'm sure will have been laid off. The savings on electricity must be huge.
    Our school uses an outside caterer. They have maintained all their staff, but obviously have no income. (we have waived their rental)
    Our security staff are working full time.
    We do not use nanny's.
    Our maintenance & landscapers are working full time.
    We are installing additional infra red temperature gates & hand sanitizer around the school etc.
    Our teachers and all teaching assistants are providing full online learning
    Electricity is a slight saving. But depends, a school I know is locked into a contract to use x amount of electricity per month or pay a 'fine'.
    Most international school's budgets are around 80-90% staff salaries. (which are a fixed cost)

    Our photocopying is down, but we still have to pay rental on the machines (arguing the toss right now)
    water slightly done.
    Site rental has been deferred, not waived.

    We have paid extra to divert phone lines to receptionists mobile.
    We have paid extra on staff internet connections.
    We have paid extra for reception staff mobile phone bills.
    Slight savings on stationary.

    Most schools are not making huge profits.

    Online learning is more work for teachers.

    Learning is not measured in minutes and hours of teacher talk.






    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post

    Imagine employing online tutors and a decent wage for them would be probaby about a tenner an hour. If you have say 20 students, thats only 50p an hour and to equate that to the amount of online tuition my daughter receives a week that would only set me back about 10 pounds per week.
    Schools are very different to tution centres and cannot be compared.

    Having said that, if I had a children aged between 3-7 ... I'd probably take them out of school, and forget school fees until 2021.
    Last edited by TheRealKW; 18-05-2020 at 04:58 PM.

  5. #30
    Thailand Expat armstrong's Avatar
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    My daughter school started online learning today. A 30 minute lesson of some guy saying animal names.

    Get what you pay for I guess...

  6. #31
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    ^ I thought you teachers got free tuition for your kids.

  7. #32
    Thailand Expat armstrong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    ^ I thought you teachers got free tuition for your kids.
    Not all places and it depends on your contract.

    Edit: you'd be surprised how many don't offer the full tuition.

  8. #33
    Thailand Expat TheRealKW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by armstrong View Post
    Not all places and it depends on your contract.

    Edit: you'd be surprised how many don't offer the full tuition.

    Discounts of 70%-90% appear to be the medium offer.

    And usually limited to 2 children.

  9. #34
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    @mendip - I know of another colleague who home-schooled his kids. One kid is now in uni, doing well. Parents are both professionals. His wife stopped work to home-school their 3 kids. I've seen the kids and they seemed polite, well-behaved and happy. He said that one advantage was that his kids have more time to hone their talents - the kids all play instruments and sometimes attend sports sessions like football/ soccer, etc.

    I think home schooling works if one parent is staying at home full time & supervises the kids. Then in high school/ college, they can have the choice to go to a regular school.

  10. #35
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    Mendip's Avatar
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    Thanks again Katie...

    Home schooling isn't an option as in normal times I'm away at work for about 50% of the time and my wife isn't in the slightest bit interested.

    I guess when reading the various posts I can see the other side of it... the schools continuing with maintenance, internet fees etc... maybe I just have too much time on my hands just now!

    I however reluctant to commit the usual fees upfront if the schools are to remain closed... I don't think the video lessons are anywhere near as good as a proper classroom.

    And I still can't believe the school isn't making big savings at the moment... catering and electricity at least.

    The school company made a 46 million Baht net profit (not including dividends) in 2019. They ain't doing badly.
    Last edited by Mendip; 19-05-2020 at 05:08 PM.

  11. #36
    Thailand Expat TheRealKW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mendip View Post
    And I still can't believe the school isn't making big savings at the moment... catering and electricity at least.
    Our monthly electricity bills are 1% of the monthly wage roll. Any savings on electricity is minimal.

    Catering probably depends on the set up. You could probably guesstimate it, but again I would not assume that because you can make a sandwich or bowl of noodles at at home for 23 or 31 baht or whatever that it scales in the same manner.

    Do students pay upfront? Is it part of school fees, or has all income dried up?

    Income
    x per meal/student = presumably 0 right now or are they providing take out meals for hospitals or charity or even business provision. (ours is doing charity)

    Costs
    Capital on Kitchen
    Capital on dining room/seating
    Electricity
    Water
    Gas
    Cleaning
    Pest Control
    Safety equipment
    PPE for staff
    ?Rent to the school
    Food supplies. (is there contract to buy x amount of milk or y amount of meat each month? - does that need to be honoured?)
    Staff wages
    Government Taxes
    Staff training
    Health certificates and other government compliance
    Any rental & maintenance of kitchen appliances


    *I'm not in catering, so just estimating costs, someone who knows more might be able to elaborate

  12. #37
    Thailand Expat TheRealKW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mendip View Post
    The school company made a 46 million Baht net profit (not including dividends) in 2019. They ain't doing badly.
    Maybe they did.

    But costs are relatively fixed right now, and with student withdrawals and any discounts being offered are cutting into that. Many international schools run on a very fine margin, and I know of several that have just closed recently.

  13. #38
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Literally just received email from the school... 5% tuition fee refund apparently.

    Better than a kick in the nuts I suppose.

  14. #39
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    5% refund? that's a kick in the Nuts

    ask for 30%

  15. #40
    Thailand Expat TheRealKW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntRobertson View Post
    5% tuition fee refund apparently.
    Refund or credit note?

    Cash flow is critical right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    ask for 30%
    I had an email asking for 50% last night.

    Just make up numbers, that feels more fun. None are likely.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKW View Post
    Maybe they did.

    But costs are relatively fixed right now, and with student withdrawals and any discounts being offered are cutting into that. Many international schools run on a very fine margin, and I know of several that have just closed recently.
    true, maybe parents are forgetting that to keep open those schools, they have financial obligations to maintain the place, and still pay teachers

    those school fees are basically there to cover all costs + owner profit,

    is 5% really the profit margin of the owners? then yes, it's justified as a discount, but I doubt it's simply 5%, or are they only taking into account the dividends paid by the school to the owners?

  17. #42
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKW
    Refund or credit note?
    Good point but both actually.

    Credit note for next semesters fees or refund for leavers.

  18. #43
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    I just finished up with online classes as of a couple of hours ago and am now on holiday until September, as normal. It's been a mixed bag with these online lessons for sure, for a while here the government mandated that working parents must be allowed to work from home for full pay, that ended a month ago and has caused issues for working parents, particularly single mums and dads.

    We used Google Meets due to security concerns surrounding Zoom-in the end I broke my students into smaller groups so they were easier to manage and we had more chance of getting some distance collaborative learning going on- Jamboards was pretty decent for this. It as taken somewhat more work than face to face learning, but a lot of that could be me getting used to new platforms etc.

    Flipgrid as been great for oracy and making homework a little more fun- I've sent students on scavenger hunts around their homes for rhymes and grammar tenses- this works best with sibling/parent/maid help.

    As I understand it my place of work has discounted the last two terms fees, but their have been some complaints as one would expect. All this screentime is no good for anyone and I hope that we are back to school in person come September.

    99% of parents have been super supportive and that goes a long way and is appreciated.

    Now what to do with around 3.5 months of downtime...

  19. #44
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    ^^ For my daughter's school it's not a refund, but the offer of 2700 Baht per term discount for the next six terms, ie over two school years. Total amounting to 16200 Baht... if you keep your child in the school for another two years.

    While we're about it, what's a ball park percentage difference in salaries between Western teachers and Filipino teachers? There seem to be less and less Western teachers at this school and more and more Filipino, and my daughter now speaks with a broad Filipino accent.

  20. #45
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    2700 THB discount for a 2 year commitment seems like very risky and not worth it, fuck them the greedy bastards

  21. #46
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    ^^Hard to generalise, but I'd say 30-50%.

    If you're considering the homeschooling option, it's '...fewer and fewer Western teachers...'

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mendip View Post
    There seem to be less and less Western teachers at this school and more and more Filipino, and my daughter now speaks with a broad Filipino accent.
    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    ^^Hard to generalise, but I'd say 30-50%.
    At a top tier International school in Bangkok you will find no Filipino teachers at all.

  23. #48
    Thailand Expat jabir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntRobertson View Post
    Literally just received email from the school... 5% tuition fee refund apparently.

    Better than a kick in the nuts I suppose.
    Not sure how bad a kick in the nuts is, but I think I would prefer that to a 5% rebate which would have me and I know at least one other well triggered. Meanwhile, no rebate and no surprise this end.

  24. #49
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    RealKW makes some valid points about fixed costs.

    ^^ Sure. Not the point under discussion, is it.

    As we all know anyway, nationality is a very blunt instrument for deciding what salary a teacher is worth.

  25. #50
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jabir
    Not sure how bad a kick in the nuts is, but I think I would prefer that to a 5% rebate which would have me and I know others well triggered. Meanwhile, no rebate and no surprise this end.
    Yeah I was sorta looking at it from the perspective of expecting nothing so something is OK.

    It's good that they've taken leavers into account as well and there is some other stuff they're doing.

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