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  1. #26
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hallelujah View Post
    Yes, we are and you would have had to have been living under a rock or a bit stupid not to have noticed this. Hang on a minute, it's Willy.

    There were also 11,600 excess deaths recorded in the UK in 2 months this year due to a backlog of the effects of Covid/and lockdowns. Cardiovascular causes show significant excess mortality.

    Why have there been excess deaths this summer? - UK in a changing Europe

    Now, about that elephant in the room...
    From that link…

    More work and more granular data are needed to fully understand the underlying drivers of excess deaths not directly caused by COVID. For now, a working hypothesis is some combination of:


    (1) Elevated cardiovascular risk following COVID infection


    A recent article in Nature provides a good summary of concerns around cardiovascular risk, which studies have shown to be elevated for months after a COVID infection. Analysis of international data will be helpful in this regard – if other countries are not seeing elevated cardiovascular mortality this explanation is less plausible. The same logic allows us to discount implausible suggestions such as harm arising from vaccination.


    (2) Current delays for urgent treatment in the NHS


    Waiting times for ambulances and for A&E admission are extremely high. Average ambulance response time for category 2 calls (for example, strokes or heart attacks) was 59 minutes in July, against a target of 18 minutes.


    The delays arise from a combination of staff availability (NHS absenteeism has consistently been significantly higher than normal through the pandemic), patient demand (93% of urgent and emergency care beds are occupied), and lack of ability to move patients through the system and discharge them. These are current issues and not, as some have suggested, a consequence of lockdowns in 2020 and early 2021.


    (3) Missed and delayed diagnoses earlier in the pandemic


    The pandemic led to significant disruption to new diagnoses as well as the treatment of chronic conditions. Some appointments had to be cancelled and, in many cases, people chose not to seek treatment. 6.7 million people are now on NHS waiting lists for elective, non-urgent care, up more than 50% since before the pandemic. Additionally, it is estimated that there is a substantial hidden need of people who have not come forward for care. Cancer care is frequently cited as a concern in this regard and, while it clear that this is not currently driving significant excess mortality, it is likely to have a longer-term impacT.

  2. #27
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    hallelujah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskit View Post
    From that link…

    More work and more granular data are needed to fully understand the underlying drivers of excess deaths not directly caused by COVID. For now, a working hypothesis is some combination of:


    (1) Elevated cardiovascular risk following COVID infection


    A recent article in Nature provides a good summary of concerns around cardiovascular risk, which studies have shown to be elevated for months after a COVID infection. Analysis of international data will be helpful in this regard – if other countries are not seeing elevated cardiovascular mortality this explanation is less plausible. The same logic allows us to discount implausible suggestions such as harm arising from vaccination.


    (2) Current delays for urgent treatment in the NHS


    Waiting times for ambulances and for A&E admission are extremely high. Average ambulance response time for category 2 calls (for example, strokes or heart attacks) was 59 minutes in July, against a target of 18 minutes.


    The delays arise from a combination of staff availability (NHS absenteeism has consistently been significantly higher than normal through the pandemic), patient demand (93% of urgent and emergency care beds are occupied), and lack of ability to move patients through the system and discharge them. These are current issues and not, as some have suggested, a consequence of lockdowns in 2020 and early 2021.


    (3) Missed and delayed diagnoses earlier in the pandemic


    The pandemic led to significant disruption to new diagnoses as well as the treatment of chronic conditions. Some appointments had to be cancelled and, in many cases, people chose not to seek treatment. 6.7 million people are now on NHS waiting lists for elective, non-urgent care, up more than 50% since before the pandemic. Additionally, it is estimated that there is a substantial hidden need of people who have not come forward for care. Cancer care is frequently cited as a concern in this regard and, while it clear that this is not currently driving significant excess mortality, it is likely to have a longer-term impacT.
    Which is why Airport Two called it the elephant in the room...

    Personally speaking?

    Quote Originally Posted by hallelujah View Post
    For the record, and once again, I am pro vaccine.

    I took the first 2 and would happily do the same again in a similar situation. Now, not so much and you would have to be at Oh Doh levels of brainwashing not to query these ongoing issues given the (rare) deaths we have seen caused by the vaccine and more frequent issues of myocarditis among recipients.
    I think it's a combination of all the things mentioned above in the report, but it would be insane to also dismiss the effect of the vaccines given the deaths that have been well documented. Anything that mentions a circulatory disease is a red flag.

  3. #28
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by malmomike77 View Post
    ^ do you have and English translation?


    Oh dear.

  4. #29
    Thailand Expat armstrong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrWilly View Post
    ^^ Again, you are conflating deaths with cardiac arrests. You are either deliberating obtuse, or rather stupid.
    You might wanna check some of those words mate otherwise you'll look really stupid.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post


    Oh dear.
    good Lord a predictive text error and Symp is in convulsions, slow day in CM......again

  6. #31
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    The hot weather the UK experienced this year will also be a factor in increased diabetes and heart disease. Personally, I would expect the hot weather to be more of an influence than the covid vaccination.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troy View Post
    The hot weather the UK experienced this year will also be a factor in increased diabetes and heart disease.
    the hot weather definitely increases mortality in the elderly but i'm not sure of its contribution to diabetes

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by armstrong View Post
    You might wanna check some of those words mate otherwise you'll look really stupid.
    Speaking of obtuse…

  9. #34
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hallelujah View Post
    Now, not so much and you would have to be at Oh Doh levels of brainwashing not to query these ongoing issues given the (rare) deaths we have seen caused by the vaccine and more frequent issues of myocarditis among recipients.
    Given the number of times I've explained this to you, your inability to understand even basic science frankly puts you at skidmark levels of intelligence.

    The overall risk of myocarditis inflammation of the heart muscle is substantially higher immediately after being infected with COVID-19 than it is in the weeks following vaccination for the coronavirus, a large new study in England shows.

    COVID-19 infection poses higher risk for myocarditis than vaccines | American Heart Association
    The risk of myocarditis is higher after Covid infection than Pfizer or Moderna vaccination across all gender and age groups studied, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

    Myocarditis risk higher after Covid infection than vaccination, CDC finds
    Myocarditis: COVID-19 is a much bigger risk to the heart than vaccination

    Myocarditis: COVID-19 is a much bigger risk to the heart than vaccination

  10. #35
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hallelujah View Post
    I think it's a combination of all the things mentioned above in the report, but it would be insane to also dismiss the effect of the vaccines given the deaths that have been well documented. Anything that mentions a circulatory disease is a red flag.
    Why?

    Unhealthy diet, increased smoking, the misuse of alcohol and a lack of exercise are all going to contribute to an increase in cardiovascular issues, and all of these occurred during numerous lockdowns.

    If the deaths have been "well documented" you should try fucking reading about them.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by malmomike77 View Post
    the hot weather definitely increases mortality in the elderly but i'm not sure of its contribution to diabetes
    Hot weather leads to dehydration, which together with reduced exercise leads to higher glucose levels in the blood and increased risk of Type-2 diabetes. My doctor once told me that he always has an increased number of diabetes cases after a hot summer.

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