The COVID-2019 Thread

[hallelujah]

That said, I know of a woman who’s adult son died of a drug overdose. He also had tested positive for covid. The woman pitched a fit that the coroner was recording his death as a drug overdose. She didn’t believe it and didn’t want it on his death certificate. The coroner was good to her and recorded the death as a covid death. Now that right-wing nutball is screaming because it is a false covid death report.

Exactly. It's easy to stick it down as Covid.

Taken by percentages, given the number of people who are asymptomatic, which we can't properly ascertain at the moment but will obviously be high, the number of people dying is going to be minuscule.

When reported as individual numbers, it's clearly exaggerated. Most of the people were on the way out anyway, but Covid (sadly) hastened their departure. In many cases in the UK, despite it being reported on their death certificate, it clearly had nothing to do with their demise.

The way figures are reported is a total sham and the sooner people realise this in greater numbers, the better.

And before people start shouting at me for not being caring, that isn't the case. We need to get a sense of proportion about this disease and weigh up the actual risks v getting on with life. Something we have so far been unable to do.

[harrybarracuda]

Exactly. It's easy to stick it down as Covid.

Taken by percentages, given the number of people who are asymptomatic, which we can't properly ascertain at the moment but will obviously be high, the number of people dying is going to be minuscule.

When reported as individual numbers, it's clearly exaggerated. Most of the people were on the way out anyway, but Covid (sadly) hastened their departure. In many cases in the UK, despite it being reported on their death certificate, it clearly had nothing to do with their demise.

The way figures are reported is a total sham and the sooner people realise this in greater numbers, the better.

As I said, simply estimates at this stage and it will be years before an accurate assessment can be done.

For example, say a cancer patient under treatment has no immune system due to chemotherapy. He gets the virus and it kills him.

You could make a case that any of the cancer, the chemotherapy or the virus killed him.

With the sheer numbers involved, the sort of cases you are talking about will be statistically insignificant anyway.

[sabang]

Who knows, we might just end up with basically another flu variant- if nature is kind. But keep jabbing- it is noteworthy that the two variants from the original Wuhan bug, Delta and Omicron, have mutated in low jabbed places.

[hallelujah]

Who knows, we might just end up with basically another flu variant

That's all it has ever been.

And not even that for most who have little more than a cough and a sputter.

[harrybarracuda]

That's all it has ever been.

And not even that for most who have little more than a cough and a sputter.

That's the sort of witless shit that explains why you criticise factual posts.

Flu deaths globally: 380,000 a year
Covid deaths globally: 2,500,000 a year

Twat.

[harrybarracuda]

People infected with earlier variants of COVID-19 do not appear to be protected against Omicron, but vaccination will prevent serious illness, a top South African scientist says.

“We believe that previous infection does not provide protection from Omicron,” says Anne von Gottberg, an expert at the National Institute for Communicable Diseases.

Outlining early research into the newly emerged variant, she says doctors are seeing “an increase for Omicron reinfections.”

“We believe the number of cases will increase exponentially in all provinces of the country,” she says. “We believe that vaccines will still, however, protect against severe disease.”

S. Africa expert: Previous infection doesn't protect against Omicron, but shots do | The Times of Israel

[harrybarracuda]

An Italian man is facing charges of fraud after turning up for his Covid-19 vaccine wearing a fake arm.
So determined was he to dodge the jab but still obtain a health pass, the anti-vaxxer may have paid hundreds of euros for the silicone prosthetic.
The bizarre episode at a vaccine hub in Biella, a town close to Turin in the northern Piedmont region, came a week after Italy announced measures barring unvaccinated people from a host of social, cultural and sporting activities.
After completing the bureaucratic formalities, including signing a consent form in front of a doctor, the man, aged 50, sat down and lifted up the sleeve of his shirt as he prepared for a health worker to administer the jab.
Initially, the health worker did not notice anything odd, as the silicone looked similar to skin. But after taking a closer look and touching the arm, the medic asked the man to take off his shirt. His plan foiled, the man, who has not been named, then tried to persuade the health worker to turn a blind eye.
“I felt offended as a professional,” Filippa Bua told La Repubblica. “The colour of the arm made me suspicious and so I asked the man to uncover the rest of his left arm. It was well made but it wasn’t the same colour.” The man said to her: “Would you have imagined that I’d have such a physique?”
She told La Stampa she could not see the man’s veins: “At first I thought I made a mistake, that it was a patient with an artificial arm.”

Italian man tries to dodge Covid vaccine wearing fake arm | Italy | The Guardian

[harrybarracuda]

ICU is full of the unvaccinated – my patience with them is wearing thin

In hospital, Covid-19 has largely become a disease of the unvaccinated. The man in his 20s who had always watched what he ate, worked out in the gym, was too healthy to ever catch Covid badly. The 48-year-old who never got round to making the appointment.
The person in their 50s whose friend had side-effects. The woman who wanted to wait for more evidence. The young pregnant lady worried about the effect on her baby.
The 60-year-old, brought to hospital with oxygen saturations of 70% by the ambulance that he initially called for his partner, who had died by the time it arrived; both believed that the drug companies bribed the government to get the vaccine approved.
All severely ill with Covid. All unvaccinated and previously healthy. All completely avoidable.
Of course, there are people who have their vaccinations but still get sick. These people may be elderly or frail, or have underlying health problems. Those with illnesses affecting the immune system, particularly patients who have had chemotherapy for blood cancers, are especially vulnerable. Some unlucky healthy people will also end up on our general wards with Covid after being vaccinated, usually needing a modest amount of oxygen for a few days.
But the story is different on our intensive care unit. Here, the patient population consists of a few vulnerable people with severe underlying health problems and a majority of fit, healthy, younger people unvaccinated by choice. Watching the mix of patients coming in with Covid, it feels to me like hardly anybody has been vaccinated nowadays; of course, this is because the people that have been vaccinated are getting on with their lives at home. If everyone got vaccinated, hospitals would be under much less pressure; this is beyond debate. Your wait for your clinic appointment/operation/diagnostic test/A&E department would be shorter. Your ambulance would arrive sooner. Reports of the pressure on the NHS are not exaggerated, I promise you.
Furthermore, we have recently rolled out a new medication for patients without antibodies against Covid. It costs about £2,000 a treatment and is subject to a rigorous and time-consuming approval process for every case we treat. Guess which patients don’t have these antibodies (spoiler: it’s not the ones who have been vaccinated).
Most of the resources that we are devoting to Covid in hospital are now being spent on the unvaccinated.
Yes, vaccinations are unpleasant. They cause side-effects. They hurt. You may even still catch Covid afterwards. I have many colleagues who have felt awful after vaccination and a few who had to take a day or two off work. However, I have not heard of any who have been hospitalised with Covid afterwards or who have had severe side-effects. The approvals process was incredibly stringent and we now have an unbelievable amount of real-world data that these vaccines work. The science that has been applied here is nothing short of awe-inspiring to me. However, I realise that none of these rational arguments would change the mind of someone who is resolved against having it, although I suppose it may push someone who remains undecided.
As a respiratory doctor, I have spent my whole career treating people whose lung diseases have been caused by smoking, including long after they knew the risks. I have spent countless hours with people who blame themselves for ruining their health; I have thought a lot about our personal responsibility for our health and to what degree we should be held accountable for our choices. I personally – unlike some of my colleagues – have never felt any ambivalence about treating smokers without judgment in exactly the same way as people with diseases that are not seen as self-inflicted.
Enshrined in the way we protect patients’ autonomy is the recognition that others may reasonably make decisions we may see as irrational or wrong. We are all products of our upbringing, education and opportunities, and I have been hugely fortunate that in my case these have led me to make decisions I value. Who is to say I wouldn’t have made different choices in someone else’s shoes.
Translating this to the choice not to take the vaccine, however, I find my patience wearing thin. I think this is for a number of reasons. Even if you are not worried about your own risk from Covid, you cannot know the risk of the people into whose faces you may cough; there is a dangerous and selfish element to this that I find hard to stomach.
Some of my frustration is directed upwards, at the flagrant misinformation flourishing in certain places and the utterly woeful example that our leaders continue to set. I have never heard a reason not to take the vaccine that I have agreed with. Most of all, however, I am now beaten back, exhausted, worn down by the continuous stream of people that we battle to treat when they have consciously passed up the opportunity to save themselves. It does make me angry.
Despite this, I find the idea of NHS and care staff being forced to be vaccinated very difficult. I know that it is the right outcome, but I dislike the means of bringing it about. It is incredible to me that there is so much anxiety and falsehood around that this could possibly be necessary after the year we have all witnessed. How strong is the hold that this information has on people that it outweighs rational thought?
Maybe it’s just that others have not seen what I have recently, or do not believe it, but even now we have nurses on our Covid ward who have not been vaccinated. I just hope that we don’t end up losing yet more staff.
Fundamentally though, for me, it comes down to this. I can’t think of a single case offhand of a person who was previously fit and healthy who has ended up needing intensive care after being fully vaccinated. It may not stop you from catching Covid. But it can save your life when you do.

The writer is an NHS respiratory consultant who works across a number of hospitals

• ICU is full of the unvaccinated – my patience with them is wearing thin | Anonymous | The Guardian

[S Landreth]

For those thinking about traveling to the US…….

Amended Global Testing-Order 12-02-2021: https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/pdf/A...-02-2021-p.pdf

SUMMARY:

Pursuant to 42 CFR 71.20 and 71.31 (b) and as set forth in greater detail below, this Notice and Amended Order prohibits the boarding of any passenger – 2 years of age or older - on any aircraft destined to the United States1 from a foreign country unless the passenger:

Presents paper or digital documentation of one of the following requirements:

(i) A negative pre-departure viral test result for SARS-CoV-2 conducted on a specimen collected no more than 1 calendar day before the flight’s departure from a foreign country (Qualifying Test)

Edit……

The important section (highlighted) related to some who live (part time) in SE Asia.

Requirements for Airlines & Other Aircraft Operators

Any airline or other aircraft operator with passengers arriving into the United States from a foreign country, shall:

A. Confirm that every passenger – 2 years or older - onboard the aircraft has paper or digital documentation reflecting a Qualifying Test or Documentation of Recovery.

1) Requirements for a Qualifying Test include:

a. Documentation of a negative SARS-CoV-2 viral test result from a specimen collected no more than 1 calendar day preceding the passenger’s flight to the United States.

The negative SARS-CoV-2 viral test result must include:

i. personal identifiers (e.g., name and date of birth) on the negative test result that match the personal identifiers on the passenger’s passport or other travel documents;

ii. a specimen collection date indicating that the specimen was collected no more than 1 calendar day before the flight’s departure (or first flight in a series of connections booked on the same itinerary);

iii. the type of viral test indicating it is a NAAT or antigen test;

iv. a test result that states “NEGATIVE,” “SARS-CoV2 RNA NOT DETECTED,” “SARS-CoV-2 ANTIGEN NOT DETECTED,” or “COVID-19 NOT DETECTED,” or other indication that SARS-CoV-2 was not detected in the individual's specimen. A test marked “invalid” is not acceptable; and

v. information about the entity issuing the result (e.g., laboratory, healthcare entity, or telehealth service), such as the name and contact information.

[russellsimpson]

Thankfully there doesn't seem to be anything (yet) in this new initiative that is going to interfere with a relatively simple open northern border which is good.

[Joe 90]

No ones travelling anywhere without a load of hassle.

[Joe 90]

That's all it has ever been.

And not even that for most who have little more than a cough and a sputter.

Death toll could be nearly 170,000
When looking at the overall death toll from coronavirus, official figures count deaths in three different ways, each giving a slightly different number.

First, government figures - the ones reported each day - count people who died within 28 days of testing positive for coronavirus. This figure is more than 145,000.

According to the latest ONS figures, the UK has now seen more than 169,000 deaths in total - that's all those deaths where coronavirus was mentioned on the death certificate even if the person had not been tested for the virus.

Chart showing the three ways of measuring deaths from Covid - the government figure of 145,424 includes all deaths within 28 days of a positive result; the ONS counts all death certificate mentions and that figure is now 169,020; the excess death figures is the number of deaths over and above the usual total and that figure is now 143,668. Updated 3 Dec.
UK reports 50,584 cases on Friday

The third measure counts all deaths over and above the usual number at the time of year - that figure was more than 140,000 as of 19 November.

In total, there were 13,743 deaths registered in the week to 19 November, which was 16% above the five-year average.

Of the total deaths, 1,088 were related to coronavirus, fewer than the previous week.

There have been more deaths involving Covid than "excess" deaths since the start of the pandemic, meaning non-Covid deaths must be below usual levels.

This could be down to the milder flu season last winter - due to less travel and more social distancing - and because some people who might have died for other reasons had there been no pandemic, died of Covid.

[Switch]

Thankfully there doesn't seem to be anything (yet) in this new initiative that is going to interfere with a relatively simple open northern border which is good.

FFS talk about jumping the gun?
You are obviously too idle and naive to read the current data on Omicron. Do some research yourself, and you might learn that even the latest impact assessments are littered with the comments about “not enough is known yet”.

Make your own studies broader and deeper. Accepting gifts positive ‘suggestions’ without a fuller review is quite plainly stupid.

[cyrille]

Accepting gifts positive ‘suggestions’ without a fuller review is quite plainly stupid.

Actually, it's literally complete nonsense.

[sabang]

Bummer to those that have been jabbed and felt a bit bad afterwards, but sure not me- easy as pie, no problema. But ever the cynic, I wonder if several gild the lily a bit so as to have a convenient excuse to throw a sicky! The only annoying thing in this nanny state is they make you hang around for 20 minutes after jab 'just in case'.

Don't think we have any anti-vaxxers left here anyway, do we?

[malmomike77]

The figures are massively skewed given the way that deaths are reported (anyone being positive for Covid within 28 days of death in the UK goes down as the lurgy).

Been said over a year ago, its why the UK figures seem comparatively high

[malmomike77]

No great surprise here and why we need to start finding ways to live with COVID that means we don't tie ourselves in knots.

NHS will be plagued by Covid ‘for at least five years’

Vaccines may be needed for a decade or more, say Downing St advisers.

Covid will be a threat to the NHS for at least the next five years and testing and vaccines may be needed for a decade or longer, the government’s scientific advisers have said.

Documents released this afternoon show that ministers have been told that it will take “at least a further five years for Covid-19 to settle to a predictable endemic state” — where the virus lingers in the background but does not threaten to rapidly overwhelm the health system.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/nhs-will-be-plagued-by-covid-for-at-least-five-years-7v90l05l6

[russellsimpson]

Accepting gifts positive ‘suggestions’ without a fuller review is quite plainly stupid.

Sorry switch but I still can't figure out what you're on about?

[harrybarracuda]

Some positive news from South Africa. This should cheer up our resident whiners.

Richard Friedland, chief executive officer of Netcare Ltd., which operates the largest private health-care network in South Africa:

• “If in the second and third wave we’d seen these levels of positivity to tests conducted, we would have seen very significant increases in hospital admissions and we’re not seeing that. In our primary care clinics it is mainly people under 30-years-old.”
• “So I actually think there is a silver lining here and this may signal the end of Covid-19, with it attenuating itself to such an extent that it’s highly contagious, but doesn’t cause severe disease. That’s what happened with Spanish flu.”
• “We are seeing breakthrough infections of people who have been vaccinated, but the infections we’re seeing are very mild to moderate. So for health care workers who have had boosters, it’s mostly mild. I think this whole thing has been so poorly communicated and so much panic generated.”
• “It’s early days, but I’m less panicked. It feels different to me on the ground.”

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

[harrybarracuda]

But this will get them whining again.

How COVID-19 harms the heart

How COVID-19 harms the heart

[harrybarracuda]

Ooooh this will get them whining again! "It's just like the 'flu! Why do I have to wear a mask!" etc.

WHO says there is no death linked to the omicron variant in the world so far.

Omicron: OMS diz que nao ha morte vinculada a variante ate o momento

[harrybarracuda]

Gwyneth Paltrow will be pleased.

Rutgers researchers studying COVID-19 have created a new way to deliver DNA molecules into skin cells, using a suction technique similar to the ancient healing practice of cupping that increases blood circulation and promotes healing.
The study appears in the journal Science Advances.
In laboratory tests with rodents, the team used the suction method to deliver a SARS-CoV-2 DNA vaccine, which generated a strong immune response – about 100 times stronger than an injected vaccine alone. Based on the results, the study’s funder, biopharmaceutical company GeneOne Life Science, Inc., has licensed the technology for human clinical trials of a COVID vaccine. A human clinical trial has advanced to Phase II based on the high level of the technology’s safety and immunogenicity.

Delivering the COVID-19 Vaccine Through Cupping | Rutgers University Foundation

[harrybarracuda]

Dec 3 (Reuters) - Europe crossed 75 million coronavirus cases on Friday, according to a Reuters tally, as the region braces for the new Omicron variant at a time when hospitals in some countries are already strained by the current surge.
Over 15 countries in Europe have reported confirmed cases of the new variant that has rattled financial markets. The European Union's public health agency said on Thursday that the Omicron variant could be responsible for more than half of all COVID-19 infections in Europe within a few months. read more

Even before the discovery of Omicron, Europe was pandemic's epicentre with 66 out of every 100 new infections each day coming from European countries, according to a Reuters analysis.
Eastern Europe has 33% of the total reported cases and about 53% of the total reported deaths in Europe. It makes up 39% of the region's population.

Europe surpasses 75 million COVID-19 cases amid spread of Omicron | Reuters

[prawnograph]

Hunting Africans?


Thai government reprimands newspaper for headline saying it is ‘hunting for Africans’



Newspaper rebuked over 'hunts Africans' headline
3 December 2021

A central government agency tasked with managing Thailand's Covid-19 response has reprimanded a local newspaper for its "poor choice" of headline.

The Bangkok Post had run the headline "Government hunts for African visitors" on its front page and website.

.

Apology for headline
PUBLISHED : 4 DEC 2021
The Bangkok Post would like to express its apologies for the insensitive choice of the word “hunts” in its headline “Govt hunts for African visitors” on the front page of the Dec 2 edition to describe police attempts to trace 783 visitors from southern African countries arriving since Nov 15 for Omicron coronavirus variant testing.

The Bangkok Post had absolutely no intention of conveying what many might have regarded as discriminatory or racist language.

The Post would like to assure that it is committed to promoting equality and human rights for all.

[Iceman123]

They actually increase your chances of getting infected. The only useful thing they do is limit your ability to spread the infection.

I doubt most of the mongs that wear them are aware of this.

Harry has posted all kinds of nonsense on every page of this thread. The above was one of his early comments on masks.
If he wants to be the font of all knowledge on this thread he should quoting from epidemiologists who possibly know more than him, not the daily shite he picks upon the interwebby.

I have formed the opinion that Harry gets harder than a redneck at a family reunion when it comes to anything covid related.