Thread: Coup 2014 !!!! : Military 'takes control' in Thailand

The Economist makes some cogent points-

The generals are likely to notice two things soon. First, that they cannot rule the country unless they are prepared to use force. Secondly, beyond the walls of the barracks, Thailand has undergone a dramatic transformation, even since 2006. It has moved away even further from being the kind of rural agricultural society with its social relations defined by hierarchical, paternalistic relations. More each year, it resembles a modern state whose individual citizens and social groups look out for their own interests. Social changes that took hundreds of years to emerge in European history have taken just half a century in Thailand. That is less time than the average age of the generals who are trying to revive for Thailand a brand of authoritarianism that was derided as being reserved for the kingdom’s poor neighbours, Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar.

When Thailand’s traditional elites made it plain that they did not know how to run the country in 1997—the year the Asian financial crisis cut short Thailand’s economic miracle—the public began to seek greater power and influence for itself. Mr Thaksin happened to be in a position to serve as their vehicle. A thriving oligarch when he came to power in 2001, he built a political machine that ran on a simple principle: find out what people want, and give it to them. He was wily and absolutely ruthless, and he knew to jump on the train that was already rolling.

This is the underlying force that the generals have to contend with: not Thaksin, but the dramatically changed society that stubbornly brought him to power.

General Prayuth does not look like a strongman to reorder Thai politics and society. Rather, he looks like a soldier who got fed up dealing with hopeless politicians, and then pushed by his arch-royalist superiors into doing their dirty work and binning electoral democracy
Military coup in Thailand: The darkened horizon | The Economist

I'd love to see one of you guys air your views on a real Thai site and post the responses on here.you could be the next Mahatma, Betty

Last night I asked a Thai bar owner.whom ive known for years, what he made of the coup and curfew and how long he thought it would last. He looked at me in disgust and walked off. They dont like white boy talking about their politics

Some protesters in Chiangmai.



https://twitter.com/MaaxRedCamfrog/s...033216/photo/1

The problem with a 'real Thai site' is they are generally either blood red, or vomit yellow.

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

Originally Posted by Albert Shagnastier

For every 1 trouble maker

This is why people like you and tewwy are dangerous, albert. By trouble maker, you actually mean somebody who is doing nothing other than standing up for their democratic rights; no violence, no harm to others, just respecting the law (which, by definition the coupists are not). The people who held a placard saying 'we want to vote' and were then arrested, are 'trouble makers'. Very scary how gullible people so easily follow the discourse of an army junta... Hence why the junta are so keen to control social discourse, they know how gullible some folks, such as you and tewwy, are... Scary stuff, you'd make Geobbels proud...

Err, no Betty - calm down, I'm stating that there will be no civil war over this.

Originally Posted by economist.com

General Prayuth does not look like a strongman to reorder Thai politics and society. Rather, he looks like a soldier who got fed up dealing with hopeless politicians, and then pushed by his arch-royalist superiors into doing their dirty work and binning electoral democracy

He is a military man who has no experience with having his orders questioned much less disobeyed .

He has absolutely no skill set to replace his gun in running the country .

I've no doubt he is becomming acutely aware he is a fish out of water .

That is very true, We know nothing.



Last night I asked a Thai bar owner.whom ive known for years, what he made of the coup and curfew and how long he thought it would last. He looked at me in disgust and walked off. They dont like white boy talking about their politics[/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Albert Shagnastier

Err, no Betty - calm down, I'm stating that there will be no civil war over this

You have been wrong every time so far.

I hope you are not wrong this time....

I should imagine Prayuth will rapidly understand the nature of his self imposed task when he is told that his command to pay the farmers what they are owed is not possible. The wheels of that scam well and truly fell off when the markets declined to buy into the debt. The losses are immense and without state borrowings to fund them there is nothing in the current budget to pay the farmers.

Economics at this level are troublesome to most societies but to a general with no grounding in such matters the prospects cannot be appealing.

Given that this was his first significant "edict" I should imagine the man will not be happy if it is not promulgated. Savings will have to be made and those Ukrainian tanks might not be so necessary after all.

Originally Posted by Mid

Originally Posted by economist.com

General Prayuth does not look like a strongman to reorder Thai politics and society. Rather, he looks like a soldier who got fed up dealing with hopeless politicians, and then pushed by his arch-royalist superiors into doing their dirty work and binning electoral democracy

He is a military man who has no experience with having his orders questioned much less disobeyed .

He has absolutely no skill set to replace his gun in running the country .

I've no doubt he is becomming acutely aware he is a fish out of water .

The skill set of a top military commander may be somewhat different to that of most elected politicians, but then, there is no annoying opposition party carping and baying from the benches, so you can operate in a completely different way.

Military staff colleges teach many of the administrative skills needed to run large organizations....and a country is just a large organization after all.

The good general will not be calling for a vote when he issues an order, or wasting time debating the merits of his decisions with those who may wish to disagree.

There are some distinct advantages in being a military dictator....and the more successful ones have been shown to be highly efficient, even if it means the odd few dissenters have to be eliminated from time to time....

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by Albert Shagnastier

Err, no Betty - calm down, I'm stating that there will be no civil war over this

You have been wrong every time so far.

I hope you are not wrong this time....

Wrong every time about what?
Is this just me clashing with your ideologies whatever they may be,or do you have some facts to back-up your bullshit?

Originally Posted by thegent

I should imagine Prayuth will rapidly understand the nature of his self imposed task when he is told that his command to pay the farmers what they are owed is not possible. The wheels of that scam well and truly fell off when the markets declined to buy into the debt. The losses are immense and without state borrowings to fund them there is nothing in the current budget to pay the farmers.

Think I read elsewhere that the funds have already been arranged.

OK , had a shufti, found this, you can probably google the source:

The Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives (BAAC) is preparing a Bt55-billion budget from its reserves and the Farmers Assistance Fund to pay farmers owed under the rice-pledging scheme, starting tomorrow.


Yingluck was politically and legally stalled on trying to borrow the funds from Thai banks. Dictator has less problems.

Originally Posted by terry57

Actually the amount of people killed in all of the Coups in Thailand pales into insignificance compared with the lives lost down south.

All this Political banter could be put to good use coming up with real answers on how to deal with the disgrace that's happening down South.

The atrocities that happen are quite disturbing in there brutality, beheadings, burning schools, targeting monks, school teachers and killing innocent people.

Only last week did the Muslim militants kill a retired solder and burn him on the road.

And even this pales into insignificance when you look at the daily carnage up and down the nation - Thai on Thai road deaths - around 80 deaths a day over peak hols and around 30 deaths daily as the norm - every year.

Never here the international community complain about this, though!

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

It's not bullshit, albert - over all the threads since you got vocal re suthep and other issues, you have been utterly wrong at every turn, but still refuse to acknowledge so...

Facts - points. Wrong about what?

Like I said - other than differing opinions - you can't name one fact i've been wrong on.

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

Tell us, albert, what will happen next?

All the parties will sit down and create a sensible road map. Then there will be an election - the result of which will be respected. How long for is another matter obviously.

Originally Posted by Albert Shagnastier

All the parties will sit down and create a sensible road map. Then there will be an election - the result of which will be respected. How long for is another matter obviously.

Bloody hell, you're an optimist. I hope you're right.

Do you think the army will do anything about the constitution, take powers away from the voters? More appointments in a senate, for example? How's about the big event, will they stay in power to manage that first? How long will the army stay in power?

Mark’s “apology”
25
05
2014
Regular readers will know that PPT thinks little of Abhisit Vejjajiva. He’s opportunistic, egotistical and allowed the Democrat Party to be taken over by extremists. He also shares responsibility for the state’s violence in 2010 that left dozens of people dead and thousands injured. He’s allowed himself to be a pawn of Suthep Thaugsuban, the military and extremist anti-democrats. He’s a failed and disgraced politician at the head of a political party that hasn’t won an election for many years.Mark the comedian

He was caught up in the military coup the other day and was looked after by the military for a few hours. This is what he said on his return to his comfortable home:

Thank you everyone who were worried about me. I apologize for being unable to push through reforms under the Constitution and for not being able to protect democracy.

Mark is pulling his own leg harder than that of anyone else. Abhisit has supported anti-democrats, royalists and fascists all intent on smashing Thailand’s electoral democracy. His “apology” is a shameless and sick joke. His “apology” is a shameless and sick joke. His boycott of elections and trashing of parliament has been a major contribution to the destruction of democracy in Thailand.

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

just saying the payments were stopped by the PADites to build pressure on PT from their own voters.

Payments were stopped long before the current cycle of protest.

The scheme was massively bungled, billions are "missing" and they were trying to throw a few more billions at it - with little likelyhood of the farmers even then getting their dosh.

I would make a guess that some hard audits are ongoing, both of money and rice stocks. I think some people are going to be trying to answer some very, very hard questions.

I think you really under estimate the staggering amount of corruption that was going on under the last government.

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

Originally Posted by Albert Shagnastier

All the parties will sit down and create a sensible road map. Then there will be an election - the result of which will be respected. How long for is another matter obviously.

Bloody hell, you're an optimist. I hope you're right.

Do you think the army will do anything about the constitution, take powers away from the voters? More appointments in a senate, for example? How's about the big event, will they stay in power to manage that first? How long will the army stay in power?

I have no idea what they will come up with.

But one thing that's for sure is this country needs to re-think it's base systems on a major scale. Public education, transport systems and networks, infrastructure, mass agricultural practices...the list goes on and on, need to be hauled into the 21st century.

If they do what they say (i.e get all the parties around a table and find the middle way) - personally I would expect at least a few good things from the next government.

To do things properly will take time, and 1-2 years before a new election would be reasonable.

^

this country needs to re-think it's base systems on a major scale. Public education, transport systems and networks, infrastructure, mass agricultural practices...the list goes on and on, need to be hauled into the 21st century.

I'd agree with that. But, I don't agree that the army has any intent to follow those ideas; quite the opposite. They want nationalism, a strengthening of the patronage system, propaganda not education.

Originally Posted by nidhogg

I think you really under estimate the staggering amount of corruption that was going on under the last government.

I've never looked into the rice scheme, just presumed it was an average idea, not well thought through and badly (and corruptly) administered at every level.

I certainly agree that the last government was corrupt, but no more than any of the dem governments, Banharn's governments have been, for example. Hence why the patronage system needs totally revising, and not in the way the army intend...

The bamboo grapevine says that this time the 'govt' will pay the farmers. Next time back to world prices.

Maybe, my family will be paid soon, let's see.

Originally Posted by hillbilly

Next time back to world prices.

I think a subsidy program that is not designed for the middlemen and also encourages high quality would be a good option

Originally Posted by baldrick

I think a subsidy program that is not designed for the middlemen and also encourages high quality would be a good option

The middlemen and their cut are certainly a massive problem, so anything that gets the farmer closer to the market price without some pu yai getting a new Benz, has to be good.

One of the main problems is that many families borrowed money from let's say less than the average banking standards. When many of them get paid they are still going to be in the red.

My family is excluded (they did not borrow that much me) because my sober BIL predicated this a long time a go.

Still sad for many families...

^good point, Hillbilly - everyday the interest will be growing, horrible situation for those folks. The gvt bank has very cheap loans for farmers, luckily my FiL only uses that system.