Suthep threatens to 'shut down' Bangkok afer New Year holidays

**DrB0b** · 07-03-2014, 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by pickel

Bob and Betty would no doubt support a Taliban victory in Afghanistan in their altruistic view of democracy.

More likely to ask you WTF you're talking about but I doubt even you know the answer to that. If you're only capable of one liners and not capable of making them funny or relevant, as you're obviously not, at least try to make them comprehensible.

Originally Posted by TonyBKK

Your incessant ad hominem attacks reveal your inability to debate the topic as a mature adult using facts and reason.

Tony, sometimes a person is genuinely a moron. You're one of those people. Calling you a moron is NOT an ad-hominem attack, it's the simple truth. You are a stranger to fact and reason but like most people who are neither intelligent nor informed, people with large egos and small minds, you're incapable of recognising that. There is a reason you are laughed at and not taken seriously and that reason is not your blinding intellect and Godlike powers of observation. No, you are derided because you're genuinely a moron and a dipshit - it's that simple.

**Butterfly** · 07-03-2014, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

He is a liar, he has no respect for the rule of law, political transparency, accountability, equality or anything else that's considered politically virtuous. Yet, folks like Terry, Albert and Tony have nothing to offer other than "But, Thaksin...", ignoring everything suthep and his mob get up to... Extremely ignorant.

agree, BUT we are unfortunately in a political environment that only favors binary thinking and binary choices, Thaksin or Not Thaksin. It's an impossible choice, but the only choice.

We can only lecture those silly monkeys about the merit of Democracy and the plurality of parties and the plurality of thoughts current to serve the Democratic process and the Democratic ideals. When Thai political currents are adequated with "mystic" school of thoughts based on obscure "Buddhism" or "Patronage allegiance", it becomes clear that there is no common goal and we are dealing with a war of religions, not a war of class, and nothing will change.

Without a common vision of political progress, there is no future in Thai politics, only a succession of power struggle between several "schools" of mystic thoughts.

In short, Thailand needs an illuminated dictator to show them the right way to Democracy.

**pickel** · 07-03-2014, 08:21 PM

Originally Posted by DrB0b

More likely to ask you WTF you're talking about but I doubt even you know the answer to that. If you're only capable of one liners and not capable of making them funny or relevant, as you're obviously not, at least try to make them comprehensible.

The basis of your support for the reds is what you consider an undeniable right of one person one vote. I'm sure you can figure the rest out from there, unless you're a moron, dipshit, etc.

**terry57** · 07-03-2014, 09:45 PM

Betty called me a naughty word,

I will not hold that against Betty as Ive been called much worse on this forum.

Anyway, Politics always gets the boys fired up hence I'd much rather read About Tony's biking adventures than read about Betty's and Bobs Slanted and biased Political views.

Jesus, they do think that they now every little detail about This issue.

**Yasojack** · 07-03-2014, 10:22 PM

Betty thought you were staying away from this subject.?

Leave them to it they see a carnival atmosphere and are blinded by whats really going on.

sure if it went on in the own countries they would be joining in the festival

**Bettyboo** · 07-03-2014, 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by Yasojack

Leave them to it they see a carnival atmosphere and are blinded by whats really going on.

You are right, Jack, but they just refuse to inform themselves and blurt complete untruths loudly; quite irritating...

**Bettyboo** · 07-03-2014, 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by TonyBKK

Do you ever get tired of screaming "RED HERRING RED HERRING!" at anyone who dares to challenge your decidedly myopic view of present day Thai politics?

Your incessant ad hominem attacks reveal your inability to debate the topic as a mature adult using facts and reason.

Your inability to grasp the fact that criticism of one party does NOT equal support of the other is another logical fallacy.

Seems in your mind Suthep is the devil and Thaksin can do no wrong. It's obvious you are so set in your position that nothing will change your mind, but I will continue to call you out on your double standards and blatant hypocrisy.

Have a nice day Betty

Thank you.

Now, read through those words again, and ask youself if any apply to you.

**Yasojack** · 07-03-2014, 11:19 PM

Ignorance is bliss

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

Originally Posted by Yasojack

Leave them to it they see a carnival atmosphere and are blinded by whats really going on.

You are right, Jack, but they just refuse to inform themselves and blurt complete untruths loudly; quite irritating...

**sabang** · 07-03-2014, 11:26 PM

Originally Posted by TonyBKK

Seems in your mind Suthep is the devil and Thaksin can do no wrong.

Originally Posted by TonyBKK

Except that in this silly country the "democratic process" is hopelessly fvcked...

How would you ever expect the citizens of Thailand to approve of, like, Suthep and his loony 'proposals' over Yingluck ('but Thaksin')? That is inconceivable.
Is it unlikely, at least in the short term, that more Thai citizens would vote for the Democrats- whose politicians are constantly implicated in attempts to overthrow the democratic vote, over PT (bad though they might be, & 'but Thaksin').

To unfvck Thai politics, offer a better alternative, and sell it. This the Democrats have persistently failed to do, at the same time as repetitively shooting themself in the foot with the average voter- insulting them, trying to overthrow or cancel their vote, the elected government, etc. They need Help- they should bring in some political spin doctors from the US, perhaps some 'How to be a grown-up' books too. If the Dem's don't grow up and step up to the mark, I daresay someone else will. But right now the lack of electoral appeal of the Dem's is well deserved, 'but Thaksin' or not.

**Bettyboo** · 07-03-2014, 11:29 PM

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

He is a liar, he has no respect for the rule of law, political transparency, accountability, equality or anything else that's considered politically virtuous. Yet, folks like Terry, Albert and Tony have nothing to offer other than "But, Thaksin...", ignoring everything suthep and his mob get up to... Extremely ignorant.

agree, BUT we are unfortunately in a political environment that only favors binary thinking and binary choices, Thaksin or Not Thaksin. It's an impossible choice, but the only choice.

We can only lecture those silly monkeys about the merit of Democracy and the plurality of parties and the plurality of thoughts current to serve the Democratic process and the Democratic ideals. When Thai political currents are adequated with "mystic" school of thoughts based on obscure "Buddhism" or "Patronage allegiance", it becomes clear that there is no common goal and we are dealing with a war of religions, not a war of class, and nothing will change.

Without a common vision of political progress, there is no future in Thai politics, only a succession of power struggle between several "schools" of mystic thoughts.

In short, Thailand needs an illuminated dictator to show them the right way to Democracy.

No, it's not binary, suthep and his backers have been trying to sell that for years - and it's just not true.

It's multifaceted and dripping in history. &, the development of democracy is what it has always been, a steady process and movement in a direction towards accountability, transparency, blind justice, equal opportunity - the same things that keep being brought up. suthep and his backers want to make sure these things never exist; it was Rama VII's call for these things, on the back of Rama V's original movement towards them, that irked the feudal lords so much they took over and continue to pull the PC, army and judicial strings - easy to check for yourself, I have done, it's a shame other posters do not bother. I will point yet again to the Rama VII museum where you can read his own, and Rama VIII's, words on the subject (ironically, last time I was there I walked past suthep on the stairs...).

Now, Thaksin doesn't want a move towards transparency, accountability, blind justice and equal opportunity either. So, he is not the longterm answer either...

The answer is: strengthen democratic institutions step by step. This must mean going back to the 1997 constitution, and improving it, taking away the power of the army to rule above politics, and a free and fair judiciary and independent organizations (such as the NACC). People from all walks of society will be needed to achieve this over many years; UDD members, dem supporters, and yes even some of the PADites. A major step needs to be taken so that the 'top tier' of society are accountable. I'd suggest starting with the coup generals, generals that put their soldiers on the streets to shoot policemen, judges who are caught cheating the system for political and financial gain, and politicians such as suthep, banharn, etc, too. Quite a task really - more likely to come from an evolved UDD group than any other at this moment in time. It was hoped, a few years back, that abhisit could be the focal point for a smooth and natural flow towards these ideals, but he decided to rape the nation instead...

**Yasojack** · 07-03-2014, 11:39 PM

what we need is some Thai whistleblowers, now that would be Pandoras box.

**Bobcock** · 08-03-2014, 07:54 AM

Originally Posted by sabang

This the Democrats have persistently failed to do

Hard Work
Long Term Effort
Understanding
Selflessness

You beginning to see the problem here aren't you....?

**Loy Toy** · 08-03-2014, 08:17 AM

I prefer to keep opinions to myself regarding the mess Thailand is in at the moment but will comment that anyone who wishes to be a politician is after personal wealth and power and will do anything to achieve their goal including sacrificing anyone in their way. This wealth and power is not achieved by the receipt of a government salary so it is clear that manipulation and questionable activity is part of their plans.

There is not much difference between Thai politicians and their counterparts in the west.

Moreover the difference here is the Thai voting population are easily manipulated, their votes can be purchased and the majority don't even vaguely know what is really going on. Most who do simply ignore the truth preferring to wipe their hands of the tomfoolery.

Until the majority of the voting community become better educated this country will never have a democratically elected government.

**taxexile** · 08-03-2014, 08:32 AM

Until the majority of the voting community become better educated this country will never have a democratically elected government.

indeed, but why at this time should they have a democratically elected governement.

thais are ungovernable, they go their own way, they do what they want, they have no respect for any laws whatsoever and they continually seek to circumvent by underhand means any regulation that gets in the way of what they want to do.

democracy here wont change a thing.

they need a benevolent dictatorship to gradually whip 'em into shape, like china or singapore.

democracy comes later.

if its still around.

"advanced" societies such as europe are gradually becoming less and less democratic as the eu superstate takes control and dictates policy.

and asean will do the same for asia as the eu is doing for europe.

**sabang** · 08-03-2014, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by taxexile

they need a benevolent dictatorship to gradually whip 'em into shape, like china or singapore.

I see. OK Somchai- Suthep, or Thaksin??
Game over.

**Loy Toy** · 08-03-2014, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by taxexile

but why at this time should they have a democratically elected governement.

I agree with you that a "Democratically" elected government is probably the wrong term.

Maybe a government elected by way of intelligent voter decision making and without the need of bribery and corruption would be a better way of phrasing it.

**taxexile** · 08-03-2014, 09:14 AM

Maybe a government elected by way of intelligent voter decision making and without the need of bribery and corruption would be a better way of phrasing it.

try telling that to some of the blinkered blowhards on this thread.

**sabang** · 08-03-2014, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

intelligent voter decision making

Game, set & match then-
According to the research on the general election of 2011 by Siriphan Noksuan Sawasdee of Chulalongkorn University revealed that post-graduate voters casted for Pheu Thai Party to the tune of 50.3%, while merely 32.3% favored Democrat Party; vote-buying prevailed in Southern and Central regions
https://th-th.facebook.com/seri.wong...02623421456590

Frankly, it doesn't seem important to me when a group of foreigners expresses a partisan preference, as indeed they have every right to do. Neither when they squabble over their partisan preference. Would I really care if some Thai told me they prefer the Australian Labor party over the Liberals? Obviously not, and the same applies in reverse.

The damage comes from the stultified, damaging, and ultimately self defeating attitudes of the Democrat party and it's primary constituencies- who are in outright denial. PT's electoral victories are not the result of vote buying (or the Isaan rice farmer

), this has been established time & again, and keeping ones head stuck in the sand in this regard just further consigns them to the electoral graveyard. And if I may throw a 'partisan point' in the ring, they fully deserve that.

If the Democrats don't wake up and smell the roses, ffs find someone who will Thailand. TRT seized just such an opportunity, and swept the board- much to the chagrin of it's amateurish opposition. The same opportunity beckons now, and frankly I much prefer that to a Thaksin/PT dynasty. But I don't expect Somchai to care what I think, merely to vote on the basis of the choices he/she is given.

**taxexile** · 08-03-2014, 09:42 AM

post-graduate voters casted for Pheu Thai Party to the tune of 50.3%, while merely 32.3% favored Democrat Party; vote-buying prevailed in Southern and Central regions

meaningless whichever way you spin it.

post grad thai equates with 15 year old euro, or a 13 year old chinese or singaporean.

at best.

**Loy Toy** · 08-03-2014, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by taxexile

try telling that to some of the blinkered blowhards on this thread.

I am not in a position to tell or argue the point with anyone Tax.

All I am doing is putting my point of view forward which I sincerely believe is correct.

If anyone disagrees with my view that is up to them but that does not stop me believing they are just as hoodwinked as the majority of Thai voters.

May I also state that all the players on board at the moment are as bad as each other which is a shame for Thailand and it's people.

**Bobcock** · 08-03-2014, 09:53 AM

The game has changed from when I was first here.

Thaksin's popularity changed it forever.

never before had someone had the numbers to dominate a parliament, to have a single party in power. It was all about coalitions, which even though we still have them are not he same as in the past.

Before every party had a share of the pie and were happy, didn't really matter who was head pig at the trough, they all got rich not serving the people.

But now defeat means that they end up with nothing, and that is not acceptable to the'entitled'

**sabang** · 08-03-2014, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by taxexile

meaningless whichever way you spin it.

So what is your definition of 'intelligent vote'? Someone who votes democrat, presumably. An increasingly rare species.

Which kinda explains why the yellow leaners seem to have this persistent attitude that the Thai are dumb. They just stubbornly refuse to see the truth (as 'told' to them by you), and thus vote for your preferred party, and stubbornly refuse to sacrifice their democratic vote for the, erm, 'greater good'. Damn monkeys.

Oh, but of course it's no fault of the Democrats- it's that takkie monster, innit?

**sabang** · 08-03-2014, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by Bobcock

that is not acceptable to the'entitled'

Perhaps it is about time for the 'entitled' (at least those on "My" political side of the 'entitled') to wake up and realise that if they continue to stuff up the nation and alienate it's voters this way, they will no longer be the 'entitled'- merely the begrudgers.

**Loy Toy** · 08-03-2014, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by sabang

So what is your definition of 'intelligent vote'?

May I answer that question mate as it was my quote.

A vote decided upon based on one's understanding of governmental policies and how those policies mean long-term benefits to that voter.

As we all know Thais generally think about and are only concerned about today and don't really have the ability to think long term let alone consequences.

That is why the vote buying for very little money targeting the electorate majority poor rural communities won the day. A brilliant tactic because it was common sense.

What is the old saying..........A bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush!

**sabang** · 08-03-2014, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

That is why the vote buying for very little money targeting the electorate majority poor rural communities won the day.

It didn't- policies targeted at (and Sold to) the long neglected (and majority) provincial vote won the day. Call it populism if you like. 'Vote buying' was there all along, long before takkie learnt how to be a bad cop.

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

A brilliant tactic because it was common sense.

I think 'brilliant' considerably overstates the case- more like a no brainer. But commonsensical, yes indeedy.
Any organised and competent opposition has a pretty good opportunity to make a considerable dent on PT, thanks to it's rice scheme stuff up. If only Thailand had one.

Thread: Suthep threatens to 'shut down' Bangkok afer New Year holidays

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