Thread: Why such abuse for TEFLers?

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

What's the point in spending years at school to get qualified, then teach in Thailand for shit money? I would of thought that with proper qualifications, you would go where the money is.

one can get ok money in thailand with a teaching degree.

I wouldnt say teachers can get great money anywhere in the world, ok yes, great no.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

What's the point in spending years at school to get qualified, then teach in Thailand for shit money? I would of thought that with proper qualifications, you would go where the money is.

How much do you think teachers get in your country Burr?

Originally Posted by Gabriel

How much do you think teachers get in your country Burr?

I have no idea, but, they do get health and a good pension.
Surely, if you were going for money, you'd go to Japan, Germany, or, where-ever, but, not Thailand unless you were in a top-flight international school.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

Surely, if you were going for money, you'd go to Japan, Germany, or, where-ever, but, not Thailand unless you were in a top-flight international school.

The wages may be higher in developed countries like Japan and Germany but the cost of living is far higher.

A teacher in the US may make 40k or 50k if they are doing well. That equates to between 115k and 145k Baht per month. A decent international job in Thailand will have you coming in at 100k with insurance, housing allowance and other perks. Of course the figure can be far higher for those in the top flight school.

Where would you rather work Burr?

Things are changing radically in Thai schools starting next year. For the mathayom classes the English contact hours have been reduced from 4 hours a week to only 3 hours a week by the MOE.

At my school, this means the farang teachers will teach one hour (before it was two) and the Thai teacher will teach two hours.

For us, instead of needing 6 teachers the school will only need three. You guys can figure out the economics of the situation.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

What's the point in spending years at school to get qualified, then teach in Thailand for shit money?
I would of thought that with proper qualifications, you would go where the money is.

Fair question. I would ask what's the point of working somewhere just to make money? I don't understand folks who spend years in hellhole like Saudi just so they can pile up some cash. Not for me, life is too short.

Chasing money is not the only consideration and tradeoff involved. For myself, I want flexibility and a decent work/life balance. Teaching is not my only interest/pursuit and oar in the water. A higher paying job is going to be more demanding and I won't have time to pursue other things that I find fufilling.

All kinda ways to live life, not just a robotic "go where the money is" approach.

^That's a good approach Bexar Stud. I like your thinking there.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

If you can't be "failed", what's the incentive to learn?

That's a good point. There are many studies that show that failing a child is not the best thing to do, because they will fall behind socially, and this could effect the child even more than we think. I was taught this in school. In the west, they can fail children, but it is very rare. They need to get the parent's approval, and have evidence that the child should be failed. I think there are cases where the parents don't want their children looking bad, or being left behind when all their peers are going ahead. I see both sides, but I also think it is unfair for a child to be put in this situation. That is one reason why you see so many different levels in the same grade.

Gabriel

Why would I think that? So where do you work Ms Phuket?

I'm presently teaching English in a public school in Korea. I am hoping to go to Thailand in the future, but I'm not going into a crap paying job, or poor quality school.

Originally Posted by phuketbound

^That's a good approach Bexar Stud. I like your thinking there.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

If you can't be "failed", what's the incentive to learn?

That's a good point. There are many studies that show that failing a child is not the best thing to do, because they will fall behind socially, and this could effect the child even more than we think. I was taught this in school. In the west, they can fail children, but it is very rare. They need to get the parent's approval, and have evidence that the child should be failed. I think there are cases where the parents don't want their children looking bad, or being left behind when all their peers are going ahead. I see both sides, but I also think it is unfair for a child to be put in this situation. That is one reason why you see so many different levels in the same grade.

Well you shouldn't have to pass or fail every year anyway - when I was at school in the UK in the 70s/80s you just passed on to the next year, that was that. I barely recall having any exams till at least secondary school.

That said, parents should be told exactly how much or how little their kids have attained, not have the wool pulled over their eyes with a false mark.

The different levels thing is a nightmare for a teacher. You can't micro-plan several lessons in one - it doesn't work and there's not enough time. So it's go too fast for some, too slow for others ...

We're actually streaming across a combined P5 and 6 next year to attempt to address this problem.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

What's the point in spending years at school to get qualified, then teach in Thailand for shit money?

They don't want to work on Oil Rigs?

Originally Posted by tropic of cancer

Originally Posted by phuketbound

^That's a good approach Bexar Stud. I like your thinking there.

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

If you can't be "failed", what's the incentive to learn?

That's a good point. There are many studies that show that failing a child is not the best thing to do, because they will fall behind socially, and this could effect the child even more than we think. I was taught this in school. In the west, they can fail children, but it is very rare. They need to get the parent's approval, and have evidence that the child should be failed. I think there are cases where the parents don't want their children looking bad, or being left behind when all their peers are going ahead. I see both sides, but I also think it is unfair for a child to be put in this situation. That is one reason why you see so many different levels in the same grade.

Well you shouldn't have to pass or fail every year anyway - when I was at school in the UK in the 70s/80s you just passed on to the next year, that was that. I barely recall having any exams till at least secondary school.

That said, parents should be told exactly how much or how little their kids have attained, not have the wool pulled over their eyes with a false mark.

The different levels thing is a nightmare for a teacher. You can't micro-plan several lessons in one - it doesn't work and there's not enough time. So it's go too fast for some, too slow for others ...

We're actually streaming across a combined P5 and 6 next year to attempt to address this problem.

Why shouldn't you pass or fail? Don't get me started on exams.
How are they testing the students in order to screen them?

Originally Posted by phuketbound

that has studied many years, and graduated Cum Laude

More proof that an education doesn't necessarily make one intelligent.

Originally Posted by phuketbound

You can't micro-plan several lessons in one - it doesn't work and there's not enough time.

plenty of pedagogical research says otherwise.

^I never said that..look back to see that Tropic of Cancer said it.

Originally Posted by lucky6666

so how much could i expect to make as a teacher here?

read the heading...

Teaching In Thailand Teaching in Thailand can be a great career with salaries in the range of $2,500 to $6,000 per month, or you could become a TEFLer with a salary range of 350-600 pounds per month, no experience necessary.

Originally Posted by kingwilly

Originally Posted by phuketbound

You can't micro-plan several lessons in one - it doesn't work and there's not enough time.

plenty of pedagogical research says otherwise.

I'm interested in research that reports 28 hours in every day...

Whatever someone's PHD theory says, the reality of teaching on the ground is that the EFL teacher is intensely involved in all stages of the reveal/learning process and the class therefore needs to be focused on attaining the same, or integrated parts of the same goal.

In terms of class dynamic, it seems clear to me that the constant (relative) failure of individuals is de-motivating to them, and this in turn feeds into the collective spirit.

It all seems obvious to me, but there's no way I'm expert enough to argue the toss.

Anyone reading this have leads for TEFL jobs,looking for anything in the Chon Buri area.Im English clean cut and enjoy teaching thanks
uconeeded[at]gmail.com

Originally Posted by dirtydog

Originally Posted by Doggsy

It also enabled me to try teaching which I had never thought of as a career as I had disliked school when I had been there. Once I realised I enjoyed teaching it has now led me to enrol on a PGCE course starting this September.

You state here that once you realised that you enjoyed teaching you decided to get properly qualified for it, are you saying that your 4 week course wasn't enough to make you a PROPER TEECHER?

Someone should have given you a 'proper teacher' years ago. It might mean you aren't semi-literate now.

Originally Posted by phuketbound

I'm presently teaching English in a public school in Korea. I am hoping to go to Thailand in the future, but I'm not going into a crap paying job, or poor quality school.

Then you'll be shit out of luck or spend many hours looking.

Salaries have FALLEN in Thailand, and the hourly rate for langugage schools hasn't changed in the 8 years I've been here. Siam Computer still offer 250 baht an hour part time, for example!

Originally Posted by Gabriel

Originally Posted by phuketbound

The government needs to up their standards, and increase the pay if they want to attract more serious, and qualified teachers.

They continue to pay peanuts however and will continue to get monkeys in the classroom as long as this goes on. That is the harsh truth of the matter.

Smack on.

But will the Thais ever see it? No, of course not.

Originally Posted by jandajoy

And they're easy meat for all you non teflers.

You've gotta have something to pick on when you stop picking on each other.

That's not it at all, JJ. The vast majority who post on here are arrogant and consider themselves some kind of 'experts' on Thailand. Their attitude gets them in hot water. Case example: Ray Carey aka Reach-Around.

Originally Posted by phuketbound

That's a good point. There are many studies that show that failing a child is not the best thing to do, because they will fall behind socially, and this could effect the child even more than we think. I was taught this in school. In the west, they can fail children, but it is very rare. They need to get the parent's approval, and have evidence that the child should be failed. I think there are cases where the parents don't want their children looking bad, or being left behind when all their peers are going ahead. I see both sides, but I also think it is unfair for a child to be put in this situation. That is one reason why you see so many different levels in the same grade.

It does appear that people are now questioning the lack of standards in education - at least in the UK. This conception that children should not fail is very dangerous on many levels.

Life is all about winning and losing (see wall street protests) and this is an essential lesson which must be absorbed before entering the big wide world. You may say that a socially responsible country would make provisions for this and support failures but that just prolongs the agony and brings about the downfall of the country itself (see parts of Europe)

Originally Posted by Rocksteady

Life is all about winning and losing

This is one of the saddest and most destructive myths of humanity. A pity.

Originally Posted by Agent_Smith

Originally Posted by Rocksteady

Life is all about winning and losing

This is one of the saddest and most destructive myths of humanity. A pity.

It's probably actually *not* a myth... you only have to look around you, and read up on history: not just of humans. Natural selection has no emotion.
Try reading Michael Marmot and Steven Pinker for a kick off.

Good point about natural selection, you'll notice that species who cooperate more with each other rather than compete against each other prosper greater.

One theory of why chimps and other primates did not evolve along the same lines as homosapiens is due to the fact they never learned how to cooperate beyond their only little family units, they are in constant competition and warfare with other primate groups. In other words they have no concept of the "greater good", which is something we are capable of though we don't always demonstrate it - mostly because of this "there must be winners and losers" nonsense we've been indoctrinated with.