Thread: 6. 20. 1000. The Soviet Invasion of Czechoslovakia

"Even in your own home someone might be listening in."

Interesting doc:

Yes . . . and factual




We had quite a few microphones in our house - I think I had posted before how my Bolivian friend (previously mentioned) had bought a detection device and we'd go through our homes locating and digging the bugs out of the walls . . . only to be informed later that day that there was a 'gas leak' in our area and 'the gas company' had to come and secure the house . . . not even sure we had gas connections . . . we were allowed back later on and found freshly patched and painted walls.

It was so funny and stupid that it was . . . funny and stupid




Beloved Russia

Originally Posted by helge

(this pic is relevant to your thread)

Yes, it is relevant. That's Alexander Dubček who was the First Secretary of the Czechoslovakian Communist Party and wanted to reform the system to show the 'Human Face of Socialism' . . . a less dogmatic and more liberal political and social system.

Fat lo of good that did him as the Soviet Union invaded Czechoslovakia because of this - the Moscow murderers were frightened they'd lose their allies - and let's be honest, if you are forced to do something it isn't real anyway.

He was forced to sign the Moscow Protocol and replaced by a Soviet stooge, Hušak, who led the hardline communist regime for over twenty years.


Yes, it is relevant to show how duplicitous and murderous Brezhnev and his Soviet military were

Originally Posted by panama hat

Yes, it is relevant. That's Alexander Dubček who was the First Secretary of the Czechoslovakian Communist Party and wanted to reform the system to show the 'Human Face of Socialism' . . . a less dogmatic and more liberal political and social system.

Fat lo of good that did him as the Soviet Union invaded Czechoslovakia because of this - the Moscow murderers were frightened they'd lose their allies - and let's be honest, if you are forced to do something it isn't real anyway.

He was forced to sign the Moscow Protocol and replaced by a Soviet stooge, Hušak, who led the hardline communist regime for over twenty years.


Yes, it is relevant to show how duplicitous and murderous Brezhnev and his Soviet military were

Here you go again, interupting Klondykes version of reality with facts. How unsporting.

Sorry, HC . . .

Originally Posted by Hugh Cow

How unsporting.

Does it matter ?

Klondyke is both Czech and balanced

Many Czechs were brave while others conspired with the invading Soviet forces to feather their own nest . . . and sell their country into slavery for the next decades.

Soviet Troops in Czechoslovakia - with friends like these

Originally Posted by helge

Klondyke is both Czech and balanced

Vielen Dank für die Blumen (Udo Jürgens)

Originally Posted by panama hat

Soviet Troops in Czechoslovakia - with friends like these

With "friends" like these who "repute" me like this (according to his fresh info from StaSi):

You sold out your country, utter swine - I hope you'll be taken to account one day

Originally Posted by panama hat

Many Czechs were brave while others conspired with the invading Soviet forces to feather their own nest . . . and sell their country into slavery for the next decades.

Needs remembering.

Actually, in short, how I have seen it, a bit different than seeing from Hollywood:

Prague Spring, Prager Frühling, Pražské Jaro (not to mistake it with annually classic music festival):

The Czechoslovak writers organized in 1967 their congress where new ideas about freedom of expression, abolishment of censorship, discussed and required. And in January 1968 the communist party had their general assembly with reshuffling of their leadership, new faces were required. Mainly to exchange the head of the Party, the then long sitting Antonín Novotný, being also a president, quite a strong man growing from the workers level, surviving German KZ as also the president before him. He actually had made some concessions in the 60s, also amnesty for the people imprisoned from the Stalinists processes in 50's. The culture was no longer so stiff, there have been many good books, theaters, films from that time, one also with Oscar, Miloš Forman did few good films before he moved after 1968 to US (Cuckoo's Nest, Hair, Amadeus, etc). And he, the president, was living with his wife quite in modest conditions, refusing president's salary, his wife giving many nice things from the Prague Castle away to people as a gift, later the new govt asked her to pay it back from their humble pension.

The last development was not liked in Moscow, they pushed for major change in the Party, after longer bickering it was given to Alexander Dubček, a Slovak. He was not very well known to general public (actually the population never cared about such people), being always active in the Slovak Party. However, he was quite well known in Moscow, allegedly he was preferred by Brezhnev more than the others. As a young boy he was staying in USSR with his parents (his father leaned to communists during his stay as a poor worker in USA, when being back to Europe, he brought the family to a small Soviet republic outside Russia where many poor people from around the world were welcome that time). As a young man he was engaged in the Slovak uprising at the end of the WW2, later sent to Moscow for study.

After the January assembly there had been a new hope for a free development, general excitement, lot of new events, happenings, in media, in theaters, TV. Mainly the writers they pushed it quite hard in such a way that the new people at the party leadership tried to calm it down, assuming certain problems. But the time was ripe and the flood could not be stopped so easily.

Few months later also the president was exchanged, looking for somebody with a good posture, remembered an retired general Ludvík Svoboda (means freedom in Czech) who was in WW2 as a commander of the Czech divisions fighting along Red Army for liberating Czechoslovakia.

Dubček was trying to slow it down, promising to manage it somehow after he was called often by Brezhnev, however, he had not had enough authority against some stronger guys. And he was sailing on his newly found popularity that never before was shown to any such big communist, promoting "Socialism with human face", sometimes people saw tears in his eyes, a real "human".

A meeting was organized with Soviet leaders in beg. August at the border Slovak-USSR, attended also by the other big guys from Germany, Poland, Hungary, Bulgary, however, nothing much has been achieved. As per later discoveries, Brezhnev had not been the one in favor of military intervention, but some others were pushing hard, not necessarily the Soviets only. Rumors had it that some Czech and Slovak Party big guys drafted an invitation letter asking for the brotherly help.

That summer was organized a huge military exercise at the eastern border at Slovakia, attended by the other armies of the Warsaw Pact (but not the Czechoslovaks), dividing the areas for the capturing. (The East German forces were not included, from the obvious history reasons.) And on the night to 21st August 1968 they invaded Czechoslovakia. I was woken up at 5 am by a crazy ringing and banging on the door. My father heavily breathing - fresh retired, living with my mother some 20 min. of sharp walk - could not reach me by phone, I was hard sleeping after a heavy night as a grass widower, the wife with kid in our old weekend cottage outside Prague - he shouted, go on the balcony and see what's flying, our place was in landing line to the airport.

So, it did happen what some were afraid of but nobody had believed. Perhaps it could had been done it in more clever way. With such invasion they reaped hatred of the whole world as well as of the last communist believers in Czechoslovakia and elsewhere. I remember an old man in our company who was an open communist and sometimes under our teasing - not every communist let it known about himself - how sad and disappointed he was, his ideals were collapsing. Similarly, it had happened to some foreign communist celebrities like Yves Montand and his wife Simone Signoret, they made publicly a big noise and renounced their commie membership.

But nothing had happened from the other world as the population had hoped for, beside the outraged declarations. All of them in that time had many of their own problems. In Germany, in France and Italy, USA was in highest heat in Vietnam and having headache not only with the anti-war protests at home but with aftermath of the 6-days Israel war.

After driving my father back to his home, seeing my mother, heading to the Center. Seeing the tanks and people discussing, some with "heroic" gestures against the soldiers what could bring nothing but a tragedy. Luckily the soldiers had endured a lot of patience. How to discuss with a tank?

The reports about casualties were always conflicting. What I see now in Wiki (E) Prague Spring, is:

During the invasion 72 Czechs and Slovaks were killed (19 of those in Slovakia), 266 severely wounded and another 436 slightly injured.[54][55]

Then driving fast to my company, discussing with outraged colleagues what to do? Nothing can be done now, just be calm. Then looking where I can fill up tank in my 20yo old car (no water needed) to get fast to my family in deep woods at a river (no communication there far around). Some main routes and bridges were blocked, but fortunately, nothing has been happening outside Prague beside some larger cities. After a week again back to the company, back to many discussions, luckily beer and wine not seized.

The new president and a group of the Party leaders together with Dubcek were flown to Moscow where they were forced to sign Protocol of new stipulations, at home we heared different stories how they were forced. In fact, there was only one who refused to sign, Dr. František Kriegel, born in Ukraine, but studying and practising in Prague, an old physician who was fighting Franco as a member of Interbrigades in the Spanish Civil War, later high and low and again high in the Party, in 60s acting as an medical advisor to Cuba.

After the August days the situation and excitements have been slowly calmed down, called as a "Normalisation". Actually, there was very good climate among people, everybody strongly united against Russians (as it was all the years, anyway), expressing a good feeling of brotherhood. The culture had been still open, people still hoping that a reasonable solution will be found.

However, nothing much happened, slowly the main positions were changed. The Party leadership (and later the presidency) was given to another Slovak Gustav Husák, a well educated lawyer who was persecuted during the Stalinists Processes in 50s, being an assistant to a big Party guy foreign minister accused of anti-state conspiracy and executed. He himself survived, allegedly very strong when tortured, always renounced his confessions in court, sentenced to life, but in 60s amnestied by the president.

And the population has also adapted to the new situation, slowly coming back to "normal". The old communists who renounced the Party in 68 were now asked to apologize, saying that they were "irritated". Some did not do that, presenting themselves as "dissidents", hence, many former communists forming a great portion of the new movement "Charta 1978". But that's another story...

There is always wars where there is no natural borders. It's totally different when you are an island like the US or Britain.

Originally Posted by Erich

There is always wars where there is no natural borders. It's totally different when you are an island like the US or Britain.

Is that you, Socal?

^Nev on her track to know... Why you do not tell us where your nick comes from? Any Czech connection?

Originally Posted by Klondyke

^Nev on her track to know... Why you do not tell us where your nick comes from? Any Czech connection?

The "Erich" avatar is of Erich Topp, a German U-Boat commander of World War II.

Erich Topp - Wikipedia

"Neverna" means acacia tree. I believe that translates as "akácie" in Czech.

Name Numerology
Neverna Name Numerology: 7


Luck Prospects
Destiny High ★★★★
Love So-so ★★★
Health Very High ★★★★★
Money High ★★★★
Family High ★★★★
Friendship Decent ★★
Blessed Careers: Food Preparation, Activism, Business Services or similar.

Neverna Name Meaning: What Makes It a Powerful Name

So, you'll get rich making Khao Pat and have good health, but have no friends and never get laid.

Originally Posted by cyrille

Neverna Name Meaning: What Makes It a Powerful Name

So, you'll get rich making Khao Pat and have good health, but have no friends and never get laid.

Originally Posted by Neverna

"Neverna" means acacia tree. I believe that translates as "akácie" in Czech.

That's strange. In my Czech dictionary it says:

nevěrná - faithless
nevěrná - false
nevěrná - false-hearted
nevěrná - disloyal (3.p.)
nevěrná - untrue (nepravdivá)

Originally Posted by helge

Klondyke is both Czech and balanced

You just can't help yourself, can you?