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  1. #21226
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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    Decent article Tax.
    Everyone who voted for leave knew it would be a long game.
    Although we saw benefits pretty quickly.
    PPE and vaccine procurement a case in point

  2. #21227
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taxexile View Post
    Anti-Brexiteers nonetheless remain entrenched by the EU’s mythology
    Fixed that

  3. #21228
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe 90 View Post
    Decent article Tax.
    Everyone who voted for leave knew it would be a long game.
    Although we saw benefits pretty quickly.
    PPE and vaccine procurement a case in point
    Dismally late PPE procurement, with millions squandered via the tory ‘buddy’ system.

    Worst COVID rates in western Europe.

    You won’t let facts get in the way, though.

  4. #21229
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Worst COVID rates in western Europe.
    Here we go again

    Our statistics are transparent and recorded differently and correctly

  5. #21230
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Yeah, here we go again…with your deluded nonsense.

    ‘Having the worst COVID rates shows we’re the best’


  6. #21231
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troy View Post
    it simply isn't British to go back on one's word.
    Oh dear I feel a history 101 sorely needed, all those little detals absent from English GCSE propaganda

    The Betrayal of Clannabuidhe

    "Game of Thrones" has nothing on this.
    Brian McPhelim O’Neill was a 16th century Gaelic lord who held lands that included Belfast and the surrounding territory. It was the time of the colonization of Ulster — when land in Ireland’s northeast was forcibly taken over by English and Scottish settlers — that is the root of the island’s division today.
    O’Neill sided with English forces to take on a rival, the powerful chieftain Shane O'Neill, and was knighted by the crown. But O’Neill soon found himself at war with the Earl of Essex, Walter Devereux, who had been granted permission to take over his lands by Queen Elizabeth I.
    Queen Elizabeth I of England knights explorer Sir Francis Drake; engraved by F. Fraenkel from a drawing by John Gilbert | Hulton Archive via Getty Images

    In the winter of 1574, the Earl of Essex used the pretense of a friendly banquet to wipe out O’Neill and his family, massacring those in attendance and taking O'Neill, his wife and brother captive, soon to be executed.
    This breach of ancient hospitality rights has inspired poetry and was recorded in the medieval Annals of the Kingdom of Ireland as “sufficient cause of hatred and disgust of the English to the Irish.”
    The Treaty of Limerick

    This was the treaty that ended the 17th century Williamite War in Ireland, in which the Protestant Prince William of Orange defeated the Catholic King James II. The first article of the treaty guaranteed Catholics would maintain their rights and promised an Irish parliament would protect them.
    However, this was swiftly followed by a series of laws barring Catholics from holding public office, owning firearms, serving in parliament, voting, owning a horse worth more than £5, and restricting their ability to inherit or own property. The stone on which it was reputedly signed is displayed prominently in the centre of Limerick, which takes its nickname “Treaty City” from the event.
    The Act of Union

    This was the act that merged Ireland fully into the United Kingdom in 1801 and dissolved its parliament, partly in response to a rebellion in 1798 that was inspired by the French Revolution and deeply rattled London.
    “There are a lot of parallels to Brexit. The Act of Union was presented as this big panacea,” said Fin Dwyer, historian and presenter of the Irish History Podcast. Protection was promised for the Irish economy as it was integrated with the stronger British market. But protective measures were abandoned in the subsequent years and the Irish economy was devastated.
    “The effect was dramatic. Within a couple of years people were saying that Dublin was a different city, that all the rich had fled to London,” Dwyer said.
    The Act of Union also promised Catholic emancipation, by lifting the legal restrictions on Catholics and allowing them to hold political office. However, this was blocked by King George III once the act was signed. It took a massive political movement led by Daniel O’Connell and another 28 years before the restrictions began to be lifted.
    Home Rule

    Bills to enact Home Rule — re-establishing a parliament in Dublin to give Ireland a measure of self-rule — were passed by the House of Commons but blocked by the House of Lords in 1893, 1912 and 1913. When the Lords' objections were finally overcome in 1914 (after the removal of their veto), the bill's enactment was delayed indefinitely by the outbreak of World War I.
    The repeated delays contributed to the decision by nationalists to abandon the parliamentary route and mount a rebellion seeking full independence in 1916.
    Those in favor of the union, particularly in the northeast of the island, felt betrayed by British support for Home Rule. Legislation on Home Rule fanned sectarian tensions in Belfast and was accompanied by deadly riots; some 500,000 signed the Ulster Covenant in 1912 refusing to recognize an Irish parliament, and unionists began to militarize to resist it.
    Partition

    Britain managed to betray both nationalists and unionists with partition.
    The idea of resolving the Irish demand for self-rule with strong opposition in the north by dividing the island in two was initially introduced by British negotiators as a poison pill.
    “The whole idea of throwing partition out there was to scupper Home Rule, to make a proposal so terrible that no one would ever accept it,” said Tim McMahon, associate professor of history at Marquette University in Milwaukee. “Both nationalists and unionists felt that they were being double-dealt.”
    Nationalists were told that any partition would be temporary. Unionists were told that the aim was to keep the entire island within the U.K., and at worst there would be Home Rule for Dublin and special protection for the nine counties of Ulster. These promises were used to help recruit some 210,000 men to fight for Britain in World War I.
    Children talk with British soldiers at a roadblock in a street of Belfast in 1969 | AFP via Getty Images

    What ultimately happened was the partition of six counties in Ulster rather than nine, in order to ensure a stable unionist majority, while Britain agreed to an Irish Free State that went significantly further than Home Rule. For unionists, it was abandonment. For nationalists, partition and the requirement that members of the new Irish parliament would have to swear loyalty to the king was so bitter it provoked a civil war.
    The division was particularly traumatic for those who found themselves on the wrong side of the border. Northern nationalists had believed they would soon live under all-island rule. Unionists in the counties of Monaghan, Cavan and Donegal suddenly found themselves living in the Catholic-dominated Irish Free State.
    “You now have British politicians saying the Irish are bringing this border up to stop us from leaving Europe. As if the Irish put the border there,” said McMahon. “I would be leery of negotiating with such people just as a matter of principle.”
    Putting Britain first

    During World War II, Britain offered the Irish government of Éamon de Valera unification if it agreed to join the war effort. De Valera refused, as it would entail stationing British forces across the island, and he did not trust that the promise would be kept.
    “I think this specific example is a really good one for pointing out why Ireland might be cautious about trusting the British government. Proposals like this are done purely in Britain’s self-interest. It’s about finding the particular carrot that will entice Ireland to do what they would like,” said McMahon.
    Market day in the city of Limerick in 1937 | Fox Photos via Getty Images

    “There were lots of suggestions after Brexit like 'why don’t the Irish rejoin the Commonwealth?' 'Why don’t they just leave with us?' That makes perfect sense to someone for whom Britain is No. 1. It makes no sense for someone with any sense of the Anglo-Irish relationship for hundreds of years, or the benefits that Ireland gets from its European Union membership now. It’s purely about British self-interest.”
    History offers countless examples of policy set in London wreaking havoc in Ireland, not least in the Great Famine of the 1840s, which devastated the Irish population through starvation, emigration and disease.
    “I think you’ve got several occasions where you have this disregard in British politics for Irish interest. I think the problem is that it’s reinforced today by the sense of the British government not acknowledging Irish history, and a complete lack of understanding in Britain about these issues,” said Dwyer.
    “I do think it’s reflective of a conscious amnesia towards Britain’s imperial past, an intentional amnesia.”



    During World War II, Harold Cole was the deputy commander of Scotland Yard. Cole is considered one of the worst traitors of the war. He disclosed secret information to the Nazis about the French resistance escape lines, which he himself had helped create.
    He also gave information about the locations of French resistance leaders to the Axis alliance. His betrayal resulted in the deaths of at least 150 people. The French police killed Cole in 1946.
    Quote Originally Posted by Latindancer View Post
    I just want the chance to use a bigger porridge bowl.

  7. #21232
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    Britain happily betrayed settlers, natives , even its own working class, Afghan interpreters, KArens offered freedom, Cossacks, the Welsh , the Cornish , the workers , off course there are rare exceptions like Randy Andy , Piers Morrgan, Jonathan Aitken, max Mosely, Oswald Mosely, ntegrity , they shit it

  8. #21233
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    Oh if you have a spare decade there is an unparalleled litany of shame, dishonour,lying , deception and greed.

    England has invaded almost everywhere bar Bolivia, Sweden and Mongolia, due to there being Scots/Irish?Frogs or negroes to murder that weekend

    Google UK lied just a few results,About 105,000,000 results (0.47 seconds)



    [COLOR=var(--pharos-color-text-40)]JOURNAL ARTICLE[/COLOR]

    The Betrayal of Hong Kong

    Martin Lee JSTOR: Access Check
    [COLOR=var(--pharos-color-marble-gray-20)]The Brown Journal of World Affairs

    [/COLOR]

    ‘Betrayal’: British Afghans accuse UK of abandoning Afghanistan

    Leading diaspora figures accuse London and its allies of ‘catastrophic failure’ amid Taliban power grab.



    Suggest you lear how an entiteld gang of aristocratic thugs once achieving naval and mercantile dominace misbehaved.

    The Tasmanians
    The Betrayal of Creole Elites, 1880–1920

    Vivian Bickford-Smith

    DOI:10.1093/acprofso/9780199290673.003.0008
    This chapter argues that in the 1880s many, if not most, members of creole élites throughout the British empire in Africa saw themselves not as ‘natives’ but as ‘black Englishmen’. In doing so they were staking a claim to equal social and political rights with ‘white Englishmen’ within this empire. Members of creole élites wished to be treated as equal partners in the ‘civilizing mission’. Because of the actual experience of partnerships in trade and missionary work in West Africa, or because of the non-racial nature of laws and the franchise in the Cape, such expectations had seemed not only reasonable but also achievable for much of the nineteenth century. But by the 1880s, increasingly strident articulations of both metropolitan and white-settler racism accompanied the period of high imperialism. In the 1890s and early 1900s, during the partition of Africa, this racism led to growing instances of discrimination against members of creole élites: be it in terms of job opportunities or through social and residential segregation.




    Britain and the ‘Great Betrayal’: Anglo-American Relations and the Struggle for United States Ratification of the Treaty of Versailles, 1919–1920* | The Historical Journal | Cambridge Core

    They even betrayed Orangemen who loyals as feck just want a good sausage
    British ‘betrayal’ gives birth to a new generation of loyalist fighters | News | The Sunday Times


    The British Betrayal of the Assyrians is a book published in 1935 written by Yusuf Malek.[1]
    As an Assyrian who fought along side the British during World War I as an Interpreter officer, and later a government official in the subsequently established country of Iraq which was under British Administration until 1932, his writings come from first hand experiences.
    Through the book, Malek reproduces letters from government officials while chronologically narrating the events which led to the formation of Iraq and the subsequent massacre of Assyrians, known as the Simele Massacre.

  9. #21234
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    Brussels vows to punish Poland for challenging supremacy of EU law

    Warsaw could face legal contest, withholding of funds or be stripped of bloc membership rights

    ‘We cannot and we will not allow our common values to be put at risk,’ European Commission president Ursula von der Leyen told the European Parliament in Strasbourg on Tuesday

    Henry Foy in Strasbourg and James Shotter in Warsaw 36 MINUTES AGO



    The European Commission will take steps to punish Poland for challenging the supremacy of EU law, its head has vowed as she condemned Warsaw for “calling into question the foundations of the European Union”.


    Ursula von der Leyen, commission president, said on Tuesday that Brussels would use one of three tools to hit back at Poland, ranging from a legal challenge, to a formal sanction that could withhold tens of billions of euros in EU funds, and a political process that has the power to strip the country of bloc membership rights.

    “We cannot and we will not allow our common values to be put at risk. The commission will act,” von der Leyen told the European parliament in a strongly critical speech, as Poland’s prime minister sat in the chamber looking on. “This ruling . . . is a direct challenge to the unity of the European legal order.”

    Brussels is under increasing pressure from European lawmakers and some member states to harden its stance against Poland and punish the country’s government for a court ruling this month that declared parts of EU law were not compatible with the Polish constitution.

    That ruling significantly escalated a five-year-long struggle between Brussels and Warsaw over rule of law concerns, related to sweeping judicial reforms by the ruling Law and Justice party (PiS) that have included an attempt to purge the Supreme Court, and the introduction of a disciplinary regime that allows judges to be punished for the content of their rulings.

    Addressing a debate devoted to the Polish crisis, von der Leyen said the commission was “carefully assessing” the ruling, adding: “But I can already tell you: I am deeply concerned.”

    Responding to her with a bellicose and counter-attacking speech of his own, Polish prime minister Mateusz Morawiecki insisted that European integration had been a “civilisational and strategic choice” for his country, and that his government was part of the “pro-European majority in Poland”.

    However, he accused the EU of double standards in its treatment of Warsaw, and dismissed criticism of his government as “unfair and biased”. He also argued that EU institutions had overstepped their powers in trying to force Poland to roll back its reforms.

    “It is not acceptable to force on others decisions which have no legal basis. And it is even less acceptable to use the language of financial blackmail, talk of fines . . . I reject the language of threats,” he told MEPs.

    The debate in Strasbourg, which saw a string of MEPs take the floor to lambast Morawiecki and his government, comes ahead of a European Council summit in Brussels beginning on Thursday where a number of EU leaders are expected to confront the Polish prime minister.



    Some member states have demanded the commission initiate a so-called conditionality mechanism that has the power to withhold EU funds — worth tens of billions of euros each year for Poland — if Brussels believes the legal spending of that cash is at risk.

    France’s European affairs minister Clément Beaune said at a separate EU ministerial meeting in Luxembourg on Tuesday that “budget solidarity cannot continue if there is no respect for the fundamental values inscribed in the EU treaty”.

    Echoing that sentiment, his German counterpart Michael Roth said he did not “see any room for compromises” over the rule of law dispute with Poland: “There can be no special deals.”

    Von der Leyen said initiating a formal procedure that could withhold cash was one of three options on the table. Another, less aggressive move would be a legal challenge to the Warsaw ruling. The final option is the EU’s Article 7 procedure, which allows the bloc to suspend a member’s rights if it believes EU values are being consistently endangered.

    “The third option is the Article 7 procedure. This is the powerful tool in the Treaty. And we must come back to it,” she said. A previous attempt to use the procedure against Poland has slipped into stalemate after Hungary vowed to block it.

    Polish government officials said the commission had misunderstood the court ruling and was both responding to its most extreme interpretation and taking a political approach to a legal issue. “With this approach to the ruling it will be hard to de-escalate,” said one.

    Morawiecki told lawmakers: “If the institutions created in the [EU] treaties exceed their powers, member states have to have a tool to respond. The EU is a great achievement of the states in Europe. It is a powerful economic, political and social alliance. It is the strongest, most developed international organisation in history. But the EU is not a state.”

    Subscribe to read | Financial Times


    thats how europe operates.

    it all starts off nice and benign, but as soon as a minnow challenges the status quo, the malignancy of brussels rears its ugly head and the stormtroopers polish their jackboots.

    cf. astra zenica, the "you must vote again" diktats when voting didnt go how brussels wanted, the brexit punishment beatings and irish intransigence and now the poles are in for 6 of the best.

  10. #21235
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    Nice to have another perspective David, although its not like the English were alone through these decades and centuries during the golden era of discov....erm conquest. Anyway, if all works out well, those complaining about getting forcibly removed from the Union can soon leave the Union and re-join the Union - everyone's a winner.

  11. #21236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe 90 View Post
    Here we go again

    Our statistics are transparent and recorded differently and correctly
    Of course they are. That's why England has two different sets, to align with other parts of the UK and to keep the numbers reasonable. Well, they did for a while but even with the trickery they win on unnecessary deaths caused by an inept government.
    Still, they appear to deceive the bottom feeders quite well.

  12. #21237
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Worst COVID rates in western Europe.
    How many infections and deaths today? 43.000 and 240?

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe 90 View Post
    Our statistics are transparent and recorded differently and correctly
    Again, you must show us the proof of this . . . but you know it isn't true.

    Just admit that it has been a dismal failure so far.



    Quote Originally Posted by malmomike77 View Post
    nations losing identity, autonomy and all the while the EU rule book grows.
    I'm glad you can finally give us sme examples
    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    You lost your identuty, did you? What a whiny little bitch. Were you forced to learn Portuguese and listen to Wagner or Vivaldi? Had your passports confiscated and replaced with an Austrian one? Forced to drive on the right-hand side?
    Your foreign policy and police budget determined by *egads* Brussels? The local council taxes on your vast real etstate holdings determined by an EU-Beschluß?
    So, nothing yet?

    Has the Soviet European High Command silenced you? Whew, luckily you are allowed to speak English again.

    You and chico should form your own political party

  13. #21238
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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  14. #21239
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    ^ Your best post in years.

  16. #21241
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    Being a member of the EU has transformed Poland. The Polish people know this so one wonders why they elected a right wing nationalist government.

    Nationalism has been proven to be a failure, one that ultimately leads to conflict and war. It is used mainly ly by the rich a d powerful to get their way and the underlings fall for it every single time.

  17. #21242
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    What a great day.

    I now have my British Passport back.

  18. #21243
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chico View Post
    What a great day.

    I now have my British Passport back.
    Was it the proper colour?

  19. #21244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe 90 View Post
    Was it the proper colour?
    Its Chico, there's a typo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chico View Post
    What a great day.

    I now have my British Passport black.

  20. #21245
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    Yes I've actually framed it,and it now has Pride and place on the mantle piece, beside my St Georges flag, and my signed autographs from Nigel, Tommy and good old Enoch


    Quote Originally Posted by Joe 90 View Post
    Was it the proper colour?
    Last edited by Chico; 21-10-2021 at 01:09 AM.

  21. #21246
    Isle of discombobulation Joe 90's Avatar
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    Cyrille will be jealous, I bet he still has the old EU maroon one

    Btw, you can shove your autographs oop your arse you Scouse twat.

  22. #21247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chico View Post
    I now have my British Passport back.
    Like this one? Luckily that maroon colour foisted on you by those mnopolokapitalisticpigdogenglishhating bureaucrats is gone.






    Speaking of casting off the demonic Soviet Socialist European Conglomeration of Brussels
    Quote Originally Posted by malmomike77 View Post
    bureaucrats desire to centralise ever more power in Brussels is what sealed it, nations losing identity, autonomy


    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    You lost your identuty, did you? What a whiny little bitch. Were you forced to learn Portuguese and listen to Wagner or Vivaldi? Had your passports confiscated and replaced with an Austrian one? Forced to drive on the right-hand side?
    Your foreign policy and police budget determined by *egads* Brussels? The local council taxes on your vast real etstae holdings determined by an EU-Beschluß?
    Still . . . *crickets* . . . NPT? One would think you'd relish the platform provided here to air your grievances, backed up with facts of course, to show how awful the EU is and that is why Brexit 'succeeded'.

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    An interesting historical perspective, demonstrating the truth of entry costs, from the political, socialist heavyweight Tony Benn.
    Described by one his socialist colleagues as the ‘Bollinger Bolshevik’. Was he the original champagne socialist?

    His reticence was predominantly caused by his desire to protect the UK industrial base. Long since eroded and replaced by the service economy. He probably didn’t see that coming.

    Never the less, he presents a strong, if somewhat idealist case, for retaining our unique democracy. Good to see that even then, the sovereignty issue was dismissed as a nonsense.

  24. #21249
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chico View Post
    my signed autographs from Nigel, Tommy and good old Enoch
    Signed autographs, eh?

    Quite a rarity - they’re mostly typed these days.


  25. #21250
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Quite a rarity - they’re mostly typed these days.
    He can't read them either way

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