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  1. #18051
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    On the edge of your seat with excitement, are you?
    Well no, of course not. But it will prompt some black humour observing just how inept the current UK government is at the stuff they actually should be getting paid for.

    As does the current saga of Pritti Patel's years of browbeating bullshit blowing up in her face.

    Of course Boris and his cabal will just be focussing on shifting blame to EU intransigence rather than their own incompetence and dearth of realism. It will be interesting to see if the UK electorate, having already proven itself to have an average IQ equivalent to that of particularly gifted amoeba, will fall for this...the biggest confidence trick of all.

  2. #18052
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    are you swapping passwords with SeekingAss, Cy?

  3. #18053
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    The devil of course is in the detail and in that respect one wouldn't expect too much in the way of material contribution from BoJo the Clown whose laziness and reputation for broad brush, and usually implausible, solutions precedes any notion that his grasp of detail will be anything but tenuous.

    No, BoJo and his lead Orcs, are only truly concerned with doctrinal oneupmanship and as we have seen from the overtures orchestrated last week the propaganda scoresheet seems mainly preoccupied with non-alignment with the EU as an act of faith, even if this means the nitty-gritty of trade negotiation will be prejudiced before the respective team members have had time to warm their seats at the discussion table.

    The real danger is that BoJo actually believes the Brexit soma drip-fed from Goebbels Cummings joy bag of fantasy unicorn juice that any and all losses from the EU schism can be compensated by increased trade with the US.

    Most authoritative pundits looking at Brexit dispassionately conclude that a deal-less WTO exit will risk a GDP loss of around 6% for the UK with a mere 2% increase in trade likely to emanate from the US, and that latter estimate is an optimistic one - there is very little that the US needs to import from the UK that it cannot already procure under the current EU/US trad protocols. The Americans however will be more than happy to offer BoJo the illusion of trade wealth in order to get a slice of the NHS pie, a concomitant majority control of the soon-to-be burgeoning medical insurance business, greater access for its own investment banking arms and of course a rather nice dumping ground for its agricultural surpluses. This will mean death for Britain's own agricultural sector but as we have already heard from Tory ERG fanatics there is more money to be made from acting as middle-men in the dumping of US products on the UK markets than there is from British farmers.

    Nevertheless, BoJo and his clique keep on with their Anglo/American love-fest and it is increasingly becoming more and more likely that Bozza the Shagger has indeed swallowed Cummings' bollox hook, line and sinker.

    As I said before, Brexit was but a first step in the re-making of Britain but it has bugger all to do with increased sovereignty and everything to do with becoming a satellite stat within US corporate hegemony.

    The actual deadline favoured by BoJo is July at the latest, a daft ploy signalled to pressure the EU into a hasty "fuck it" solution. This is poor brinkmanship but one must not forget, there is no-one in the current government who has any experience of successful government, they are all demonstrable second rate and to a considerable extent failures, most of all BoJo who has done nothing in his entire life other than drink, shag, lie and exploit the appetites of the vapid and the deluded - not for nothing did that creep Gove claim he was unfit for government.

    If I were Von der Leyen et al I'd simply ask for a definitive response from BoJo this week that he is going to honour his agreement to last year's declarations. If they fail to get this assurance in a memorandum of understanding then they should consider Brexit is indeed a done deal, terminate the negotiation process and prepare for the UK's departure as a WTO status third country on 1.1.21 and leave it at that.

  4. #18054
    Thailand Expat CaptainNemo's Avatar
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    ∆ TL;DR... Why do you bother? You could probably do it all more succinctly with a big teary scribble. Germany still wants to export to the UK, and they don't want tariffs; the rest don't matter. The civil service needs an enema, a political catheter and disinfection of all traces of bacterial new-labour-itis.
    Last edited by CaptainNemo; 02-03-2020 at 05:23 PM.

  5. #18055
    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jabir View Post
    First starve
    I'm sure you have the logic and facts to back up your assertion

  6. #18056

  7. #18057
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    So, that dosh is gonna really come rolling in from all corners after the UK is free from the EU and can make its own deals, eh?...

    The British economy would be at most 0.16% larger by the middle of the next decade under a comprehensive trade deal with the US, the government has admitted, laying bare the limited benefits from striking an agreement with Donald Trump.


    In a document published by Liz Truss’s Department for International Trade designed to kick-start post-Brexit trade talks with the Trump White House, the government said the British economy stood to benefit from an “ambitious and comprehensive” trade deal worth a fraction of GDP, equivalent to 3.4bn after 15 years.


    Prompting warnings from economists that the benefits would be far outstripped by the losses from crashing out of the EU, the official analysis also showed that a more limited trade deal with the US would deliver benefits to the UK economy worth just 0.07% by the middle of the 2030s, or about 1.4bn.


    The government had previously estimated the economy would be as much as 7.6% smaller should Britain leave the EU without a deal, and about 4.9% smaller under Boris Johnson’s preferred Canada-style agreement.


    Dr Peter Holmes, an academic at the UK Trade Policy Observatory at Sussex University, said: “The numbers are very small. It just goes to show how tiny the gains are from any free trade agreement with the US compared to losing our present arrangements with the EU.”
    British economy 'to grow 0.16% at best under US trade deal' | Politics | The Guardian

  8. #18058
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    Who cares about the economy, we need to get back to the work to live , not live to work ethos, that made Britain great .
    How many immigrants are gonna get booted out is what the righteous voted for.
    Without those millions of low skilled parasites to look after the GDP per capita would rise anyway., And the stressfull overcrowding will be reduced,
    With the added bonus the streets would sound and smell better,

  9. #18059
    Hansum Man! panama hat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Booth View Post
    Who cares about the economy
    Spoken like a true economist . . . even with the crappiest economy jobs will be plentiful, right? Ha, once those continentals are gone loads of jobs even you can do like nursing, teacher, uni lecturer, plumber, doctor etc...

  10. #18060
    Thailand Expat lom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Booth View Post
    With the added bonus the streets would sound and smell better,
    Brexit - It's Still On!-ep3zgcawoaam25e-png

    no comments needed picture speaks for itself

  11. #18061
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    Bojo is stoopid, Bojo the clown, upper class twit etc etc. Expostulated by bitter folk who where somewhat obviously never head prefect at Eton or any other good school (but possibly someones Head boy), do not have an Oxbridge degree, and were never even Mayor of Milton Keynes- never mind London.

    I think Boris Johnson is considerably more clever than he is being given credit for in the remoaner Press. The UK hasn't seen a true Blue collar Conservative for some time, and I agree with quite a lot of what he is doing. Oft compared to Trump- who said he will help the common working fool who voted for him, but in practise slashes taxes for the rich, balloons the Deficit, and slashes services for the poor & working class- he is quite the opposite. Except for the silly hair cut. That spells votes, especially new votes in the traditionally Labour heartlands of Britain. Bojo may well be around for longer than you hope. Read and Weep, moaners:-


    Boris Johnson is the real blue-collar conservative

    Unlike Trump, his actions, not his words, appeal to a wide swath of working-class voters

    Call him an upper-class Etonian twit if you like, but the reality is that Boris Johnson, not Donald Trump, might be the 21st century’s first genuine blue-collar conservative.
    Since becoming prime minister of the United Kingdom, Johnson has represented a profound break from the prevailing market fundamentalist ideology of the past 40 years in terms of both his rhetoric and, more important, his actions. His policies evoke a 1970s-style economic corporatism (much derided by Margaret Thatcher) or, in more historic terms, a reversion to a kinder, gentler form of “one nation conservatism.”
    In the words of UK-born, US-residing pundit Andrew Sullivan, the core of Johnson’s ideology is an appeal to “the working poor and aspiring middle classes, [by being] tough on immigration and crime, but much more generous in spending on hospitals and schools and science.”
    Is it for real? Recall that this was also the promised policy formula that helped elect Donald Trump president of the United States in 2016, but which he hasn’t implemented while in office. By contrast, Johnson’s actions suggest a more serious intent, which could have long-lasting consequences for British politics and beyond. The center-left of Europe and the US ignores this phenomenon at its collective peril.
    To caricature Johnson as a “British Trump” is a lazy narrative that grossly mischaracterizes what he has done already during his comparatively short tenure leading the United Kingdom.

    ..... In his victory speech, he acknowledged that voters in the traditional Labour heartlands
    merely “lent” their votes to him, and that more needed to be done to consolidate their long-term support. With that in mind, he has already backed off his party’s original plan to cut corporate taxes by 2%, so that his government could spend more on voters’ priorities, including the state-funded National Health Service (on health care, Johnson’s Conservative Party is farther to the left of most of the Democrats now running for president other than Bernie Sanders, let alone Trump and the Republicans).

    On infrastructure, Johnson has green-lighted approval for the construction of a high-speed train line to the Midlands and northern England, a US$130 billion venture that many have derided as a wasteful money pit, but which the PM views as a crucial means of regenerating these depressed regions outside the home counties.
    As a transport concept, the High Speed 2 (“HS2”) benefits might be marginal: huge expenditure and big dividends to builders. In reality, light rail is all the UK probably needs. But the proposal was symbolically important, of course. And the amounts approved represent something well beyond tokenism, as the project constitutes one of the largest infrastructure spends of its kind anywhere in the world.
    At the same time, Johnson has been able to connect culturally with voters in the post-industrial Midlands and northern England, who wanted nothing to do with Labour’s “woke” identity politics. Historic indifference to their deep, often unstated misgivings about where the country and its culture were going was often dismissed as racism, much as Hillary Clinton derided a large chunk of Trump supporters in 2016 as a “basket of deplorables.”
    Even on immigration (where we see echoes of Trump and the charges of racism have become most pronounced), it should be acknowledged that Johnson’s prioritization of a skills-based immigration policy is not inherently restrictionist (in fact, both Canada and Australia, the models for his new immigration policy, have high net immigration rates).
    Unlike Margaret Thatcher or Ronald Reagan, the new British PM’s goal is not to roll back the frontiers of the state but, rather, to use it to mitigate inequality by enhancing middle- and working-class wage growth, arrest the stagnation of dying communities and, above all else, reassert the primacy of the nation-state as the central organizing foundation for society (as opposed to subsuming it into a larger supranational political grouping).
    In Johnson’s vision, the state, labor and business would all play major roles in the promotion of national economic development, as well as restoring the social contract long shredded by economic neoliberalism on the left and radical free-market libertarianism on the right.

    .......In fiscal-policy terms, Johnson’s rejection of the Treasury’s prevailing austerity bias has been particularly noteworthy. The former chancellor, Sajid Javid, had repeatedly insisted that the UK should run a balanced budget by 2023, the maintenance of which would have severely hampered the Johnson administration’s ability to offset potential trade shocks emerging from a more restrictive trade relationship with the European Union, as well as mitigating the government’s ability to embrace a robust national industrial policy post-Brexit.

    The resultant clash was brought to a head when Johnson forced out his chancellor, by issuing an ultimatum to Javid to fire all his advisers – a condition that the chancellor later said “no self-respecting minister” would accept.
    The clipping of the Treasury’s wings (and the corresponding resignation of Britain’s chancellor of the exchequer) has been caricatured by Johnson’s opponents in both Parliament and the press as the actions of an insecure, power-hungry prime minister seeking to centralize power. But in reality, the move represents a long-overdue move to cut down the Treasury’s stranglehold over the totality of economic policy relative to other government departments and paves the way for an expansionary post-Brexit budget.
    It is true that government spending under Donald Trump has not been marked by deficit fetishism. But unlike Trump, much of Boris Johnson’s anticipated spending bonanza is largely being directed toward the working and middle classes, as opposed to society’s top tier.
    By and large, Johnson’s policy reflects the embrace of a national industrial policy that collides with the prevailing neoliberal notion that the government should be nothing but a neutral umpire, delegating all entrepreneurial activity and innovation to the private sector. That is an idea akin to Holy Writ in Brussels. The problem with this view, as I have written before, is that it arbitrarily restricts the range of fiscal activity that can be undertaken for broader public purpose:
    “When governments occasionally find a way to redistribute the benefits of [extracting value from the economy] to the broader population [rather than to the top 1 percent], whether via a minimum wage, tighter regulation, state intervention, or similar policy, these measures are invariably castigated as wrongheaded, inevitably leading to less efficiency, sub-optimal growth and lower standards of living.”
    The Johnson government’s prioritization of redistributing fiscal resources to the country’s poorer northern regions runs in the face of these neoliberal shibboleths. The regions on which he is focusing have long been the losers of globalization while London and the southern home counties boomed as communities in the rest of the country began to wither away.
    Johnson’s measures also send profoundly important political signals. They are designed to build on his recent political success where he breached Labour’s “Red Wall,” the party’s traditional working-class base in the manufacturing and mining districts of northern England, which largely supported Brexit and turned to the Tories during the December election for the first time in decades. Johnson’s political endgame is to ensure that these newly acquired working-class constituencies are converted to long-term electoral strongholds for the Tories.
    The consequences of that kind of electoral success could have long-lasting implications. With his policy actions so far, the British PM is appealing to a mass of working-class constituencies long alienated by successive governments, both Tory and Labour, that prioritized the European Union’s technocratic market fundamentalism.


    .... Boris versus EU
    What about the big elephant in the room, namely Brexit and the UK’s future trading relationship with the EU?
    Boris Johnson’s domestic political jiujitsu has understandably discombobulated his negotiating interlocutors in the EU, which likely means a much more contentious negotiation about the evolution of the post-Brexit relationship between the UK and EU. Hints of the challenges lurking became evident when Boris Johnson’s chief Brexit negotiator, David Frost, warned Brussels that the UK would not under any circumstances sign up to EU rules in a trade deal with Brussels, which circumscribed the former’s sovereignty and enforced the EU’s regulatory and legal framework via the European Court of Justice.
    To be sure, these are but the opening shots in what is likely to be a difficult negotiation, but in contrast to the previous administration of Theresa May, Johnson’s government is reversing the government’s priorities: national sovereignty over the maintenance of frictionless trade, rather than the opposite.
    The reality is that Johnson’s nationalism represents a vision that is ultimately irreconcilable with that of Brussels, a fact that the EU is only beginning to grasp as it establishes its negotiating brief. Brexit was never an end in itself, but a means to a very different sort of destination for the UK.
    As such, not only is the UK a regulatory rival of the EU, but also, in a broader sense, it presents an ideological challenge to much of the prevailing framework that has dominated policymaking globally for more than half a century, but which is likely ending.
    Johnson will succeed if he can re-establish a social contract among business, labor and government constituents, a modern-day tripartism that replaces today’s incipient caste system, characterized by a steadily growing underclass, often foreign-born, in menial, dead-end personal service jobs.


    Rather than simply deriding him, the Left would do well to pay heed. Failure to do so could have catastrophic consequences for them.
    FULL ARTICLE- https://asiatimes.com/2020/02/boris-johnson-is-the-real-blue-collar-conservative/


    In the US, Trump seems to have maintained his popularity with the Faithful with empty rhetoric- and I wonder how long that will last?
    In the UK, Bojo is stealing the rug from right under Labour and the compliant latte' clases with policies designed to actually help those left behind by neo-Liberalism.
    Ignore and deride at your own peril. Who is indulging in Identity Politics now?



    Last edited by sabang; 03-03-2020 at 06:47 AM.

  12. #18062
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    Quote Originally Posted by NamPikToot View Post
    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/mar/01/eu-scheme-to-help-roma-prisoners-stay-uk-after-brexit
    A slightly misleading headline; the article actually refers to people outside the normal categories of immigrants i.e. Prisoners and Romanies.

    The bottom line is that the EU countries, especially Czech and Slovakia from where many of the Romanies hail, definitely do not want them back.

  13. #18063
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by panama hat View Post
    Punch - the final issue was printed in 1992
    Just saw this...

  14. #18064
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    Nothing to stop it coming back, now that we've got the clown show in Europe to laugh at. And yes, I was well aware Punch had ceased publication. (hint- PH knew too)
    Any comment containing some meat syb- like what do you have to say about the rather substantive article above, that actually has content? I won't hold my breath.

  15. #18065
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Likewise please feel free to address the on-topic material coverered in many of my posts. I won't be expecting that to happen either. All I would say is that pointing out BoJo is a clown is not always a suggestion that he lacks intelligence.

    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    Well, at least we won't use the Brit Army to foil Napoleon Macron's grand schemes this time around. We'll just read about from afar, in Punch magazine and Private Eye.
    Why would you suggest that 'we' consult a satirical magazine that went bust 28 years ago for news on recent political developments?

    The 'I was just joking' defence seems utterly risible, frankly.

    It does raise questions.

  16. #18066
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Likewise please feel free to address the on-topic material coverered in many of my posts. I won't be expecting that to happen either. All I would say is that pointing out BoJo is a clown is not always a suggestion that he lacks intelligence.



    Why would you suggest that 'we' consult a satirical magazine that went bust 28 years ago for news on recent political developments?

    The 'I was just joking' defence seems utterly risible, frankly.

    It does raise questions.
    You c&p from the Guardian, usually from opinion pieces, rather than factual information. You = hard left moron. Seeking ass just makes shit up out of thin air, and pretends hes clever. In both cases you expect socialist rhetoric to win over arguments.

    Your inherent bias and selective deafness makes genuine debate impossible. You have both been outed as foolish, broken expats, unable to cope with the UK in person, but happy to throw stones and blame others for the breakages. Wankers.

  17. #18067
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    It is implicit in any discussion involving Brexit and its stupid constituency of the dull-witted and ignorant, that anything dismissive of their cause is mere opinion and everything deriding or criticising the EU and Britain's membership thereof is evidence based, scientific study proving a truism that is as incontrovertible as, say, day follows night.

    Truly, they are the dimmest tribe to emerge from the English lower end.

    Interesting though that Auerbach ( Asia Times above) should agree with my perception that Brexit was but a a Trojan horse used to destroy the old order and to re-fashion Britain into a new economic force. The rest of his thesis is rubbish. BoJo has no sense of statesmanship, has no doctrine of his own and certainly has no interest in anything as mundane as day-to-day governance. He is a sly buffoon obsessed by his own pathological need to be admired who deflects criticism by invoking a faux Churchillian gravitas garbed in an affected boyish charm.

    BoJo is in truth an empty vessel driven by ambition for its own sake but is also riven with doubt and insecurity. Have you noticed whenever he is making a statement or answering some invitation to elucidate on an issue he almost always ends up in delivering scarcely coherent waffle interspersed with frequent hesitations as he searches in his mind for the mot juste. The reason for this inarticulacy is really not that difficult to fathom - despite his brains, his education and his social milieu, BoJo has no inner convictions, he has no cornerstone on which to found a dogma that he might develop into a system worthy of support, he has no belief system that informs his behaviour. In short, BoJo is very much a psychopath and he simply does not care for others or their lives, he is only interested in winning approbation for himself but the satisfaction he gains from this is ephemeral and in his sickness he has nothing of substance with which to sustain his victories. His speech is never from the heart nor is it the truth - he approximates all the time and is forever self censoring his thought patterns so that what he finally does say is what he thinks others might say if they were in his position. And in the end he almost inevitably falls into generalisations, cliche and hackneyed phrases, his inimitable piffle waffle patter.

    The truth of the matter is that Britain is now a vehicle for Hedgefunders'RUs and corporate snake oil salesman carpetbaggers who have found in BoJo the perfect circus clown to lead a vacuous public down the path away from democratic social conservatism into the land of centrist manipulated laissez faire jungles where the tax payer will subsidise the profits of the corporate elites. Auerbach loves this crap but he seems to have missed the joke about the North/South divide being levelled - the only levelling to be done will be the level of debt soon to be shared by all, hugely, except the northerners will be buying a pig in a poke.

  18. #18068
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    and a new road block in those wonderful negotiations

    Choppy waters of Brexit threaten Danish fishing - BBC News

    With an icy wind blowing behind it the fishing trawler Asbjoern 265 enters port in Skagen on the very northern tip of Denmark. It's Denmark's busiest fishing harbour.

    A flock of seagulls wheels overhead, raucous and hungry. Snowflakes drift in the air. Out to sea a line of white waves mark the turbulent waters where the currents of the North Sea and the Baltic collide.

    The Asbjoern is an impressive sight. It is 75m (246ft) long, freshly painted, with a hold crammed with fish. This catch alone, of blue whiting, is worth more than 1m ($1.3m).

  19. #18069
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    Brexit could cost the UK up to 30 times more than it will gain back from striking a Trump trade deal


    Brexit could cost the UK economy up to 30 times as much as the country hopes to gain back from securing a new trade deal with US President Donald Trump, official figures suggest.

    The UK's Department for International Trade on Sunday evening published its objectives for talks with the Trump administration ahead of negotiations scheduled for later this month.

    The department's analysis estimated that an independent new trade deal with the US — possible only because of Brexit — would boost the UK economy by as much as 3.4 billion, or up to 0.16%, over the next 10 to 15 years.

    However, this figure is dwarfed by estimates of the cost of Prime Minister Boris Johnson's Brexit deal.

    A UK government analysis published in November 2018 suggested that a modelled average free-trade agreement along the lines of Johnson's planned deal with the European Union would reduce economic growth by about 4.9% and up to 6.7% over 15 years.

    economic growth by about 4.9% and up to 6.7% over 15 years.



    The UK government's analyses of Johnson's and Prime Minister Theresa May's Brexit deals. UK government An analysis of Johnson's deal published last year by the independent think tank UK in a Changing Europe forecast a 6.4% hit to per-capita GDP.

    This means the cost of Brexit could be 30 times as big as the projected economic gain of a trade deal with the US.

    Pro-Brexit figures in Johnson's government have in the past questioned such forecasts. Conservative MPs accused former Chancellor Philip Hammond last year of being too gloomy when the Treasury revealed its analysis of how a new free trade deal with the US could benefit the UK economy.

    However, the latest analysis of a trade deal with the US is pretty much in line with previous government projections.

    David Henig, a former UK trade official, said on Monday said that the projection matched past analyses of the effect on the UK of a trade deal between the EU and the US.

    Henig, the UK director at the European Centre for International Political Economy, told Business Insider that it was "in line with" Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership forecasts, approximately "0.1% of GDP from a modest deal."

    Henig added: "These forecasts are based on the same models that suggested a much larger economic hit as a result of a shallow UK-EU deal."

    Naomi Smith, the CEO of the cross-party campaign Best for Britain, said: "It isn't economically sensible to rip up all of our existing trade deals in order to pursue an arrangement with the US worth just a fraction of our trade with the EU."

    She added: "If the Government is serious about making a success of Brexit, it should start by ensuring we maintain the strong trading relationships we already have as part of the EU, rather than prioritising the relatively low benefits of a US trade deal."

    https://www.businessinsider.com/brex...de-deal-2020-3

  20. #18070
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    Of course, the Brexit rabble will dismiss these assessments as " project fear" or as our resident Brexiteers would have it, mere "opinion" and therefore of no value.

  21. #18071
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    Why all the attention to the USA, as if this is the be all and end all? China and Germany are both bigger international exporters than the USA. Then you have Korea and Japan, industrial behemoths too. Agriculturally, ANZ is a major exporter, as well as Brazil, Canada and other nations. If UK/EU trade is affected by Brexit, there are several nations that stand to benefit- the US being one of them. To treat the USA as if it is the only trade alternative, as per the analysis above, is beyond ridiculous.

    The intrinsic point, however, is that trade barriers such as tariffs placed on existing trade relationships between the EU & UK would be bad for both parties- and thus I do not anticipate it will happen to any substantive degree. The UK is the EU's largest export destination, remember- being 14% of overall exports. Do you really think pique filled bureaucrats will be allowed to endanger such a vital source of export revenue? I don't, and I would argue the same applies in reverse.

  22. #18072
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    Sabang, the EU derives 3% of its GDP from trade with the UK, vice versa its 13%.

    You really haven't a clue, have you.

    Look, let's put it this way, what is it that Britain will sell to the world that it could not before Brexit through its miscellany of trade agreements negotiated by the EU with over 60 countries including Japan, Mercosur countries, Korea and the Antipodes, deals which most certainly will not be improved post Brexit for the UK?

  23. #18073
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    Speaking as an ex stockbroker, offshore investment advisor, and asset manager with the requisite MBA, I am pretty certain I have a firmer grip on macroeconomics that than you, Seeking Aslum! Which is why I am trying to inject a modicum of common sense into this typically petty debate, marked more by name calling, pique or triumphalism, and Identity politics than any sort of rationalism.

    Neither party benefits from a reduction in existing trade, it is a lose/ lose situation. Britain has left the EU, that certainly is not going to change. If one party takes a punitive or restrictive approach to trade negotiations & ongoing trade, it will obviously be reciprocated- and this hardly harms the UK's hand inordinately, because it imports far more from the EU than it exports to it, and none of these imports are a monopoly. Good old fashioned common sense will prevail- why cut off yer nose to spite yer face, as the saying goes. When the shouting is over, you will see. Remind me then if I was wrong or right.

  24. #18074
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    The intrinsic point, however, is that trade barriers such as tariffs placed on existing trade relationships between the EU & UK would be bad for both parties
    don't tell us, tell Boris and his hard Brexit supporters

    it's like a bad wife asking for 100% of your wealth in a divorce, she can't have it both ways

    if she wants to benefit 100% of your wealth, she has to put up with the shit, or else she gets 0%

  25. #18075
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    Well, if imo the Bojo Tories take a petty or damaging approach to trade negotiations, I will certainly say so BF! Early days to opine that though.
    Economically, I am certainly a soft Brexiter. On matters of Sovereignty however, a pretty firm line needs to be drawn.
    I mean now the UK has left, surely you wouldn't want on ongoing situation where UK political considerations would affect the ability of the EU to enact it's own policy? Same in reverse.

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