1. #27851
    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    Why is this in the Trump thread.
    World news or 2020 election I would have thought.
    as you are a mod , you can move it where ever you like

  2. #27852
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    I like this... Sham what a good way to describe the last 3.5 years.

    Tax bombshell reveals Trump's image is a sham

    Donald Trump's image revealed as a sham after tax bombshell - CNNPolitics

  3. #27853
    Thailand Expat raycarey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aging one View Post
    Tax bombshell reveals Trump's image is a sham
    it's always been that way with trump...even before he got into politics.

    he's a conman/showman who doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself (and his oldest daughter).

    if there's any justice, he'll die in jail.

  4. #27854
    Thailand Expat harrybarracuda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by raycarey View Post
    it's always been that way with trump...even before he got into politics.

    he's a conman/showman who doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself (and his oldest daughter).

    if there's any justice, he'll die in jail.
    That's why they want his banking data.

    If he inflated his worth to get bigger loans, and deflated it to get lower taxes, he's a sitting duck.

  5. #27855
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    Him paying either nothing or 750 dollars only per year is not going to sit well with a great many people. This time he may not be teflon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nidhogg View Post
    Him paying either nothing or 750 dollars only per year is not going to sit well with a great many people. This time he may not be teflon.


    I wonder if there's a person on the planet who hasn't already made up his mind about the upcoming election?

  7. #27857
    Thailand Expat David48atTD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cisco999 View Post
    I wonder if there's a person on the planet who hasn't already made up his mind about the upcoming election?
    Interesting point.

    It was a news article I saw, so no reference but, a week out from the last election, about 15% were undecided, and this time closer to 7% ... making the Polls closer to the eventual outcome.

  8. #27858
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nidhogg View Post
    Him paying either nothing or 750 dollars only per year is not going to sit well with a great many people. This time he may not be teflon.
    You'd think so but per the CNN article:

    Yet given Trump's strong emotional and tribal connection to his followers, his success in constructing alternative political realities while discrediting journalists, and the propaganda from conservative media, the October-surprise style bombshell may have less immediate political impact than might be expected.
    And right on cue the echo-chamber are pushing a bogus story about congresswoman Omar to distract and it's being jumped on by pro-Trumpists.

    These people just flat-out ignore any facts they don't like.

  9. #27859
    Thailand Expat tomcat's Avatar
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    President Donald Trump-ei_r5ynxcaabo8n-jpg

  10. #27860
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    fake taxes

  11. #27861
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    Quote Originally Posted by cisco999 View Post
    I wonder if there's a person on the planet who hasn't already made up his mind about the upcoming election?
    Apparently (and remarkably) there is still a few percentage points undecided.

    For the rabid trumptard, not going to make a difference, but of the less fervent but pro-trump broadly - those could well find this a step too far. Old joe blow paying thousands in tax is not going to be a happy cherub.

  12. #27862
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    Depends how the dems play it.
    They need to target his demographic with ads that ask "how much did you earn last year? How much Tax did you pay?
    Trump earned xxx billions and paid 750 dollars."
    Last edited by Cujo; 28-09-2020 at 06:41 PM.

  13. #27863
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    Dems already selling "I paid more tax than Donald Trump" stickers.....

  14. #27864
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    Why? Isn't it good enough that the super rich buy the Rembrandts, Picassos, Lear Jets, mansions, yachts? Let the small people pay the taxes, they are so proud on their richmen, richest in the world, especially when they rally for high positions...

  15. #27865
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
    Depends how the dems play it.
    They need to target his demographic with ads that ask "how much did you earn last year? How much Tax did you pay?
    Trump earned xxx billions and paid 750 dollars."
    And here it comes


  16. #27866
    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    Donald Trump ‘a bad businessman or a tax cheat – probably both’, say accountants

    Alex Cobham, the chief executive of the Tax Justice Network, an international group campaigning for a fairer and more transparent tax system, said: “This shows that Trump is either a very bad businessman or a tax cheat who is not respecting the tax system that he is asking everyone else to pay. Probably both are true.”

    fcuk he is a joke

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    On Sunday night, the New York Times reported that for most of the last 20 years, Donald Trump paid little in the way of income tax. In 2016, he paid only $750. In 2017, he paid the same. Many years, as the review of his taxes show, Trumpís losses far outweighed his income.

    The presidentís allies have already sprung into action. Itís ďtax avoidanceĒ, not tax evasion, of course. They claim Trumpís maneuvers are legal and the kind of thing any smart person would do if they were able. Trump says the detailed report is ďfakeĒ.

    None of this is a surprise, of course.

    Given that Trump is the same man who bankrupted two Atlantic City casinos, launched a short-lived airline and was recently charged with fraud surrounding his ďTrump UniversityĒ, the presidentís finances have consistently been an adventure in accounting. His status and wealth are crucial to his public image. He sold the American people on the folly that he was a successful businessman who could engineer an American resurgence. Much like everything involving Donald Trump, this was pure fiction, a con, that is unraveling before our very eyes.


    When he was a reality television star running his own family company, Trumpís gymnastic finances were problems of his own making and the headache of his staff, workers and bankers. As president, how Trump makes and spends his money is indicative of his personal taste (such as it is) and his willingness to use the office for personal enrichment.



    His debts, though, are far more concerning.

    The New York Times report reveals that Trump is leveraged to the tune of more than $400m, much of it personally guaranteed. Most reputable lending institutions would require significant collateral to extend that kind of credit. Who then, would be willing to lend so much money to such a high-risk client?

    We donít know that answer, of course. It does raise the legitimate question, though: to whom does the president of the United States owe so much money, and what are they willing to do to ensure repayment? Especially when you consider that he has hundreds of millions of dollars in loans due for collection in the next four years. If he is unable to pay them back, what would these lenders be willing to accept in kind as payment for unpaid debts from the man who hopes to continue being the leader of the free world?

    His hotel across from the White House canít fill the holes. His golf courses, according to the Times, are money pits
    Anyone applying for a ďposition of national securityĒ with the US government must fill out an exhaustive document, the SF-86, before beginning work. Aside from the usual questions about past criminal behavior or drug use, are questions related to the applicantís personal finances. Difficulties with money have long been among the quickest routes to blackmail and coercion for foreign intelligence services.

    More than Trumpís own well-documented issues with money, his son-in-law, Jared Kushner has previously found himself in a similar situation. The Kushner Companyís 666 Park Avenue project had been a black hole of cash for years until a sovereign wealth fund made a substantial investment in the property (after Kushner was already serving as Trumpís top adviser in the White House).

    Add that to this monthís report from the Senate intelligence committee that confirmed the 2016 Trump campaignís interactions with agents of Russian intelligence and the presidentís financial woes become that much more concerning for all Americans.

    Itís likely at this point that Trump cannot afford to be president. Though his companies generate some revenue, they wonít make him the kind of money he needs to climb out of debt. Even his hotel just across the street from the White House canít fill all the holes. His golf courses, according to the Times, are money pits.

    For Trump, the presidency has always been performative. Standing behind the podium, before adoring crowds Ė that is what Trump lives for. The actual business of the job holds little interest for him. Now that the world knows for sure heís consistently teetering on the brink of financial ruin, itís not hard to believe that he will focus even less on being president and more on shoring up his personal empire.

    And that, unfortunately, means that the American people will once again take a distant back seat to Trumpís personal concerns and needs. While Americans continue to get sick, thousands more die every week and our way of life is ruined, Trump will do what he always does: put himself at the head of the line.

    Trump sold voters on the folly that he's a successful businessman. That's a con | US news | The Guardian
    ďIf we stop testing right now weíd have very few cases, if any.Ē Donald J Trump.

  18. #27868
    Thailand Expat tomcat's Avatar
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    ...a closer look at tRump's tax debacle:

    Trump's Taxes Show He's a National Security Threat

    What trade-offs would a president with this level of indebtedness be willing to make to save face?

    By Timothy L. O'Brien Trump's Tax Returns Show He's a National Security Threat - Bloomberg
    September 28, 2020, 4:00 PM GMT+7 Corrected September 28, 2020, 4:37 PM GMT+7


    If he were still just a reality TV oddity, the presidentís indebtedness wouldnít be so troubling. Photographer: Frazer Harrison/Getty Images
    Timothy L. O'Brien is a senior columnist for Bloomberg Opinion.

    In a tour de force of hard won reporting, the New York Times has put numerical clothing on what weíve known about President Donald Trump for decades ó that, at best, heís a haphazard businessman, human billboard and serial bankruptcy artist who gorges on debt he may have a hard time repaying.

    The Times, in a news story published Sunday evening that disclosed years of the presidentís tax returns, also put a lot of clothing on things we didnít know. Trump paid just $750 in federal income taxes in 2016, the year he was elected president, and the same amount the following year, when he entered the White House. In many years recently he hasnít paid anything at all. He has played so fast and loose with the taxman that heís entangled in an audit. He paid his daughter Ivanka lush consulting fees that he deducted as a business expense even though she helped him manage the Trump Organization. And heís taken questionable tax write-offs on everything from getting his hair coifed to managing his personal residences.

    Step away from the tragicomic tawdriness and grift that the tax returns define, however, and focus on what they reveal about Trump as the most powerful man in the world and occupant of the Oval Office.

    Due to his indebtedness, his reliance on income from overseas and his refusal to authentically distance himself from his hodgepodge of business, Trump represents a profound national security threat Ė a threat that will only escalate if heís re-elected. The tax returns also show the extent to which Trump has repeatedly betrayed the interests of many of the average Americans who elected him and remain his most loyal supporters.

    I have some history with Trump and his taxes. Trump sued me for libel in 2006 for a biography I wrote, ďTrumpNation,Ē claiming the book misrepresented his track record as a businessman and lowballed the size of his fortune. He lost the suit in 2011. During the litigation, Trump resisted releasing his tax returns and other financial records. My lawyers got the returns, and while I canít disclose specifics of what I saw, I imagine that Trump has always refused to release them because they would reveal how robust his businesses and finances actually are and shine a light on some of his foreign sources of income. The Times has now solved that problem for us.

    According to the Times, Trump has about $421 million in debts which he has personally guaranteed and which are coming due over the next several years. This is consistent with earlier reporting about how much debt he carries, a chunk of which could be gleaned from the personal financial disclosures he is required to file with the federal government. But Trumpís overall indebtedness is greater than the Times tally, I believe.

    Russ Choma reported in Mother Jones last summer that Trumpís debts were nearly $500 million and would come due in relatively short order, pressuring the presidentís finances. But Trumpís debts are even bigger than that, and heís worked hard to keep them hidden for decades. Dan Alexander, a senior editor at Forbes, has been covering Trumpís business interests since 2016 and has a new book out about the presidentís financial conflicts of interest, ďWhite House Inc.Ē Alexander, in a helpful tally he shared Sunday evening, estimates Trumpís total indebtedness to be about $1.1 billion. Now thatís more like it.

    Trump has been bloviating about being worth $10 billion ever since he entered the 2016 presidential race, a figure that simply isnít true. Heís worth a fraction of that amount, and the larger his indebtedness becomes, the more strain it puts on his assets. The Covid-19 pandemic has taken a particularly brutal toll on the sectors in which the Trump Organization operates ó real estate, travel and leisure. If Trump is unable to meet his debt payments, heís either going to have to sell assets or get bailed out by a friend with funds. Trump has never liked to sell anything, even when itís hemorrhaging money. So if heís tempted to save himself by getting a handout, that makes him a mark.

    If Trump was still just a reality TV oddity, that wouldnít be earthshaking. But heís president, and the trade-offs someone like him would be willing to make to save his face and his wallet taint every public policy decision he makes Ė including issues around national security. If Vladimir Putin, for example, can backchannel a loan or a handout to the president, how hard is Trump going to be on Russia? Not that we should worry about Trumpís relationship with Putin. Thatís just a hypothetical question.

    Trumpís own history of avoiding tax payments Ė and often paying nothing -- is the other issue that should alarm the presidentís supporters. Trump and the Republican Party engineered a massive tax cut in 2017 that largely benefitted the most affluent Americans and the largest corporations in the U.S. Now we learn that the president who pushed a tax cut that didnít deliver the economic stimulus he claimed it would, but feathered the nests of the most privileged, has rarely paid taxes in recent years.

    Trump paid $750 in taxes the year he was elected! Thatís way less than the $130,000 in hush money he paid Stormy Daniels. In 2012, Trump criticized Barack Obama for ďonlyĒ paying $161,950 in taxes. Thatís a lot more than $750 too! And itís a lot more than the $0 in taxes Trump frequently paid.

    Trump even paid far less than his really wealthy buddies. As Times reporter David Leonhardt noted, ďOver the past two decades, Mr. Trump has paid about $400 million less in combined federal income taxes than a very wealthy person who paid the average for that group each year.Ē Itís even more troubling when you compare Trumpís tax payments to an American household earning about $75,000 in 2016. Those folks paid about $14,000 in federal income taxes ó which is also a lot more than $750.

    Anyone buying Trumpís tripe about looking out for the little guy while he occupies the White House, or who takes their lives in their hands attending one of his Covid-19-defying campaign rallies, should bear in mind one of the many things the Timesís reporting substantiates: The president of the United States is in it only for himself, and heís laughing all the way to the bank. And heís laughing at you, too.
    Majestically enthroned amid the vulgar herd

  19. #27869
    The Fool on the Hill bowie's Avatar
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    Say what you all want. I've been dealing with the convoluted, ridiculously complex USA Tax Code for decades. Both personal and business.

    The myth of the 70,000-page federal tax code - Vox
    "The internal revenue code, as published by companies like Thomson Reuters and CCH, takes up a little over 4,000 pages."

    And, those 4k pages are for the most part small font single spaced.

    Go ahead, take a look, available on-line at: Internal Revenue Service | An official website of the United States government

    I'll pretty much guarantee that Donald Trump, as do the vast majority of Americans, has done naught more than sign his name to any of the tax documents when it is/was required by law. His, Donald Trumps so called tax returns are completed by; employed CPA's and Tax Attorneys who are fully trained, and most likely among the best money can buy. When you are dealing the vast sums of money the 1%ers have, this is always the case.


    Now, as far as how the American general public will receive the awful news that The Donald has managed to pay little in personal income taxes, well, some will gasp in horror and some will smile in appreciation.

    Really a none issue when it comes to which lever to pull.

  20. #27870
    Thailand Expat tomcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowie View Post
    I'll pretty much guarantee that Donald Trump, as do the vast majority of Americans, has done naught more than sign his name to any of the tax documents when it is/was required by law
    ...he still bears responsibility for what's in those tax documents, not the CPAs or tax lawyers...

    Quote Originally Posted by bowie View Post
    Now, as far as how the American general public will receive the awful news that The Donald has managed to pay little in personal income taxes, well, some will gasp in horror and some will smile in appreciation.
    ...it's the evidence of fraud, not clever accounting, that tRump fears...

    Quote Originally Posted by bowie View Post
    Really a none issue when it comes to which lever to pull.
    ...not if you view his huge indebtedness as a national security issue...

  21. #27871
    The Fool on the Hill bowie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomcat View Post
    bears responsibility for what's in those tax documents
    His responsibility will be in declaring the monies in dividends, securities, etc. he receives.

    Quote Originally Posted by tomcat View Post
    evidence of fraud
    I will pretty much guarantee that each and every Trump tax return is audited specifically looking for that evidence

    My personal experiences, in many years I received letter notifications from the IRS of mistakes I had made in completing personal and business taxation documents detailing corrections the IRS made to my calculations/documents with instructions on how to challenge them if I did not accept their analysis. And I did challenge, and often prevailed. @25% of the time my interpretation was accepted - once I explained in writing how I had made the determination.

    In Trumps case, his tax attorneys will answer for what is contained in the tax docs


    Quote Originally Posted by tomcat View Post
    you view
    as has been discussed in many avenues of this thread - individuals will have their own views. They hear the news and select whatever it is they decide is correct.

    The divisive American political machine won't have it any other way.

  22. #27872
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowie View Post
    Say what you all want
    Cool... The president of the US is a tax-dodging/cheating fraud and only a billionaire if you add up all the debts that make him a national security risk. He is morally, ethically and actually bankrupt and unfit for office and no amount of attempts to turd-polish or distract by his cultists changes that.

  23. #27873
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    as you are a mod , you can move it where ever you like
    Not in speakers corner though.

  24. #27874
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    I like this meme that just screams FACT!!!

    President Donald Trump-120282386_1045722339190693_42518067637870848_n-jpg

  25. #27875
    Thailand Expat tomcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowie View Post
    My personal experiences, in many years I received letter notifications from the IRS of mistakes I had made
    ...I think you mean "mistakes"...

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