The 'Americans Getting Shot' Thread

[Headworx]

^And the usual calls for assault weapons to be banned is rolled out yet again, predictably. I have no idea why anyone even bothers because nothing will change on that point and even if by some unforeseeable miracle it did, any semi-auto weapon with a 30 shot clip or two handguns with 15 shot clips will kill exactly the same amount of people in the hands of a nutter on a suicide mission but nobody is calling for them to be banned too.

As sad as it is it's America where long ago, they learned to accept that a part of their precious gun ownership rights is these sort of things will happen. And it's too late to change that now anyway, can't be done.

[Troy]

Not quite the average US mass killer is she...



Not sure flying flags at half mast for the rest of the month is going to help...

...Introduction of gun control laws, similar to the rest of the world, might be a better option.

[Headworx]

Introduction of gun control laws, similar to the rest of the world, might be a better option.

Cannot be done. There could be 100 school kids slaughtered in the next week and it still cannot be done. There's too many of them that would rather die or watch others die than to even think about handing their guns over, or giving up their right to own them.

[MarilynMonroe]

Not sure flying flags at half mast for the rest of the month is going to help...

...Introduction of gun control laws, similar to the rest of the world, might be a better option.

I read about this today,, was so sickened. JFC! Another one.....
I just can't get over all of these school shootings and nothing is being done to prevent them.
Obviously human life means nothing to the pro gun people and government.

[MarilynMonroe]

it still cannot be done.

Something can be done, the thing is nothing will be done more like.

[MarilynMonroe]

The fucking place is nuts.

Understatement of the decade.
I live about an hour away from the border, and when I hear of these mass murders especially in schools, I just can't seem to wrap my head around it. We have pretty strict gun laws here in Canada, and we hardly ever hear about mass shootings in schools. Mostly hunters own guns here and guns and ammo are not easy to obtain.

[Hugh Cow]

Probably in many ways a pointless thread. Most have commented since this thread was opened and still people keep dying. Too many Americans love guns more than preventing gun deaths. The only hope is that its only pro gun members and their families that get killed. Either that or make it compulsory for every american to carry a loaded gun at all times.
That reminds me of ricky gervais's jokes regarding the "do not drink" warning label on bleach bottles. He suggested the warning should be removed for a year. After that, it wouldn't be neccessary anyway.
Please explain the joke to any of your American friends.

[aging one]

After that, it wouldn't be neccessary anyway.
Please explain the joke to any of your American friends.

I get it. Every time there is a mass shooting I just recoil in horror. The average American's attitude toward guns is simply reprehensible.

[cyrille]

There have been 130 mass shootings so far this year in the US.

Just incredible.

[taxexile]

Not incredible at all when you consider the sense of impotent rage and angry macho entitlement held by so many americans of all political persuasions.

[Troy]

^ Well, I guess they are killing off a lot of potential mass shooters...

Cannot be done.

I'm quite sure a well prepared and logical debate with plenty of examples of how it has been done elsewhere, as well as examples of the horrors that have been inflicted by guns, would go a long way to help convince the dumbest of folks. Brainwash the masses with positive reasons for removing guns from society instead of keeping them.

To say it cannot be done is a defeatist attitude that I wouldn't expect from someone such as yourself.

[MarilynMonroe]

I think a big problem now is that these mass shootings are causing people and young people to live in fear. Mental health issues are building up, with stress, anxiety and fear dominating. This could trigger people that are on the verge with easy access to guns to just do it. Was reading an interesting article today about the stress of all of these mass shootings cause collective trauma in the USA.

Stress of mass shootings causing cascade of collective traumas

[MarilynMonroe]

I can't imagine as the article points out, being a student in a class and fearing a mass shooting while thinking about how to find an escape route.
The effects of these mass shootings and jus in general of hearing them so often in the news is causing suicides, stress, PTSD, etc. So sad to live in fear like that.

[Headworx]

To say it cannot be done is a defeatist attitude that I wouldn't expect from someone such as yourself.

Ok smart arse, what you and your know-fuckall attitude should do then is try to live somewhere like Houston, which is by American standards a reasonably safe place to live, where you can pretty much assume most people will have as a minimum something like a .45 handgun on them when they're in public and a home protection long arm such as a 12 gauge in their house, and they've had those weapons and the correct permits to own them since they were old enough to apply.

Go up to them and give them your personal assurance that just because they are giving their firearms up, the bad guys will be too (and there's a lot of bad guys there) and if they ever get into a situation where they think their life is in danger on the street or someone is kicking their back door down in the middle of the night, they should call emergency services and wait for assistance. Tell them you're from England to drive home the point that you know all about these things, and that's how you do it there with great success, and that they should try it too. You clueless fucking idiot.

[Headworx]

Something can be done, the thing is nothing will be done more like.

Ok your first step is to get every low life piece of shit and anyone with certifiable mental issues in America that owns guns, legally or otherwise, to hands their guns in. Get back to me when this is done, and we'll move on to step two.

[Troy]

^^ Oh dear, that quite obviously won't succeed and is not what I had in mind. One hopes you aren't allowed a gun.

[MarilynMonroe]

Ok your first step is to get every low life piece of shit and anyone with certifiable mental issues in America that owns guns, legally or otherwise, to hands their guns in. Get back to me when this is done, and we'll move on to step two.

I said something could be done, I didn't say to get Americans to give up their guns.
I get it that mindset in America. I have lived there a few times and I have relatives that live in Arizona of all states who own a gun.
I think it should be harder to obtain a gun and ammunition. There should be way more mental health support in the US for one.
I really think if that people at the top really wanted to change things, they'd do more about it, but it is ingrained in the national psyche that owning a gun is the only way to keep safe.

[Edmond]

America.

Pretty much a failed state from top to bottom.


And this is the country that wants to police the world.

[harrybarracuda]

Ok smart arse, what you and your know-fuckall attitude should do then is try to live somewhere like Houston, which is by American standards a reasonably safe place to live, where you can pretty much assume most people will have as a minimum something like a .45 handgun on them when they're in public and a home protection long arm such as a 12 gauge in their house, and they've had those weapons and the correct permits to own them since they were old enough to apply.

Go up to them and give them your personal assurance that just because they are giving their firearms up, the bad guys will be too (and there's a lot of bad guys there) and if they ever get into a situation where they think their life is in danger on the street or someone is kicking their back door down in the middle of the night, they should call emergency services and wait for assistance. Tell them you're from England to drive home the point that you know all about these things, and that's how you do it there with great success, and that they should try it too. You clueless fucking idiot.

Keep in mind that households with guns are more likely to have a death than those without.

Suicide, murder-suicide, accidents, not to mention the likelihood of an intruder shooting back.

[Headworx]

Oh dear, that quite obviously won't succeed and is not what I had in mind.

No here's what you had in mind:

I'm quite sure a well prepared and logical debate with plenty of examples of how it has been done elsewhere...

Yeah that'll sort it right out, a well prepared and logical debate. Can't believe nobody has ever thought of this before, problem solved! FFS are you really that naive? Who's on the invite list out of interest, I hope there's a representative of the millions of people that'll never have a taxable job who own enough unregistered weapons to start and win a war as well.

One hopes you aren't allowed a gun.

Well keep hoping because I've been a licenced firearm owner before and could be again.

I said something could be done,

Like what, and please don't say a well prepared and logical debate. You at least sound like you understand how things are in America so what are you suggesting that you'd give even the slightest chance of being enforceable, successful, and accepted by everyone there?

I think it should be harder to obtain a gun and ammunition.

But it's already too late for that, there's way more guns than people in America with an uncountable amount of ammunition in circulation that people can get their hands on without walking into shops. So we're back to square one of expecting people to hand their legally acquired guns and ammo over. Do I even need to mention that the people with illegal weapons and ordinance probably wouldn't comply?

I really think if that people at the top really wanted to change things, they'd do more about it..

Plenty of Presidents past and current have wanted to do something about it but obviously they can't or they would have, so what chance has anyone from the public got? Call it a defeatist attitude if you will but there's a ton of insurmountable reasons it can't be done, any chance of real change was gone decades ago.

How does this help kids getting shot in schools? It doesn't. My only suggestion, without knowing if the numbers are feasible, would be putting a few Cops or Military on something like 1 month rotations at schools. Maybe that could be part of basic taining for those entering the Armed forces or Police, as well as being part of being in any of the services during their careers if requested to do so? Maybe that would also be a good way to end the careers of people in the services if they wanted an easy 9 to 3 job for a few months or a year at the end of their duties? Of course this wouldn't stop the mass shootings away from schools, but at least the kids would stand a chance.

[harrybarracuda]

How does this help kids getting shot in schools? It doesn't. My only suggestion, without knowing if the numbers are feasible, would be putting a few Cops or Military on something like 1 month rotations at schools. Maybe that could be part of basic taining for those entering the Armed forces or Police, as well as being part of being in any of the services during their careers if requested to do so? Maybe that would also be a good way to end the careers of people in the services if they wanted an easy 9 to 3 job for a few months or a year at the end of their duties? Of course this wouldn't stop the mass shootings away from schools, but at least the kids would stand a chance.

Ah, so the suggestion to stop people getting shot is to have more people with guns.

And you don't see the problem?

Not to mention how well that turned out at Parkland, Robb, etc.

[Headworx]

Keep in mind that households with guns are more likely to have a death than those without.

Without looking at stats I don't doubt this. But, its a risk they're prepared to take. To be perfectly honest, if I lived in America and could legally own/carry a firearm I would. Especially if I lived in an area where violent crime and home invasions were not uncommon.

[Headworx]

Ah, so the suggestion to stop people getting shot is to have more people with guns.

And you don't see the problem?

Oh I see the problem alright, as clear as day. And I also see the solution of disarming everyone cannot be done. It worked perfectly in Australia, it would not work in America. Tell me your plan to make it happen and prove me wrong.

[harrybarracuda]

Oh I see the problem alright, as clear as day. And I also see the solution of disarming everyone cannot be done. It worked perfectly in Australia, it would not work in America. Tell me your plan to make it happen and prove me wrong.

There so no plan, because it requires a constitutional change that will never get enough states.

However that does not preclude a ban on assault-style weapons which are the mass shooters weapon of choice. It's happened before.

But republicans (and a few democrats) are terrified of getting primaried if they don't back the NRA line, or get too much cash to say no.

[Troy]

Oh I see the problem alright, as clear as day. And I also see the solution of disarming everyone cannot be done. It worked perfectly in Australia, it would not work in America. Tell me your plan to make it happen and prove me wrong.

It would take longer than ot did in the UK or Australia but it can still be done. Stop popularizing guns would be the obvious start, in films, tv games etc. Don't promote their sale by removing them from display.
To be more proactive a licence should require several weeks training. The licence needs to be limited to one or two years with recurrent training. High tax on gun and ammunition purchase would also help.
Increased funding to actively promote why gun ownership is bad for society.
Force gun companies to take responsibility for their product and remove the liability concessions that currently exist.
Remove all private sales and gun show sales.
Remove right to carry in public.
That's a start, without banning any ownership...