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  1. #1
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Are All UKIP Members Distinctly Odd?

    Ukip MEP apologises for apparently calling charity boss a paedophile | Politics | theguardian.com

    Jane Collins deletes tweet to Church Army boss Mark Russell, saying she was ‘a bit hot headed’

    A Ukip MEP has been forced to apologise for apparently calling the head of a Christian charity a paedophile on Twitter.

    Jane Collins, one of Ukip’s leading politicians, agreed to make a donation to the charity after she implied that Mark Russell was a criminal on the social networking site on Thursday.

    Russell, who is a Labour party member and head of the Church Army charity, had posted support for his party’s candidate in the South Yorkshire police and crime commissioner byelection.

    But Collins replied, telling Russell: “Yes because we’d soon stop your criminal activity. Paedos leave our kids alone. #Ukip.”

    The byelection was prompted by the resignation of the Labour police commissioner Shaun Wright in the wake of the Rotherham child exploitation scandal.

    Collins initially refused to apologise for her paedophile implication, saying: “It was aimed at the paedophiles not you.” But she agreed to delete the tweet because it “read wrong”, explaining: “I’m a bit hot headed sometimes.”

    She later added: “I apologise for associating you with paedophiles but you’re still supporting a party that has failed our children badly.”

    However, Russell said the Ukip MEP was turning her mistake into party politics and threatened her with legal action. Eventually she conceded: “I am in the wrong … I unreservedly apologise for implication.”

    Russell told the Guardian the tweet was highly damaging to his work, which includes supporting vulnerable people. It was made worse because Collins’s accusation was retweeted many times by Ukip supporters, he said.

    He told Collins: “I’ve dedicated my life to helping kids and your tweet was as hurtful as offensive … this is my reputation.

    “I merely encouraged my fellow South Yorks residents to vote for Alan Billings, the Labour candidate.”

    Russell is the head of Church Army, an evangelist charity linked to the Church of England that has the Queen as its patron. He said the MEP had offered to make a donation to the group after he threatened to sue her.

    Collins’s tweet follows accusations that Ukip exploited the suffering of Rotherham sex abuse victims for political gain in the police and crime commissioner byelection. One victim denounced the party’s tactics as “disrespectful” after it launched a “1,400 reasons to vote” campaign, in reference to the estimated number of victims in the city between 1997 and 2013.

    Collins did not respond to emails from the Guardian.

  2. #2
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    Cyrille : How does one person who is a member of UKIP who is tweets something, something not in the slightest bit "distinctly odd" , how would that make every other member of UKIP "distinctly odd" .
    Could you explain your reasoning for the thread title ?
    I cannot see the sense in it .
    Or was it simply a case of .
    A UKIP member tweeted something .
    I dont like UKIP
    I shall use the tweet to give UKIP abuse ?

  3. #3
    Hangin' Around cyrille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke
    Cyrille : How does one person who is a member of UKIP who is tweets something, something not in the slightest bit "distinctly odd"
    What, you consider it completely normal for an MEP to accuse someone who works for a children's charity of being a paedophile without a shred of evidence?

    Judging by your struggles with the language can I take it you're not completely without an interest in this one?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke
    Cyrille : How does one person who is a member of UKIP who is tweets something, something not in the slightest bit "distinctly odd"
    What, you consider it completely normal for an MEP to accuse someone who works for a children's charity of being a paedophile without a shred of evidence?

    Judging by your struggles with the language can I take it you're not completely without an interest in this one?
    Did you read the article ?
    The allegation was made because the person in question supports a Political party that seemed to allow paedo activity .
    You still didnt answer as to how one person making a tweet could possibly make thousands of other people to be "distinctly odd"
    The tweet wasnt even odd, maybe uncalled for, but certainly not odd

  5. #5
    Not a Mod. Begbie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke
    Cyrille : How does one person who is a member of UKIP who is tweets something, something not in the slightest bit "distinctly odd"
    What, you consider it completely normal for an MEP to accuse someone who works for a children's charity of being a paedophile without a shred of evidence?

    Judging by your struggles with the language can I take it you're not completely without an interest in this one?
    Did you read the article ?
    The allegation was made because the person in question supports a Political party that seemed to allow paedo activity .
    You still didnt answer as to how one person making a tweet could possibly make thousands of other people to be "distinctly odd"
    The tweet wasnt even odd, maybe uncalled for, but certainly not odd
    Agree with Fluke that the Collins woman accused Mr Russel of being a pedophile. The simple solution is that he sues her for defamation. The damages could be given to the charity he represents and the vile Collins would most likely have to quit. Two birds with one stone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Begbie View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke
    Cyrille : How does one person who is a member of UKIP who is tweets something, something not in the slightest bit "distinctly odd"
    What, you consider it completely normal for an MEP to accuse someone who works for a children's charity of being a paedophile without a shred of evidence?

    Judging by your struggles with the language can I take it you're not completely without an interest in this one?
    Did you read the article ?
    The allegation was made because the person in question supports a Political party that seemed to allow paedo activity .
    You still didnt answer as to how one person making a tweet could possibly make thousands of other people to be "distinctly odd"
    The tweet wasnt even odd, maybe uncalled for, but certainly not odd
    Agree with Fluke that the Collins woman accused Mr Russel of being a pedophile. The simple solution is that he sues her for defamation. The damages could be given to the charity he represents and the vile Collins would most likely have to quit. Two birds with one stone.
    She could argue in Court that Labour turning a blind eye to the mass paedo activity in Rotheram rendered them compliant, because they could have and should have stopped it .
    I really dont think that a Church leader at the centre of a huge paedo network which they are trying to cover up, would want any publicity that Court action would bring

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    The balance of proof is on you I think Fluke, as you do protest so much.
    Show us a UKIP member that isn't odd

  8. #8
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    Cyrille made the claim, its down the him to explain the logic for his claim

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille
    Are All UKIP Members Distinctly Odd?
    Well, they might be a little odd but nothing compared to Labour / Conservative / Lib Dems -
    both their voters and politicians,
    whom support a utterly unhinged set of policies and:

    Grotesquely seem to in the pocket of big business -
    Ignorantly - start preemptive aggressive wars around the world ( ie the main charge at Nuremberg WW2 trials)
    Bizarrely use children in experiments (giving vulnerable kids to homosexual 'couples' to adopt )
    Preposterously -supporting same sex marriage
    Ludicrously have an open door immigration policy, favouring the worlds criminal and parasitic filth..
    Farcical economic policies, basing everything around house price inflation.
    Preposterously giving billions in aid to countries that don't need it, or simply waste it .
    Irrationally favouring immigrants over indigenous people.
    George Orwellianly placing CCTV cameras everywhere.
    Brainlessly turning a blind eye to Muslim paedo rings
    Deliriously Championing everything PC over common sense and decency .
    Nastily forcing multi-culturalism and encouraging separate communities.

    The main criticism I'd lay on UKIP is not being a bit odd , but as been far too liberal.
    Democracy has failed Britain, we need a benevolent dictator, at least until the countries back on its feet.
    A friendly easy going despot who would deportmost of the 7,000.000 immigrant scum, and lock up homosexuals in secure hospitals until a cure is found .

  10. #10
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    ^ I think like a lot of people, you'd do well to take a good look at both UKIP's manifesto, their politicians, and their funding. The idea that they're some grassroots movement sticking it to the establishment is utterly ridiculous.

    UKIP's exposure and access is fascinating considering how much of a single issue joke they are. I think they're more than just a party that's struck the right balance between xenophobia and pragmatism in the eyes of your average white van man. I think they're there to move the debate even further to the right. It allows the established parties to move more to the right as well and in doing so, the language and ideas of the moderate right become the more practical, common sensical. Then at the other end of the spectrum, the left, the left of a fair day's pay for a fair day's work and a reasonable social contract for all etc. becomes all the more the loony left. Ridiculous and out of step with the cold hard conditions of modern society.

    I liked this from an article about a George Lakoff book recently:

    'the left has cleaved moderately well to established principles around the politics of the individual – women are equal, racism is wrong, homophobia is wrong. But everything else: a fair day's work for a fair day's pay, the essential dignity of all humans, even if they're foreign people or young people, education as a public good, the natural world as a treasure rather than an instrument of our convenience, the existence of motives besides profit, the pointlessness and poison of privatisation, the profundity, worth and purpose of pooling resources … this stuff is an embarrassment to centre-left parties, even when they're in government, let alone when they're in opposition. When unions reference these ideas, they are dismissed as dinosaurs.'

    So, liberalism is focusing too much on making sure there're at least seven gays and someone in a turban in every television show you watch and there's at least one ethnic minority Old Bill present when ethnic minorities are being stopped and searched for being black while telling people that racial profiling of black people who commit more crime because they're generally of the lower socio-economic strata of society is wrong innit, and not enough time on actually making sure the cousins of those lads being searched because they're driving a Porsche through Broadwater Farm don't end up selling crack because they're so fucked off with working at Nandos for six quid an hour. Then the aforementioned uniformed black police officer leaning against the police car is looking uncomfortable because he's realised it's his brother in the Porsche and he's hoping he lose his job because of police cutbacks because he might end up having to ask his brother for a job.

    And UKIP serve to exacerbate that trend while feeding off the public's increasing annoyance with the politically correct issues peddled by the existing (neo-)left in place of going after the true root causes of inequality and crime....

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke
    She could argue in Court that Labour turning a blind eye to the mass paedo activity in Rotheram rendered them compliant, because they could have and should have stopped it .
    She wouldn't have to. It would be up to Russel to prove he is not.

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    Again who decided that wanting to leave the EU should be labelled a 'right wing' policy?? Scotland wanted to leave the UK and I don't seem to recall the ultra left SNP being called right wing?? Quite a few Labour MPs and their supporters also want to leave the EU are these people all right wingers too??

    So what if UKIP are mainly a one issue party, Farage is never going to be prime minister, he along with many other people in the UK want out of the EU and UKIP gives us that voice as LibLabCon all support continued membership.

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    Quote Originally Posted by buriramboy
    So what if UKIP are mainly a one issue party
    Politics bores the shit out of me so I could be wrong, but I'm fairly sure you answered your own question in that sentence BRB.

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    In relation to Europe, again, people supporting UKIP's supposed manifesto should look at their actual voting patterns and what they're saying in public and in their manifesto on matters relevant to the country's sovereignty and workers' rights. TTIP is the biggest threat to sovereignty and democracy for the UK right now and UKIP's silence on it is deafening, much the same as all of the establishment parties. None of UKIP's MEPs voted against TTIP. That there is the proof in the pudding regarding who and what they are. If you don't know what TTIP is and the danger it represents, read up on it.

    You know what the saddest thing about UKIP and the media circus that perpetuates its increasing popularity is? It's that it's diverting those people who have genuine grievances with the way the country and the world are being run away from the organisations and parties that actually might look to deal with the true causes.

    Look at the disparity in incomes and how now over a million people in the UK need to use food banks while zero hour contracts are given to people working at McDonalds and even Buckingham Palace while the average earnings of the so-called 1% are rising exponentially. Look at how people are rioting in the streets of Greece and Italy and how the unemployment rate for young people of a working age in Spain is over 50%. Look at who truly benefits.

    The current system is rotten but UKIP are libertarian mentalists who would privatize thin air if they could. And while their policies are driven by exploiting people's fears over immigration, their true loyalties lie with big business and it's big business that look to pay as little in wages as possible which fuels those slave wages for people both Brits and people coming from countries in the EU where median wages are even lower.

    The UK government spends huge amounts that don’t go into the economy. Sadly a great deal of that goes into the lemon economics of privatizing profits while socializing costs. The banks should have been allowed to fail for example. That would have been true free market economics but when the government and the economy is essentially run by politicians that are owned and run by corporate interests and financial institutions then what did you think was going to happen. Cameron and Farage both come from Banking and finance. They're part of the problem. Neither can offer a solution as they're not programmed to think how economies could be run in a different way.

    The Tories and Neo-Labour will not 'take us out of this' and a tribe of xenophobic buffoons too old and middle class for Britain First led by a banker wanker fox hunting enthusiast in a tweed jacket won't put a stop to the rot either.

    This system is broken and it needs fixing and squabbling over whether someone has the right to take that 5 quid an hour job cleaning the toilets at Tesco because they were born in Bucharest or whether Dai next door could actually work with his epilepsy because he can sit in the pub all day alright seems an awful waste of time and effort. Especially when it's a classic case of divide and conquer and deflection of people's focus away from the real issues.

    The superrich accumulate and accumulate, probably to buy space ships to take them and their families to that secret space station they’ve been building on Titan for when the Earth becomes too hot and toxic to live on.

    Anyway, I tell you what isn't a vote against all of the above, that's voting for a party full of failed, defected, and disgraced ex-Tory party politicians led by an ex Tory activist who's been quoted as saying that he's the only politician 'keeping the flame of Thatcherism alive.'

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke View Post
    She could argue in Court that Labour turning a blind eye to the mass paedo activity in Rotheram rendered them compliant, because they could have and should have stopped it .
    I really dont think that a Church leader at the centre of a huge paedo network which they are trying to cover up, would want any publicity that Court action would bring
    Wow, how have you come up with this conclusion? Even following your twisted guilt-by-association assertion, this is a looong way off.

    Logic and reasoning aren't your strong points.

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    I understand the point about UKIP being part of the establishment , and I think many people realise that too , but see it like this:
    In a way it doesn't matter how bad UKIP would be as a government or what their internal policies were. because after they left power we'd still have Britain, to change and start again .

    The way things are going at the moment we won't have a country, we will lose all control to Europe and will be flooded with another 7 million immigrants from the 2nd and third world .

    And its not far off either, the next big thing thing the European union will dictate is that is unlawful to have internal borders in Europe, they will argue its as illegal to have a border between France and England as England and Wales .
    Then the floodgates will really open and it's game over.

    If anyone can stop this they get my support, be it BNP UKIP or a General Idi Amin look alike.

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    Big business supports continued EU membership as it gives them a never ending supply of cheap labour. UKIP aren't against immigration or anti immigration, they are against mass uncontrolled immigration, they favour a points system as in something similar to Australia where basically you get skilled immigrants coming to the country who have something to offer as opposed to the free for all we have now which has turned the minimum wage into the maximum wage.

    At the end of the day UKIP are never going to be running the country so I along with many others couldn't really give a fuk what their policies may or may not be on any range of obscure issues that don't affect me in the slightest, I just want a referendum on EU membership and only way that is going to happen is if enough UKIP MPs get elected to force the issue, we have the vote then LibLabCon can get back to running the country which they should then find harder to fuk up being outside the EU.

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    Quote Originally Posted by neemo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke View Post
    She could argue in Court that Labour turning a blind eye to the mass paedo activity in Rotheram rendered them compliant, because they could have and should have stopped it .
    I really dont think that a Church leader at the centre of a huge paedo network which they are trying to cover up, would want any publicity that Court action would bring
    Wow, how have you come up with this conclusion? Even following your twisted guilt-by-association assertion, this is a looong way off.

    Logic and reasoning aren't your strong points.
    I was giving an example of what her defence could be , if the Church guy took legal action .
    You say that reasoning isnt my strong point . I gave a reason, you didnt give any reason why my reason was "way off" , you just said that it was , without giving a reason as to why

  19. #19
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    Leaving the EU... yeah that'll work

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    Okay I give up, I witnessed demonstrators in Rochester High street today. two white tribes arguing the toss, two groups that have nothing to do with the Election here on the 20 th November. Decided to front each other in Rochester High Street.
    News blackout, not reported on local Tele news Meridian.
    Will have to await Monday morning papers, to see if the News is going to be manipulated.
    Free expression in the U.K. only by authority.
    Last edited by wasabi; 02-11-2014 at 02:03 AM.

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    Of course they'll give it some publicity.. UKIP is the only viable alternative

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke View Post
    I was giving an example of what her defence could be , if the Church guy took legal action .
    You say that reasoning isnt my strong point . I gave a reason, you didnt give any reason why my reason was "way off" , you just said that it was , without giving a reason as to why
    No, you said: "I really dont think that a Church leader at the centre of a huge paedo network which they are trying to cover up, would want any publicity that Court action would bring" - there is nothing at all which points at this, no 'reason', you made it up, a moronic gutter smear, is this your 'style'?


    moron
    and one for the road

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    Quote Originally Posted by neemo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluke View Post
    I was giving an example of what her defence could be , if the Church guy took legal action .
    You say that reasoning isnt my strong point . I gave a reason, you didnt give any reason why my reason was "way off" , you just said that it was , without giving a reason as to why
    No, you said: "I really dont think that a Church leader at the centre of a huge paedo network which they are trying to cover up, would want any publicity that Court action would bring" - there is nothing at all which points at this, no 'reason', you made it up, a moronic gutter smear, is this your 'style'?


    moron
    I was referring to the Rotherham paedo network , which was what the UKIP person was referring too . I already stated that in my original post .
    Do try to follow the discussion , you fuckwit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo View Post
    Leaving the EU... yeah that'll work
    The EU needs the UK more than we need it, we are a net contributer to the club, we have a massive trade deficit with them, we are burdened with rules and regulations that make us uncompetitive, the unskilled are free to flood our country with the added burden that puts on the NHS, education system, housing etc. that we all pay for and basically is overwhelmed and at breaking point in many parts of the UK. What exactly does the UK gain from being a member of this club that we couldn't do better from being out of it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by buriramboy View Post
    we are burdened with rules and regulations that make us uncompetitive


    You've never worked in the EU have you? If you have you would know that the UK is far more deregulated than comparable EU countries.

    Whichever way the balance of trade is with the EU, the UK cannot be competitive without the EU market and will lose a huge part of it's exports to the EU, so how is that good for business..? Who are we going to sell all that extra stuff we're going to be able to produce to..?

    As for immigration, you do understand what Schengen is.? The free movement of EU citizens within the EU, and you do understand that the UK opted out of that agreement when it was implemented..? No? Well you do now..

    So how is the EU's fault we have so many immigrants..? It's not, we have them because the politicians and businesses in this country sold you the lie that it was good for the country, and you're probably one of the sheep that bought into it.

    Do yourself a favour BB and try thinking for yourself, instead of letting a bunch of political wingbats do it for you.

    Last edited by Neo; 02-11-2014 at 06:44 AM.
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