Thread: How dangerous is Vladimir Putin?

Originally Posted by OhOh

One wonders which countries exist where governments do not have such arrangements.The stone is rolling, with no moss stuck to it, so far.

Next stop the regions: Russian lawmakers approve final bill on amendments to constitution

"Russian legislators have given the final nod to a package of constitutional amendments proposed by President Vladimir Putin, which include giving sweeping new powers to parliament and tightening background checks on top officials. During the third and final reading in the State Duma on Wednesday, parliamentarians passed the bill amending Russia’s basic law in a 383-0 vote with 43 abstentions – all MPs from the opposition Communist Party.

The amendments then went to the upper house – the Federation Council – where 160 members voted yes, while one objected and three others abstained.

The only member of the body who voted no was the representative from the Irkutsk region Vyacheslav Markhaev, of the Communist Party. Three more abstained - Lyudmila Narusova (Tuva), Vasily Ikonnikov (Oryol Oblast) and Valery Usatyuk (Khakassia). The latter pair are also Communist Party members.

Now the law will be sent to the regions for their consideration: It must be supported by at least two-thirds of regional parliaments, according to the rules.

Assuming this is successful, the Federation Council is set to meet again on Saturday to approve these decisions.

Once the complex list of procedures is completed, Putin must then forward the proposed changes to the Constitutional Court, which will have seven days to decide whether or not they are contrary to Russia’s principal law. If the court green-lights the bill, it's scheduled be put to a nationwide vote on April 22, a one-off public holiday in Russia.

The constitutional amendments will come into effect if a majority of voters on the day support them. The president is then obliged to order the amended Constitution to be published, also setting the date when the entire document becomes valid.

The amendments involve, among other things, shifting some presidential powers to the Duma, restricting the president’s time in office to two overall terms, going forward, and banning officials from having foreign citizenship.

They also set the minimum wage above the basic cost of living, endorse traditional marriage between and a man and woman as solely legitimate and officially proclaim modern Russia the successor to the Soviet Union."

Next stop the regions: Russian lawmakers approve final bill on amendments to constitution — RT Russia News


It appears to be a 6 step process, of which two have been completed.

Step three requires two thirds of the regional parliaments agreement.

Step four requires the Russian Constitutional Court to decide they are not contrary to Russia's Principle Law.

Step five requires it be put to a nationwide vote on April 22, a one-off public holiday in Russia. (No mention of any requirement, so presumably 50+ %)

Step six the president is then obliged toorder the amended Constitution to be published and set the date for it's validity. ( One presumes the date could be before or after the date of the next required Presidential election.)

Amen

Originally Posted by OhOh

No finger pointing at others, no blame of foreigners. Just direction and planning. Compare and contrast in so many situations with the other alleged, "world leaders".

Most others don't either . . . you (and Klondyke) should stop insinuating all the time and just name them/say what's on your mind. It's neither clever nor mysterious, it just sounds rather dim. This is a discussion area . . . a written one, so your form of 'subtlety' doesn't translate

Originally Posted by OhOh

No finger pointing at others, no blame of foreigners. Just direction and planning. Compare and contrast in so many situations with the other alleged, "world leaders".

Indeed, that's what reasonable people understand and appreciate: caring for that what needs to be care for, without blaming others. Even in the difficult conditions imposed by others.

As somebody remarked here lately: he is the only adult in this situation.

Originally Posted by panama hat

Most others don't either . . . you (and Klondyke) should stop insinuating all the time and just name them/say what's on your mind. It's neither clever nor mysterious, it just sounds rather dim. This is a discussion area . . . a written one, so your form of 'subtlety' doesn't translate

The problem is that they live in their own little whacky world, so fuck knows what they're on about most of the time.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Most of the world's countries are not "world leaders". That rules out most of Asia, Africa, ME and South America along with the non-EU European countries.

Agree?

Depends on how you quantify it - still, just say what you are trying to cleverly be 'mysterious' about. As I said, a forum like this, or generally a written form of discourse, doesn't lend itself to insinuations . . . you said yourself that the best method of exchanging thoughts is sitting together with a beer . . . discussing.

Originally Posted by panama hat

you said yourself that the best method of exchanging thoughts is sitting together with a beer . . . discussing.

Fucking hell, are you having trouble sleeping PH?

If the Russians prefer a Czarist system of governance then let them have it. Democratic systems are messy and have their downsides, as well, but I am glad I chose to live in a country that nominally has that system (or at least pays lip service to it, mostly).

Unless, or until, humans get their shit together and form a one world government (democratically based, hopefully) then the untold suffering and inequity, wars and refugees, famines and exploitation, will continue.

Regardless of who is the leader of whichever powerful nation state is topic of the day, the world is f*cked for now.

To analyse the Putin phenomenon, you have to look at the situation following the collapse of the Berlin Wall, when Russia entered a period of virtual anarchy. I believe average male life expectancy dropped by close to a decade (puts this CV in perspective). Corruption, gangsterism and widespread alcoholism were the hallmarks of "newly democratic" Russia. The most successful of the corrupt, who played the cronyism game well, are todays Russian oligarchs. Others are dead. Putin, if I recall correctly, took over from that notorious drunk Boris Yeltsin.

In short, a strong leader was needed to sort the situation out, and get Russia back on track. No easy task, given the sheer size and diversity of that great nation, and the entrenched criminal networks rising to the very top. Enter Putin. He did so, and is credited with doing so by the Russian people. In the process, he restored their national pride. Hence his enduring popularity, which no western leader comes close to emulating. Naturally he has his enemies, and some of them have come to sticky ends, but they are far outnumbered by his fan club.

2018 Russian presidential election

Results

The final results of the elections were approved by the CEC on 23 March 2018.^[162]

Candidate		Party	Votes	%
	Vladimir Putin	Independent	56,430,712	76.69
	Pavel Grudinin	Communist Party	8,659,206	11.77
	Vladimir Zhirinovsky	Liberal Democratic Party	4,154,985	5.65
	Ksenia Sobchak	Civic Initiative	1,238,031	1.68
	Grigory Yavlinsky	Yabloko	769,644	1.05
	Boris Titov	Party of Growth	556,801	0.76
	Maxim Suraykin	Communists of Russia	499,342	0.68
	Sergey Baburin	Russian All-People's Union	479,013	0.65
Invalid/blank votes			791,258	1.08
Total			73,578,992	100.00
Registered voters/turnout			109,008,428	67.50

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Russian_presidential_election#Results

Vladimir Putin's approval rating in Russia 2000-2020

Published by Statista Research Department, Mar 11, 2020

In February 2020, 69 percent of Russians approved of activities of the Russian president Vladimir Putin. In the previous year, the rating sharply fell to 65 percent. One of the reasons behind the decline were the pension reform and a retirement age hike, named the major domestic event of the year.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/896181/putin-approval-rating-russia/


Down 7% after two years. Possibly enough for the Constitutional changes?

Originally Posted by sabang

To analyse the Putin phenomenon, you have to look at the situation following the collapse of the Berlin Wall, when Russia entered a period of virtual anarchy. I believe average male life expectancy dropped by close to a decade (puts this CV in perspective). Corruption, gangsterism and widespread alcoholism were the hallmarks of "newly democratic" Russia. The most successful of the corrupt, who played the cronyism game well, are todays Russian oligarchs. Others are dead. Putin, if I recall correctly, took over from that notorious drunk Boris Yeltsin.

In short, a strong leader was needed to sort the situation out, and get Russia back on track. No easy task, given the sheer size and diversity of that great nation, and the entrenched criminal networks rising to the very top. Enter Putin. He did so, and is credited with doing so by the Russian people. In the process, he restored their national pride. Hence his enduring popularity, which no western leader comes close to emulating. Naturally he has his enemies, and some of them have come to sticky ends, but they are far outnumbered by his fan club.

Putin is gold, and the best European leader out there

Originally Posted by sabang

Naturally he has his enemies, and some of them have come to sticky ends, but they are far outnumbered by his fan club.

Exactly the impression one can create when one controls the media, bans opposition gatherings, and executes critics.

Putin relies on the feeble minded to continue his autocracy and institutional theft.

Originally Posted by OhOh

2018 Russian presidential election

Results

The final results of the elections were approved by the CEC on 23 March 2018.^[162]

Candidate		Party	Votes	%
	Vladimir Putin	Independent	56,430,712	76.69
	Pavel Grudinin	Communist Party	8,659,206	11.77
	Vladimir Zhirinovsky	Liberal Democratic Party	4,154,985	5.65
	Ksenia Sobchak	Civic Initiative	1,238,031	1.68
	Grigory Yavlinsky	Yabloko	769,644	1.05
	Boris Titov	Party of Growth	556,801	0.76
	Maxim Suraykin	Communists of Russia	499,342	0.68
	Sergey Baburin	Russian All-People's Union	479,013	0.65
Invalid/blank votes			791,258	1.08
Total			73,578,992	100.00
Registered voters/turnout			109,008,428	67.50

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Russian_presidential_election#Results

Vladimir Putin's approval rating in Russia 2000-2020

Published by Statista Research Department, Mar 11, 2020

In February 2020, 69 percent of Russians approved of activities of the Russian president Vladimir Putin. In the previous year, the rating sharply fell to 65 percent. One of the reasons behind the decline were the pension reform and a retirement age hike, named the major domestic event of the year.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/896181/putin-approval-rating-russia/


Down 7% after two years. Possibly enough for the Constitutional changes?

Gullible twat.

Here's one of many videos of Putin's "Supporters" doing a bit of "voting".

. . . and how many people in the opposition were arrested, intimidated not to vote etc...

Putin has lost his edge, shouldn't it be a NK-style 99% . . . . ? Heads will roll . . . literally

Putin relies on the feeble minded to continue his autocracy and institutional theft.

Look at the national performance of Russia since he took office. I rest my case. Putin remains enormously popular.

You just read the yank book of utter bullshit Harry- and swallow it whole like a good guppy. Nah, Assad wasn't really elected, Náh- Crimea didn't really vote to rejoin Russia, náhhh neither Saddam, náhh nor Gaddafi, nor Putin, nahh nor Morales or Maduro or Chavez. Nahhh.

Yet in the Land of the Flee, the last two Republican Presidents have officially been elected with a democratic minority. Go figure.

Originally Posted by sabang

Look at the national performance of Russia since he took office. I rest my case. Putin remains enormously popular.

What on earth are you babbling on about?

"National performance"?

It's one of the most oil-rich countries in the world, and Putin and his oligarch buddies have been divvying up the proceeds for years.

Where did you get the popularity poll? Pravda?

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Where did you get the popularity poll? Pravda?

The newspaper ?

The Communist Party is not too keen on Putin, so I guess the poll could have some truth in it

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

What on earth are you babbling on about?

"National performance"?

Only an idiot (or an agent provocateur paid by TD to increase the clicks ) can question that considering the situation in Russia 30 years ago with their empty shelves and state coffers on brink of real bankruptcy, all valuable stolen by oligarchs protected by Western powers, when the huge armies had to pull out from occupied satellites, and much more.

And what is the situation today? When NASA cannot do anything without Russian spacecrafts, spending already zillions for their help? And that as a reward for all the sanctions?

The biggest asset of Russia is not the oil and gas but Putin.

That's all very well known to the population, they do not need to be massaged by the state propaganda as in (please no names here), they have their pride and brain seeing what's the best for them.

Whether they long to have such a showcase every day on their screens for electing another old man - very honorable - who can make their country Great Again?

Originally Posted by Klondyke

all valuable stolen by oligarchs protected by Western powers

Yea, and another brainfart . . . but keep going as we seldom see pure idiocy on display

Originally Posted by Klondyke

all valuable stolen by oligarchs protected by gangsters

FTFY

The rule of law in Russia is wielded as a weapon, not as a shield for the citizens.

No one appears to have anything like the percentage of Putin. Boris Nemtsov must have been close as he was shot near the Kremlin.
Nevalny cant be as close as Nemtsov. He has only been imprisoned and he and his families bank accounts have been frozen. He needs to increase his popularity if he wants to upgrade to assassination material like Nemtsov.

Originally Posted by Hugh Cow

No one appears to have anything like the percentage of Putin. Boris Nemtsov must have been close as he was shot near the Kremlin.

"must have been close" to Putin's percentage? On what ground is your claim? That even the Western Wikipedia would not say. Although supported by Jelcin (similarly as Putin originally was) and in high political positions in 1990's his vote percentage was not enough to get into parliament. Changed later to Ukraine to help then president Yuschenko, it did not work either. Nor his involvement with oil tycoons and with infamous Brezinsky, you can learn a lot what all he had tried...

Even for a mayor of Sochi before Winter Olympic he ended up with 14%, whilst it was won with 77%, very close?

His only achievement was opposition to Putin and support by Western big people (e.g. McCain), but what else he could offer?

There goes a story (among many others) about his assassination: It was known to him and to Navalnyj (and warning either) - that within next days is something going on against them. In fact, not by Putin, but as a "reward" by Chechen people for their support of the huge demonstration for "j' suis Charlie". Navalnyi took it seriously, organized pamflet showcase and let himself got jailed securely for 2 weeks. Not the proud guy Nemtsov, showing off his beautiful Ukraine girlfriend model ...

The assassins were caught within 2 weeks - quite a different time frame unlike many other famous assassins...

Who was their sponsor who paid them 15 mil. rubles, it's not really known, but guessed...

Originally Posted by Hugh Cow

No one appears to have anything like the percentage of Putin. Boris Nemtsov must have been close as he was shot near the Kremlin.
Nevalny cant be as close as Nemtsov. He has only been imprisoned and he and his families bank accounts have been frozen. He needs to increase his popularity if he wants to upgrade to assassination material like Nemtsov.

Oh I don't know.

The leaders of Vietnam, Cambodia and North Korea do pretty well.

They just don't have as much money to nick, so they rely on giving away their peoples land and resources for chinky backhanders.