Thread: Will the GOP Force a Govt Shutdown and/or Debt Default?

republicans are at it again....pushing the US economy towards the brink in an ill conceived plan that could only reap short term political gain.

essentially they're threatening to shut down the US govt and also default on the US debt because they don't like the health care law in the US.

one can only hope the adults in the GOP will eventually step in and put an end to this before it's too late.

a bit more background info:

Washington could be mere days away from a government shutdown – and a few weeks out from a catastrophic default on the national debt.But the reality of this looming fiscal crisis has many Americans wondering how we ever got ourselves into this mess. And, more importantly, what Congress can do over the coming days to avoid it.

We take a look at some of the questions that lawmakers are dealing with – and the possible answers.

What do Congress and the president need to do to meet these deadlines?First, Congress must pass a spending bill, called a continuing resolution or “CR,” which would continue spending after Sept. 30, the end of the 2013 fiscal year.

Republican House Speaker John Boehner speaks to the media Thursday, saying that the House will pass a plan that defunds the Affordable Care Act and addresses the budget.

If, as expected, the Senate rejects a House-passed CR that defunds Obamacare, then Speaker John Boehner might be forced to consider a “clean” CR with no provisions attached.

If he and Majority Leader Eric Cantor can’t find enough votes among their own members to pass a clean CR, they may seek Democratic votes to pass a measure which doesn’t include a “defund Obamacare” provision.
Obama and his spokesmen have repeatedly said he would not accept any resolution that would delay or defund Obamacare.

What happens if Congress doesn’t pass a spending bill?There would be a funding shortfall and the executive branch would begin a partial shutdown of federal operations.
Some workers would be furloughed and some agencies would suspend their functions.

What’s the debt limit and when is the deadline for that?Separate from the spending bill impasse is the fight over the debt limit. As it stands now, the government’s legal authority to borrow more money runs out in mid-October.
The congressionally mandated limit on federal borrowing is currently set at $16.7 trillion. The debt limit has been raised 13 times since 2001 and has grown from about 55 percent of Gross Domestic Product in 2001 to 102 percent of GDP last year.

What would happen if the debt limit were reached?At that point, the Treasury “would be left to fund the government with only the cash we have on hand on any given day,” said Treasury Secretary Jacob Lew.

Money from tax payments would still be coming in to the Treasury, but it would not be enough to pay each day’s bills. While some bills to vendors and others could be paid, they’d be paid late.

Investors holding Treasury securities might not get prompt re-payment of their principal when their bonds matured. That in turn could cause a downgrading of U.S. Treasury securities by bonds rating agencies.

Senator Dick Durbin, D-Ill., speaks on the Senate floor Thursday, explaining his view of the debt ceiling and the upcoming budget deadline.

According to the Bipartisan Policy Center, if that date arrived on October 18, the Treasury “would be about $106 billion short of paying all bills owed between October 18 and November 15 … .”

It estimated that about a third of the funds owed for the period would go unpaid.

more info found in the link below:

Shutdowns and debt limits: Making sense of the fiscal deadlines ahead - NBC Politics

^ I believe they will this time making themselves fodder in 2014.

The Republican Party is no longer capable of governing the nation. It's now a fanatical group run out of right-wing states by a cadre of nihilists, Know-nothings, and a handful of billionaires.
Why the Upcoming Shutdowns and Defaults Are Symptoms of a Deeper Republican Malady | Robert Reich

The loonies have well and truly taken over the GOP. Time to form a new political party I reckon, amerka.

You have to love the irony- the GOP claims they want to repeal the ACH, aka Obamacare, because they believe it will be bad for the US economy. How do they propose getting rid of Obamacare? By ruining the US economy...

Time to throw the bums out!!! Clay Bennet sums it up nicely in his latest political cartoon:

Originally Posted by sabang

The loonies have well and truly taken over the GOP. Time to form a new political party I reckon, amerka.

this is a tragedy for the left, as they could place anyone against those republican clowns and get away with it

A quote from the comments section of your commentary link, BM.

"Among the huge variety of opinions over Obamacare, there is only one thing we can say with absolute certainty about the people trying to defund Obamacare....they all have health insurance."


Most of the force behind the right wing is coming from old right wingers on social security and medicare. Socialist programs are good enough for them but not for the rest of the nation. Personally, I think if they were to pull Obamacare, social security and medicare and the rest of it should be pulled. Let the old folks pass as God intended. The government shouldn't be playing god with these socialist programs.

Well Ted is making a bigger and bigger ass out of himself..

Watching the pushback against Senator Ted Cruz right now is like watching a group of kids who have been in thrall to a bully suddenly wake up to who he is and start working to cut him down to size. Republican members of Congress who were once his allies have begun to turn on a man who has become an outsize figure in their party since winning office less than one year ago.

“As soon as we listed Ted Cruz as our featured guest this week, I got unsolicited research and questions, not from Democrats but from top Republicans, to hammer Cruz,” Fox News Sunday host Chris Wallace said on his show. "Why are Republicans so angry at Ted Cruz?"

"You cannot build a congressional majority, in either party, for any kind of action, unless you are treating your colleagues with some certain amount of respect, and saying, ‘Hey, what do you think of my idea?’” Karl Rove told Wallace, speaking of Cruz and Utah Senator Mike Lee, who are together leading the Don't Fund Obamacare movement. “Instead they have dictated to their colleagues ... and not consulted them about this strategy at all.”

The dynamics of the last-ditch effort to try to derail the implementation of the health-insurance exchanges set to open for enrollment on October 1 have pitted House Republicans against Senate ones and all but ensured Republicans will take the blame for any government shutdown, since they are the ones who will have to cause it or else watch Obamacare funding go through.

The congressional dynamics at play here are complicated and hard to communicate to a general public that's not versed in parliamentary procedure, leaving Cruz and Lee calling on voters to call their senators to ask them to block "cloture," or limiting debate on the budget bill in the Senate. Except it's not even a proper budget bill but a continuing resolution to maintain current levels of spending for the next two and a half months. Calling for GOP senators to "in effect, filibuster the House-passed continuing resolution in the Senate," as Roll Call described it, could shut down the government when the fiscal year ends on September 30 at midnight, if the Senate cannot pass a budgetary extension before then.

"If you caught Sens. Ted Cruz (R-Tex.) or Mike Lee (R-Utah) on the Sunday talk shows, you would quickly realize that these two have absolutely no idea what they are doing," concluded conservative columnist Jennifer Rubin. "Lee’s and Cruz’s insistence that they are the ones 'fighting' is belied by the facts. They are actually intent on running into a concrete wall again and again to prove their political machismo. For many Republicans this isn’t bravery but stupidity."

Not only that, what Cruz and others are calling "defunding Obamacare" won't actually end it, as the more than three-year-old Affordable Care Act is already partially implemented, has been upheld by the Supreme Court, and will remain in effect, slowly changing the health-care financing system nationwide.

"It's not honest to call on Republicans to defund Obamacare because it's not achievable," observed former George W. Bush communication director Nicolle Wallace on MSNBC's Morning Joe.

The comments by Rove and Wallace are particularly interesting in light of revelations in Jason Zengerle's GQ profile of Cruz that Bush-world aides sidelined him after the 2000 campaign because of his off-putting personal style:

Ted Cruz blew his first big shot in politics. Back in 2000, he had scored a plum assignment working in the policy shop of George W. Bush's Austin-based presidential campaign. He distinguished himself in the weeks after the election, serving on the legal team that helped Bush win the Florida recount and, by extension, the White House. He seemed destined for a meaty job in the new administration.

But Cruz's personal style earned him many detractors in BushWorld. He was infamous for firing off mundane work e-mails in the middle of the night — it happened so often that some in the Bush campaign suspected him of writing them ahead of time and programming his computer to send while he was asleep. He was also known for dispatching regular updates on his accomplishments that one recipient likened to "the cards people send about their families at Christmas, except Ted's were only about him and were more frequent." When it came time to divvy up the spoils of victory, many of Cruz's campaign colleagues headed to the White House; Cruz went to Washington, too — but he was exiled to the outer Siberia of the Federal Trade Commission.

It was the continuation of a pattern of being self-promoting and self-interested to the point of being uncollegial, Zengerle observes. "As a law student at Harvard, he refused to study with anyone who hadn't been an undergrad at Harvard, Princeton, or Yale," he reported.

There's one group happy with Cruz's anti-Obamacare performance: The activists who have been working for years to try to defund, replace, or repeal the president's law to expand the availability of health insurance. More than 1.5 million have signed on to Cruz's "Don't Fund It" petition.

How Unpopular Is Ted Cruz Right Now? - Garance Franke-Ruta - The Atlantic

Originally Posted by Boon Mee

Confused again aren't we? There won’t be a shutdown unless Obama vetoes the budget.

Obama’s ego has put him in another dangerous “red line” situation and we know how those sort of situations turn out, don't we?

Perhaps Obama can ring up Putin and get some realistic advice?

This is an opinion piece of trash written by a far right repubtard from Tennessee. His point is a moot one because the ACA is the law of the land. This clown is trying to have a debate that has already ended just like Ted Cruz is doing with his futile filibuster.

It is people like this that have wasted valuable time trying 42 times to repeal the ACA. Negotiating with people like this is a waste of time.

Well, one thing I'm sure y'all will agree on is America's Ruling Class shouldn't be exempted from Obamacare which is one of Ted's points. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Originally Posted by youneverknow

Cruz’ speech cannot be officially considered a “filibuster” unless it delays Senate business. In this case, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) has already locked in a vote for Wednesday morning. That can only be stopped if 41 senators object, which is highly unlikely.

exactly.

this is not a filibuster...just a pathetic attempt by rafael at saving face (with a dollop of grandstanding). however, i have no doubt that in the very near future the revisionist teabaggers will try to label this as a filibuster.

this goes nowhere, and everyone serious knows it.

Fanatics are America's problem.

Stop worrying. On the last day the GOP will approve, and Obame move some more wealth from the working man to the rich.

ronald reagan has a message from the grave on the debt ceiling for ted cruz, john boehnher and the rest of the GOP:

the quotes in the video below are taken directly from his diary and a radio address to the nation




doesn't the GOP worship at the altar or st. ronnie anymore?

^
Thank you for that.

I wonder why it isn't on any of the newscasts...?

GOP Grows A Pair For Now: DELAY OBAMACARE OR WE WILL SHUT IT DOWN.



House Republicans will vote to pass a one-year delay of Obamacare in exchange for funding the government, a plan that drastically increases the chances of a government shutdown this Tuesday.
The decision was announced by the GOP leadership in a closed meeting Saturday afternoon, according to sources present. Republicans will also pass a separate bill to fund U.S. troops if the government shuts down, GOP lawmakers said. The House’s funding measure will keep the government open until mid-December.

Additionally, Republicans will adopt a “conscience clause” that delays until 2015 an Obamacare requirement that employers cover birth control as part of their health-insurance packages.
The move puts Senate Democrats and the White House at loggerheads with House Republicans, a standoff that could lead to the first government shutdown since 1995.

Government shutdown: House delays Obamacare as shutdown nears - POLITICO.com

It's funny, when Alan Grayson was in his first term and did that presentation (the GOP "don't get sick" and "die quickly" strategy), he was roundly criticized even by liberals for overstating the GOP's position. Turns out he had it completely right, and he didn't even go far enough. Now the GOP's strategy is "even though there is something in place that will cost less in the long run AND let you see a doctor, we hate Obama so much that we would rather have children die than let this plan go into action".

Originally Posted by quimbian corholla

we hate Obama so much that we would rather have children die than let this plan go into action".

Hyperbole or what?

"The Plan" is crap and we all know it. Needs major reworking to get it right then we'll 'save the children' even better.

Originally Posted by Boon Mee

Needs major reworking to get it right then we'll 'save the children' even better.

OK, fair point. What is the GOP alternative proposal?

Yeah, there isn't one. Obamacare is the GOP proposal, they just can't stand the fact that the guy who got it passed has a (D) after his name.

Originally Posted by quimbian corholla

Originally Posted by Boon Mee

Needs major reworking to get it right then we'll 'save the children' even better.

OK, fair point.

major reworking?

nonsense. of course their are minor glitches with a program of this size and scope...everyone serious expected as much...that's why the roll out begins Oct 1 and the actual insurance doesn't begin until jan 1.

and speaking of nonsense.....what is the GOP end game in all this brinksmanship? can someone explain to me what gets them to victory? what is it that they realistically can hope to acheive by shutting down the govt or defaulting on the debt. don't tell me it has anything to do with delaying or killing the ACA, because for any number of reasons, that is NEVER going to happen. despite rafa cruz lying about its possibility everyday on TV, it's pure fantasy.

this whole thing just comes across as the far right having a temper tantrum on the world stage....and it's all going to end in tears when they get nothing for it.......in fact, it will likely cost them multiple seats in the house and there is a small chance they'll lose the majority.

The funniest part of all of this is that even in a shutdown, the ACA still gets funded.

The Republicans are correct, however, in one single aspect: the Affordable Care Act will cause substantial economic hardship if it is neither repealed nor defunded because their position is based upon the undeniable fact that the Republican party will intentionally crash the economy if the Act is neither repealed nor defunded.

You gotta ask yourself why is Obama shutting down the Government? Why does this clown make these explicit threats to veto whatever the GOP sends him? His arrogance. His ego or his just plain stupidity...

The intransigence is all on the Democrat side btw... The White House announced this evening that it would veto any bill that includes a Republican proposal to delay Obamacare implementation and repeal a medical device tax.

Sure sounds like a job-killer to the most objective observer...

Originally Posted by Boon Mee

You gotta ask yourself why is Obama shutting down the Government?

You live in a fantasy world.