Phillipines : Bishops want debate with Cabral on condoms

Bishops want debate with Cabral on condoms
03/07/2010

After engaging her in a brief word war last month, Philippine Catholic bishops have challenged Health Secretary Esperanza Cabral to a debate on the effectiveness of condoms in bringing down human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) and Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome (AIDS) cases.

Lipa (Batangas) Archbishop Ramon Arguelles and Caloocan Bishop Deogracias Iñiguez Jr. also accused the Health Department of hiding the truth about condom failures.

In an article on the Union of Catholic Asian News website, Arguelles said CBCP lawyer Jo Aurea Imbong and pro-life activist Dr. Ligaya Acosta coul present data in the debate.

Arguelles is vice chairman of the CBCP Episcopal Commission on Family and Life (ECFL).

Last month, Catholic bishops demanded Cabral’s resignation after the Health Department distributed condoms during Valentine’s Day. The DOH said this was to prevent HIV-AIDS infection.

But Cabral shot back, saying there is a separation of Church and State. She also said the Church is partly to blame for blocking AIDS-prevention efforts.

“Masasabi ko na bigo dahil di kumpleto ang ating programa dahil sa malaking pagtutol ng sektor ng simbahan sa third component sa prevention ng HIV-AIDS, at ito ang paggamit ng condom (I can say our program to prevent HIV-AIDS because the Church is blocking the third component of our program, which is to encourage the use of condoms)," Cabral said in a radio interview.

For her part, Acosta – a former DOH official and now executive director of Human Life International – claimed the DOH is not telling the whole truth about condom use.

She claimed surveys of the United Nations and International Planned Parenthood Foundation show that condom is safe only 70-percent effective in preventing sexually transmitted disease.

“According to several surveys, 30-35 percent of latex condoms allowed sperm to get through and the HIV virus is 450 times smaller," Acosta said.

She said testing of condoms was conducted under unreal conditions that do not provide for the impact of hard physical sex.

Prolonged usage actually increases the possibility of HIV cases, she added.

But UN family planning experts refuted her claims.

“The fact is that when condoms are properly used, in conjunction with programs encouraging abstinence and fidelity to one partner, they provide effective protection against HIV/AIDS transmission," Thoraya Ahmed Obaid, executive director of the UN Population Fund, had said in response to previous Vatican claims that condoms do not protect people from HIV.

Acosta also criticized the DOH’s approach of preventing HIV by teaching abstinence, faithfulness of spouses as well as condom use.

“If you use a condom and you do not have to worry about HIV, why would you need A and B?" she said, referring to DOH’s ABC (abstinence, be faithful, condom use) of HIV prevention.

She criticized strategies such as the United Nations Program on AIDS/HIV, which she said were pouring millions of dollars to push their “anti-life agenda."

Acosta ‘sympathizes’ with Cabral

Acosta, in an interview on Church-run Radio Veritas, claimed she sympathizes with Cabral for her supposed lack of knowledge on the issue.

“I really sympathize with her. She is so ignorant of the issue. I think she should have studied first before becoming secretary of health. She should have concentrated first on her private practice. What she is saying is very embarrassing," Acosta said in the interview, excerpts of which were posted on the CBCP news site.

Acosta also noted Cabral had stated the Philippines should decrease its fertility rate to 1.3%.

“She doesn’t know that 1.3 is a dying level? So, there are many countries in the world, which is below replacement level. According to the United Nations the replacement level should be 2.1 for the population to survive. A married woman should at least give birth to more than 2," she said.

She added money running to billions of dollars is being poured in condom campaign, saying this may be why the DOH is very eager to distribute it.

But according to a research study Acosta said, 52 per cent of those who use condoms have confirmed that condoms have pores which are big enough to allow the sperm to pass through it.

“Hence, the breaking of condom will cause viruses like herpes which can be found all over the genital area," she added.

Acosta then said that Thailand and Africa are some of the countries with the highest rate of AIDS because these countries also have the highest demand for condoms.

“Nagpopondo talaga ng billions of money ang mga bansang ito para sa condoms kaya sila ang may pinakamataas na kaso ng HIV AIDS sa mundo" (These countries spend billions of money on condoms and yet they have also the highest incidence of HIV AIDS in the world), she said.

gmanews.tv

Gotta love religion...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mid

Acosta also noted Cabral had stated the Philippines should decrease its fertility rate to 1.3%. “She doesn’t know that 1.3 is a dying level? So, there are many countries in the world, which is below replacement level. According to the United Nations the replacement level should be 2.1 for the population to survive. A married woman should at least give birth to more than 2," she said.

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That 2.1 would apply to a population with a balance of old and young. in Countries like the Philippines where the vast majority is very young 2.1 children per couple would mean almost a doubling of the population in one generation. Only then the growth would level off.

You can see that in China. Even with a one child policy in place already since 1978 the population is still growing. The Chinese Government is planning to keep it in place for another decade.

China One Child Policy

They should start to use them too, however I just doesnt looks too good if the Priest in front of you at Tescos smiles at your son and then pays for some condoms. And no it doesnt helps if he turns around and tells me its not for him but for the Arch Bishop

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cenovis

They should start to use them too, however I just doesnt looks too good if the Priest in front of you at Tescos smiles at your son and then pays for some condoms. And no it doesnt helps if he turns around and tells me its not for him but for the Arch Bishop

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According to the article cited in the OP, they actually claim use of condoms increases the AIDS-risk and that is the reason why AIDS is so prevalent in Thailand.

Quote:

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Prolonged usage actually increases the possibility of HIV cases
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Acosta then said that Thailand and Africa are some of the countries with the highest rate of AIDS because these countries also have the highest demand for condoms.

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Sigh

This is just the kind of crap so often purported by the Catholic church with its arrogant, bigoted uniformed and ridiculous doctrines.
Neither Archbishop Ramon Arguelles and Caloocan Bishop Deogracias Iñiguez Jr. need look very far to see the reliability and effectiveness of use of condoms, Thailand being one notable examplle if these two idiots would wake up from their self-induced coma!

Quote:

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But according to a research study Acosta said, 52 per cent of those who use condoms have confirmed that condoms have pores which are big enough to allow the sperm to pass through it.

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I wonder just who these 52 percent are and just how they know that to be the case? Are they using a magnifying act before the act or indulging in a new kind of sex game that most of us have never head of? Little doubt this just some muddled-headed statement contrived to justify her already baseless statements. Acosta should also read up on few facts; the high rate of AIDS in any country is largely attributable to the lack of use.

One of the many things that makes Thailand so good is that it is not infested by the Catholic Church or the schizophrenia of Christianity.

Here we go again. The good catholics using HIV as an excuse for non use of contraception in order that more people will be born and provide more funds for one of the biggest empires on earth.

Whilst it seems that many of their their divine preachers have abused kids with none or little retribution.

Condom debate brought to Philippine bishops’ doorstep
Leila Salaverria
Philippine Daily Inquirer
09-03-2010

They came bearing condoms.

Members of a workers group Monday (March 8) brought the condom debate to the doorstep of Filipino Catholic bishops, in a bid to convince the prelates that prophylactics protect the health of women.

Carrying baskets with inflated condoms and flowers, members of Partido ng Manggagawa (PM, Party of Workers) gathered Monday at the gates of the Catholic Bishops’ Conference of the Philippines (CBCP) in Intramuros, Manila, to ask the bishops to bless the rubbers.

But not one of the Catholic bishops was available to meet with PM members. Instead, the group submitted a copy of a position paper supporting the government’s distribution of condoms to curb the spread of HIV-AIDS.

The CBCP continues to object to the program because it believes it encourages promiscuity and weakens the moral fiber of the youth.

PM secretary-general Judy Ann Miranda said the mass action was timed to coincide with Women’s Day observed worldwide Monday.

“We humbly asked the bishops to bless the condoms as a conciliatory gesture (for everyone) to unite for reproductive health and women’s rights,” Miranda said in a statement.

The group supported the distribution of condoms because it would allow women to space their children and safeguard their health.

Right to health

In its position paper, PM said women, especially the poor, have an unmet need for effective contraception, which remains unfulfilled because of Church opposition.

“Reproductive health is a woman’s (right) yet her choice has always been challenged by institutions based on moral standards,” the PM said.

“Contrary to the Catholic Church’s pronouncements that this is a moral issue, the distribution of condoms to address the spread of HIV-AIDS is a reproductive health concern that should be addressed through widespread education and the provision of appropriate social services,” it added.

Abortion study

PM cited a 2005 study on induced abortion in the Philippines which showed that one out of two married women who did not want children right away or who did not want to have any more children were not using contraceptives.
“This means that women and men want to limit the number of children but do not have the means to do so,” the workers group said.

It added that those in poorer communities could not afford to buy condoms because food took precedence over contraceptives. The price of one condom was the same as a pack of noodles.

The group also accused the Catholic Church and a pro-life group of trying to muddle the issue of condom distribution by discrediting the prophylactics’ effectiveness in preventing HIV-AIDS.

Church won’t change

It added that a study showed that condoms were 80-percent effective against HIV-AIDS with constant use and the 20-percent failure rate was because people used them incorrectly.

Sought for comment, CBCP spokesperson Msgr. Pedro Quitorio said the CBCP would not be changing its stand.

“If the Church teaches that contraceptives are immoral, nothing can change that. Not even the vote of the whole country can change that,” he said.

asianewsnet.net

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mid

Sought for comment, CBCP spokesperson Msgr. Pedro Quitorio said the CBCP would not be changing its stand. “If the Church teaches that contraceptives are immoral, nothing can change that. Not even the vote of the whole country can change that,” he said.

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True but it can and will make the churches position irrelevant because people increasingly don't buy it any more.

Philippine leader resolute in contraceptives row
Sat Oct 2

https://teakdoor.com/images/smilies1/You_Rock_Emoticon.gif
Philippine President Benigno Aquino has sought dialogue with the powerful Catholic church amid a row …
AFP/File

MANILA (AFP) – Philippine President Benigno Aquino on Saturday sought dialogue with the powerful Catholic church amid a row over birth control, but stressed he would not back down in his support for contraceptives.

Aquino also sought to downplay the row with the Catholic Bishops Conference of the Philippines, which he said was played up by the free-wheeling press.

"We have set a dialogue with the bishops," Aquino told reporters, but said the exact date for the meeting with bishops was still being finalised by his office.

The bishops, who wield considerable influence in the largely Catholic country, two days ago said Aquino may be excommunicated because of his pro-contraceptive position.

The debate began after Aquino said his government would support giving contraceptives to couples if they asked for them as part of family planning efforts to curb a high population growth rate.

Aquino reiterated on Saturday that he would support a reproductive health bill in Congress that called for state funding of contraceptives.

"My stand has not changed, the state has an obligation to educate all of its citizens as to their choices," he said.

"The state not (been) empowered by any law to dictate upon any couple how they should plan their family."

The church considers contraceptives as a form of abortion, and has in the past campaigned against public officials supporting them.

The bishops are often seen as providing moral guidance from the pulpit and remain politically influential as well because 80 percent of the population belong to the Catholic faith.

Aquino's challenge to the church has been welcomed by birth control advocates, who have pressed the need to trim the country's population growth rate, which is among the world's highest.

news.yahoo.com

Sometimes Catholics remind me of Muslims. Their way or the highway.

Philippine Catholic Church Backs Down
Wednesday, 06 October 2010

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Bishops deny threat to excommunicate President Aquino over birth control flap

Having ignited a firestorm of protest, the Catholic Church appears to be backing away from a veiled threat to excommunicate President Benigno Aquino III for his statement of support for families who opt for birth control, saying a top church leader's comments were misunderstood.

The incident is both a graphic reminder of the church's hold over the Filipino population and an indication that that hold may be weakening. For years, the church has kept a reproductive rights bill bottled up in the Congress, threatening to campaign against anybody who votes for it and in a couple of cases succeeding in driving proponents from politics.

But at a time when Filipinos seem to be flocking to a variety of evangelical sects instead of the mother church, the support given the bill by several protestant churches could also further erode the Roman Catholic dominion.

Public protest over this latest incident has been widespread. After a statement by Bishop Nereo Odchimar, president of the Catholic Bishops' Conference of the Philippines (CBCP), that Aquino could be denied the church's blessing, the Philippines' scrappy radio stations came alive with demands that the church get out of politics.

Also, in a reference to a corrupt Spanish friar named Padre Domaso from Jose Rizal's novel Noli Me Tangere, who fathered a daughter, supporters of the reproductive health bill have been printing up T-shirts with the word "Damaso" as a protest. One activist disrupted mass at Manila Cathedral by going in dressed as Rizal and holding a up a sign saying "Damaso."

Critics have also thronged Facebook and other online sites as well.

"The anachronistic historically irrelevant Catholic Bishops Conference of the Philippines is becoming increasingly isolated in its opposition to the RH bill which polls show is favored by at least 71 percent of the population," one wrote. Another wrote that "a coalition of churches and faith-based organizations in the Philippines has given their support for House Bill 5043, also known as the Reproductive Health Bill, which seeks to address the high population and worsening poverty in the Philippines through the promotion of reproductive health."

Odchimar later denied having threatened the president, despite the fact that in an interview with the church-run Radio Veritas, he mentioned the possibility that Aquino could face excommunication should he push for the use of artificial contraceptives.

The church wanted to address reproductive health issues "in the spirit of dialogue and not confrontation," Odchimar said. "While the prevailing sentiment of a number of bishops was that of dismay and frustration over the reported stance of the President regarding artificial contraceptives, imposition of the canonical sanction has not been contemplated by the CBCP."

Monsignor Pedro Quitero, the CBCP's media director, told reporters that Odchimar was "misunderstood somewhere."

It is estimated by the Guttmacher Institute in the United States that in defiance of the church, as many as half a million women in the Philippines each year undergo abortions and that millions more use artificial birth control methods. However, millions more want to avail themselves of the means to control the number of children they bear and newspapers are rife with stories of expectant mothers who throw themselves down stairs in attempts to miscarry. Anecdotal evidence indicates that women whose mothers had as many as eight children are now opting to have perhaps just one or two, particularly in urban areas.

Interestingly, prominent economist Dr Bernardo Villegas, a devout Catholic and opponent of birth control legislation, estimated that the National Statistical Coordination Board had overestimated the number of babies counted during the 2000 census by nearly 150,000 on the assumption that the Philippine population pyramid would continue to grow instead of starting to turn inverted, as it has in other Asian countries. The United Nations Population Commission, Villegas wrote, estimates the Philippine population rate at somewhere between 1.6 to 1.8 percent annually.

Nonetheless, the country still has one of the highest birth rates in Asia. The 2010 population is estimated at 94.01 million, up from 76.5 million in the 2000 census, making it the 12th most populous nation in the world.

During an interview last week with the Philippines Inquirer, Deputy Presidential Spokesperson Abigail Valte reiterated that President Aquino is for responsible parenthood and does not favor any one form of family planning. "It's the state's duty to provide assistance to couples who made the informed choice whether it be for natural family planning or for artificial family planning," she said.

Aquino has said he has not changed his position to provide couples an informed choice in planning their families. "We are all guided by our consciences," he said in a statement. "The state's duty is to educate our families as to their responsibilities and to respect their decisions if they are in conformity to our laws."

As Asia Sentinel reported in November 2009, proponents of the reproductive health bill, called "An Act Providing For National Policy On Reproductive Health, Responsible Parenthood and Population Development and For Other Purposes" got further than they ever had before, with about 100 of the 238 members of the House of Representatives saying they backed the bill.

Gloria Macapagal Arroyo, the former president, was an opponent of birth control and was staunchly backed by the bishops, who helped to drive her predecessor, Joseph Estrada, from office in 2001. Under her administration, supplies of public-sector contraception services dropped steeply. In addition, the administration of US President George W Bush prodded the United States Agency for International Development to stop providing free family planning supplies to the government.

Arroyo is now in the House of Representatives and can be expected to continue to oppose the bill. But many political observers say much of her power has melted away. Certainly, her advertised plans to take over the speakership of the house and continue her political sway were thwarted.

asiasentinel.com

Can I just say fuck the pope? After all, he is an ex nazi youth member masquerading as the protector of paedophiles the world over.

Why anyone listens to these c**ts is beyond me, they're just leeches.