Thai Wife's travel history; kibosh on UK vistor visa?

Going to ask a question that I probably, sadly, know the answer.

Sometime in the future, probably end of 2023, I'd like to come back to the UK prior to a permanent relocation to Thailand; clear ot my house, get it sold, settle my affairs. My Thai wife has said she'd like to come and see England, so I thought a 6 month "holiday", see the place, help me out.

But, there is an obvious spanner in the works. Its become clear, before I knew her, she and some of her pals (they were all looking for work), went on a jaunt to Malaysia to illegally work "because everyone did it". Well, she didn't last long in Malaysia, and was picked up on the first day, handcuffs slapped on, 12 hours shock in a Malaysian cell, and deportation, with a 5 year ban. I personally think the Malaysians did her a favour. It evidently shocked her, and she wasn't going to do it again. She could have gotten in far worse trouble than simply crossing the Malaysian police. Her former boss, herself former Thai police, told me about this, and thought the whole thing was rather funny ("silly girls", though none of them were young).

This was within the last 10 years; she was divorced but her passport was in her married name.

UK Visitor visa application includes travel history in the last 10 years. I suppose being thrown out of Malaysia for illegal entry, no matter how contrite you are, effectively puts paid to any successful Visa application, and it wouldn't matter that she has her own Thai business (a shop) now.

I have absolutely no idea. Does she use the same name on her current passport? Probably worth a try if it isn't..

I don't know but the British Embassy or Consul will, give them a ring before you buy tickets.

o2 305 8333

Hi, I'm a Filipino citizen, so similar passport standing to your Thai wife. I haven't been to the UK but have successfully obtained Schengen & USA visitor visas. In the online application form, there's always a question "Have you been convicted of a crime?" Answer yes/no, then if yes, give details.

My answer was "no". I believe that if the answer is "yes" it would significantly decrease the chances of being granted a visa.

For US visa, I had a colleague who was denied even if he had all the right documents. The consul said during the interview that he didn't show enough ties to his home country (even if he had a stable job & car). He's a single guy in his early 30s, has a mom living in the US.

All the best & good luck.

My wifes mate a lao girl has been in Europe many times and despite learning German couldn't get a visa to stay. I think because her boyfriends divorce from a German lady was complicated. Recently she applied for an Australian tourist visa but was knocked back. The reason given was we don't think you will return to lao. She has a chicken breeding farm in Laos and is about 30. She's a sweetheart and a stunner so maybe they thought she might raise to many cocks.

I think her current passport will reflect that it was issued in replacement of the former document and they might want to have sight of that which will doubtless bear some sort of Mys immigration stamp reflecting her deportation. If not and her current passport is virgin then keeping quiet might be a better option.
Her application to accompany you hinges on the demonstrable strength of your relationship and that the marriage is registered and not simply a custom arrangement. Also, you would need to demonstrate your intended return to Thailand and settlement is genuine and the plan to return to UK with wife is not some clandestine attempt to establish a de facto residence in Blighty not possible otherwise. So, demonstration of adequate funds will be required in addition to evidence of settlement in Thailand.

The details you have given of your circumstances are quite scant and so any advice cannot be properly tailored to your likely prospects. Her previous breach is less important than her current status which has radically changed. The Brits are only concerned about one thing, will she do what you both say she will do.
You need to give more information.

SA makes good points re intention to return, the irony if she entered by inflatable she would get a free a hotel and at least 6 months as an "asylum seeker" as present processing time is very long. Also a slim chance of a bonus excursion to Hotel Rwanda.

I would never lie on a visa form as it may preclude all future visits if revealed, up to you.

There is no way the UK can access the information regarding your partners Malaysian escapade.

Make the application, say nothing about it and I would wager that all will be well.

To expose this issue to UK Immigration will result in a refusal of entry, therefore omitting the incident is your logical option.

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Visiting the UK


Applying for a visa
The UK Border Agency considers applications for permission to enter or stay in the United Kingdom through their visa services around the world. Visit their website to apply for a visa to come to the UK.

Application form
On the application form(s), the questions are:

Do you have any criminal convictions either in the UK or overseas (you must include spent and unspent convictions as well as traffic offences)?”

In the guidance notes, it states:

Please give details of the date and place (country) of the offence and what you were convicted of. Please state what sentence you received. To assist your application, you may want to supply documentary evidence of the conviction (e.g. the official record) detailing the crime you were convicted of and the sentence you received.”

A further question is:

Have you ever been charged in any country with a criminal offence for which you have not yet been tried in court (including traffic offences)?”

The Declaration section states:

I am aware that it is an offence under the Immigration Act 1971 (as amended) to make a statement which I know to be false, or not believe to be true, in order to obtain a visa/entry clearance to the UK. I am also aware that my application will be automatically refused and I may be banned from going to the UK for 10 years if I use a false document, lie or withhold relevant information. I may also be banned if I have breached immigration laws in the UK. I am further aware that should I use a false document, lie or withhold relevant information my details may be passed to law enforcement agencies.”



Overseas Criminal Record Certificate

From April 2015, the Home Office introduced a new ruling requiring applicants to provide an overseas criminal record certificate from any country they have lived in continuously for 12 months or more over the past 10 years. The requirement will be introduced in phases and will start with Tier 1 (Investor and Entrepreneur) applicants and their adult dependants. By starting with a small category of applicants the Home Office believe that they will be able to successfully monitor and evaluate the implementation of the policy. This requirement will apply to all applications submitted on or after 1st September 2015.

From March 2017, the requirement to provide a criminal record certificate was extended to Tier 2 (General) applicants coming to work in education, health and social care sectors and their adult dependants. You can only apply for a Tier 2 (General) visa if you’ve been offered a skilled job in the UK and you’re from outside the European Economic Area and Switzerland.

A criminal record certificate will be required for applicants working in:

Education, for example teachers, education advisers and school inspectors
Healthcare, for example nurses, doctors, managers, pharmacists, dentists, ophthalmic opticians
Therapy, for example psychologists, speech and language therapists
Social services, for example social workers, managers, probation officers.
You can find the full Standard Occupation Classification Codes here.

Certificates will also be required from partners applying from overseas, on or after 6 April 2017 who want to join an existing Tier 2 (General) visa holder working in one of the above sectors.

The requirement may be waived where it is deemed not “reasonably practicable” to obtain a certificate, such as if a country or authority does not produce such documents.

Updated policy guidance on Tier 1 (Investor) and Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) was published in April 2016. For questions or enquiries please refer to the UK Visa and Immigration.

Refusal on the grounds of criminal convictions – Immigration rules part 9
The following information is extracted from the Gov.UK website, making reference to the Immigration Rules.

Grounds on which entry clearance or leave to enter the UK is to be refused

Paragraph 320(2) of the Rules states that an application should normally be refused if:-

The person seeking entry to the United Kingdom:

is currently the subject of a deportation order; or
has been convicted of an offence for which they have been sentenced to a period of imprisonment of at least 4 years; or
has been convicted of an offence for which they have been sentenced to a period of imprisonment of at least 12 months but less than 4 years, unless a period of 10 years has passed since the end of the sentence; or
has been convicted of an offence for which they have been sentenced to a period of imprisonment of less than 12 months, unless a period of 5 years has passed since the end of the sentence.
Where this paragraph applies, unless refusal would be contrary to the Human Rights Convention or the Convention and Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees, it will only be in exceptional circumstances that the public interest in maintaining refusal will be outweighed by compelling factors.

Paragraph 320(18A) of the Rules states that an application should normally be refused if within the 12 months prior to the date on which the application is decided, the person has been convicted of or admitted an offence for which they receive a non-custodial sentence or other out of court disposal that is recorded on their criminal record.

Paragraph 320(18B) of the Rules states that an application should normally be refused if in the view of the Secretary of State:

the person’s offending has caused serious harm; or
the person is a persistent offender who shows a particular disregard for the law.
Paragraph 320(19) of the Rules states that an application should normally be refused if the immigration officer deems the exclusion of the person from the United Kingdom to be conducive to the public good. For example, because the person’s conduct (including convictions which do not fall within paragraph 320(2), character, associations, or other reasons, make it undesirable to grant them leave to enter.



Useful links
Below you will find links to useful websites relating to this page.

UK Border Agency – Check if you need a UK Visa
UK Visa and Immigration
More information
For practical information – More information on coming to (and staying) in the UK
To discuss this issue with others – Read and share your experiences on our online forum
Questions – If you have any questions about this, you can contact our helpline

Travelling to the UK - Unlock.

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i would not mention it, bearing in mind that if the deportation from malaysia for working illegally is known to the uk authorities then her chances of ever obtaining a visa are very slim. depends if her deportation and arrival back in thailand was recorded as such by the thai authorities and whether the thai would share such info if it were requested by the uk immigration dept as part of a visa check.

state her old passport was lost or damaged in a flood etc. and hope for the best.

with half the uk border "force" either on strike, about to strike, working from home, busy hugging illegal asylum seekers, whinging about their mental health issues or pulling long covid sickies i doubt if anyone really checks on anything at the moment. the country is fucked. welcome to the uk.

To add to what has been said before, she would need to explain what she would be doing on a 6 month "holiday" (and does the fact that you used quotation marks suggest that it may not really be a holiday?).

You say she has her own Thai business (a shop). How will that run itself without her? No need to tell me/TD, but whoever processes the application might want to know.

And then there is the funding of her "holiday". How will it be financed? By her or you? Proof of adequate funding will be required.



^ I don't think the UK Border Force process visa applications outside of the UK nowadays. In Thailand, that is contracted out to an agency in Bangkok at the Trendy Building (unless it has moved). The name of the agency escapes me at the moment but I'm sure somebody else will know it.

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Originally Posted by Neverna

The name of the agency escapes me at the moment but I'm sure somebody else will know it.

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VSF

I used to live on soi 13 its nr Sportsman or car park at rear of Ambasador Hotel

If you need overnight Citrus is next door and many nearby

https://visa.vfsglobal.com/tha/en/sw...centre/bangkok

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I don't think the UK Border Force process visa applications outside of the UK nowadays. In Thailand, that is contracted out to an agency in Bangkok at the Trendy Building (unless it has moved). The name of the agency escapes me at the moment but I'm sure somebody else will know it.

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yes, you are correct.

Was she actually criminally charged? Or just processed and kicked out. Big difference.

All UK visa applications are decided by an officer within the UKVI ( Uk Visas and Immigration )a directorate within the Home Office. All applications and payment are online but submission of hard copy documents and delivery of biometric data is contracted out to corporate partners - in Thailand this will be VFS located at Trendy House, Soi 13. VFS have no authority whatsoever to offer opinions on the merit of any application and certainly have no function within the decision making process which is solely considered by a UK government contracted official operating under the Immigration Rules as published from time to time in accordance with the Immigration Act 1971 as amended.

The entire process has been reorganised into different geographical hubs and most decisions are now made in the UK in Croydon, Sheffield and Liverpool according to the category of application and location of applicant.

All visit visa applications within the region of South and Southeast Asia ( Thailand ) are decided by UKVI at New Delhi BHC. Asia and Pacific ( including Australia/NZ ) applications go to Beijing.

Settlement applications from Thailand are considered by UKVI Sheffield.

This of course will be subject to change.

A fundamental principle adopted by the UKVI in considering applications is that an applicant who has already obtained a visa from the US/Can/Antipodes/EU and has complied with its conditions will, all things being equal, most likely be successful.

All applications are decided on their own merits and considered under the legal test of the balance of probability i.e a thing is, more often than not. This is in marked contrast to, say, the American regime which considers from the outset that all visit visa applicants are really intending to settle in the US and will not be successful until they can prove otherwise by demonstrating they have constructed a life that compels them to return to their country of application - a generic US visit visa refusal is “ insufficient ties “.

If any applicant is doubtful about their chances then sometimes help from an immigration advisor could be a way to go but make sure they are OISC registered. A company that has established a good reputation managed by Brits is Thai Visa Express, a consultant for which regularly posted sound advice on Thaivisa/Asean.

That's a lot of words for a basic "I dunno".

It was meant as a background note for an obvious newbie giving him a flavour of what the system is all about, you stupid, gormless fuckwit.

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Originally Posted by Neverna

To add to what has been said before, she would need to explain what she would be doing on a 6 month "holiday" (and does the fact that you used quotation marks suggest that it may not really be a holiday?).

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In quotes, because the idea is she would be helping me sort out my property for sale, clear out/ship off my life, rather than a "holiday" where she is spending all her time sightseeing. Perhaps too much was read into that.

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You say she has her own Thai business (a shop). How will that run itself without her? No need to tell me/TD, but whoever processes the application might want to know.

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Plans are in place

And then there is the funding of her "holiday". How will it be financed? By her or you? Proof of adequate funding will be required.



^ I don't think the UK Border Force process visa applications outside of the UK nowadays. In Thailand, that is contracted out to an agency in Bangkok at the Trendy Building (unless it has moved). The name of the agency escapes me at the moment but I'm sure somebody else will know it.[/QUOTE]

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Originally Posted by DrWilly

Was she actually criminally charged? Or just processed and kicked out. Big difference.

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Not entirely sure, I think the latter. From what she told me, she and her friends went over, and while she was mooching at the market the same day, the local police picked her up, clapped her in irons, stuck in a police cell for a few hours and booted her out, along with a 5 year ban for not having a work permit. Malaysian penalties include flogging; pretty sure that never happened to her.

In terms of a "big difference", what does that practially mean. My assumption is its an offence that has no defence. No one is actually convicted in a court of being an illegsl immigrant; in effect, the migrant has to prove their innocence (that they are legal). Illegal immigrants in the UK are not choking up the court system. but they are all convicted.

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

I think her current passport will reflect that it was issued in replacement of the former document and they might want to have sight of that which will doubtless bear some sort of Mys immigration stamp reflecting her deportation. If not and her current passport is virgin then keeping quiet might be a better option.
Her application to accompany you hinges on the demonstrable strength of your relationship and that the marriage is registered and not simply a custom arrangement. Also, you would need to demonstrate your intended return to Thailand and settlement is genuine and the plan to return to UK with wife is not some clandestine attempt to establish a de facto residence in Blighty not possible otherwise. So, demonstration of adequate funds will be required in addition to evidence of settlement in Thailand.

The details you have given of your circumstances are quite scant and so any advice cannot be properly tailored to your likely prospects. Her previous breach is less important than her current status which has radically changed. The Brits are only concerned about one thing, will she do what you both say she will do.
You need to give more information.

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1. Registered marriage
2. Fair point; will she decide to go work in a UK sweat shop rather than live off me.
3. I am a director within a UK Plc, my own financial circumstances is not an issue, vis a vie financial guarantor. My return to Thailand will be based on said Plc issuing a letter to the effect that my role is being transferred from London to a beach in Thailand

I take from that, as you sound like some sort of specialist in the field, her past is not nearly as important as I thought. And clearly, since that time, her circumstances have changed (improved; she has a business).

She's still on the passport issued previously, and yet to get a new one with her new name. My assumption is that as it is a biometric passport, Malaysian authorities retain significant data, though I do not know if they have a data sharing agreement with the United Kingdom. My assumption is that during visa applications, the UK authorities perform deeper checks than what you see at passport control.

The UK requires details of 10 years of travel.


My assumption is in the event of applying for a Partner visa, such details, beyond conviction for serious offences, becomes irrelevant.