Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast
Results 126 to 150 of 181
  1. #126
    I'm in Jail

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Last Online
    17-02-2020 @ 07:16 PM
    Posts
    26,724
    Doubt that very much at all.

    Lieland has some of the best Hospitals on the planet if one can afford to pay.

    Kev was in a top wack Hospital.

    Na, he was fooked from the get go unfortunatly.

  2. #127
    Thailand Expat
    taxexile's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    15,901
    Hard to say if it would have cured or saved him, but he would have been spared a lot of the anxiety and uncertainty that comes with a cancer diagnosis and not knowing if treatment was affordable or not. 2 of my in laws here in thailand have died of cancer, they were treated in thai hospitals, one a government hospital and one a private hospital. In both cases the treatment planning was haphazard, tests were often duplicated unnecessarily thanks to doctors from different departments not reading the notes thoroughly and there were surgical interventions close to end of life that just made the suffering worse. The end of life protocols in thailand were frankly horrifying. In the uk there is calm acceptance and peaceful hospice care, in thailand there were just endless interventions in useless attempts to prolong an already doomed life.

  3. #128
    CCBW JPPR2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    6,618
    Quote Originally Posted by terry57 View Post
    Can happen to anyone hence it is nice to know ya have Insurance.

    If he never had the cash to pay the Hospital bill suppose he would of just died earlier. ???
    So this is my point of view, I agree on insurance when younger. I had it for my wife and I and children. Completely makes sense. The body can recover, ailments can be fixed and you are young enough to live life.. I just don't get people that want to cough up loads of money on medical insurance at 70? Why? I mean if you are diagnosed with a terminal disease do you really want to keep paying into it to sustain your life..or worse yet, make it a longer slower death?

  4. #129
    The Familyman Dillinger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    30,989
    Quote Originally Posted by JPPR2 View Post
    do you really want to keep paying into it to sustain your life..or worse yet, make it a longer slower death?
    Hell yeah.
    Have you seen how a normal Thai dies, in agony with no morphine or dignity.

    I wonder if the guy has got any family back home or will be a lonely death in a hospice over there.Be better than having that annoying skinny bald yank visiting though

  5. #130
    I'm in Jail

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Last Online
    17-02-2020 @ 07:16 PM
    Posts
    26,724
    Good thing about Hospice in the real world is you are that out of it anyway you would not know who was hanging around ya bed. Pain control these days is superb mostly.

    But in this seething shithole its hit and miss how they would treat you.

    Silly coonters.

  6. #131
    CCBW JPPR2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    6,618
    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    Hell yeah.
    Have you seen how a normal Thai dies, in agony with no morphine or dignity.

    I wonder if the guy has got any family back home or will be a lonely death in a hospice over there.Be better than having that annoying skinny bald yank visiting though
    Actually the Thais that I have seen pass were pretty well taken care of. But then there are probably more that are not.

    I guess what I am saying Dil, Have some money set aside for those morphine doses at home. I mean at some point the body stops healing itself. We have a shelf life. Maybe my point of view is based on personal experience watching people I know spend every last penny on keeping someone alive (And they had insurance but the company at some point stops paying). They refinanced their house, pulled money from their 401Ks then had to file bankruptcy and the person they were trying to save, died a short time after.

    I know if I was ever diagnosed with a terrible disease like cancer, I will say no treatment. I am at an age now that I have seen and done enough. Not really much more I want to do except maybe pilot one of the parasailing things I see flying around my damn condo....

  7. #132
    Thailand Expat cyrille's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    18,346
    Quote Originally Posted by JPPR2 View Post
    Why?
    Not wanting to die like a stray dog, jppr.

    Some things not even you could carry off with panache.

  8. #133
    Thailand Expat cyrille's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    18,346
    So much for the Paddaya Wunderlaaand.

  9. #134
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Online
    19-02-2020 @ 07:53 PM
    Posts
    603
    My wife's Grandfather was taken to hospital and while there he had 3 heart attacks. The first time they revived him, second time same but on the third occasion my missus told them no more let him die. Of course this lead to a bit of a family squabble and the wife says to the Aunties who wanted to keep bringing back that when and if he came home they had to look after him as she wouldn't (he had been living with us). Very quickly they changed their minds and he died not long after. He was over 90 so it was time.

    Anyway I am a firm believer in euthanasia but the person involved really needs to have made a will explicitly stating that was what they wanted.
    In Thailand it is not allowed but happens in that people are just allowed to die.

    Keeping someone alive who is terminally ill is the same as not giving the death sentence to a murderer just a waste of money in a system (both cases health and prison that needs all it can get.

  10. #135
    CCBW JPPR2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    6,618
    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Not wanting to die like a stray dog, jppr.

    Some things not even you could carry off with panache.
    But see I do not see it dying like a stray dog. I am saying why cough up a ton of cash at 70 to insure oneself? Just set aside some cash for the good meds and call it. Again my opinion is based on watching some others go down a long dark financial ruins path (even with good insurance). To me its all about the quality of life, not just living and trying to hold on to live a long life.

  11. #136
    CCBW JPPR2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    6,618
    Quote Originally Posted by ootai View Post
    Anyway I am a firm believer in euthanasia but the person involved really needs to have made a will explicitly stating that was what they wanted.
    Me too ootai.

    Quote Originally Posted by ootai View Post
    Keeping someone alive who is terminally ill is the same as not giving the death sentence to a murderer just a waste of money in a system (both cases health and prison that needs all it can get.
    This is my feeling as well. We had a similar situation with my Grandmother in the states. After about 80 she was alive but living a recluse life. She started falling and breaking bones that were not going to heal right. They wanted to do a hip replacement at 84. I chimed in to my Mother and aunt and said "Think about it" . She didn't want it, but they did. She muddled along until 90. Quality of life had really long since been gone. Hadn't been out of the house unless to go to the doctors and maybe a store. Finally was diagnosed with Cancer and they all agreed NO MORE. They had a nurse drop by and giver her Morphine and she passed shortly after.

  12. #137
    Thailand Expat cyrille's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    18,346
    Quote Originally Posted by JPPR2 View Post
    To me its all about the quality of life, not just living and trying to hold on to live a long life.
    I agree, but with a proviso and a question.

    P: I might feel very different if/when I get to say 84 and just fancy the idea of 85.

    Q: Are 'good meds', ie painkillers, that easy to get in Thailand through the proper medical channels?

    Certainly in the UK palliative care comes to a point when you're just basically put on opiates. Could Kev for example have just got those with relative ease in Hospital, or would he have had to ask somone to try a street corner outside?

    I have the impression that it's the latter, but I'm happy to admit to a lack of experience in this (so far).

  13. #138
    CCBW JPPR2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    6,618
    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Are 'good meds', ie painkillers, that easy to get in Thailand through the proper medical channels?
    Well I can tell you from the few I know that have been in the hospital here in Thailand for Major life threatening events, Yes you can. Its all available here. However I think it will probably depend on what hospital and the location. I seriously doubt that many govt hospitals have top meds but like you, I do not know that. That would be my guess from the visits I have gone to with my FIL.

    I currently have insurance through work but at some point in the near future I am going to "Retire" again and I will not. I will likely get outside med insurance for awhile but will eventually stop it. My wife is covered through her own insurance.

    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    I might feel very different if/when I get to say 84 and just fancy the idea of 85.
    Hey if your life is still active and you are enjoying it, then more power to ya. Most at that age sadly are not. Its more of a waiting game.

  14. #139
    Thailand Expat cyrille's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    18,346
    Quote Originally Posted by JPPR2 View Post
    if your life is still active and you are enjoying it, then more power to ya. Most at that age sadly are not. Its more of a waiting game.
    Agreed...that's looking on from the outside though, isn't it.

    If I may say so, given your seemingly sunny outlook on life it seems unlikely to me that you'll be screaming to be let out.

  15. #140
    Thailand Expat
    taxexile's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    15,901
    Certainly in the UK palliative care comes to a point when you're just basically put on opiates. Could Kev for example have just got those with relative ease in Hospital, or would he have had to ask someone to try a street corner outside?
    i believe thai doctors are very reluctant to prescribe opiates in the strength or dosage necessary to end a life in a terminal case, it is tantamount to a killing and goes against buddhist principles. death must occur naturally, and that sometimes can be unpleasant both for the patient and the patients loved ones in the days leading up to it.

    i have observed deaths from lingering terminal illnesses both here and in the uk, and there is no way i would want to be at the "mercy" of the thai system. it is cold, calculating and heartless. the medical staff show no consideration for the feelings of the patient or the bereaved, they just do their jobs like programmed robots and the final insult is the visit to the accounts department at the end which just compounds the feelings of total abandonment and lack of compassion as the calculator clacks up every pill, potion and procedure to the very last satang.

    dont even get me started on the greed and detachment of the undertakers or the heartless bean counters at the temple. avaricious scum.

  16. #141
    CCBW JPPR2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Here
    Posts
    6,618
    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    If I may say so, given your seemingly sunny outlook on life it seems unlikely to me that you'll be screaming to be let out.
    Well I do enjoy life. Always have. That said though I am also realistic in that we all die. Some from natural causes or events, others from terrible diseases. I just know that I will not try and prolong my life if I am diagnosed with a terminal disease. When I go, I go. I think many fear death. Its a deep discussion for certain. We have a built in mechanism to survive. Hard to fight that. Its why Morphine is so helpful.

  17. #142
    Thailand Expat cyrille's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    18,346
    ^^ Thai Buddhists just have a different way of dealing with it.

    It's tough though, no doubt about that.

    Where isn't it, one way or another?

  18. #143
    Thailand Expat
    OhOh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Last Online
    19-02-2020 @ 12:08 AM
    Location
    Where troubles melt like lemon drops
    Posts
    18,854
    Quote Originally Posted by taxexile View Post
    The end of life protocols in thailand were frankly horrifying. In the uk there is calm acceptance and peaceful hospice care,
    Horrifying for the penniless vagabond, luxury for the hi so "insured", until their assets are zero. I suspect similar in many countries, barring those governments who truly are designed around and actually work towards, alleviating their citizen's strife.

    My own, personal experience, not hearsay, of Thai long term cancer care was this.

    My MIL had been diagnosed with, I was told "leukaemia", an accurate translation or not. Already cut open, bits removed and overweight even for older Thai women.

    Her long term treatment consisted of a 3 day expedition a day's bus travel to the nearest Thai cancer specialist hospital Chonburi, a day being scrutinised at the hospital, scans, tests etc. but mainly waiting as it was always crowded. A day's bus travel home.

    Once i arrived and had transport, it was a 24 hour jaunt.

    Leave home at 4 in the morning, to get a low number ticket, a full days "treatment", and a return in the evening. This went on for a number of years until she was told "it had returned". At that point she decided to stop the visits and went to our local city hospital, some tests but mainly drug supply topping up. After a year or so of this I saw here take to her bed. She then just faded away.

    In the company and care of her family and friends.

    Quote Originally Posted by JPPR2 View Post
    I just don't get people that want to cough up loads of money on medical insurance at 70? Why? I mean if you are diagnosed with a terminal disease do you really want to keep paying into it to sustain your life..or worse yet, make it a longer slower death?
    Agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    Have you seen how a normal Thai dies, in agony with no morphine or dignity.
    See above

    Quote Originally Posted by cyrille View Post
    Not wanting to die like a stray dog, jppr.
    See above.

    The civilised alternative is drug induced "care" which being "privatised" is just a room, a few meals, and a large TV in the corridor/communal room.

    No Thanks.

    But as long as you have a plan I wish you well.
    A tray full of GOLD is not worth a moment in time.

  19. #144
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Chonburi, Thailand
    Posts
    6,290
    Quote Originally Posted by ootai View Post
    Anyway I am a firm believer in euthanasia but the person involved really needs to have made a will explicitly stating that was what they wanted.
    Isn't the will read after the fact ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly View Post
    let me explain simply 100MB != 1GB RAM

  20. #145
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Online
    19-02-2020 @ 07:53 PM
    Posts
    603
    Quote Originally Posted by Fondles View Post
    Isn't the will read after the fact ?
    Fondles
    I think I understand what you're asking and yes if the will is only looked at after you're dead then how did anyone know what you wanted before you died?

    What I was trying to say is that you need to make it known somehow while you are in a fit and healthy state of mind and body that once you can no longer care for yourself or know what day it is then you would like someone to help you end the mindless state you're in. I don't just mean if you are in immense pain but if you are then I think it should be known you would like them to help you leave this world. I hope I am making sense, maybe I'm at the stage where someone needs to step in?

    I am not sure but I think the terminology is a "Living Will".

    Just checked with Google and got this as the meaning.
    a written statement detailing a person's desires regarding their medical treatment in circumstances in which they are no longer able to express informed consent, especially an advance directive.


  21. #146
    Thailand Expat jabir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    9,621
    Quote Originally Posted by JPPR2 View Post
    Well I do enjoy life. Always have. That said though I am also realistic in that we all die. Some from natural causes or events, others from terrible diseases. I just know that I will not try and prolong my life if I am diagnosed with a terminal disease. When I go, I go. I think many fear death. Its a deep discussion for certain. We have a built in mechanism to survive. Hard to fight that. Its why Morphine is so helpful.
    Might change my mind when there's no time for philosophy, but for now I don't think it's death that people fear so much as the act of dying, life's ultimate humiliation of a once strong body that shuts down and off.

  22. #147
    Thailand Expat jabir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Last Online
    @
    Posts
    9,621
    Quote Originally Posted by ootai View Post
    Fondles
    I think I understand what you're asking and yes if the will is only looked at after you're dead then how did anyone know what you wanted before you died?

    What I was trying to say is that you need to make it known somehow while you are in a fit and healthy state of mind and body that once you can no longer care for yourself or know what day it is then you would like someone to help you end the mindless state you're in. I don't just mean if you are in immense pain but if you are then I think it should be known you would like them to help you leave this world. I hope I am making sense, maybe I'm at the stage where someone needs to step in?

    I am not sure but I think the terminology is a "Living Will".

    Just checked with Google and got this as the meaning.
    a written statement detailing a person's desires regarding their medical treatment in circumstances in which they are no longer able to express informed consent, especially an advance directive.

    Just make sure those that matter know about your living will, that you made it in the right state of mind, and also confirm it early when things start going wrong. They can be expensive to challenge, and the lawyers end up with whatever the hospitals couldn't prise out of your estate.

  23. #148
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Chonburi, Thailand
    Posts
    6,290
    Quote Originally Posted by ootai View Post
    Fondles
    I think I understand what you're asking and yes if the will is only looked at after you're dead then how did anyone know what you wanted before you died?

    What I was trying to say is that you need to make it known somehow while you are in a fit and healthy state of mind and body that once you can no longer care for yourself or know what day it is then you would like someone to help you end the mindless state you're in. I don't just mean if you are in immense pain but if you are then I think it should be known you would like them to help you leave this world. I hope I am making sense, maybe I'm at the stage where someone needs to step in?

    I am not sure but I think the terminology is a "Living Will".

    Just checked with Google and got this as the meaning.
    a written statement detailing a person's desires regarding their medical treatment in circumstances in which they are no longer able to express informed consent, especially an advance directive.


    Ahhh yeah living will, mum tried to do one before her dementia got too much of a foot hold but sadly was too late.
    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly View Post
    let me explain simply 100MB != 1GB RAM

  24. #149
    Member
    ChalkyDee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    27-01-2020 @ 12:47 PM
    Posts
    907
    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    Hell yeah.
    Have you seen how a normal Thai dies, in agony with no morphine or dignity.

    I wonder if the guy has got any family back home or will be a lonely death in a hospice over there.Be better than having that annoying skinny bald yank visiting though
    I've seen normal Thais, whatever you mean by that, die with dignity and morphine.

  25. #150
    Member
    ChalkyDee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Online
    27-01-2020 @ 12:47 PM
    Posts
    907
    I'm going to get the 432 baht a month for life Social Security insurance.
    I don't use it often but do when I know the doc there also works at the best private hospital, or is an expert.

Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •