Thread: "Tung" in Thailand

Hi Newty, it will be a pleasure to send you some for your loft. Can you tell me how much oil you will need so that I can check the stock and arrange to send it to you?

Not sure, how far does it go ?

We have about 40 square meters to do....maybe more.

I have used "teak oil" for that Nawty

it costs about B1000 for 5 litres. Coverage depends on the porosity of the wood; the second coat uses less

hopefully, Tung oil is the same

Afraid I am not able to say which is better. We are in the testing and development stage ourselves.

Perhaps for anyone from this forum who will be interested to try the Tung Oil for their project, we will give an introductory price.

tung oil, oil obtained from the seeds of a tropical tree, the tung tree (Aleurites fordii) of the spurge family, and from seeds of some related species, all from Indomalesia or W Pacifica. It is known also as China wood oil and nut oil. The poisonous seeds found in the heart of the tung fruit (which is the size of a small apple) contain more than 50% tung oil, readily obtained when the seeds are heated, ground, and pressed. The oil is amber-colored and contains a high proportion of eleostearic acid. Because of its wide use as a dryer in varnishes and paints, it has great commercial importance. While the bulk of the product is utilized by the paint and varnish industry, tung oil has additional uses, e.g., as a component of insulating compounds and in the manufacture of linoleum and oilcloth. China was long the chief producer of the oil, but the tree has been introduced in other areas as well. The U.S. Dept. of Agriculture experimented with tung tree growing early in the 20th cent., and afterward encouraged Southern farmers to cultivate it. In recent years, an increasing portion of the commercial supply has been obtained from trees grown in the United States, particularly in the South.

careful for nut allergy

Food contact and allergic reactions
As the source of tung oil is a nut, people with nut allergies often report adverse reactions to contact with (or even the odour of) tung oil. Reactions can be severe in some cases. Whilst tung oil has been used for many centuries as a finish for kitchen items such as wooden bowls and cutting boards, some individuals must avoid its use.

apply like this

Application
The traditional technique is to apply the diluted oil as a succession of very thin films with soft non-fuzzy cloth like tee-shirt cotton. Dilutants range from traditional Spirits of turpentine to any of the new citrus thinners to VM&P naphtha. The choice of thinner should be guided by how fast the coating needs to set. Naphtha is often too fast, but works well in spray-on applications in well ventilated studios. Primary coats may be laid down at a 1:2 oil-to-thinner ratio, and successive layers (3 or more) at higher oil concentrations, with the final layer consisting of the oil alone. This technique results in the traditional wet-wood look by filling in all open wood cells as water does. The finish is matte by its nature.
Tung oil finishes that start with polymerized pure oils or ‘tung oil preparations’ are best applied in the fat over lean principle: thinned pure oil is applied to deeply penetrate the surface, to fill pores. Straight oil is then applied moderately to adhere to the surface and provide a good base for the thick gloss layers. The polymerized oil is then applied thickly as a single layer, allowed to fully dry, is buffed smooth with very fine sandpaper then 00 steel wool. The surface is wiped clean with a moistened rag, then allowed to dry. A final coat is again applied fairly thickly — the oil will smooth itself into a glass-like coating — and allowed to dry for two to three days. The resulting finish is almost completely impervious to water.

most Tung oil comes from the US at the moment

also this is weird, not sure how correct it is

Should I treat my teak with teak oil?

The answer to that is a clear NO. Teak oil is normally solvent based and is meant to penetrate the timber and replace the lost natural oils. Grade A teak will not lose its natural oils and therefore does not need replacing. Applying teak oil on good quality teak will eventually have the opposite effect. Once the teak oil has penetrated, the solvents within it literally destroy the natural oils and will render the teak dry and brittle if the maintenance is not continued on regular intervals. Once you start using Teak oil, you will need to continue using it. Teak oil also encourages mildew and generally turns teak into an oily orangey greasy mess.

I thought teak oil left the surface looking oily ?

Whereas this tung stuff I read leaves it dry and natural finish.

Do not want oily at all, so hope tung is ok.

When you going to get it to me to try Thor....I can be your TD experiment

Many different methods can be found on Google, but the stuff mentioned seems to be rare commodities around here which make the cost higher, so we are trying the oil with different mixes which are readily available in the local neighbourhood store that supplies construction material.

We used Tung Oil mixed with alcohol on our old wooden floor in one room. Just spread it all over and left it to dry. Took 6 hours, redone it 3-4 times, then sealed it with a mat sealant. Looked like a natural finish, exposing the grains of the wood well.

Taken into consideration that the Chinese Junks, were painted with the Oil, sailed the seas years ago, so the mixture couldn't have been that complicated.

Went to check on the floor we painted a couple days ago. It is drying well and the grain of the wood can be seen quite well.

Have to correct what I said last time, as we mixed the Oil with "nam mun son", usually called "turpentine" and not alcohol. Sorry! Can anyone help me with the meaning of 'Citrus thinner' in THAI please, so that I can get it here?

Forgot to bring the camera, will take pictures to share next time.

Thor called me the other day.......nice to talk to her......yes her, thought it was a him.

Look forward to the pics.

Hope being a "her" would not be a problem? I have been involved in building projects for other people for the past 20 years. We can do a lot of things you GUYs con do too folks.

Now I hope to have a chance to build my own house and kennels for our 32 dogs we have on our farm now.

That's why I enjoy TD's section for dogs so much. Thanks!

32 dogs....crikey, have you not heard of castration ?

What kind of dogs ?

Yes, but they are too young for that right now. We intend to get they spreayed in a few months, after they are fully grown. They are strays that we have picked up in Bangkok as there are many on the roads. After we give them food infront of our home in Bangkok, we let them come into our home when it rains, but after feeding them, they don't go away. When our place become too crowded, we move them to our farm, so that there is lots of space for them to run around. They are all lovely and after having them for a while, we grow to love them.

Thought I should share this info with anyone interested: -

A pure or polymerized tung oil finish is easy to use and will produce beautiful results on any type of wood. Usually applied to unfinished wood, but can be used over oil base stain.
Existing finishes must be removed, as this is a penetrating oil. It needs to penetrate deeply into the wood fibers and pores.


Preparation

New wood needs to sanded smooth prior to application. This finish will not build a film like varnish, so most of the sanding should be done before any tung oil finish is applied. If the wood is ruff start with medium grit sand paper and then finish with a fine grit, always sand in the direction of the grain.
After sanding, all repairs can be done. Any holes or cracks can be filled with a wood filler. If a wood stain is to be used choose a stainable filler.
For wood without any stain choose a colored wood filler that approximately matches the woods color. Do a final sanding if necessary and remove all dust with tack rags.


Staining

Any oil base wood stain can be applied. A tung oil finish has an amber color that will change or enhance the stain color. Choose traditional colors that will be subtle and still enhance the wood grain.
When in doubt apply the stain and finish to a scrap piece of similar wood before staining.


Applying Tung Oil

A tung oil finish can be applied pure or thinned up to 50% with mineral spirits or turpentine. Thinning the first coat will increase penetration, decrease the drying time and produce better results.
A typical application is by hand rubbing. Dip a soft cloth or rag into the finish and rub onto the wood. Keep applying until the wood is saturated. Use a natural bristle brush for hard to reach areas. Allow each coat to remain on the surface for 20-30 minutes. Wipe all areas to remove any excess. Check for drips or runs after another few minutes.
Drying is a slow process and will occur between 24-48 hours. This depends on the porosity of the wood and whether you thinned the finish. It will take 3-4 coats to achieve a waterproof surface. You can lightly sand or buff with extra fine steel wool between coats.
For exterior use, brushing will be the best method for application. The first application should be thinned to increase penetration. Pick up all drips and runs after 30 minutes. Apply 4-6 coats on new, very porous woods like cedar.


Maintenance

Maintenance is very easy. Light scratches can be gone with a light sanding and the addition of another coat of tung oil finish. Interior wood surfaces might need another coat every 2-4 years and exterior wood 1-2 years depending on exposure to sun light and wood species.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nawty (Linseed Oil/Tung Oil)
Understand that, but what is needed to know is how much you would be paying someone as a farmer, for their seeds.

I understand you may not know this as just starting out, but you need to know it so people can make a decision to grow it or not and if it is worth their while.

Also need to know how many kilos on average you can expect from well cared for trees per rai etc. Nobody will start to grow them and think it is ok to wait 5 years before they find out what their income will be.

Also can the trees be used for wood ?? If so, what kind of wood is it, sort, hard, are people using it for anything currently ? What life span does the tree have etc.

I am interested in this, but not as a farmer and its probable meagre returns, but for the whole package and having a friend highly involved in forestry in Oz.


We have devised a buy-back offer to those who will join us to grow, bearing in mind that there are 5 species of the "TUNG", therefore we have a contract (drawn out by a lawyer ready) in place for those who will be getting the plants from us, that they will be able to sell their seeds back to us, for 5-7 Baht/kg, shelled. We would prefer to only buy back the seed from those who have got the plants from us because we need to be sure of the quality of our product.


A brief guideline on the number of tree to grow per Rai have been suggested on our website: .....thorzen.co.th The tree will start to bear fruit in the 3rd year, but they will be fully grown by the age of 5 yeilding their full potential, possibly with around +20 kgs. If you have 100 trees per Rai, times 20 = 2,000kgs gross weight.

The great thing about caring for the Tung trees is how easy it is - it loves natural vitamins obtainable, i.e. cow, pig & chicken dun, which are cheap and easily obtainable anywhere. I keep a bucket and a shovel in the back of my car and make stops when I see piles of them on the road, especially in the mornings and evenings when the farmers lead their cows along the road between their homes and their destinations.

As each tree grows to the height of 15-20 meters, every part of the tree can be used, the whole tree can be used for structures for houses, planks, furniture, etc. Understand that the native in China used them to build their houses and furniture.

The first mention of the Tung oil can be found as early as 400 B.C. Tung oil was mentioned in the writings of Confucius. The Chinese who identified the benefits and uses of this oil mainly used tung oil since the ancient days as a way to protect the masts and sails of the boats. This was also used to give a good finish to the furniture that belonged to the royal families

Tung oil in its purest form is water and alkali resistant. Therefore, Tung oil, when used on furniture, resists scratching and damage. This oil penetrates well and has a transparent finish giving a matte look. Tung oil is also used for paints and waterproof coatings and many professionals are known to testify about the lustrous and excellent finish it gives for wood. This amber colored oil is very high in its proportion of eleostearic acid. Tung oil gained prominence because of its commercial use in the paint industry. Besides, other oils such as the castor oil and linseed oil are known to take a longer time to dry when used on a wood surface as compared to the Tung oil. The specialty of the Tung oil remains in the fact that it can dry quickly and give a waterproof coating. This is useful in paints, varnishes and printing inks. Other oils leave an oily surface till they get completely soaked into the wood.

Tung oil is able to adhere other minerals that are porous. This is because of the excellent penetrating power of the Tung oil. It is an important ingredient that is used to apply to granite or marble, which is mainly used for the kitchen and the bathroom areas. Such areas need stain resistant materials due to the usage of chemicals and food products that cause stains. When applying Tung oil to any surface, remember to dust it properly to get rid of all the particles. The first coat of the Tung oil can be applied with a soft rag. Let it remain for at least 10 minutes so that it can soak completely. Excess Tung oil can be wiped off with a rag or a soft cloth. You have to ensure that it dries completely before two coats. The number of coats you need to apply would largely depend upon the object.

Tung oil is used for kitchen tables, chopping blocks, wood floors etc. With the long shelf life that Tung oil offers, it is not a wonder that this is the most preferred oil by many, today.

I would have to say after trying out the Tung Oil over the weekend.....I am somewhat disappointed in it.

Using vast amounts of land to make fuel that would otherwise be used for food that is also becoming scarce because of global warming. (Cough cough) doesn't make sense to me. The only sense it does make is to those who perhaps want to make a larger profit.

Have you not heard of using it for land that is degraded and cannot support crops for farming for various reasons, terrain, erosion etc etc.

Then there is the benefit large areas of trees have for our health and well being and the atmosphere.....but lets forget about that and go and pull down the amazon rainforst and grow potatoes and mung beans.

There is a guy on another site that has said he used tung oil successfully on Bamboo....I shall investigate more...

Thinking of building a small house out of all the natural material, bamboo structures (think it will be strong enough since the scaffolding for a building 40 story high can be built from Bamboo in Hong Kong), walls from woven bamboo and palm leaves for the roof.

Bamboo floors, doors and windows? Don't want to use wood.

Soak and treat everything with Tung Oil and see how long the place will last.

Any ideas anyone?

Discuss with Smithson...exactly what he is doing now and wants to do more of.

I like wood and I am not sure of how long the bamboo in a structure lasts.....would like to try bamboo though in some form or areas of a house.

There is a bamboo thread here also somewhere.

Also google and research some bali build sites, they are the experts with Bamboo and build some spectacular buildings, smithson has sent me some websites re this, maybe he can post them here again.

Thinking of starting it when the weather gets dryer. The roof made of palm leaves (or thatch roof as you called it) we built for our shed last year is already showing signs as it is shedding little sprinkles, so everything is covered with a layer of dist all the time. That's why I am thinking of testing the next batch we get by soaking it with a mixture of Tung Oil and Smithson's organic Som-O thinner, if he can produce it in a couple of months?

There are a couple of different materials used for the thatch and the backbone of the sheet.

You obviously have the bamboo backbone, this will be eaten by bugs and cause the dust everywhere.

There is another backbone which is made of either a wood and/or a similar looking wood to bamboo but it is not eaten by the bugs and therefore no dust....so i hope.

The later one is more expensive at 14 to 20b per piece, depending on area and time of year. The bamboo backbone is around 7b per sheet.

Hi Thorzen, I've been looking for Tung Oil for months now and had no luck. I'm based near Udon Thani. I'm coming to Bangkok in a coule of weeks; any chance of buying 5 or 10 litres of Tung oil?

hope you still visit these pages.

regards

Paul