Thread: Rubber trees 101

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Oh Oh, I suggest you read this article (and then totally ignore it) you write about human rights abuses by the White Colonists over a Hundred years ago in Africa but simply Ignore what is taking place right now in Zimbabwe ,because to say the blacks have fucked the Country up (even though its true) would leave you wide open to accusations of racism by the other left wing PC plonkers on these boards,frankly your's and the other escapism from the truth is fucking sickening to the extreme China puts its stamp on Zimbabwean economy | Zimbabwe Situation

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Yeah, I looked at post 42 on 'are you a racist' but it I find it hard to correct Yaso as I believe he 'flounced' and no longer post on 'Teakdoor'. Or is he posting under another name?

Its Yaso all right, back from a long absence , no doubt about it as he's come out with the mud hut gibe three times in the past ,I can take a joke as good as any one but when its the same bollocks 3 or 4 times it gets a wee bit tiresome especially when it has FA to do with the thread

In case you hadn't noticed, Piwanoi, this thread is about rubber. It is in the "farming-and-gardening-in-thailand" part of the forum. It has been a good and informative thread (about rubber in Thailand). Let's keep it that way.

One that note.. what were cup prices today?

Originally Posted by Neverna

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Oh Oh, I suggest you read this article (and then totally ignore it) you write about human rights abuses by the White Colonists over a Hundred years ago in Africa but simply Ignore what is taking place right now in Zimbabwe ,because to say the blacks have fucked the Country up (even though its true) would leave you wide open to accusations of racism by the other left wing PC plonkers on these boards,frankly your's and the other escapism from the truth is fucking sickening to the extreme China puts its stamp on Zimbabwean economy | Zimbabwe Situation

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Yeah, I looked at post 42 on 'are you a racist' but it I find it hard to correct Yaso as I believe he 'flounced' and no longer post on 'Teakdoor'. Or is he posting under another name?

Its Yaso all right, back from a long absence , no doubt about it as he's come out with the mud hut gibe three times in the past ,I can take a joke as good as any one but when its the same bollocks 3 or 4 times it gets a wee bit tiresome especially when it has FA to do with the thread

In case you hadn't noticed, Piwanoi, this thread is about rubber. It is in the "farming-and-gardening-in-thailand" part of the forum. It has been a good and informative thread (about rubber in Thailand). Let's keep it that way.

True , it's about rubber, not China, a gentlemen s discussion about rubber plantations.
Lets keep it that way, thanks. Jim

Hi Jim.
My town is deserted. The tappers are disappearing, and Thai Hua are struggling to get workers.
They still wont pay properly and the Thais wont work for them. Cambodians are leaving.
How much a kilo today? Cant get sense out of my lot.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Originally Posted by ltnt

Chinese buying up Thailand till there's no turning back

The Chinese are buying every hard asset they can find worldwide. They have got to turn their profits/fiat "invested" in the US markets into something real that has value.

Just in case you are not aware, this thread is about Rubber farming here in Thailand as Nervana has reminded us , kindly keep China's world wide land grabbing activities out of the thread ,Thankyou

Originally Posted by Neverna

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Oh Oh, I suggest you read this article (and then totally ignore it) you write about human rights abuses by the White Colonists over a Hundred years ago in Africa but simply Ignore what is taking place right now in Zimbabwe ,because to say the blacks have fucked the Country up (even though its true) would leave you wide open to accusations of racism by the other left wing PC plonkers on these boards,frankly your's and the other escapism from the truth is fucking sickening to the extreme China puts its stamp on Zimbabwean economy | Zimbabwe Situation

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Yeah, I looked at post 42 on 'are you a racist' but it I find it hard to correct Yaso as I believe he 'flounced' and no longer post on 'Teakdoor'. Or is he posting under another name?

Its Yaso all right, back from a long absence , no doubt about it as he's come out with the mud hut gibe three times in the past ,I can take a joke as good as any one but when its the same bollocks 3 or 4 times it gets a wee bit tiresome especially when it has FA to do with the thread

In case you hadn't noticed, Piwanoi, this thread is about rubber. It is in the "farming-and-gardening-in-thailand" part of the forum. It has been a good and informative thread (about rubber in Thailand). Let's keep it that way.

You might just want to look as to just who started the ball rolling about China's land grabbing activities

China is the current and future leader in utilization of the rubber resource production globally according to the latest statistics and future projections by the International Rubber Institute.

May I say, China and its activities has a great deal of affect on the future of rubber production, prices and use.

If you don't discuss China in this thread its actually projecting an incomplete picture of the market.

Originally Posted by ltnt

China is the current and future leader in utilization of the rubber resource production globally according to the latest statistics and future projections by the International Rubber Institute.

May I say, China and its activities has a great deal of affect on the future of rubber production, prices and use.

If you don't discuss China in this thread its actually projecting an incomplete picture of the market.

Yeah I agree, So has the price of Oil ,but I won't go into that and start on various Oil producing Country,s which has an effect on Rubber prices here ,I mean lets have it right Nervosa might get upset about me straying from the fold

Originally Posted by the dogcatcher

Hi Jim.
My town is deserted. The tappers are disappearing, and Thai Hua are struggling to get workers.
They still wont pay properly and the Thais wont work for them. Cambodians are leaving.
How much a kilo today? Cant get sense out of my lot.

Sold some wet cup yesterday 21 Baht a kilo.
No tappers here either, I have good latex producing trees, but my tappers, husband wife teams only earn 800 baht [400 each] per tap. Other owners with Thai producing trees 1/2 that. No one works for 200 Baht, plenty of other jobs.

Thai Hua and the other big producers are losing money on every kilo they produce, they will stop or gear down soon. Then no buyers, no buyers no one taps, no rubber.
Any over supply will be gone, if it hasn't already.
Market will stabilize, price will go up, or everyone, world wide can park their cars, no tires.

Bad here, wages in Malaysia are higher, India about the same as here, China is reducing it's stock pile for their own reasons.
Numbers will come out showing the oversupply has gone, futures buyers will step back in and prices will rise. Just got to sit it out, 2009 someone posted, rubber is finished, I replied, roads are still full of cars, when I see empty streets, I'll know rubber is finished. Jim

Originally Posted by thaiguzzi

Getting rid of grass leads to soil erosion and good stuff in the soil like worms etc. Grass just needs cutting regularly, also adding nutrients as the cut grass rots into the ground.

That photo posted showed flat land so erosion would not be a problem and therefore no weeds at all would be better then some or the mess in that pic.

May be it's all a shift to finding an alternative to natural rubber?

Mention dandelion and a shudder wriggles down most gardeners’ spines. Scourge of lawns, borders, patios and allotments, they’re a major reason why we spend a fortune on weed killer or hours bent double, extracting their thong-like roots. Now, a species of Russian dandelion is set to become one of the most important plants on the planet, propping up civilisation with rubber made from the glutinous, milky sap found in its roots.

In July this year, Indian-Dutch company Apollo Vredestein rolled out the first prototype tyres produced from European-grown rubber. If tests go well, they hope to start full production in 2015. The dandelion, Taraxacum kok-saghyz (TKS), is one of three plants currently being investigated by various international consortia, made up of government agencies, big business and scientific research establishments, locked in a multi-million pound scramble to find alternatives to natural rubber.

Car tyres made from dandelions - Telegraph

^Are You changing the subject again?

Originally Posted by ltnt

^Are You changing the subject again?

Nice one!

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

May be it's all a shift to finding an alternative to natural rubber?

Mention dandelion and a shudder wriggles down most gardeners’ spines. Scourge of lawns, borders, patios and allotments, they’re a major reason why we spend a fortune on weed killer or hours bent double, extracting their thong-like roots. Now, a species of Russian dandelion is set to become one of the most important plants on the planet, propping up civilisation with rubber made from the glutinous, milky sap found in its roots.

In July this year, Indian-Dutch company Apollo Vredestein rolled out the first prototype tyres produced from European-grown rubber. If tests go well, they hope to start full production in 2015. The dandelion, Taraxacum kok-saghyz (TKS), is one of three plants currently being investigated by various international consortia, made up of government agencies, big business and scientific research establishments, locked in a multi-million pound scramble to find alternatives to natural rubber.

Car tyres made from dandelions - Telegraph

Rubber[edit]
Taraxacum kok-saghyz was cultivated on a large scale in the Soviet Union between 1931 and 1950, as well as in the United States, the UK, Germany, Sweden and Spain during World War II as an emergency source of rubber when supplies of rubber from Hevea brasiliensis in Southeast Asia were threatened. During this time period, the highest yields achieved by the U.S. were 110 kg of rubber per hectare, while the USSR achieved yields of 200 kg of rubber per hectare. With the conclusion of World War II and the return of affordable Hevea brasiliensis rubber, the majority of T. kok-saghyz programs were discontinued.

There has been a resurgence of attention on T. kok-saghyz due to allergic reactions to Hevea rubber used in medical devices, and to shortcomings of the Hevea brasiliensis rubber supply.[1] One threat to Hevea brasiliensis rubber production is the South American Leaf Blight (SALB), which has afflicted conventional rubber production in South America since 1934. This blight may spread to the Hevea brasiliensis trees in Southeast Asia, which are genetically very similar to each other and those of South America. Furthermore, land used for rubber production is being converted to palm oil plantations in order to produce biofuel, and labor costs reduce the profitability of Hevea brasiliensis plantations, as each tree must be manually tapped in order to harvest its latex. Rising oil prices limit the economic viability of synthetic rubbers, and natural rubber often cannot be pragmatically replaced by a synthetic equivalent.[3]

Taraxacum kok-saghyz cultivars that are easier to cultivate and produce more and better rubber are being developed[6] as part of a large research project at many institutions.[7


Nothing new, 200 kilos per hectare, or 40 rubber trees, no even a rai, plus extracting costs, no competition there.

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

May be it's all a shift to finding an alternative to natural rubber?

Mention dandelion and a shudder wriggles down most gardeners’ spines. Scourge of lawns, borders, patios and allotments, they’re a major reason why we spend a fortune on weed killer or hours bent double, extracting their thong-like roots. Now, a species of Russian dandelion is set to become one of the most important plants on the planet, propping up civilisation with rubber made from the glutinous, milky sap found in its roots.

In July this year, Indian-Dutch company Apollo Vredestein rolled out the first prototype tyres produced from European-grown rubber. If tests go well, they hope to start full production in 2015. The dandelion, Taraxacum kok-saghyz (TKS), is one of three plants currently being investigated by various international consortia, made up of government agencies, big business and scientific research establishments, locked in a multi-million pound scramble to find alternatives to natural rubber.

Car tyres made from dandelions - Telegraph

Amazing !, no doubt they'll be making condoms from it too!

May be you buy the condoms according to the size of the dandelion?

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

May be you buy the condoms according to the size of the dandelion?

No need Pragmatic, I have been fireing blanks for the last 45 years

Originally Posted by jamescollister

Rising oil prices limit the economic viability of synthetic rubbers,

Oil production on the rise along with their side-cuts for production of all things synthetic. Saudi having difficulties with over-production in a market awash in oil and its by-products.

Will this trend continue? Russia production due to current political conditions may be a short fall and thus supply side economics will encourage imports from other off-shore producers for Europe.est However Russias friend China is in the best possible position to acquire butt loads of cheap Russian oil. Looking for a glut of plastics from China in the near future.

Originally Posted by ltnt

Originally Posted by jamescollister

Rising oil prices limit the economic viability of synthetic rubbers,

Oil production on the rise along with their side-cuts for production of all things synthetic. Saudi having difficulties with over-production in a market awash in oil and its by-products.

Will this trend continue? Russia production due to current political conditions may be a short fall and thus supply side economics will encourage imports from other off-shore producers for Europe.est However Russias friend China is in the best possible position to acquire butt loads of cheap Russian oil. Looking for a glut of plastics from China in the near future.

Don't know much about oil, but like rubber there is a production cost, price has to reflect, plus profit the cost of getting it out.
Unprofitable wells and new fields will stop if they are loss makers.
No ones in business to lose money, if they do they'll cut production of non profitable wells, rubber farmers will cut production of non profitable plantations.
Australia has closed some open cut coal mines, no profit, simple supply and demand, rubber is already cheaper than synthetic.

When one stops tapping for say a year or two does the tree growth improve foliage or trunk diameter? Does the price of a Rai of rubber plantation increase according to the trees age?

Originally Posted by jamescollister

Originally Posted by the dogcatcher

Hi Jim.
My town is deserted. The tappers are disappearing, and Thai Hua are struggling to get workers.
They still wont pay properly and the Thais wont work for them. Cambodians are leaving.
How much a kilo today? Cant get sense out of my lot.

Sold some wet cup yesterday 21 Baht a kilo.
No tappers here either, I have good latex producing trees, but my tappers, husband wife teams only earn 800 baht [400 each] per tap. Other owners with Thai producing trees 1/2 that. No one works for 200 Baht, plenty of other jobs.

Thai Hua and the other big producers are losing money on every kilo they produce, they will stop or gear down soon. Then no buyers, no buyers no one taps, no rubber.
Any over supply will be gone, if it hasn't already.
Market will stabilize, price will go up, or everyone, world wide can park their cars, no tires.

Bad here, wages in Malaysia are higher, India about the same as here, China is reducing it's stock pile for their own reasons.
Numbers will come out showing the oversupply has gone, futures buyers will step back in and prices will rise. Just got to sit it out, 2009 someone posted, rubber is finished, I replied, roads are still full of cars, when I see empty streets, I'll know rubber is finished. Jim

My wifes uncle who owns a few hundred rais gave up on Thais. He only employs Burmese families. After I read your thread, I had a good talk with him this week. He was surprised how much I know about the rubber business....thanxs to you

Originally Posted by OhOh

Originally Posted by ltnt

However Russias friend China is in the best possible position to acquire butt loads of cheap Russian oil. Looking for a glut of plastics from China in the near future.

Russia and China agreed a price acceptable to each of them, given their current/future postions. As some know China's requirement for oil and gas has been increasing by 8 - 10% per year. Given the infrastructure to be built, the proven resource available and a defensible supply route it would be crazy for the Chinese not to invest time and effort in accepting the offer. China is accumulating cost effective supplies of every resource it needs, including latex.

OH OH ,seriously who knows two years down the line whats going to happen, but as you rightly say the Chinese as they always do are hedging their bets for the future ,sadly from what I have seen here over the last 10 years or so there is no such thing as "tomorrow" its either boom or bust, the ill thought of "rice scheme" being a classic example, which IMHO is going to have a serious knock on effect for quite some time. .