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  1. #1
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    Bringing back Special Constables

    Bringing back the special constables in my opinion will not work, as things have changed drastically since they last used them.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jul/26/cameron-budget-cuts-diy-policing?CMP=AFCYAH

    David Cameron's "big society in action" answer to police budget cuts was revealed tonight as a plan to appeal to the public to take part in "do-it-yourself" policing ‑ and perhaps even go on patrol with uniformed officers.

    A radical police reform white paper published by the home secretary, Theresa May, says that she wants to explore new ideas including creating a reserve army of volunteers prepared to act as community crime fighters along similar lines to fire reservists who help staff some neighbourhood fire stations.

    The idea for greater public involvement in policing emerged as the home secretary's Liberal Democrat coalition partners warned that the current state of her proposals to introduce directly-elected police and crime commissioners are in danger of giving a green light to "Judge Dredd populists".

    The proposal for directly-elected police commissioners, who will have the power to hire and fire chief constables, is already under attack from senior police officers and Conservative-led local government.

    The unexpected outspoken criticism from the Liberal Democrats reflects the coalition's failure to agree the detail on the checks and balances that are to be put in place to avoid "populist politicians turning individual forces into their personal fiefdom".
    The Home Office consultation paper, published today , says each of the 43 police forces in England and Wales will elect the new commissioners - who will replace existing police authorities - every four years, starting in May 2012, for a maximum of two terms.

    The commissioners will be powerful new figures who can not only sack a chief constable if necessary but also set budgets and force priorities.

    The Home Office paper says that a new police and crime panel will monitor the commissioner in each force.
    The panels will be free to make any concerns public and in cases of serious misconduct to call in the Independent Police Complaints Commission to investigate their commissioner. But how these panels are to be appointed and who will serve on them remains a stumbling block.

    The Lib Dem home affairs spokesman, Tom Brake, said that without "tough checks and balances" the proposals could be seen as "a green light for the election of Judge Dredd characters more interested in populism than effective co-operative policing".
    In the Commons he warned that there was a danger of populist politicians turning forces into their personal fiefdom.

    The Association of Chief Police Officers greeted the proposals very cautiously saying they had to be examined in detail to see how they could "maintain operational independence against the practical reality of directly-elected police and crime commissioners." The Tory-led Local Government Association estimated the elections would cost 50m - the cost of 700 police officers.

    The home secretary defended her proposals insisting that by replacing "invisible police authorities" with elected commissioners would forge a direct link between the police and the public and replace bureaucracy with democratic accountability.

    But she seemed less attached to the idea floated in the police reform paper to recruit a "do-it-yourself" reserve army of policing volunteers, saying it was a matter for consultation. The scheme was first raised in a Conservative pre-election policy document which talked of creating a "new cadre of police reserves".

    The consultation paper says that neighbourhood policing is key to David Cameron's "big society ... we want more active citizens taking part in joint patrols with the police, looking out for their neighbours and passing on safety tips as part of neighbourhood watch groups or as community crime fighters," it says. May said she wanted to see more special constables, whose numbers have plummeted from 67,000 in the 1950s to 15,000 today.

    But the paper adds that they want to go further and explore new ideas to "unlock the potential of police volunteers in the workforce, for example, as police "reservists".

    It says they would be a "clear manifestation of the 'big society' in action". The public are also to be asked to get involved through "virtual beat meetings" with the police using Facebook and Twitter.

    The Home Office paper confirms a shakeup of national policing bodies with a new National Crime Agency to replace the existing Serious and Organised Crime Agency.

    The NCA will also have a border policing unit and take in other functions such as managing the national DNA database currently carried out by the National Police Improvement Agency, which is to be phased out.

    The Association of Chief Police Officers, which is currently a limited company, is to lose key functions including its role in monitoring domestic extremism and will be established on a more accountable basis involving the new commissioners.

  2. #2
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    Most coppers I know hate the specials.

    Something about giving someone, anyone, a bit of power & they always, always, abuse it - then having to clean up the mess they've left behind.

    I thought they were being hypocritical, but there it is.

  3. #3
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    ^ pretty much like the police then!

  4. #4
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    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jul/26/cameron-budget-cuts-diy-policing?CMP=AFCYAH

    David Cameron's "big society in action" answer to police budget cuts was revealed tonight as a plan to appeal to the public to take part in "do-it-yourself" policing ‑ and perhaps even go on patrol with uniformed officers.
    Sounds a bit like a clarion-call to "have-a-go" heroes ?

  5. #5
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    Hopefully the police unions can do some good for a change and put an end to this politically correct nonsense. The type of power hungry do gooder, naive idiots this would attract would be a menace to both the professional police officers and the public.

  6. #6
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    The special constables could be used for some non technical work. They are deployed in Canada with success and the UK proposal is based in part upon that working model. The Canadian model was based upon the UK, but cleaned up for Canadian sensibilities. These workers are unarmed and do not undertake any police activity like ticketing or crime suppression. Instead they are used for passive patrols at public functions and are more likely to assist with traffic, helping sick or disoriented people and just acting as a visible deterrent to yobs. If the UK goes back to the modified model then no one is going to protest the special constables.
    Kindness is spaying and neutering one's companion animals.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    a plan to appeal to the public to take part in "do-it-yourself" policing ‑ and perhaps even go on patrol with uniformed officers.


    Now don't do it again...



    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    Theresa May, says that she wants to explore new ideas including creating a reserve army of volunteers prepared to act as community crime fighters






    Oh what fun it'll be.....

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    directly-elected police and crime commissioners are in danger of giving a green light to "Judge Dredd populists".


    Even if I do look gay as fook....

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    The Home Office paper says that a new police and crime panel will monitor the commissioner in each force.
    Great, more quango's just like in the Thatcher/Major years...

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    But how these panels are to be appointed and who will serve on them remains a stumbling block.
    By utter morons who know nothing about the job or what's needed...slipping down again on the slope of 'conservatism' or was that 'cronyism'...


    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    The home secretary defended her proposals insisting that by replacing "invisible police authorities" with elected commissioners would forge a direct link between the police and the public and replace bureaucracy with democratic accountability.



    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    The scheme was first raised in a Conservative pre-election policy document which talked of creating a "new cadre of police reserves".


    Quote Originally Posted by jojo333
    The NCA will also have a border policing unit and take in other functions such as managing the national DNA database currently carried out by the National Police Improvement Agency, which is to be phased out.
    Then subsequently run by someone as inept as Group4....what a wonderful job they did with the prison's in the UK....
    "Opppps, lost another prisoner"



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  8. #8
    Thaiguy
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    I have always supported proper authorities controlling crime and assault but with modern judiciary and legislation all organised to protect the guilty and prosecute the victim I have had to change my mind completely.
    The inmates are in control of the asylum and nobody that has to abide by judicial regulations will have a chance in hell of taking back the streets, therefore police and special constables can be ruled null and void..
    We only have 2 options to live in a safe environment :
    1. really strong control and harsh permanent penalties for lawbreakers , thugs, rapists and those in general who prey on the weak the elderly and the innocent
    OR
    2.Take the law into our own hands , arm ourselves and organise our own unidentifiable protection force to hand out rough justice to those that would deny justice to others.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thaiguy View Post
    2.Take the law into our own hands , arm ourselves and organise our own unidentifiable protection force to hand out rough justice to those that would deny justice to others.
    I think you will find this is how the tribals view things in Pakistan's north west frontier and Afghanistan.
    i don't think it ever created a nice place to live. their's always some criminal family with bigger guns to make your life a misery

  10. #10
    Thaiguy
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    Quote Originally Posted by hazz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Thaiguy View Post
    2.Take the law into our own hands , arm ourselves and organise our own unidentifiable protection force to hand out rough justice to those that would deny justice to others.
    I think you will find this is how the tribals view things in Pakistan's north west frontier and Afghanistan.
    i don't think it ever created a nice place to live. their's always some criminal family with bigger guns to make your life a misery
    Your probably right but do you have any other answer ?
    Where I live it's out of control - Bangkok at night is a retirement home and kindergarten compared to Surfers Paradise or Coolangatta.
    Tell all your friends not to come to the Gold Coast of Australia for holidays because it's too dangerous - maybe when the hip pocket nerve starts to hurt we might get some control of the streets?

  11. #11
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    Unhappy Confused

    Hi,

    Stumbled across this post via Google and it made me register and post a resonse.

    "Bringing back the special constables in my opinion will not work, as things have changed drastically since they last used them."

    They (as in the government) are using them right now!!

    Special Constables have been around since 1831 when an act was passed and have been used every day since.
    I am a Special Constable and was last on duty on Friday night arresting people trying to steal cars.

    There are currently 18,000 of us around the UK performing duties that the regular police force undertake, so to propose bringing us back wouldn't work, we never went away!
    Most coppers I know hate the specials.

    Something about giving someone, anyone, a bit of power & they always, always, abuse it - then having to clean up the mess they've left behind.

    I thought they were being hypocritical, but there it is.
    Most coppers I know (and I work with them during my day job and as a volunteer) appreciate the help we provide. As always there are some that ruin it for the masses and the recent coverage of a Special Constable who has been imprisoned for perjury doesn't help, but that is one of the first cases I have seen for a while in amongst one of the head of the Met being arrested and various other regular police officers.

    I personally enjoy making a difference and most people can't even tell the difference between me and a regular officer as we wear the same uniform and perform the same duties.

    Many Specials have been killed and injured whilst on duty and to say that it wouldn't work bringing us back is an outrage to their memories.

    Apologies for hijacking this thread but the original poster needs to do some homework before making this outrageous comment and just think next time you ring the police would you be able to tell if a Regular constable or a Special Constable turned up could you tell?

    Rob

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by robl
    Apologies for hijacking this thread but the original poster needs to do some homework before making this outrageous comment and just think next time you ring the police would you be able to tell if a Regular constable or a Special Constable turned up could you tell?
    I wouldn't worry too much, Rod. People who come from criminal families are always putting down those who try to keep law and order.

  13. #13
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    Same same tourist police volunteers.
    Psycological issues?

  14. #14
    The Pikey Hunter
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    Quote Originally Posted by robl
    next time you ring the police would you be able to tell if a Regular constable or a Special Constable turned up could you tell?
    The Special will be the one with the extra shiny shoes and wearing rubber underwear.

  15. #15
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    Blue band round the hat and head further up arse than usual.

  16. #16
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    Apart from criminals who gives a crap if the guy in the uniform is a special or profecional copper, as long as they are there doing the job they do and keeping the scum at bay I'm happy, I can't understand why ordinary folk would complain.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by the dogcatcher View Post
    Blue band round the hat and head further up arse than usual.
    Blue band around hats would refer to PCSO's (Police community Support Officers) they are completely different to Special Constables!

    Specials have full police powers PCSO's don't. My uniform just says in big letters POLICE. Apart from a very small crown and SC logo on my epaulette there is no difference, handcuffs, baton, CS spray everything.

    And yes some do get drunk on power, but thankfully that is the minority and not the majority.

  18. #18
    The Pikey Hunter
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    Quote Originally Posted by robl
    Apart from a very small cock and SC logo on my epaulette there is no difference, handcuffs, baton, CS spray everything.
    Yes, we knew that, but thanks for confirming.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerbil View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by robl
    Apart from a very small cock and SC logo on my epaulette there is no difference, handcuffs, baton, CS spray everything.
    Yes, we knew that, but thanks for confirming.
    Ha ha ha, nearly fell off my chair laughing.

    It is so easy to bash people when you don't know them and are quite anonymous on the internet.

    However the name gerbil, what does that suggest about the size of yours?

  20. #20
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    Maybe there is some confusion to the general public about what a 'special constable' actually is, robl.

    As far as I'm aware, in the past there have been paid special constables who were not volunteer police officers. The Atomic Energy Authority had it's own constabulary I believe who were made up of 'sworn in' special constables, as far as I'm aware that has now changed to the Civil Nuclear Constabulary and those special constables have lost their 'special constable status' as it's duties are to provide law enforcement and security for civil nuclear establishments and materials?

    I have heard that special constables can also be paid through bounty payments and that in some forces this payment mechanism has been in place for some time.

    You have all the legal powers of your regular counterparts when on and off duty but you are not allowed to carry out certain aspects of the regular police forces job, such as driving a motor vehicle in pursuit of another?


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