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crippen

All pussy's are dangerous. They can suck your money right out of your pocket!

tsicar

yes, and i have personal experience of waking up with pussy all over my face.

one isolated incident of a (probably starved) python eating a kid, and now the poor bloody things have to be hunted and killed. that tosser who used this incident and the emotion he might stir up as a reason to try get the everglades rid of burmese pythons probably stands to make a buck out of it, somewhere along the line.
if, as an alien invader species, it needs to be controlled to preserve indigenous wildlife, then so be it.
why doesn't he just call for the extermination of alligators? surely a large one would be just as likely to consider a two year old kid to be a tasty snack?
burmese pythons were very common in the part of isaan where i lived, and there did not seem to be any cases of them eating the natives' kids.
NOT dangerous animals.
wild animals kept in captivity have to be managed properly, and a snake CAN NEVER BE TAMED!
they can get used to being handled, but never tamed.
my pet boa, if not handled regularly (about every three days, minimum) would bite the shit out of me, and so did the burmese pythons i kept in thailand.
the "incident" was an isolated and unfortunate accident, and the animal should not be vilified for doing what comes naturally to any hungry animal.

it's kinda like a loaded gun.
guns are not dangerous, only irresponsible gun owners.

same can be said for owners of dogs. i am willing to bet that for every one toddler eaten by a python, there will be at least 500 killed by dogs (EXTREMELY conservative estimate, since i have no idea of the figures). -not a reason to lobby for the elimination of all pet dogs, though, is it?

Sakeopete

Same can be said for dogs, far more children are injured or killed by them. But hey dogs are cute and furry.

tsicar

agreed

i think pythons are far cuter than dogs.
stunning and fascinating animals, and they don't bark or make demands on humans.
most people who do not actively seek them out, or accidentally happen upon one in the wild or in the chicken coop, will never get to see one, even though they are all around you in thailand.
you may share a house with a snake for years without ever meeting up with it, and once you do, and you kill it, you and your family ll be at far higher risk via disease etc from the rats and mice which will take its place, than you ever were from the snake.
normally, no snake will seek out a human to attack or eat, and their shared presence in an human environment should be welcomed for the benefits it brings.
pray what, if any benefit does a starving, mangy thai soidog bring to society?
(apologies to nr, just trying to make a point here)

Mr R Sole

^ seconded

Panda

I dont mind having them around as they keep the rats down.
But once they finish off the rats, the bigger ones start on the chooks and ducks. So thats when they get relocated to snake heaven.

Had a big one living in the roof who used to come out at night. Once he started strangling the ducks and just leaving them there dead on the ground with their guts coming out their arse, it was on. I set up a snare at his exit hole in the fascia board. He broke a 50lb fishing line snare first time. So upped the strength to 100lb line. He wouldn't come out for a week after the first attempt, but eventually got him again with the stronger line which he broke again.

So set up another snare with 200lb stainless trace wire. The bugger knew it was a trap by now and would only stick his head out as far as the noose for weeks.
I could see him sticking his nose out from my lounge room window each evening, but he couldn't see me because I was underneath him.

Eventually he did a runner and bailed out one night while I was asleep, never to return. I am counting that as a victory. Found a skin he had shed in the garden that measured 3.2 meters. Almost wish we had him back now because we have got a lot of rats again. Another one will move in soon though.

S Landreth

Hunters get go-ahead to kill pythons in Big Cypress

Following up Florida's creation of a python posse, federal agencies will let hunters kill the invasive snakes in a national refuge.

The python posse is turning into a brigade.

The federal government on Thursday said it would open up Big Cypress National Wildlife Refuge, which borders Everglades National Park, to a pilot program allowing licensed hunters to ''terminate'' any python they encounter.

It's part of a broad program to control the invasive snakes, laid out Thursday by Interior Secretary Ken Salazar. The announcement comes days after Florida Sen. Bill Nelson called for a controlled hunt in Everglades National Park and state wildlife managers announced they would permit expert trappers to kill snakes on state marshland.

The program includes many things park scientists have been doing for years to battle the Burmese import: outreach and hot lines for the public; studies of python movements, habits and threats to the ecosystem; and programs to design python traps and sexual scents that might be used to bait them.

But Salazar, who pledged to tackle the snake problem during his first visit to the Everglades in May, also vowed to seek more funding to expand efforts.

For instance, federal scientists are working with the University of Florida to develop drone aircraft with thermal imaging to pinpoint the difficult-to-detect snakes.

The park also might add to the dozen agents who have removed hundreds of pythons during the past few years, and will consider whether to expand the state's expert posse program into Everglades National Park.

One hurdle is a park prohibition against hunting. But the pilot program will open federal land in the Big Cypress, where seasonal hunting and guns are allowed. Because no laws protect python, there is technically nothing to prohibit properly licensed hunters from shooting them now, but the program would formalize the effort and data collection.

''We are committed to aggressively combating this threat, including having trained and well-supervised volunteers hunt down and remove snakes,'' Salazar said in a release.

Eradicating python will be difficult. Scientists say less than 5 percent of the estimated 100,000-plus snakes in the park are ever seen. Hunting alone likely won't do it. ''There is no one silver bullet,'' said Paul Souza, field supervisor for the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

Link: http://www.miamiherald.com/news/southflorida/story/1145344.html

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Panda

There could be an export market in Asia there.
Hunters armed with CO2 fire extinguishers could freeze the suckers on site for export to Thailand.

I do have to wonder how well thermal imaging from drone aircraft would show up on a cold blooded creature?

Panda

Sniffer dogs could be a useful way of tracking down the pythons. Pythons in particular stink. They usually have a lair where they lay up during the day or for longer periods after they have had a good feed. Sniffer dogs trained to find python scat would certainly lead them to the pythons lair.

When I was a kid I used to take our cattle dog snake hunting. The dog would sniff them out and I would dispose of them. On a good morning I could account for up to a dozen snakes. Hunting alone I would be lucky to find one. So I know for sure that dogs do work. Wouldn't be too hard to grid map an area and work through it. Perhaps someone should email the Florida wildlife folks and suggest dogs?

The Gentleman Scamp

RIP - The python that is, it was just doing what came naturally in an environment that was against its will. The father on the other hand was doing what comes naturally in a situation that he created.

One less human in the world anyway, good.

robuzo

They do have dogs trained to sniff out snakes; they aren't that dumb. In places like the northern Florida prairie you could grid map an area and find pythons pretty easily were they there. The Everglades, aka the "River of Grass" is a different story. It's a huge place and unbelievably hostile habitat most of the year; either underwater (shallow) or on fire in lots of places during the dry season.

Still, not impossible. I have a novel idea for getting rid of a number of invasive species: issue permits to hunters (of course, Florida Wildlife officials don't have that option for the Glades or Big Cypress, which are federally managed). Python skin is worth quite a bit, I think. If you want to clear the snakeheads, oscars, and discuss out of the springs in the state parks, let people spear them. I have seen snakeheads as fat as my arm in Alexander Springs (shucks, that's Federal, too). They seem to know you can't touch them, which is a shame because coming out of the sweetest water I've ever swum in they probably taste really nice.

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Panda

Yes Snakehead is a delicious eating fish.

Re the Everglades being a a difficult region to use dogs during the seasonal floods, I do acknowledge that. But the thing is that while the Burmese python is semi aquatic, it does like to rest up on higher ground where it could be vulnerable to discovery by sniffer dogs. Not saying dogs are the only answer, but I do think they could be a very valuable part of the solution.

Milkman

The Burmese python population has grown a lot in Florida. Big snakes. Can be aggressive. It's an issue to deal with.

As a pet with a kid. Quite stupid.

robuzo

I agree. I find it kind of odd that the Burmese pythons are doing so well in SoFla, because in Thailand they do like to climb (until they get really big) and there aren't very many trees in which they can do so in the Glades (outside the cypress swamps). Searches of the big "hammocks" during the wet season might be the ticket (I expect the rangers have thought of that, they are pretty well-informed). I think it (fortunately) just gets too cold for the other giant snakes to thrive in Florida, and the Burmese also appear to be very adaptable. South Florida gets a major cold spell about every 5 years or so, which helps keep the exotics down, plus the Glades being an extremely predator-rich environment (almost all predators of one kind or another, in which things eaten as young grow up to eat their species' predators) probably helps. I think manpower and money are the big obstacles, plus the fact that so much of the land is federally managed.

S Landreth

The constrictor stretched 17 feet, 2 inches and measured 26 inches around at its thickest point. It weighed in at a staggering 207 pounds

snip

Florida wildlife managers pointed to the find as the latest, and largest, evidence that the exotic snake, which has settled into the Everglades, is spreading across the state.

"The capture of this large python shows us how well these snakes can thrive in the wild and create a dangerous situation after illegal release or escape,'' said Rodney Barreto, chairman of the of Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission. "It also illustrates why the FWC is partnering with other agencies to implement python control measures in South Florida.''

Link: Biggest python yet is bagged -- a 17-footer - Breaking News - MiamiHerald.com

mordred

It isn't the burmese pythons we have to worry about populating the everglades. We do need to be concerned about reticulated pythons as they get much larger and are more prone to bite. Retics aren't sold as much here in the states due to their large size and behavior. For that reason burmese are sold more often in the pet trade as are red tail boas which are found in Mexico and central and south america. I believe both retics and burmese can be found in Thailand, but I've only seen one burmese in a tree. Anyone come into contact with reticulated pythons in Thailand?

They are all beautiful animals and their power should be respected.

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robuzo

I've bumped into retics in Khao Yai (where I helped a 3-meter snake get across the road) and Koh Phangan (was in a coffee shop when they pulled one out of a cabinet in the kitchen), and recall when a big one caused a stir crossing road near the Dusit Thani a few years back BKK. I don't think they are hardy enough to survive the cold spells that hit South Florida nearly every year- Burmese pythons can brumate, which is close to hibernation, for a couple of months, but I don't think retics can do so. Maybe they could manage in the southernmost part of the Glades along the coast or in the Keys, which are more or less frost-proof, but there would have to be enough released animals to meet and breed. Anecdotally, I noticed last spring that the population of iguanas was down in my neighborhood in Palm Beach County (their numbers were getting ridiculously high) and the papaya trees that grow near the beach (the only place they will grow successfully) were badly damaged, in both cases probably due to an especially harsh winter.

WEC242/UW286: Burmese Pythons in South Florida: Scientific Support for Invasive Species Management
"Other large nonnative snakes—such as the common boa (Boa constrictor), green anaconda (Eunectes murinus), yellow anaconda (Eunectes notaeus), and reticulated python (Python reticulatus)—have been observed in the wild in South Florida, but only Burmese pythons and common boas are known to be breeding. Boas have been breeding since approximately 1970 in the Charles Deering Estate at Cutler, southern Miami-Dade County. Boas have also been reported elsewhere in South Florida, but without evidence of breeding."

There probably aren't more boas or ball pythons because people don't as often cut them loose when they become adults. Even Burmese can be kept after adulthood because they become used to people- I once "handled" an 18-footer that a guy had overfed trying to break the weight record; he had brought to the Miami Serpentarium to try to sell it to Bill Haas. And you are right, that is definitely not the case with retics or anacondas (especially the latter) which are much less even-tempered than Burmese pythons- the bite of a large constrictor can leave a very nasty wound that easily goes septic.

There are experts who are afraid that we will soon face breeding populations of retics, so I guess we'll have to wait and see. I don't think that poses any more immediate danger to humans than does a population of Burmese, but it could be a threat to native species like Key Deer or panthers. Of course, it could also provide some needed predation for the droves of non-native wild pig hybrids that cause a lot more damage to state game lands than do exotic snakes.

S Landreth

While watching the news on CNN last Friday they announced they would be doing a special on the python problem in Florida, next week (week of August 17th) if anyone is interested.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/tech/2009/08/03/zarrella.python.hunters.cnn?iref=videosearch

S Landreth

Couple charged with third-degree murder, manslaughter in python-related child death


OXFORD - The mother of a 2-year-old Sumter County girl asphyxiated by a Burmese python and the woman's live-in boyfriend were charged with third-degree murder and manslaughter in connection with the death, officials said Monday.

Jaren Ashley Hare, 19, and Charles Jason Darnell, 32, also face child-abuse counts, according to the Sumter County Sheriff's Office. The charges come nearly two months after the July 1 the death of little Shaiunna Hare, who was killed by the snake in her crib.

The mother turned herself into the Wildwood Police Department Monday after a warrant was issued by the 5th Judicial Circuit State Attorney's Office. Darnell, who was already incarcerated at the Sumter County Jail on unrelated narcotics charges, was notified of the three new charges late Monday.

Link: http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/florida/orl-bk-python-death-charges-082409,0,7833384.story

robuzo

I don't know the details, but on the face of it I can't see the point in prosecuting these people, unless it is to discourage the keeping of large snakes. That's not a bad idea, although it seems a bass ackwards way of going about it. Maybe there is more than meets the eye if the mother is anywhere near normal I expect she's suffered enough already and will continue to.