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  1. #1
    Balls to Monty
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    Breivik gives Nazi salute in court challenge jail isolation

    Jailed Norwegian mass murderer Anders Behring Breivik has given a Nazi salute upon returning to court to argue that his isolation violates his rights.
    The right-wing extremist says he is being held in inhuman conditions but the state rejects this.



    Breivik killed 77 people in 2011 when he bombed central Oslo before going on a shooting spree at a Labour Youth camp on the island of Utoeya.
    He was sentenced to 21 years in prison in 2012.

    Tuesday's hearing, in a prison gym converted into a court, marks his first public appearance since then.

    He entered the court in a grey suit shortly before 09:00 (08:00 GMT). He shook hands with his lawyers and made the Nazi salute after police removed his handcuffs.

    Breivik, 37, is mainly challenging the government over his solitary confinement, as well as over general conditions including what he claims is the excessive use of handcuffs.

    Image copyright AFP Image caption The case is being heard in a prison gym that has been converted into a court In his opening statement, Breivik's lawyer Oystein Storrvik said his client's punishment was worse than the death penalty, which is outlawed in Norway.

    Breivik accuses the Norwegian government of breaching two clauses of the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR).

    One of the clauses guarantees the right to respect for "private and family life" and "correspondence", while the other prohibits "inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment".

    Media captionMads Andenas, whose niece survived Brievik's attack, said his appeal was "something we have to go through" In court, Mr Storrvik cited an earlier case involving the French government and Ilich Ramirez Sanchez, an imprisoned Venezuelan left-wing militant better known as "Carlos the Jackal".

    In that case, the European Court of Human Rights ruled in favour of arguments that solitary confinement had violated some of the prisoner's rights. Mr Storrvik argued that Ramirez Sanchez had nonetheless been held in better conditions than Breivik.

    Breivik is the only prisoner in the high-security wing of Skien prison, about 100km (60 miles) south-west of the capital Oslo. Authorities say Breivik's correspondence is censored to stop him setting up an "extremist network".
    His visits are almost all with professionals across a glass partition. According to his lawyer, Breivik's mother was the only person allowed to visit him without being separated by the glass screen.

    The attorney general's office has insisted that Breivik's prison conditions are "well within the limits of what is permitted" under the convention.
    The court hearing is expected to run until Friday. Breivik is expected to testify on Wednesday.

    If the court decides that Breivik's prison conditions are so strict that they cause him harm and violate his human rights, it could order an easing of restrictions.



    Image copyright Reuters Image caption Breivik is currently serving his sentence at Skien prison, where a typical cell looks like this

    Last September, Breivik threatened to starve himself to death in protest at his treatment in prison.

    His cell at Skien prison has a TV and computer but he has no access to the internet.

    In a letter to media outlets in Norway and Sweden, he said he was kept in almost total isolation, with time outside his cell limited to one hour a day.
    He said the harsh prison conditions had forced him to drop out of a political science course at the University of Oslo.

    Breivik was first held at Ila Detention and Security Prison near Oslo before being moved to Skien in 2013. At Ila, he also complained of being held in "inhumane" conditions.

    In a letter to prison authorities, he said his cell was poorly decorated and had no view. He also complained that his coffee was served cold, he did not have enough butter for his bread, and he was not allowed moisturiser.

    Breivik gives Nazi salute in court return to challenge jail isolation - BBC News


    I do not understand why this affront to humanity is not simply offed.

    It is like some contorted political exercise in showing how nice we can be to individuals who do not deserve the privilege of human consciousness.

    If he were put to sleep quietly and painlessly then the world would move on and this preposterous waste of legal resources and process could be put to better use.

  2. #2
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    Amazing that he's got any rights at all.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    Amazing that he's got any rights at all.

    Rights. Whatever that is.


    Termination with extreme prejudice is the only right he should be afforded.

  4. #4
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    He should have the right to share a cell with Charles Bronson, he was looking for a cell mate

    Britain's most infamous prisoner Charles Bronson will meet Parole Board bosses this month to plead for an end to his solitary confinement.
    The 62-year-old is currently on 23-hour lockdown at HMP Wakefield, banned from associating from any fellow inmates due to his violent reputation
    .

    Prisoner Charles Bronson meets parole bosses to plead for end to solitary confinement after nearly four decades - Mirror Online

  5. #5
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    Norway should pay Thailand to house this idiot at Bang Kwang.

  6. #6
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    don't believe he'll ever walk the streets again.

    out and out nutter.

    odd that he even gets media attention.
    friends and relatives don't need to be reminded of the slaughter and his childish
    whining.

  7. #7
    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda
    Amazing that he's got any rights at all.
    amazing anyone actually gives a sh1t about him - why give him news coverage , as that is what he wants

    being considered irrelavent is his worst reality

  8. #8
    Balls to Monty
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    I think the notion of western justice has been perverted by the convoluted nonsense of Christianity.

    We have a Christian ideological notion drummed into us that no matter how bad someone is we should rise above it and not seek revenge against them and turn the other cheek. This is not morally virtuous; it is absurd.

    There is nothing morally wrong with seeking to inflict suffering or death on an individual who has not only broken society's laws in the most heinous fashion but seems to take delight in the attention it brings him and revels in the absurd manner in which the 'justice' system of Norway treats him like a guest of honour.

    There is nothing morally wrong with ending this individual's life. It would be a just outcome for society, for the victims and for setting an example to society that outrageous acts of violence will meet with a proportionate response. It should be done painlessly since we are not barbarians feeding criminals to the lions for gory entertainment but it should be done nonetheless.

  9. #9
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    I'll pull the trigger.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looper
    I think the notion of western justice has been perverted by the convoluted nonsense of Christianity.
    Western Justice is wholly based on Christianity, you sententious twerp. It hasn't been perverted by Christianity, it's derived from Christianity.

  11. #11
    MrG
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looper
    There is nothing morally wrong with ending this individual's life. It would be a just outcome for society, for the victims and for setting an example to society that outrageous acts of violence will meet with a proportionate response. It should be done painlessly since we are not barbarians feeding criminals to the lions for gory entertainment but it should be done nonetheless.
    Painless or not, it is the obligation of any society to deal with problems better than our own worst criminals.
    Yes, there was a trial.
    Yes, his death could be painless.
    Even yes, he deserves it.
    But it is still dealing with killing by killing and calling it justice.

  12. #12
    Balls to Monty
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrB0b View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Looper
    I think the notion of western justice has been perverted by the convoluted nonsense of Christianity.
    Western Justice is wholly based on Christianity, you sententious twerp. It hasn't been perverted by Christianity, it's derived from Christianity.
    Hey BoobleBrain,

    Here is a how it works.

    Humans have a naturally evolved sense of right and wrong and morality.

    Humans organise rules in their societies based on an intuition of those evolved moral rights and wrongs and on higher level abstract thinking based on those intuitions.

    Religion is a side show that usurps (among many other things) the notion of a being the source of right and wrong (good and evil).

    Religion grows in parallel to the communal social rules. Those social rules eventually end up as a justice system. The rules and religion become badly intertwined in most societies (until religion's bluff is called at some point) but religion is not the source of moral right and wrong or the source of the social rules which eventually result in a justice system. It is religion which constructs a confection of lies to match the intuited sense of what is right and wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrG
    Yes, his death could be painless. Even yes, he deserves it.
    If he deserves it then why is it not reasonable to end his life?

    If it is done painlessly and his life simply ends quietly and peacefully then society can take comfort in the fact that the people who offend society's rules in the most heinous ways are dealt with in a proportionate manner. If I was a relative and had to listen to this man whining about the quality of his computer and TV in his private cell I would be seriously thinking about taking the law into my own hands if the opportunity arose. This is the danger that can befall society when judicial systems become overly obsessed with how liberally they can get away with treating offenders.

    Some people will even take a macabre pleasure in seeing his suffering or death but I don't see that that is so morally wrong. Revenge is a naturally evolved human emotion. It serves a purpose and if it is continually thwarted then the stability of society is put at risk.

  13. #13
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    it is the obligation of any society to deal with problems better than our own worst criminals.
    so how on earth do you deal with the man who meticulously planned and then calmly and over the space of an hour took the lives of over 70 young people who he had never met before other than by pushing him through the same gates of hell that he pushed his victims through.

    his punishment should be up to the families of the victims, when you step outside the bounds of decency as proscribed by society, you automatically lose your right to any treatment based on "human rights".

    for what he did he needs to suffer and suffer hard for a long time.

  14. #14
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    I would probably give him inbound only internet. But if he wants to starve himself to death I would be happy to let him do so.

    I suppose Norway is a bit cold for the Arizona style tent city and Bologna sandwiches.

  15. #15
    Pronce. PH said so AGAIN!
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    Giving a Nazi salute to back up his complaint about being detained in inhumane conditions probably isn't going to get him many brownie points..

  16. #16
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taxexile
    his punishment should be up to the families of the victims, when you step outside the bounds of decency as proscribed by society, you automatically lose your right to any treatment based on "human rights".
    Ah good 'ole fashioned eye-for-an-eye 'ole Testament styleeee revenge. I mean justice.

  17. #17
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    Surprisingly he was only sentenced to prison for 21 years. Norway is going to have a problem when he is released in 2033 before he turns 55 if he doesn't die in prison...hopefully he is not released early .

    I can well understand a complaint about being served cold coffee though possibly the prison authorities don't want prisoners to scald themselves (or others).
    Room without a view...that is a story for another day. Surprise he didn't complain about his hard mattress.

  18. #18
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeeCoffee
    Surprisingly he was only sentenced to prison for 21 years. Norway is going to have a problem when he is released in 2033 before he turns 55 if he doesn't die in prison...hopefully he is not released early
    He was only sentenced to 21 years as that's the legally mandated maximum sentence in Norway, but that's not to be confused with only serving 21 years.

    His sentence can be extended indefinitely. He will never get out.

  19. #19
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    well, you have to ask yourself if you had lost a child in that massacre, and whilst you grieved and relived the day of the massacre every day for many years, would you want him to be living a relatively comfortable life with food, warmth, entertainment, company, room service, family life and all the other benefits that the "human rights" brigade deem necessary, even for people like that, or would you rather he suffered, maybe felt anxiety and fear as his day of execution approached, felt endless despair knowing that he would never get out of jail or have the luxury of human contact or the choice of what to eat, where to go etc.

  20. #20
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Revenge is a natural inclination but it's called the 'justice system' for a reason and is based on processes and facts not emotive responses.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntRobertson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by PeeCoffee
    Surprisingly he was only sentenced to prison for 21 years. Norway is going to have a problem when he is released in 2033 before he turns 55 if he doesn't die in prison...hopefully he is not released early
    He was only sentenced to 21 years as that's the legally mandated maximum sentence in Norway, but that's not to be confused with only serving 21 years.

    His sentence can be extended indefinitely. He will never get out.
    Thank you Ant. I wasn't aware of that.

  22. #22
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeeCoffee
    I wasn't aware of that.
    It's a bit confusing to be fair. I remember at the time it caused a bit of a stir as people - quite understandably - were upset at the notion of someone only serving 21 years for killing 77 people.

    But basically he won't be released if he's 'still deemed a threat' and that will undoubtedly be never.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntRobertson View Post
    Revenge is a natural inclination but it's called the 'justice system' for a reason and is based on processes and facts not emotive responses.
    whilst justice may better serve society when the aggrieved are calling for the hands of shoplifters to be amputated, i believe in a case like this the emotional needs of those affected by this crime should come before the kind of justice that puts brevers in a what amounts to living in the confines of a relatively comfortable cheap hotel room for the foreseeable future.

    the fact that he is already complaining about his incarceration indicates that he is suffering some emotional distress as he considers his needs are not being met.

    but real justice would ramp up his emotional discomfort levels a few notches for good measure

  24. #24
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    If the scumbag doesn't like solitary , put him in general population and see how he likes that ,fuk him.

  25. #25
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    This fiend is invaluable to the human race and to be studied psychiatrically and medically to find out what drives human beings to commit such crimes.

    Treat the guy with what he wants and use him as a guinee pig.

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