Mein Kampf

[Norton]

Mein Kampf hits stores in tense Germany

By Damien McGuinness
Berlin correspondent
8 January 2016

It's one of the most talked about publications of the year. It's not a new book. And it's not even a well-written book. But Mein Kampf, by Adolf Hitler, which hits German bookshops for the first time in 70 years on Friday, is certainly attracting attention.

Hitler's anti-Semitic tirade is seen as the forerunner to the Holocaust. But that is also why historians want it republished.

Hitler wrote it mostly while in prison in the mid-1920s, and academics say it helps explain the Nazis' crazed ideology when they came to power less than a decade later.

As such, they say, it's a crucial academic text. Not pleasant reading, but essential to understanding the Holocaust and Hitler's brutal rule.

Surprisingly, some Jewish groups have also supported this edition.

This is an annotated, critical version, with thousands of academic notes.

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions, still found in second-hand bookshops or online. Those are certainly not critical. The idea is that republishing Mein Kampf will help undermine it.

Mein Kampf hits stores in tense Germany - BBC News

[DrB0b]

^ And once again all goes quiet after the gullible are shown up for being gullible. As usual they'll be back soon, pretending they were never caught out.

Mein Kampf hits stores in tense Germany

Don't really see the relevance, the fact that it was going to be republished was announced this time last year. While I can see DE becoming a lot more right-wing over the immigration situation I seriously doubt many Germans are keen on a resurgence of NAZIsm

[Horatio Hornblower]

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

Mein Kampf hits stores in tense Germany

By Damien McGuinness
Berlin correspondent
8 January 2016

It's one of the most talked about publications of the year. It's not a new book. And it's not even a well-written book. But Mein Kampf, by Adolf Hitler, which hits German bookshops for the first time in 70 years on Friday, is certainly attracting attention.

Hitler's anti-Semitic tirade is seen as the forerunner to the Holocaust. But that is also why historians want it republished.

Hitler wrote it mostly while in prison in the mid-1920s, and academics say it helps explain the Nazis' crazed ideology when they came to power less than a decade later.

As such, they say, it's a crucial academic text. Not pleasant reading, but essential to understanding the Holocaust and Hitler's brutal rule.

Surprisingly, some Jewish groups have also supported this edition.

This is an annotated, critical version, with thousands of academic notes.

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions, still found in second-hand bookshops or online. Those are certainly not critical. The idea is that republishing Mein Kampf will help undermine it.

Mein Kampf hits stores in tense Germany - BBC News

[DrB0b]

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

[Horatio Hornblower]

May I recommend you do you homework Andreas Wirsching is a jew.

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

[Horatio Hornblower]

There was no issue with the copyright it was held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945,

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

[DrB0b]

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

There was no issue with the copyright it was held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

[Horatio Hornblower]

nope once again your wrong it was outlawed for publication in 1945

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

There was no issue with the copyright it was held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

[DrB0b]

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

There was no issue with the copyright it was held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

nope once again your wrong it was outlawed for publication in 1945

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

[Horatio Hornblower]

‘We made the anti-Mein Kampf’

?We made the anti-Mein Kampf? | The Jewish Chronicle




By Igal Avidan, December 31, 2015
The academics leading the project to publish the first edition of Mein Kampf in German since the end of the Second World War have argued that their version will be an "antidote" to the hate-filled original.
Christian Hartmann, one of four historians who worked full-time for three years to create a fully annotated edition of Adolf Hitler's manifesto for publication on January 8, said that the book would be the "anti-Mein Kampf".
On December 31, the copyright on the book, held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945, expired. In preparation, the state of Bavaria commissioned the Munich-based Institut für Zeitgeschichte (IfZ) to create a version that rebuts and dissects the original.
IfZ director Andreas Wirsching explained in an address to the Foreign Correspondents Society in Berlin: "It would be irresponsible to allow Hitler's book, which from 2016 will be in the public domain, to circulate uncommented through the German media.
"Our critical edition confronts Hitler's lies through counter-statement and in footnotes. It destroys the myth around the book by exposing the fatal results of Hitler's racist propaganda, for example in the notorious Nuremberg Laws."
Both Mr Wirsching and Mr Hartmann agree that the new edition is necessary "as an antidote" given the growing popularity of the far-right in Germany.
Hitler wrote Mein Kampf as a heroic epic for his followers after his failed coup in 1923. In it he describes his - partly faked - background as a soldier and revolutionary, and urges a war against the enemies of the "superior" Germans - the Marxists and the Jews, whom he describes as "the calamity of the world".
Until its publication was outlawed in 1945, the book sold 12 million copies worldwide.
Mr Wirsching said Germany intended to maintain its ban on publication of the original, adding that: "The German democracy is stable enough to accept our critical edition."
Yad Vashem has expressed support for the new edition, said Mr Wirsching, but added that some Holocaust survivors reject it "because Mein Kampf is a symbol and it will be published in Germany, the country of the perpetrators".
He stressed, however, that the book was available on the internet and in second-hand bookshops anyway, "so we want to confront it as intensively as possible, which is what the Shoah victims would have wished".
In 2012, German historians discussed the plan to create the annotated edition with representatives of Jewish organisations, and most Jewish and Israeli historians backed the project.
Some 250 copies have been ordered; the IfZ said that any profits would be donated to appropriate charities.
Mr Wirsching said he welcomed translations and added that the IfZ plans to produce an online edition for 2017.

[Cujo]

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!

And without this republication, the only hard copies available in Germany would be the pre-1945 Nazi editions

Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

There was no issue with the copyright it was held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

nope once again your wrong it was outlawed for publication in 1945

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

You are wrong.
(again )

[DrB0b]

Wondering why they were talking about the copyright expiring recently makes sense, no doubt published by a Jew group now.

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!




Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

There was no issue with the copyright it was held by the Bavarian finance ministry since 1945

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

nope once again your wrong it was outlawed for publication in 1945

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

You are wrong.
(again)

Prove it. Quote the edict banning it as opposed to the copyright holders ban on publication while copyright lasted.

Here's a start.

Mein Kampf
Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria, which acquired the copyright after Hitler's death in 1945 since it was the location of his official residence. The copyright will expire at the end of 2015. Private ownership and trade is allowed so long as it does not "promote hatred or war".

Owning and buying the book in Germany is legal. Trading in old copies is legal as well, unless it is done in such a fashion as to "promote hatred or war." In particular, the unmodified edition is not covered by §86 StGB that forbids dissemination of means of propaganda of unconstitutional organisations, since it is a "pre-constitutional work" and as such cannot be opposed to the free and democratic basic order, according to a 1979 decision of the Federal Court of Justice of Germany.

Off you go...

[Cujo]

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!




Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

You are wrong.
(again)

Prove it. Quote the edict banning it as opposed to the copyright holders ban on publication while copyright lasted.

Here's a start.

Mein Kampf
Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria, which acquired the copyright after Hitler's death in 1945 since it was the location of his official residence. The copyright will expire at the end of 2015. Private ownership and trade is allowed so long as it does not "promote hatred or war".

Owning and buying the book in Germany is legal. Trading in old copies is legal as well, unless it is done in such a fashion as to "promote hatred or war." In particular, the unmodified edition is not covered by §86 StGB that forbids dissemination of means of propaganda of unconstitutional organisations, since it is a "pre-constitutional work" and as such cannot be opposed to the free and democratic basic order, according to a 1979 decision of the Federal Court of Justice of Germany.

Off you go...

As you say, owning and buying the book is quite legal.
But thank you for proving my point
Up until now

Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria,

But you are correct in that now that the states copyright has expired it is legal to publish it.

[Cujo]

Wonder what copies of original editions fetch these days.

[DrB0b]

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

You are wrong.
(again)

Prove it. Quote the edict banning it as opposed to the copyright holders ban on publication while copyright lasted.

Here's a start.

Mein Kampf
Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria, which acquired the copyright after Hitler's death in 1945 since it was the location of his official residence. The copyright will expire at the end of 2015. Private ownership and trade is allowed so long as it does not "promote hatred or war".

Owning and buying the book in Germany is legal. Trading in old copies is legal as well, unless it is done in such a fashion as to "promote hatred or war." In particular, the unmodified edition is not covered by §86 StGB that forbids dissemination of means of propaganda of unconstitutional organisations, since it is a "pre-constitutional work" and as such cannot be opposed to the free and democratic basic order, according to a 1979 decision of the Federal Court of Justice of Germany.

Off you go...

As you say, owning and buying the book is quite legal.
But thank you for proving my point
Up until now

Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria,

But you are correct in that now that the states copyright has expired it is legal to publish it.

Well done for finally admitting that the book was never, in fact, legally banned, even though you had to be told several times before you could finally understand you did get there in the end. Doesn't it feel better to finally admit the truth?

I wonder if poor little Horatio will be man enough to admit he was wrong too, somehow I doubt it.

[Takeovers]

I have just looked it up. The issue that will be published will be legal. But legal because it is heavily commented. Publishing the original version without comments remains illegal.

Source:
Adolf Hitler: Neuausgabe von "Mein Kampf" soll 2016 erscheinen |[at]ZEIT ONLINE

Unkommentierte Ausgabe bleibt verboten

Im Sommer des vergangenen Jahres hatten die Justizminister der Bundesländer entschieden, die unkommentierte Verbreitung von Mein Kampf solle auch nach dem Auslaufen der Urheberschutzfrist in Deutschland verboten bleiben.

Uncommented Issue remains prohibited

In summer last year the justice ministers of the Bundesländer decided, the uncommented distribution von Mein Kampf will remain prohibited after copyright has ended.

Unclear is to me now if owning a copy is legal, for example a prewar one.

[Horatio Hornblower]

Jeez he's gone so low hes gone the Wiki route .

The Institut für Zeitgeschichte is a German Government institute, you fool!




Nor is this true. It just wasn't allowed to be published in Germany because of copyright issues. Post 1945 hard copies are available in almost all libraries and many shops. There are hardly any pre-1945 copies left in Germany as after the defeat most Germans burnt their copies in case the allies decided they were evidence of being a Nazi.

Yes, and the copyright issue was that the copyright holder would not allow publication. Sheesh!

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

You are wrong.
(again)

Prove it. Quote the edict banning it as opposed to the copyright holders ban on publication while copyright lasted.

Here's a start.

Mein Kampf
Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria, which acquired the copyright after Hitler's death in 1945 since it was the location of his official residence. The copyright will expire at the end of 2015. Private ownership and trade is allowed so long as it does not "promote hatred or war".

Owning and buying the book in Germany is legal. Trading in old copies is legal as well, unless it is done in such a fashion as to "promote hatred or war." In particular, the unmodified edition is not covered by §86 StGB that forbids dissemination of means of propaganda of unconstitutional organisations, since it is a "pre-constitutional work" and as such cannot be opposed to the free and democratic basic order, according to a 1979 decision of the Federal Court of Justice of Germany.

Off you go...

[Horatio Hornblower]

Pretty sure Bob will set you straight

I have just looked it up. The issue that will be published will be legal. But legal because it is heavily commented. Publishing the original version without comments remains illegal.

Source:
Adolf Hitler: Neuausgabe von "Mein Kampf" soll 2016 erscheinen |[at]ZEIT ONLINE

Unkommentierte Ausgabe bleibt verboten

Im Sommer des vergangenen Jahres hatten die Justizminister der Bundesländer entschieden, die unkommentierte Verbreitung von Mein Kampf solle auch nach dem Auslaufen der Urheberschutzfrist in Deutschland verboten bleiben.

Uncommented Issue remains prohibited

In summer last year the justice ministers of the Bundesländer decided, the uncommented distribution von Mein Kampf will remain prohibited after copyright has ended.

Unclear is to me now if owning a copy is legal, for example a prewar one.

[Cujo]

It was never outlawed for publication in Germany. The copyright holder refused to allow it to be published, that is the so-called "ban". That's why it's being published now that the copyright has expired. It's not rocket science!

You are wrong.
(again)

Prove it. Quote the edict banning it as opposed to the copyright holders ban on publication while copyright lasted.

Here's a start.

Owning and buying the book in Germany is legal. Trading in old copies is legal as well, unless it is done in such a fashion as to "promote hatred or war." In particular, the unmodified edition is not covered by §86 StGB that forbids dissemination of means of propaganda of unconstitutional organisations, since it is a "pre-constitutional work" and as such cannot be opposed to the free and democratic basic order, according to a 1979 decision of the Federal Court of Justice of Germany.

Off you go...

As you say, owning and buying the book is quite legal.
But thank you for proving my point
Up until now

Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria,

But you are correct in that now that the states copyright has expired it is legal to publish it.

Well done for finally admitting that the book was never, in fact, legally banned, even though you had to be told several times before you could finally understand you did get there in the end. Doesn't it feel better to finally admit the truth?

I wonder if poor little Horatio will be man enough to admit he was wrong too, somehow I doubt it.

I refer you to takeovers post 128. It appears I was a tad hasty in conceding.
Do you now admit YOU were wrong?

[DrB0b]

I have just looked it up. The issue that will be published will be legal. But legal because it is heavily commented. Publishing the original version without comments remains illegal.

Source:
Adolf Hitler: Neuausgabe von "Mein Kampf" soll 2016 erscheinen |[at]ZEIT ONLINE

Unkommentierte Ausgabe bleibt verboten

Im Sommer des vergangenen Jahres hatten die Justizminister der Bundesländer entschieden, die unkommentierte Verbreitung von Mein Kampf solle auch nach dem Auslaufen der Urheberschutzfrist in Deutschland verboten bleiben.

Uncommented Issue remains prohibited

In summer last year the justice ministers of the Bundesländer decided, the uncommented distribution von Mein Kampf will remain prohibited after copyright has ended.

Unclear is to me now if owning a copy is legal, for example a prewar one.

The uncommented book is not banned. It is illegal to "disseminate" it. That is what ausgabe means in this context. That is not the same as being banned. A banned publication is illegal to possess. It is perfectly legal to own an uncommented copy of Mein Kampf.

[Cujo]

I have just looked it up. The issue that will be published will be legal. But legal because it is heavily commented. Publishing the original version without comments remains illegal.

Source:
Adolf Hitler: Neuausgabe von "Mein Kampf" soll 2016 erscheinen |[at]ZEIT ONLINE

Unkommentierte Ausgabe bleibt verboten

Im Sommer des vergangenen Jahres hatten die Justizminister der Bundesländer entschieden, die unkommentierte Verbreitung von Mein Kampf solle auch nach dem Auslaufen der Urheberschutzfrist in Deutschland verboten bleiben.

Uncommented Issue remains prohibited

In summer last year the justice ministers of the Bundesländer decided, the uncommented distribution von Mein Kampf will remain prohibited after copyright has ended.

Unclear is to me now if owning a copy is legal, for example a prewar one.

The uncommented book is not banned. It is illegal to "disseminate" it. That is what ausgabe means in this context. That is not the same as being banned. A banned publication is illegal to possess. It is perfectly legal to own an uncommented copy of Mein Kampf.

[DrB0b]

You are wrong.
(again)

Prove it. Quote the edict banning it as opposed to the copyright holders ban on publication while copyright lasted.

Here's a start.



Off you go...

As you say, owning and buying the book is quite legal.
But thank you for proving my point
Up until now

Printing and public distribution of Hitler's book Mein Kampf is not allowed by the copyright holder, the state of Bavaria,

But you are correct in that now that the states copyright has expired it is legal to publish it.

Well done for finally admitting that the book was never, in fact, legally banned, even though you had to be told several times before you could finally understand you did get there in the end. Doesn't it feel better to finally admit the truth?

I wonder if poor little Horatio will be man enough to admit he was wrong too, somehow I doubt it.

I refer you to takeovers post 128. It appears I was a tad hasty in conceding.
Do you now admit YOU were wrong?

Takeover's post is about dissemination of the book. The actual law about whether or not the books are banned is stated in a Federal court judgement of 1979.

The judgement is at https://www.jurion.de/Urteile/BGH/19...-StR-182_79-_S and the title is

Strafbare Verbreitung von Propagandamitteln verfassungswidriger Organisationen; Öffentliche Verwendung von Kennzeichen einer ehemaligen nationalsozialistischen Organisation; Abgrenzung von vorkonstitutionellen Schriften, welche sich gegen Grundwerte einer freiheitlichen Demokratie wenden, und Propagandamitteln im Sinne des § 86 Strafgesetzbuch

The relevant section is

1.

Zu § 86 StGB

6
Eine Anwendung des § 86 Abs. 1 Nr. 4, Abs. 2 StGB scheitert jedenfalls daran, daß es sich bei den 1935 und 1943 erschienenen Stücken des Buches "Mein Kampf" von Adolf Hitler um eine vorkonstitutionelle Schrift handelt, aus deren unverändertem Inhalt sich eine Zielrichtung gegen die in der Bundesrepublik Deutschland erst später verwirklichte freiheitliche demokratische Ordnung noch nicht ergeben konnte.

7
Schon der Wortlaut des § 86 Abs. 1 Nr. 4 StGB, der auf Propagandamittel abstellt, die nach ihrem Inhalt dazu bestimmt sind, Bestrebungen einer ehemaligen nationalsozialistischen Organisation fortzusetzen, könnte für einen Ausschluß solcher Schriften sprechen, die unter der Herrschaft des Nationalsozialismus dessen Bestrebungen verfolgten. Das kann aber dahinstehen.

8
Jedenfalls handelt es sich bei den beiden Büchern nicht um Propagandamittel im Sinne des § 86 Abs. 2 StGB. Zwar trifft es zu, daß Hitlers "Mein Kampf", das Programmbuch der NSDAP, den Konstitutionsprinzipien jeder freiheitlichen Demokratie sowie dem Gedanken der Völkerverständigung Hohn spricht und daß es auch von einer aktivkämpferischen Tendenz getragen ist. Damit sind aber die Kriterien des § 86 Abs. 2 StGB noch nicht ohne weiteres erfüllt.