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  1. #1
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    Man, 80, guns down pregnant home invader: ‘I shot her twice, she best be dead"

    Tom Greer killed the woman after she and a man jumped him and robbed his Long Beach house Tuesday night. The couple fled after he showed his revolver, but the woman was killed as she tried to run away.

    They came to the wrong house.

    An 80-year-old California retiree shot dead a pregnant woman as she and a male accomplice tried to flee Tuesday night after breaking in and robbing the man’s home in Long Beach.

    And Tom Greer has no regrets about plugging the woman with two shots as she begged for her life.

    “She says, 'Don't shoot me, I'm pregnant! I'm going to have a baby!' And I shot her anyway," Greer told KNBC-TV.

    The elderly man, wearing his arm in a sling Wednesday as he spoke to a reporter, said he came back to his house in the ritzy Bixby Knolls neighborhood Tuesday evening and found the woman and a man ransacking his home.

    "When I went in there, they tackled me," Greer told the news station. "Both of them jumped up on top of me."




    During the struggle, Greer fell to the ground as the intruders rummaged through a safe. But the man had pocketed his .22-caliber Smith & Wesson revolver in the chaos of the moment.

    "I come back and they see me with a gun, and they run," he told the NBC affiliate.

    The man took off but the woman stumbled in an alley behind the home. She pleaded for her life as Greer took aim and fired.

    "She was dead,” he told KNBC. “I shot her twice, she best be dead ... (The man) had run off and left her."

    Cops have yet to identify the dead woman and her accomplice remains on the lam. Greer, meanwhile, was headed to the hospital to have a shoulder and collarbone injury treated, he told a reporter.

    Greer said it was the first time he had shot a person — but wouldn’t be the last if anyone tries to mess with him again.

    "I shot her, so that's going to leave a message on (her accomplice’s) mind for the rest of his life," Greer told the station.

    It’s unclear if Greer will face charges in the shooting.

    California man, 80, guns down pregnant home invader:

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99
    She pleaded for her life as Greer took aim and fired.

    "She was dead,” he told KNBC. “I shot her twice, she best be dead ... (The man) had run off and left her."
    That would be murder then.

  3. #3
    Philippine Expat Davis Knowlton's Avatar
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    I think the old-timer is going to jail. She was out of the house, fleeing, and represented no threat to his life. He's going down. Her partner had a gun and they both assaulted him; if he'd shot her inside the house he would have been ok.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by pseudolus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99
    She pleaded for her life as Greer took aim and fired.

    "She was dead,” he told KNBC. “I shot her twice, she best be dead ... (The man) had run off and left her."
    That would be murder then.

    If it went down as described in the OP - yes I agree

  5. #5
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    A good lawyer may be able to argue that two against one 80 year old is attempted murder anyway and he had cause to think she would return.

    He may get away with manslaughter if he's lucky.
    Last edited by Thormaturge; 25-07-2014 at 02:15 PM.

  6. #6
    Lord of Swine
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    he might be lucky, it California.

    "2) Even though it’s not in the law, the California Criminal Jury Instructions (CALCRIM) do allow a jury to acquit someone based on a stand-your-ground defense. The instruction appears in CALCRIM #505 and #506, both of which deal with justifiable homicide:

    “A defendant is not required to retreat. He or she is entitled to stand his or her ground and defend himself or herself and, if reasonably necessary, to pursue an assailant until the danger of (death/great bodily injury/<insert forcible and atrocious crime>) has passed. This is so even if safety could have been achieved by retreating.”

    So in California, not only could you stay and fight, you can even chase your attacker if it will neutralize the threat to your life.

    3) California’s stand-your-ground defense as part of the justifiable homicide rules has several conditions. Aggressors are not eligible for this — you must be defending, not striking first. You, as a reasonable person, would have to believe the danger is imminent and not a threat at some time in the future. Also, you had to have believed that deadly force was necessary, and you had to have used just enough force to defend yourself. However, a defendant does not have to be correct about having actually been in danger. A jury can acquit if they think the defendant reasonably believed that mortal danger was truly there."

  7. #7
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    You might be right, Fishman. However, the argument between 1st and 2nd degree murder will be about to intent to kill. There can be no doubt that there was premeditation about his actions because he made the decision to shoot after she had pleaded for his life. This will be a minefield for defense and prosecution. Did he intend to kill her? I would say he probably did - he shot her twice. Did he want to kill her? Most likely yes. Was he in control and not unduly affected by the stress of the situation, who knows.

    I would think he will serve time, and as he is 80, one way or another, he will not serve a lot of time.

    Necron - good information. However, she was not running away. According to him, she was on the floor pleading for her life before he shot her twice.

    Also, not forgetting, she said she was pregnant. That could be 2 charges to contend because I assume the baby died as well if there was one.

    Shame for the old duffer really - he never asked for them to break in. However, he decided to shoot her in those circumstances and one assumes he will answer for that.
    Last edited by pseudolus; 25-07-2014 at 02:20 PM.
    Originally Posted by bsnub "No wonder I drive a tesla"

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    California man, 80, who gunned down

    Accomplice caught - he's been charged with Murder. She dies because he took her whilst he went to rob the old man - quite right too on that one I reckon.

  9. #9
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    ^ He said she stumbled.
    That's not "on the floor"

    An 80 year old can probably consider a young person in any position a threat to his life. Particularly if they had just attacked him.
    He pursued and neutralized the threat.

    Bet he walks.

  10. #10
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    Even the language used in US media speaks volumes. "plugged" instead of shot, "busted" instead of arrested.
    Two shots from a .22 is a "hail of gunfire"

    The accomplice will go for felony murder, they will see that as justice served and leave the old guy alone.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by pseudolus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99
    She pleaded for her life as Greer took aim and fired.

    "She was dead,” he told KNBC. “I shot her twice, she best be dead ... (The man) had run off and left her."
    That would be murder then.
    What a coward shooting her in the back

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99 View Post
    Even the language used in US media speaks volumes. "plugged" instead of shot, "busted" instead of arrested.
    Two shots from a .22 is a "hail of gunfire"

    The accomplice will go for felony murder, they will see that as justice served and leave the old guy alone.


    As it should be.

    He didnt ask for this, and in the heat of the moment used excessive force, but given the circumstances who can blame him.

    Its always good to see criminals suffer.

  13. #13
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    He will be charged but I do not see a jury convicting him.

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    Growing up in hillbilly land the first thing I would have asked is "why a 22?".

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99
    Even the language used in US media speaks volumes.
    Lack of schooling?

  16. #16
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    he sounds like a mean old fucker, like you see too many times in the US

    hang the fucker or let him rot in jail,

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by hillbilly View Post
    Growing up in hillbilly land the first thing I would have asked is "why a 22?".
    It's not the size that counts, but how you use it.

  18. #18
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    They attacked and robbed him in his home. Dunno about anyone else, but I would be frightened and probably very angry.
    There is no world shortage of criminal pond-life. Fukc 'em.

  19. #19
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    What sort of scum pregnant women runs around assaulting old men and robbing homes?

  20. #20
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    An autopsy Friday determined that Miller was not pregnant, Los Angeles County coroner's spokesman Ed Winter said.

    Under California law, homeowners have a right to protect themselves with deadly force inside their homes and in the immediate vicinity — such as a patio — if they feel they are in imminent danger of great bodily injury or death, said Lawrence Rosenthal, a former federal prosecutor who teaches law at Chapman University.

    But this case enters a gray area because Greer, by his own account, chased the burglars and fired at them outside his home as they were fleeing, Rosenthal said.

    Prosecutors will have to decide if the evidence shows the immediate threat had subsided by the time Greer fired again, or if he still could reasonably fear for his life.

    "As a technical matter, this would be a homicide, possibly second-degree murder or voluntary manslaughter, but that doesn't mean that you should charge everything that's technically an offense," Rosenthal said.

    "The problem here is that all this happens very fast and his legal right to use force probably ended just a few seconds before he did use deadly force. So the question is should you charge somebody on the basis of what really was a series of split-second decisions when he's just been robbed and physically assaulted?"

    Miller and Adams, who had histories of similar crimes, were unarmed, McDonnell said.

    Greer had been burglarized three times before and believed the same suspects were responsible.

    He returned home shortly after 9 p.m. Tuesday to find the pair in his home. Police said both suspects attacked him, hitting him with their fists and ultimately body-slamming him to the floor and breaking his collarbone, McDonnell said. Miller continued to hit him, McDonnell said, while Adams went to a safe and tried to pry it open.

    When Miller left him to also work on the safe, Greer was able to get to another room where he grabbed a gun and returned to open fire on the suspects, police said.

    They fled through the garage and into an alley, and Greer chased them, firing again, McDonnell said.

    McDonnell would not say whether Miller was shot in the back as Greer said. He also declined to say how many shots were fired and whether either of the suspects was hit inside the house before fleeing.

    No phone listing was available for Greer and he could not be reached for comment by The Associated Press.

    Charges Possible Against Tom Greer After Killing Burglar Claiming To Be Pregnant

  21. #21
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    Shooting someone in the back apparently is not self defense - wonder what a jury will say?

  22. #22
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    I am sure a great many lawyers will spend a great deal of time (and money) debating this second by second, trying to determine if (and when) this shifted from justified (in house, in persuit on land) to non-justifiable (in an alley? in the back), whether the first shots in the house were sufficient to carry intent..blah, blah blah.

    One just wishes, that some times, they could look at the dead woman, shrug, and say "occupational hazard" and move on.

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    Guys 80, been burgled 3 times, this time assaulted, in his mind same people, took action so no 4th time.
    Hard to prove another motive, if they were there before, no case to answer, if not, they have to catch and arrest the other burglars and prove he knew they were different people.
    Bet he doesn't get burgled again. Jim

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    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly View Post
    he sounds like a mean old fucker, like you see too many times in the US

    hang the fucker or let him rot in jail,
    Why? He was attacked and beaten in his own home. The woman claimed she was pregnant. How was he to know if that's the case. it couldn't have been a lie, used to buy time so she could attack him again. If she was pregnant, she should have thought twice before burglarizing and then assaulting an old man. At least this man was honest, unlike the perps. He was entitled to the safety of his home. Who was this woman to come in and attack him?
    Kindness is spaying and neutering one's companion animals.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingwilly View Post
    What sort of scum pregnant women runs around assaulting old men and robbing homes?
    My ex , she robbed Me blind to keep her motorcycle taxi boyfriend happy.

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