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Milkman

^^ Good points and post SK, but Surasak also is correct to the fact that wages have been stagnant since 2000 - which means they have declined because of the rate of inflation.

Yes, there is GDP growh, worker efficiency has increased - but wages have not.

If you go into the private sector in the U.S. Storekeeper (which I know you don't plan on doing soon) you will realize have sh*tty the private has become in recent years. I mean, now.

Storekeeper

Nothin' has changed since I left Bremerton in March 2004. I didn't agree with the doom and gloom then and I don't now. All people have to do is live within their means and not think they have to have a big gas guzzling SUV ... or the largest flat screen TV on the block.

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stroller

^
That's right, there is no reason the accumulating wealth should benefit ordinary folks, after all they can make a decent living without it.

Dood boy, SK, a model Republican!

Storekeeper

Thanks for the kindergarten response stroller. I'm only suggesting that many Americans could live a very good life if they didn't think they had to keep up with the Smugleys.

Companies are in business to make money and the owners who take the risk shouldn't be expected to fair share the profits in he way you suggest. The risk their capital and bear all the responsibility for the success or failure of the company.

That doesn't mean I don't think employees should be taken advantage of. They should be paid a fair salary. A fair salary shouldn't be determined by anything other than what the market is willing to pay you for your skills or labor. Either accept your lot in life or obtain further education and skills to make yourself competitive for a higher paying job.

"In the past 33 months the size of America's entire economy has increased by 20 percent -- or, as National Review Online's Larry Kudlow put it, "In less than three years, the U.S. economic pie has expanded by $2.2 trillion, an output add-on that is roughly the same size as the total Chinese economy." In the 2 1/4 years before the 2003 tax cuts, economic growth averaged 1.1 percent annually; in the three years since it has averaged 4 percent per year"

OpinionJournal - Outside the Box

Milkman

^ and ^^^

Good points SK, I do agree. My angle (for some strange reason) has always been, "How much can I save and invest." (Even though in my South East Asia stint for the time being, I am putting away a lot less).

Here's what I've been asking people in Kitsap:

Q: if you make 50K per year, USD, can you save $30,000?" People proclaim "hell no!"

Q2: "how about 20K" per year (Saving a little under 1800 USD per month)?
They answer, "hell no."

I agree with your point. People have to increase their market value. That means learning new skills, getting more ed. etc.

Also, doing a side-business. Some mates are doing darn well doing that, right now.

One cannot just be an employee now.

Storekeeper

Most of those same people can't even save $6000 a year.

People in my paygrade with my same time in service in the military are pathetic whiners as well.

I have many peers in the military with 28 + years living paycheck to paycheck ... they opt for they huge monthly vehicle payments ... I'd rather save in one year what they will pay for the vehicle in four years of payments.

Civilian or military ... always wankin' about more money.

Sanuk Canuk

I have been absent from this thread for a bit but I would guess that this quote is pretty misleading. If you look at things in the stock market there was a huge drop just after 2000 as the dot coms melted down and this was followed by enron, worldcom, tyko, etc. accounting scandals. There was a huge reduction in wealth in the US related to equity devaluation that would have drawn down the portfolios of most Americans by 20% or so.

I am not sure if this quote refers to equity valuations or to GDP figures but GDP can also be misleading. How has the GDP been measured? Was inflation included or excluded? Did it correct the dollar values to a set point in time, (the US currency is down significantly against most of its trading partners).

It all goes to show there are 3 types of liers, you have liers, damn liers and statistics. I doubt the US is in as bad of shape as it is painted since like nature global economies hate a void or any type of imbalance. As US currency weakens, US exports will increase, this should lead to increased job creation which will then lead to consumer confidence and recovery. One huge plus is that despite the debt and other issues in the US they have managed to keep non-energy related inflation in check. Personally I am seriously thinking of moving many of my Canadian investments into the US market because I think the US is undervalued.

Once the commodities prices drop we should have some flat or negative growth for a bit then the us manufacturing sector will take off, after a year or 2 of that watch for commodities to take off again. Then resource based economies like Canada will be a good buy. It's all cycles and if you do what the herd is doing you will always lose.

The hardest part is predicting when the ass will finally fall out of commodities, my guess is as soon as Asian manufacturing shows any signs of leveling off the commodity prices will implode in a nasty way.

Milkman

What's the real federal deficit?
How many billions (or trillions) of dollars depends on how you do the accounting
By Dennis Cauchon
USA TODAY

The federal government keeps two sets of books.
The set the government promotes to the public has a healthier bottom line: a $318 billion deficit in 2005.

The set the government doesn't talk about is the audited financial statement produced by the government's accountants following standard accounting rules. It reports a more ominous financial picture: a $760 billion deficit for 2005. If Social Security and Medicare were included — as the board that sets accounting rules is considering — the federal deficit would have been $3.5 trillion.

Congress has written its own accounting rules — which would be illegal for a corporation to use because they ignore important costs such as the growing expense of retirement benefits for civil servants and military personnel.

Last year, the audited statement produced by the accountants said the government ran a deficit equal to $6,700 for every American household. The number given to the public put the deficit at $2,800 per household.
A growing number of Congress members and accounting experts say it's time for Congress to start using the audited financial statement when it makes budget decisions. They say accurate accounting would force Congress to show more restraint before approving popular measures to boost spending or cut taxes.

“We're a bottom-line culture, and we've been hiding the bottom line from the American people,” says Rep. Jim Cooper, D-Tenn., a former investment banker. “It's not fair to them, and it's delusional on our part.”
The House of Representatives supported Cooper's proposal this year to ask the president to include the audited numbers in his budgets, but the Senate did not consider the measure.

Good accounting is crucial at a time when the government faces long-term challenges in paying benefits to tens of millions of Americans for Medicare, Social Security and government pensions, say advocates of stricter accounting rules in federal budgeting.

Entire: USATODAY.com

man with no head

Toyota posting huge gains as are many Japanese automakers while the sloth-like US automakers keep posting losses.

Man, I wonder if someone in Detroit could figure out that we are tired of gas guzzling behemouths?

Milkman

The gas hikes have really had an effect. The auto-makers have studied this but the recent drops in sales of the gas-guzzlers has been pretty big. Also, I think a lot of consumers are looking at the possibility of future gas prices in their current buying decisions.

man with no head

It's probably going to be a big issue I hope. We waste so much oil in the United States that we could probably solve all the Middle East issues without firing a shot just by being more careful.

Milkman

^ At least the recent spike in gasoline has more attention being paid to altnernative energy and fules sources.

Higher gas prices will prompt more investment in these areas.

I don't know much about Ehthanol but there are some positivies of just adding a small percentage to fuel.

Look at the different also, of the UK and Germany.

(As for the automakers, it seems that GM is really on death's door. Ford has been taking a pounding recently, also.)

man with no head

There aren't many positives. Ethanol has less energy content, thus, you need more to go the same distance. Look at the drought conditions in the U.S. right now. You can't grow grain for livestock and expect to fuel our thirst for fuel.

We ought to conserve. The Japanese do it splendidly.

Milkman

^

Yaeah, I know very little about Ethanol. On the drought topic, it seems that this drought is pretty bad in the U.S.

man with no head

Another idea is to use switchgrass to wean ourselves off oil. The problem is that to replace gasoline with ethanol from switchgrass would require planting an area the size of California, Arizona, and Nevada with only switchgrass. Imagine that!

Biodiesel really is a better way as diesel has more BTUs per gallon than gasoline. This means better fuel economy as well.

Storekeeper

Read it and weep liberals and losertarian:

The federal deficit will register $260 billion this year, the lowest in four years, reflecting a strong economy and resulting growth in tax revenue, congressional analysts said Friday. The estimate by the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office is well below its earlier predictions and also below the $296 billion White House estimate less than a month ago.
Better-than-expected revenues are driving the deficit down from last year's $318 billion figure and far below the record $413 billion posted in 2004.
At $260 billion, it would be the lowest since the $158 billion figure in 2002, the first deficit following four years of surpluses.
The deficit picture is even better when measured against the size of the economy, which is the comparison economists think is most important.
"At 2 percent of gross domestic product, the 2006 deficit would be smaller than the deficit recorded in the past three years — 3.5 percent in 2003, 3.6 percent in 2004 and 2.6 percent in 2005," said the CBO report.

Anyone want to make book on what the FY 2007 deficif will be? Who wants to start taking bets that, provided a Democratic majority isn't elected this November, that the book balance by FY 2009?

Deficit Estimated Lowest in 4 Years

man with no head

There was a surplus until GWB started wasting it on useless wars. Are we ever going to get back our 'investement' in Iraq? The bill so far is $2,000 for every person living in the U.S. and growing daily. I wonder what better uses we could have found for that money.

Speaking of oil, a major Alaskan pipeline is shutting down.

Major Alaskan oil field shutting down - Yahoo! News

Whoops, another $10 a barrel folks. Thanks, GWB for failing to take any leadership in mandating better efficiency.

Storekeeper

What type of SUV or 8 cylinder truck are you driving ? You don't have one of them hybrid cars now do you ?

man with no head

I have neither, I have a Honda Civic CRX HF. Better than any new hybrid. If I have need for something larger I rent it.

Storekeeper