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floorpotato

He shaved a lot more years off the lives of over 4,000 brave, young, patriotic American soldiers by misleading his country into an Iraqi war for the benefit of Israel and oil companies.

britmaveric

-Idea to spread democracy to the middle east, work in progress with Iraq and Afghanistan.

-Ease dropping/surveillance program against baddies
-Got Libya to give up WMD programs
-Brought the fight to the terrorists, no attacks to yankland since 911
-GITMO, through baddies in jail for undetermined time

Sure Boon/Tex can think of many more.

raycarey

this was his 'idea'?
no, his idea was to do it by force.....with a bribed and extorted 'coalition'.


who really knows what your trying to say here, but let's assume you mean that he increased telecom surveillance.
the supreme court has repeatedly found that he over stepped.

he 'got' libya to do that, eh?
interesting perspective.


when was the last attack before 9/11?


along with the 'baddies', untold innocents as well.

of the same quality of your examples?
i'm sure they can.

Milkman

The official policy of the US government is to support dictatorships in the Middle East. This has been the policy for the last 80 years, and continues to the policy.

Saud family in KSA, #2 most aid in the world from the US goes to Hosni Mubarak in Egypt, doing the oil deal with Qaddafi, Kuwait, and other Gulf States.

Elections that are free and fair int he Middle East, is the last thing the US government wants.

OIL - is the reason.

And, democracy is not looked upon the same in the M.E. as it is in Euro-Centric nations.

The entire notion reveals the cultural arrogance and the ignorance of the United States government and public.

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durianfan

1993 - World Trade Center Bombings

1995 - Oklahoma City (although this was domestic)

I'm sure there are many MANY terrorist attacks that were attempted but were never carried out because Homeland Security/NSA/CIA/FBI thwarted them. We just never hear about it.

raycarey

exactly 1993.....approx 7 or 8 years before 9/11.

Panda

Hit the nail right on the head there.

stroller

I am sure it would be all over the news, to celebrate the success. But there has been silence.

raycarey

there have been a few incidents over the years...but they generally consisted of posers, and a few knuckleheads in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Panda

They do a pretty good job of killing each other without the need for terrorists.

Norton

Given the number of terrorist attacks since 9/11 in Europe, there "likely" have been several thwarted in the US. Silence maybe justified.

stroller

Sorry, I do not follow. Justified in what way? Why would one keep silent about successfully preventing terrorist attacks?

Norton

I would think the spooks may be reluctant to publicize as it could give away some of the methods or intelligence sources they have. Purely speculation on my part but we know how the intel community is about secrecy. If a bomber was arrested at an airport or in a building likely would be publicized. If the plot was thwarted in the early stages due to inside intelligence doubt we'd hear about it. The method of "thwarting" may be a reason for non disclosure as well.

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attaboy

They caught the guy at the Canadian border with a carload of explosives. The disrupted the plan to bomb LAX airport.


On another note if it's all about oil how come:


China close to oil deal with Iraq - MarketAvenue

How come:
DNO strikes oil in Iraq

Shares in Norwegian oil company DNO jumped nearly 11 percent on Monday, after the company confirmed that it had struck oil in Northern Iraq.


DNO strikes oil in Iraq - Aftenposten.no


We aren't keeping it all to ourselves. So what do people mean by saying "we are there for the oil"?

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As a kid I always thought my nickname was "attaboy" until I realized they were rooting for the dog: "Attaboy, get 'em! Get 'em!".

Panda

Well, for a start there was certainly no other reason for the invasion and occupation.

But on to the oil issue. The Chinese deal is only a proposal at this stage as far as I am aware.

All the Middle East oil producing countries (including Iraq) nationalized their oil industries in the 1970s to stop exploitation by multinational oil companies.

Despite having massive oil reserves, Iraq's oil industry didn't fare well due to successive wars and later the sanctions placed on it by the west in the 90s.

Bush has been pushing the new Iraqi government to scrap the nationalized oil industry and open it up to privatization by the multinationals once again. There has been great debate about this and the idea is opposed by most Iraqis as it will mean the big international oil countries will make nearly all the profit while paying the Iraqi people a pittance of a royalty around 10%. This is a case of blatant exploitation, but little the Iraqi people can do about it with their country in ruins and occupied by a foreign army. No other ME oil producing country would allow such a law.

See the Wikipedia script below.
"
Iraq oil law (2007)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Jump to: navigation, search
The Iraq oil law, also referred to as the Iraq hydrocarbon law,[1] is a proposed piece of legislation submitted to the Iraqi Council of Representatives in May 2007.[2]
The Bush administration hired the consulting firm BearingPoint to help write the law in 2004.[3][4] The bill was approved by the Iraqi cabinet in February 2007.[5] The Bush administration considers the passage of the law a benchmark for the government of Prime Minister Nuri Kamal al-Maliki.[6][7]
The new law would authorise production share agreements (PSAs) which guarantees a profit for foreign oil companies.[2] The industry had been completely nationalized by 1972.[8][2] The government in the 1990s, under the presidency of Saddam Hussein, gave PSAs to Russian and Chinese companies which gave a profit percentage of less than 10 percent.[2]
The central government would distribute remaining oil revenues throughout the nation on a per capita basis.[1] The draft law would allow Iraq's provinces freedom from the central government in giving exploration and production contracts.[2] Iraq's constitution allows governorates to form a semi-independent regions, fully controlling their own natural resources.[2]
The Iraq National Oil Company would have exclusive operational control of just 17 of Iraq’s 80 known oil fields. Normally countries do not have the type of exclusivity that would leave two-thirds of known and unknown fields open to foreign control. However, operational control of the fields does not mean control of the money made from them, and a percentage of the profits will be going into Iraqi tax revenue.[1][9] Iraq’s oil reserves are believed to be the second largest in the world[1] after Saudi Arabia.[10]
Journalist Pepe Escobar points to the destiny of the Iraq oil law as the crucial point determining the will of the American administrations to withdraw from the Iraq war.[11]"

Some more discussion on the subject here---


ZNet - Iraqi oil law

"The draft oil law is no doubt "re-privatizing" Iraqi oil wealth and will return Iraq to the era prior to Law 80 of 1961. Law 80 nationalized 99.5% of the Iraqi land from the IOCs and returned it to the Iraqi nation."

good2bhappy

How come this thread isn't blank?

xpat

He has made a lot of us laugh at his stupidity.......but unfortunately, more have cried as well.

stroller

Oh yes, there were. Establishing a military presence and strategic advantages in the ME to start with.

Panda