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US Domestic Issues Topics which focus on issues within the US or concern those who come from or live in the US.

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Old 02-05-2008, 02:35 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Current law requires all to pay into the system so no one can opt out if they prefer their own retirement fund.
Not quite.

My father worked (legally) in the States for 35+ years. He never paid a dime into social security. He retired about 10 years ago with a fantastic pension, but gets no social security.

Railroad Retirement.

They don't play that game, homey.
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Old 02-05-2008, 02:40 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Texpat View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norton View Post
Current law requires all to pay into the system so no one can opt out if they prefer their own retirement fund.
Not quite.

My father worked (legally) in the States for 35+ years. He never paid a dime into social security. He retired about 10 years ago with a fantastic pension, but gets no social security.

Railroad Retirement.

They don't play that game, homey.
How was this so, Texpat.

Once you have an SS number YOU HAVE TO pay into SS.

You do not have to get an SS number by law, but once you have one, you have to pay in.
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Old 02-05-2008, 02:41 PM   #23 (permalink)
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^I can tell you that even as a self-employed person, or person working for foreign companies, you do have to pay into SS. There is no getting away from it for any US citizen, no matter where you are in the world.
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Old 02-05-2008, 02:44 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Dunno MM, but he never paid and gets nothing from SS.

He gloats about not being part of the system every time I see him.

Google railroad retirement.
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Old 02-05-2008, 02:45 PM   #25 (permalink)
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^I can tell you that even as a self-employed person, or person working for foreign companies, you do have to pay into SS. There is not getting away from it.
Correct. It's the law. You have to pay in, if you have an SS number.

What really hurts, is the small business owners. If someone is self-employed they have to pay the full amount. This would about 6.4% + 6.4%, which is 12.8%

This is really a bad deal.
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Old 02-05-2008, 02:46 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Dunno MM, but he never paid and gets nothing from SS.

He gloats about not being part of the system every time I see him.

Google railroad retirement.
Thanks, I'll google it.

Before the mid 80s, federal employess at least, didn't pay into SS, becuase they had the federal retirement program. Then it was changed. Perhaps this is the reason. Anyway, good on him.
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Old 02-05-2008, 04:05 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Texpat
Railroad Retirement.
Correct. Railroad workers were initially exempted from paying SS. Not sure if this is the case now though.
Last edited by Norton : 02-05-2008 at 04:11 PM.
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Old 02-05-2008, 04:20 PM   #28 (permalink)
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For those who have paid income taxes, note there is a line item asking income from railroad retirement. Income is non taxable (in most cases).
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Old 02-05-2008, 04:33 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Since 1983, Social Security Trust Fund is no longer part of the unified federal budget so not included in expenditures. If it was, the projected federal budget deficit would be much higher than the already sick one we have. SS pays out about $500 billion per year, the single greatest expense in government budgets.
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Old 02-05-2008, 07:57 PM   #30 (permalink)
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SS pays out about $500 billion per year, the single greatest expense in government budgets.
All people in their 60s should be cut off.

Bloodsuckers of America.
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Old 03-05-2008, 11:17 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Milkman
All people in their 60s should be cut off.
No good. Would only leave the streets filled with starving geriatrics.

Euthanization on ones 60th birthday is a much better solution.
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Old 03-05-2008, 01:12 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Norton View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milkman
All people in their 60s should be cut off.
No good. Would only leave the streets filled with starving geriatrics.

Euthanization on ones 60th birthday is a much better solution.
That is a fable.

People in their 60s can still work. 60, is not "old" in my opinion.
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Old 03-05-2008, 01:22 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norton
Yes, retirement benefits are currently calculated on money paid into the system to determine monthly benefit. No matter how much is paid in there is a set maximum benefit for all which is in the neighborhood of 1700/month currently. Most people pay far more into the system than they will ever get back in return.
I worked for the Social Security Administration for 30 years. The statement quoted above along with most of the other posts in this thread, are full of errors and misconceptions. No wonder the SS debate never gets resolved.

I hate the "Issues" forums and won't add anything more here.

But, until Americans understand how SS works and what the real financial issues are we'll continue to have debate like this that is completely meaningless because it contains so much that is completely wrong.
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Old 03-05-2008, 01:25 PM   #34 (permalink)
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^Buad Hai,

Please, I think we'd all like to know more from your perspective. You could add a lot to the discussion.
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Old 03-05-2008, 02:33 PM   #35 (permalink)
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This is probably a politically incorrect statement to make, but the obesity problem in the US that is getting worse every year may be a God-send for the SS department... With the current rate of obesity, it is very likely that the average age of death in the US will drop, which means fewer people on SS for a lesser amount of time...Of course obesity is one of the biggest drag on medical costs...

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Old 03-05-2008, 02:57 PM   #36 (permalink)
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This link was posted somewhere else, but very relivant to this discussion.
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Old 03-05-2008, 03:06 PM   #37 (permalink)
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^Wow, a tsunami of spending about to happen with all the baby boomers retiring this year and next. This will be a huge burden and actuarial nightmare. And the medicare problem is 5 times the SS problem? Whew.
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Old 03-05-2008, 03:16 PM   #38 (permalink)
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^Wow, a tsunami of spending about to happen with all the baby boomers retiring this year and next. This will be a huge burden and actuarial nightmare. And the medicare problem is 5 times the SS problem? Whew.
Yea, but what would David Walker know?! He is only the Controller General of the US Govt Accountability Office. Surely people like GWB know better? Hell, the US is in good shape.
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Old 03-05-2008, 04:06 PM   #39 (permalink)
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I originally posted the above Youtube with form GAO, David Walker. Walker recently started an information-awareness group that is being funded by some famous, big financial people.

Social Security: it's all in the math

Medicare: It's all in the math, and yes, Medicare will be worse than Social Security.


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Old 03-05-2008, 05:19 PM   #40 (permalink)
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What really hurts, is the small business owners. If someone is self-employed they have to pay the full amount. This would about 6.4% + 6.4%, which is 12.8%

This is really a bad deal.
I have the same crap in Canada. I have to pay the pension plan twice -- once for my personal taxes and once for my business, which is where I derive my personal income.
Retire at 60? I retired at 39. But I kept working on my own and will continue to do so til the day I die. Who wants to die a doddering old git?
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