The Thailand expat forum for Travel, Lifestyle and Fun.

raycarey · 20-01-2007, 05:47 PM

simply because fitzgerald wasn't able to charge libby with leaking doesn't prevent me from thinking that he did.

Quote:

Days after Novak's initial column appeared, Matthew Cooper of Time magazine published Plame's name citing unnamed government officials as sources. In his article, entitled "A War on Wilson?", Cooper raises the possibility that the White House has "declared war" on Wilson for speaking out against the Bush Administration.[53] The names of Cooper's sources, later revealed as a result of Special Counsel Fitzgerald's investigation, are Karl Rove and Scooter Libby.[54]

Plame affair - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

man with no head · 20-01-2007, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by attaboy

surasak- It depends on whether Libby lied before or after Armitage admitted he was the leaker. Theorectically, the investigation could have wrapped up and perhaps there would not have been the specific interviews in which Libby felt the need to lie.

Whether is was Bush or a future administration I think you are right. The US, after the first Gulf War, had Saddam on a short lease and ready to be used at a time of their choosing.

Theoretically Libby could have just cooperated. If he was afraid he could have gotten immunity, or, simply pleaded the 5th. Anyways, doesn't matter, a rather small fry in the larger food chain.

Re: Saddam on a short leash: Maybe keeping him around as an excuse to invade when the time was right and nobody was looking.

If we had a sane energy policy then none of this would be necessary. It's disgusting that we fail so miserably in this regard.

raycarey · 22-01-2007, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by attaboy

You're a partisan. The article states he is on trial for obstructing the investigation yet you and BF go on about him being the leak. Am I giving you both too much credit by saying it's a troll on your parts? You actually didn't know he wasn't the leaker?

Quote:

Mr. Libby had nothing to do with the leak to Mr. Novak, but he testified under oath that he had not disclosed information about Ms. Wilson to other journalists. Ms. Miller and Matthew Cooper of Time magazine told the grand jury that he did, in fact, talk about Ms. Wilson with them. Mr. Libby also testified that he learned of Ms. Wilson’s identity from a third journalist, Tim Russert of NBC News, but Mr. Russert is expected to testify that that is false.
Mr. Libby’s lawyers are expected to argue that he did not tell those reporters about Ms. Wilson and that, even if he did, he remembered incorrectly what had happened.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/22/wa...n/22press.html

libby fed other stories to judith miller at the times, and then cheney quoted the times on 'meet the press' as if his office had nothing to do with the story.

Boon Mee · 23-01-2007, 07:51 AM

This case is going to go the way of the Duke 'rape' case where Mike Nifong hs folded his tent...

raycarey · 30-01-2007, 10:31 AM

former bush press sec. ari fleischer testified at libby's trial yesterday.

Quote:

Though a series of government officials have told the jury that Libby eagerly sought information about a prominent critic of the Iraq war, former ambassador Joseph C. Wilson IV, Fleischer was the first witness to say Libby then passed on what he learned: that Wilson's wife was a CIA officer who had sent him on a trip to Africa. Wilson's mission there was to explore reports, ultimately proved false, that Iraq had tried to buy nuclear material in Niger.
Fleischer, testifying under an immunity agreement with the prosecution, also made it clear that Libby had told him Wilson's wife held a position in the CIA's counterproliferation division, where most employees work in a covert capacity.

Quote:

Fleischer testified that, later on the day of his lunch with Libby, he and other top aides left with President Bush on a five-day trip to several African nations. He said that while he was on Air Force 1 between South Africa and Uganda, he overheard Dan Bartlett, at the time Bush's communications director and now counselor to the president, "vent" about news accounts that Cheney had requested Wilson's mission.
Fleischer said that he decided to tell two reporters, NBC's David Gregory and Time magazine's John Dickerson, as they were walking along a road in Uganda: "If you want to know who sent the ambassador to Niger, it was his wife; she works there" -- a reference to the CIA.

Former Press Secretary Says Libby Told Him of Plame - washingtonpost.com

Milkman · 30-01-2007, 11:34 AM

This is a relevant trial and a relevant issue for several reasons.

One current reason is that Senatorial elections are coming up in about 19 months for one-third of the Senate.

No Senators are not invovled in this but the climate may not be so incumbant friendly, and this may be a factor in the many tightly contested purple states.

SheriffAndy · 30-01-2007, 12:16 PM

Ahs beena watchin' thisn' discussulmulcatin fer quit a gud trawl ne'a an' ah b'lieve somethin' need sayin' hen't been sed yet. That is whut, there-unta pertainin' hent ought be nobody in ner near the gub'mint with a name like 'Scooter'. I wen't to cyphrin scheul with a boy what wanted callin' 'Scooter' an' whall he wrote him couple them bad checks (see whut all that lernin' got'im?) went up the river fer about 6 months and come out with a whole new perspective an' a husband.

Ne'a ah don't mean dispariagin' all the 'Scooters' out there, but 100% of the 'Scooters' ah know hent got no hair on their chest ner their nether regions henether.

That said his Paw, G. Gordon is a perty tuff feller an' maybe it'uz him whut give that name to his boy in much the same whay Johnny Cash gett'n named Sue did. Cain't fer the life'o me say fr'sure, but this 'Scooter' looks a little mamby pamby.

Ah ree'leyes the Man in Black was whut the' call fictitionalizatin' which y'know is ok as we got that artistic licence an' whatnot -- which ah s'pport - ah do'nt support that there Maplethorp stickin' a bull whip in whut really ought be an exit only ramp, but ya gawdda take the bad with'n the good.

raycarey · 30-01-2007, 07:01 PM

i have no doubt that you've made some interesting points sheriff, but i just can't be asked to read it....it took me about 30 secs. to read the first two sentences.

so, back to the trial....

Quote:

WASHINGTON - Former New York Times reporter Judith Miller is scheduled to be called as a witness Tuesday, as the perjury and obstruction trial of Vice President Dick Cheney's former chief of staff, I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby headed into its second week of testimony.

Quote:

On June 23, 2003 at a meeting with Libby in his office at the Old Executive Office Building, Libby, according to prosecutors, talked to Miller about press coverage dealing with pre-war intelligence about Iraq. Libby, according to the government, complained to Miller that he thought the CIA was leaking to the press unfairly, putting the White House on the defensive.During the course of that conversation, he mentioned that Wilson's wife worked at the CIA.

is there anyone in washington that libby didn't out an undercover CIA agent to?

Miller expected to testify at Libby trial - Politics - MSNBC.com

raycarey · 31-01-2007, 05:40 PM

here's somebody else libby blabbed to....

Quote:

Time magazine reporter Matt Cooper, who is expected to appear as a witness Wednesday in the trial of I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, is expected to testify that he was advised by Libby, Vice President Dick Cheney's former chief of staff, on July 12, 2003, that Libby had heard that other reporters were saying that former ambassador Joseph Wilson's wife worked for the Central Intelligence Agency. Libby, according to prosecutors, further told Cooper that he did not know if the assertion was true.
Libby's assertion that he was told about Valerie Wilson Plame's identity from reporters runs counter to testimony from a State Department official, Marc Grossman, and a CIA official, Robert Grenier, that they told Libby weeks earlier that Plame worked at the CIA.

Time magazine reporter due to testify - Politics - MSNBC.com

attaboy seems to gone into hiding

attaboy · 01-02-2007, 02:51 AM

DC is full of gossip and rumours. It's what people do there. You can't leak something that is common knowledge. Why don't you grab a shovel and build a timeline and see what happened when? Come on ray. Put your shoulder into it. Do something other than gripe. That's a good boy. You're coming off as some sort of parrotchicken with your cut and pastes.

raycarey · 01-02-2007, 09:06 AM

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...102900242.html

raycarey · 01-02-2007, 09:18 AM

so when the vice president's chief of staff outs an undercover CIA operative to the press (it was not 'common knowledge') because her husband was criticizing the manipulation of pre-war intelligence....according to attaboy, it's gossip and rumor. there used to be another word for it...treason.

and surasak, as far as this not being an important story is concerned, i wholeheartedly disagree.

wilson stood up the white house and called their bluff....and they attacked him and his wife.....even though she was an undercover CIA agent. this didn't go unnoticed in the intelligence community, and most certainly stopped others from speaking out against the cherry picking that was going on at the white house and the pentagon.

if libby is allowed to go unpunished, the bush white house (and others in the future) will assume that they can act with impunity.

but maybe i'm just overreacting and this is just 'gossip and rumor'....it's just a parlor game in DC.....who cares about the trillion $ in lost treasure, 3000 dead american kids, tens of thousands of dead iraqis, etc...

Whiteshiva · 01-02-2007, 12:28 PM

I guess it basically stops her career dead in its track - a well-known "secret agent" isn't really that useful, right?

What about local people she has dealt with in the places her husband has worked before - certainly they could now risk being accused of espionage by their governments (rightfully or not) and face rather serious consequences?

raycarey · 01-02-2007, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whiteshiva

What about local people she has dealt with in the places her husband has worked before - certainly they could now risk being accused of espionage by their governments (rightfully or not) and face rather serious consequences?

EXACTLY!

and anyone who dealt with her while she was doing her job (and if i'm not mistaken she worked on iranian issues) is now highly suspect....and this is at the very same time when the president is rattling sabres with iran.

but i suppose it's just no big deal......a parlor game for people in washington.

just gossip and rumors that everyone knew anyway....right attaboy?

attaboy · 02-02-2007, 04:56 AM

Once again you cut and paste like a parrot. The c&p'd timeline is a start. Now fold in when Armitage and Ari Flischer and all the media people spoke of her. No one is charged with leaking. Parrotchicken.

raycarey · 02-02-2007, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by attaboy

Ari Flischer and all the media people spoke of her.

FACT:

libby told press secretary fleischer....in their only lengthy conversation
libby told NY times reporter miller.
libby also told time magazine reporter cooper.

but you probably don't hear much of that on foxnews.

SheriffAndy · 02-02-2007, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raycarey

i have no doubt that you've made some interesting points sheriff, but i just can't be asked to read it....it took me about 30 secs. to read the first two sentences.

'precinate them kin'werds. The Sheriff kent hardly read so'z writin' don'cum ez nether. That sed ah feyl mah voice need be heard. A few issues ah bean perkilatin on lately:

1. Dick Cheney: Vampire?
2. Gub'mint monitoring my thoughts?
3. That thang in'a back'o my fridge?
4. Anna Nicole Smith: real or fake?

The Sheriff whall be kepin' an eye on y'uns.

raycarey · 06-02-2007, 12:36 AM

much obliged, sheriff.

maybe this will help attaboy and earl

Quote:

Fitzgerald said that Libby learned Plame's identity from his boss, Vice President Dick Cheney and discussed it with journalists. Libby says he forgot about his conversation with Cheney and, when he heard about Plame from NBC reporter Tim Russert weeks later, it struck him as new information. Fitzgerald says Libby concocted that story to protect himself from prosecution because repeating rumors from reporters is less serious than repeating sensitive information from Cheney.
............
Russert is scheduled to be Fitzgerald's last witness, most likely late Tuesday.

Tapes of Libby testimony to be released - Yahoo! News

libby's in trouble.

Mr Earl · 06-02-2007, 08:21 AM

Quote:

At this point, with reams of evidence in the case still hidden from public view, it is impossible to say much of anything for sure. And there may in fact be irrefutable evidence that Valerie Wilson "was a person whose identity the CIA was making specific efforts to conceal and who had carried out covert work overseas within the last five years." But if there is, Patrick Fitzgerald hasn't shown it yet

So if a crime was committed wouldn't evidence to support said crime be needed???
Why is Patrick Fitzgerald concealing the evidence?
Could it be that there isn't any?

linky

30-01-2007, 11:34 AM	#26 (permalink)
Milkman Gone Off Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: shelf Posts: 9,543	This is a relevant trial and a relevant issue for several reasons. One current reason is that Senatorial elections are coming up in about 19 months for one-third of the Senate. No Senators are not invovled in this but the climate may not be so incumbant friendly, and this may be a factor in the many tightly contested purple states. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. _____________

30-01-2007, 12:16 PM	#27 (permalink)
SheriffAndy Kamala Beach Last Online: 02-06-2008 09:27 AM Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 18	Sheriff Chimes In Ahs beena watchin' thisn' discussulmulcatin fer quit a gud trawl ne'a an' ah b'lieve somethin' need sayin' hen't been sed yet. That is whut, there-unta pertainin' hent ought be nobody in ner near the gub'mint with a name like 'Scooter'. I wen't to cyphrin scheul with a boy what wanted callin' 'Scooter' an' whall he wrote him couple them bad checks (see whut all that lernin' got'im?) went up the river fer about 6 months and come out with a whole new perspective an' a husband. Ne'a ah don't mean dispariagin' all the 'Scooters' out there, but 100% of the 'Scooters' ah know hent got no hair on their chest ner their nether regions henether. That said his Paw, G. Gordon is a perty tuff feller an' maybe it'uz him whut give that name to his boy in much the same whay Johnny Cash gett'n named Sue did. Cain't fer the life'o me say fr'sure, but this 'Scooter' looks a little mamby pamby. Ah ree'leyes the Man in Black was whut the' call fictitionalizatin' which y'know is ok as we got that artistic licence an' whatnot -- which ah s'pport - ah do'nt support that there Maplethorp stickin' a bull whip in whut really ought be an exit only ramp, but ya gawdda take the bad with'n the good.

01-02-2007, 02:51 AM	#30 (permalink)
attaboy Elite Member Last Online: Today 02:15 AM Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,422	DC is full of gossip and rumours. It's what people do there. You can't leak something that is common knowledge. Why don't you grab a shovel and build a timeline and see what happened when? Come on ray. Put your shoulder into it. Do something other than gripe. That's a good boy. You're coming off as some sort of parrotchicken with your cut and pastes. __________________ As a kid I always thought my nickname was "attaboy" until I realized they were rooting for the dog: "Attaboy, get 'em! Get 'em!".

01-02-2007, 12:28 PM	#33 (permalink)
Whiteshiva Elite Member Last Online: Yesterday 01:58 PM Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nontaburi Posts: 3,802	I guess it basically stops her career dead in its track - a well-known "secret agent" isn't really that useful, right? What about local people she has dealt with in the places her husband has worked before - certainly they could now risk being accused of espionage by their governments (rightfully or not) and face rather serious consequences? __________________ Any error in tact, fact or spelling is purely due to transmissional errors...

23-01-2007, 07:51 AM	#24 (permalink)
Boon Mee Senior Member Last Online: Yesterday 06:47 PM Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 9,820	This case is going to go the way of the Duke 'rape' case where Mike Nifong hs folded his tent...

01-02-2007, 09:06 AM	#31 (permalink)
raycarey texpat's sexual obsession Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: deleting posts in issues Posts: 5,550	http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...102900242.html

01-02-2007, 09:18 AM	#32 (permalink)
raycarey texpat's sexual obsession Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: deleting posts in issues Posts: 5,550	so when the vice president's chief of staff outs an undercover CIA operative to the press (it was not 'common knowledge') because her husband was criticizing the manipulation of pre-war intelligence....according to attaboy, it's gossip and rumor. there used to be another word for it...treason. and surasak, as far as this not being an important story is concerned, i wholeheartedly disagree. wilson stood up the white house and called their bluff....and they attacked him and his wife.....even though she was an undercover CIA agent. this didn't go unnoticed in the intelligence community, and most certainly stopped others from speaking out against the cherry picking that was going on at the white house and the pentagon. if libby is allowed to go unpunished, the bush white house (and others in the future) will assume that they can act with impunity. but maybe i'm just overreacting and this is just 'gossip and rumor'....it's just a parlor game in DC.....who cares about the trillion $ in lost treasure, 3000 dead american kids, tens of thousands of dead iraqis, etc...

02-02-2007, 04:56 AM	#35 (permalink)
attaboy Elite Member Last Online: Today 02:15 AM Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,422	Once again you cut and paste like a parrot. The c&p'd timeline is a start. Now fold in when Armitage and Ari Flischer and all the media people spoke of her. No one is charged with leaking. Parrotchicken.