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  1. #1
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    Chimp showes human trait, better cut his balls off

    Chimp who threw stones at zoo visitors showed human trait, says scientist

    Assembling ammunition in advance reveals ape's unsuspected ability to plan for future



    Santino the chimp with a stone in his hand. Photograph: PA

    The loutish behaviour of a stone-throwing chimpanzee at a zoo near the Arctic circle has challenged scientists' beliefs about human beings.
    Santino, a 31-year-old male at Furuvik zoo in Sweden, may be the first animal to exhibit an unambiguous ability to plan for the future, a behaviour many scientists argue is unique to humans. Forward planning takes considerable cognitive skills, because it requires an animal to envisage future events it will have to deal with.
    Santino would get agitated when the first groups of visitors arrived at his enclosure in the morning, and would start hurling stones at the spectators. When the zookeepers investigated, they found that, while the zoo was closed, Santino had been busy making piles of ammunition, and returned to them to resupply.
    To catch the chimp in action, one zookeeper hid in a room overlooking the enclosure and observed the ape's behaviour before the zoo gates opened each morning. She saw Santino dragging stones from a protective moat that surrounded his island home, before placing them in piles. Further covert surveillance of the ape revealed he spent some time tapping areas of concrete floor with his fist. Occasionally, the animal would thump harder, releasing chunks of concrete that he broke into rough discs.
    A survey of the enclosure showed that Santino made piles of ammunition only on the quarter of the island's shore that faced the visiting crowds.
    Since becoming aware of the issue, zookeepers have removed hundreds of caches of stones from the island and have observed Santino gathering stones and putting them in piles at least 50 times. Santino's attempts to fashion concrete discs has been recorded 18 times, according to a report in Current Biology.
    Staff at the zoo coped with Santino's antics by warning visitors when he was getting agitated, and erected a fence to try to contain the projectiles. Cognitive scientist Mathias Osvath, the author of the study, believes that such complex forward planning suggests Santino can anticipate future events and is able to devise ways of dealing with them. In this situation, he is trying to get the crowds to move on.
    "Forward planning like this is supposed to be uniquely human; it implies a consciousness that is very special, that you can close your eyes you can see this inner world," he said. "Many apes throw objects, but the novelty with Santino is that he makes caches of these missiles while he is fully calm and only throws them much later on.
    "We are not alone in the world within. There are other creatures who have this special consciousness that is said to be uniquely human."
    Osvath interviewed zookeepers at Furuvik and examined records of the chimp's behaviour. He found that Santino only gathered rocks and made concrete missiles when the zoo was closed. He gave up the behaviour completely when the zoo was shut over the winter.
    The zookeepers recently decided that an operation was the best way of controlling Santino's behaviour.
    "They have castrated the poor guy. They hope that his hormone levels will decrease and that will make him less prone to throw stones. He's already getting fatter and he likes to play much more now than before. Being agitated isn't good for him," said Osvath.
    Chimp who threw stones at zoo visitors showed human trait, says scientist | Science | guardian.co.uk




    great, they dont like his behaviour, so CUT HIS BALLS OFF....


    hmmm, where have i heard that before?

  2. #2
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    I remember this Gorilla at Taronga Park Zoo in Sydney doing this huge shit in his hand and then throwing it at the onlookers hitting this woman right in the head.

    Hope they didn't cut his balls off for having a good throwing arm!

  3. #3
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    Us humans give ourselves too much credit.
    Animals are a lot smarter than we think.

    My old pooch used to get angry when she would go outside in the morning to find the Ibis (big wild birds) at her bones out in the yard. So each evening she would gather up all her bones, one at a time, and bring them inside. Problem solved.

    Anyone who has lived on a farm will have stories of animals forward planning.

    These scientists are a bit slow catching on me thinks.

  4. #4
    ding ding ding
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingwilly
    Santino, a 31-year-old male at Furuvik zoo in Sweden, may be the first animal to exhibit an unambiguous ability to plan for the future, a behaviour many scientists argue is unique to humans
    Wo wo wo! Lets not be hasty jumping to conclusions including all humans, clearly planning for the future hasnt arrived round here

  5. #5
    The cold, wet one
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingwilly
    great, they dont like his behaviour, so CUT HIS BALLS OFF.... hmmm, where have i heard that before?
    You referring to me, babboon-butt? I neuter to stop population growth, not for behavioural issues.

    Actually, I was going to say don't castrate him, give him a Nobel prize! One smart chimp. If we can teach him how to use a computer, we don't need you anymore, KW.

  6. #6
    or TizYou?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loy Toy
    Hope they didn't cut his balls off for having a good throwing arm!
    I heard they dressed him in white and called him Shane Warne.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by November Rain
    You referring to me, babboon-butt? I neuter to stop population growth, not for behavioural issues.
    erm, not at all. in fact wished i'd been in time for my kitten.

    reference the chattering masses on a pedo suspect been arrested thread.

  8. #8
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    I'd like to see a primate make head nor tail of what this man is saying. I am no tech primate, but I am finding it difficult to comprehend what's he's going on about. Yes, I understand heuristics, I understand algorythyms, but what is he on about? He gives nothing away!

    Wolfram Alpha to challenge Google

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panda View Post
    Us humans give ourselves too much credit.
    Animals are a lot smarter than we think.

    My old pooch used to get angry when she would go outside in the morning to find the Ibis (big wild birds) at her bones out in the yard. So each evening she would gather up all her bones, one at a time, and bring them inside. Problem solved.

    Anyone who has lived on a farm will have stories of animals forward planning.

    These scientists are a bit slow catching on me thinks.
    Not so much the scientists per se....but the broad cultural characteristic that indoctrinates them all.

  10. #10
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    Animals like chimps are just as smart, and now can plan in advance of a possible threat. Animals also have feelings, I believe.

    Why the heck would they want to cut his balls off. Just stop the visitors, and let him roam wild.

  11. #11
    Burn All Hippies
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    Quote Originally Posted by phuketbound
    Just stop the visitors, and let him roam wild
    Have to agree with these sentiments. Although I would suggest leaving an M4 Carbine assault rifle in one corner of his enclosure and several magazines in the other corner, as an intelligence test. Get some annoying tourists to stand at the front of the enclosure pointing and laughing and making monkey noises and see how long it takes him to figure it out.



    Just for scientific research purposes like?

  12. #12
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    I believe most primates shit in their hand and throw it at intruders or another creature that pisses them offr

    Quote Originally Posted by Loy Toy
    I remember this Gorilla at Taronga Park Zoo in Sydney doing this huge shit in his hand and then throwing it at the onlookers hitting this woman right in the head.
    I believe most primates shit in their hand and throw it at intruders or another creature that pisses them off.
    I have had some close calls in S America and Africa!!

    Seems to have faded out of Homo Sapiens tendencies ( well most of them anyhow )

    a

  13. #13
    たのむよ。
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panda View Post
    Us humans give ourselves too much credit.
    Animals are a lot smarter than we think.

    My old pooch used to get angry when she would go outside in the morning to find the Ibis (big wild birds) at her bones out in the yard. So each evening she would gather up all her bones, one at a time, and bring them inside. Problem solved.

    Anyone who has lived on a farm will have stories of animals forward planning.

    These scientists are a bit slow catching on me thinks.
    Hell yes, we're arrogant fucks and thick as shit in the scheme of things.

  14. #14
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    My Khmer GF told me that when she used to walk to school through the jungle with her sister that there was a large monkey that used to swing down and hang by his arms from a branch above the path blocking their way with his legs open sporting a large erection and she also told me that her grandmother told her that a girl had been raped by a large monkey.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looper
    her grandmother told her that a girl had been raped by a large monkey.
    that was the Khmer Rouge, not the monkey

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    Hell yes, we're arrogant fucks and thick as shit in the scheme of things.
    You maybe.
    Don't speak for the rest of us, I still think I'm smarter than a monkey (though my wife might disagree)

  17. #17
    たのむよ。
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dug View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    Hell yes, we're arrogant fucks and thick as shit in the scheme of things.
    You maybe.
    Don't speak for the rest of us, I still think I'm smarter than a monkey (though my wife might disagree)
    I'm speaking for all of us, and you're taking my comment as a personal one instead of looking from outside the circle. You're no smarter than any other human, did you know the tsunami was coming three days before it did, can you telepathically communicate with another of your species, have geese, elephants or lemurs made the world what it is today?

    I suppose you think intelligence is what seperates us from the animals, well i'll tell you what seperates us from the animals because it's three things.

    1. Necrophilia

    2. Greed

    3. Murder


    That's the truth, and no I'm sorry but don't start giving me 'An animal can't write a sonet or build a jumbo jet' because all animals have capabilities different from the next. We are so fucking arrogant we think we can save the planet.

    Ask a man trapped under earthquake rubble, a tsunami victim or somebody who lost their house in a bushfire, ask them if they think they're a threat to the planet.

  18. #18
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    Chimps have been filmed ambushing other troops of chimps and then bashing to death and eating one of the rivals. The eating part was thought to be more of a territorial victory celebration/display than anything else since there was no shortage of food in the area. If they got their hands on some 21st century automatic combat weaponry they could make Planet of the Apes look like a holiday picnic.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dug View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    Hell yes, we're arrogant fucks and thick as shit in the scheme of things.
    You maybe.
    Don't speak for the rest of us, I still think I'm smarter than a monkey (though my wife might disagree)
    I'm speaking for all of us, and you're taking my comment as a personal one instead of looking from outside the circle. You're no smarter than any other human, did you know the tsunami was coming three days before it did, can you telepathically communicate with another of your species, have geese, elephants or lemurs made the world what it is today?

    I suppose you think intelligence is what seperates us from the animals, well i'll tell you what seperates us from the animals because it's three things.

    1. Necrophilia

    2. Greed

    3. Murder


    That's the truth, and no I'm sorry but don't start giving me 'An animal can't write a sonet or build a jumbo jet' because all animals have capabilities different from the next. We are so fucking arrogant we think we can save the planet.

    I still maintain I'm smarter than any animal.
    If you aren't,well....

    Ask a man trapped under earthquake rubble, a tsunami victim or somebody who lost their house in a bushfire, ask them if they think they're a threat to the planet.
    What?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loy Toy View Post
    I remember this Gorilla at Taronga Park Zoo in Sydney doing this huge shit in his hand and then throwing it at the onlookers hitting this woman right in the head.

    Hope they didn't cut his balls off for having a good throwing arm!
    Ditto the old "Belle Vue" zoo in Manchester, when I was a kid. I wondered why all the perspex screens around the Gorilla enclosure, until this male picked up a handful of shit and packed into into a cricket ball. It threw it flat for about 20 yards at a group of kids who were taunting it. Without the screen it might have killed one of them.

  21. #21
    たのむよ。
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    ^^ Arrogance - you are not smarter or better than any animal, only bigger or smaller. Jeez, what are you a Christian or something?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    ^^ Arrogance - you are not smarter or better than any animal, only bigger or smaller. Jeez, what are you a Christian or something?
    I didn't say better, I said SMARTER.

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    get a room you too.

    Dug - you are a fool for even getting drawn into one of scmapys puerile arguments...

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingwilly View Post
    get a room you too.

    Dug - you are a fool for even getting drawn into one of scmapys puerile arguments...
    It's entertaining and doesn't take much effort.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looper View Post
    Chimps have been filmed ambushing other troops of chimps and then bashing to death and eating one of the rivals. The eating part was thought to be more of a territorial victory celebration/display than anything else since there was no shortage of food in the area. If they got their hands on some 21st century automatic combat weaponry they could make Planet of the Apes look like a holiday picnic.
    They generally only eat the babies of the defeated chimp troop.
    They could easily be taught to use automatic weapons, but they are such lazy fcukers they could never afford them.

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