US Food stamps and UK Food vouchers...first path to the cashless society?

[pseudolus]

30% of Americans are getting shit wages and government food stamps. In the UK it's about the same. There seems to be a deliberate policy to take away peoples cash and replace it with a ration.

Surely this is the path to a cashless global society, with no dollars, pounds, euros etc but workers getting a food allowance, a housing allowance, a fuel allowance, and if you don't agree with it they cut you off?

Coupled with the fact that legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat .... should we actually be concerned that Daddy Bush's call in the 1980's that a world order is coming is now almost here?

[DrAndy]

do they have "food stamps" in the UK?

legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat

how does that work?

[Boon Mee]

30% of Americans are getting shit wages and government food stamps. In the UK it's about the same. There seems to be a deliberate policy to take away peoples cash and replace it with a ration.

Surely this is the path to a cashless global society, with no dollars, pounds, euros etc but workers getting a food allowance, a housing allowance, a fuel allowance, and if you don't agree with it they cut you off?

Coupled with the fact that legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat .... should we actually be concerned that Daddy Bush's call in the 1980's that a world order is coming is now almost here?

George Soros has been working tirelessly to this end for ever.

[pseudolus]

do they have "food stamps" in the UK?

legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat

how does that work?

Lots of little laws. In the US, Senate Bill S510 Makes it illegal to Grow, Share, Trade or Sell Homegrown Food. In the UK, remember the raw milk thing right now? Illegal to drink non processed milk basically.

[pseudolus]

30% of Americans are getting shit wages and government food stamps. In the UK it's about the same. There seems to be a deliberate policy to take away peoples cash and replace it with a ration.

Surely this is the path to a cashless global society, with no dollars, pounds, euros etc but workers getting a food allowance, a housing allowance, a fuel allowance, and if you don't agree with it they cut you off?

Coupled with the fact that legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat .... should we actually be concerned that Daddy Bush's call in the 1980's that a world order is coming is now almost here?

George Soros has been working tirelessly to this end for ever.

Soros is basically the devil, right? One of the architects of the global warming fraud that introduced carbon taxes paid to the World Bank (owned by the same group of people that own the Fed Reserve) and traded through the crook Al Gores carbon trading firm that he set up with that david rockefeller chap; the one who looks like he eats babies.

[DrAndy]

do they have "food stamps" in the UK?

legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat

how does that work?

Lots of little laws. In the US, Senate Bill S510 Makes it illegal to Grow, Share, Trade or Sell Homegrown Food. In the UK, remember the raw milk thing right now? Illegal to drink non processed milk basically.

so they don't have food stamps in the UK

the raw milk being illegal is more based on health risks than anything else

and growing your own is encouraged in the UK

so the US and UK have little in common in this respect

[Zooheekock]

I don't think raw milk is illegal in Britain but its production is tightly monitored. I agree there's a lot of rubbish in Britain about this type of stuff - I can't imagine it's easy to keep a pig in your back garden and the slaughter it yourself - but it's a world away from the 1000s of crazy American local laws about not being able to grow veg in your front garden.

Soros is basically the devil, right? One of the architects of the global warming fraud that introduced carbon taxes paid to the World Bank (owned by the same group of people that own the Fed Reserve) and traded through the crook Al Gores carbon trading firm that he set up with that david rockefeller chap; the one who looks like he eats babies.

Oh, Christ. The internet has a lot to answer for.

[pseudolus]

do they have "food stamps" in the UK?

legislation in both countries is hitting people hard who simple grow some veges in their gardens or milk their cow / goat

how does that work?

Lots of little laws. In the US, Senate Bill S510 Makes it illegal to Grow, Share, Trade or Sell Homegrown Food. In the UK, remember the raw milk thing right now? Illegal to drink non processed milk basically.

so they don't have food stamps in the UK

the raw milk being illegal is more based on health risks than anything else

and growing your own is encouraged in the UK

so the US and UK have little in common in this respect

In the UK - Not yeat.
Conservatives raise the spectre of food vouchers for the poor - UK Politics - UK - The Independent

But as they are already deciding what should and should not be included, you can assume they are a dead cert.

Raw milk is a choice. I grew up with raw milk from the small holding across the road and never ill. It's a load of protectionist shit trying to scare people into only drinking processed milk that has supplements added.

Also, the legislation is already in the UK for them to come to your garden, see that you are not conforming with the same rules that a multi million quid enterprise has to, and stick you in the dock for it.

Food Standards Agency - Regulation and legislation

[Mid]

Aus and Singapore have both been virtually cashless societies for quite a while now , difficult to identify downsides .

[Zooheekock]

Three that come immediately to mind.

Cash is created by the government. Non-cash money is usually created by private organizations for profit.

Cash is a simple, resilient technology which is very difficult to break. Cashless transactions require additional fragile, easily disrupted layers of complexity.

And for the paranoid, it's an awful lot easier for The Man to know what you're up to if you leave a mile-wide trail every time you buy something (and it's a lot easier to make sure you're not spending your money on things The Man doesn't like).

[Mid]

I'd wipe the first two points out , direct debit - cash without physical cash .

I'll grant you the third and go on record as to stating it don't bother me

Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's ...............

[pseudolus]

Remove cash, you are then limited to a system where somewhere how much you own / earn is record and controlled by the government. i.e., a credit card with a number of tokens stored somewhere. They control it, can take from it any time they like, or more worrying can stop your access to credits thus you starve to death; can't buy food basically.

[misskit]

I don't like using cards.

Not because The Man is going to keep tabs on what I buy because he might not like it. I just don't want The Man selling the information on what I bought to some company who is going to bombard me with targeted sales promotional materials.

[Mid]

I just don't want The Man selling the information on what I bought to some company who is going to bombard me with targeted sales promotional materials.

Agreed and at least in Aus it's opt in NOT opt out

[misskit]

Remove cash, you are then limited to a system where somewhere how much you own / earn is record and controlled by the government. i.e., a credit card with a number of tokens stored somewhere. They control it, can take from it any time they like, or more worrying can stop your access to credits thus you starve to death; can't buy food basically.

Why are you so worried about this with a SNAP card? Already people are not paid in cash. The money is directly deposited directly into their accounts. No one is paying their bills, for their food, or anything else with cash anymore.

It's been that for the last 20 years in the US, if you pull out cash to pay for a purchase, the cashier thinks you're a drug dealer.

[pseudolus]

^ Its now being made up as part of the wages. 30% odd of the US public gets less in cash than they need to live. It is being replaced with a food ration. It's nothing about the stamps or what have you - it's government rationing food and taking away choice. Where can you spend the food stamps?? Any where? Government approved places? Only places that accept credit cards? Can you go to the farmers market and use it?

I know the FIAT money system is fake and built on a lie, but at least right now, if you are out of favour with the state, you can still have bit of cash in your pocket and buy a meal / bottle of water. Lose money from the equation, and suddenly without the government assigned / bank assigned card, you are going to starve. i.e., you don't pay your credit card bill, the bank just takes it from your Credits card and you have no money to pay your food bill. you don't eat.

[Zooheekock]

I'd wipe the first two points out , direct debit - cash without physical cash .

What does that mean? Direct debit isn't cash. Cash is a physical object which (nowadays) is made by/for governments. Direct debit is a way of moving around credit/debt, which is made by capitalist organizations for their own ends. And try buying a pint of milk with direct debit in the middle of a power cut.

I'll grant you the third and go on record as to stating it don't bother me

Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's ...............

That was Jesus's advice on how to complete your tax return, not on whether to use cash or a card. And opening up yet more of your life to government and corporate observation and (potentially) control doesn't bother you? That's not the impression I got from your other posts.

[Mid]

Direct debit isn't cash.

Yes it is , least in my little corner of the world , cash comes out of your account and into the merchants account not credit .

And try buying a pint of milk with direct debit in the middle of a power cut.

valid point .

[Mid]

And opening up yet more of your life to government and corporate observation and (potentially) control doesn't bother you? That's not the impression I got from your other posts.

This ones a furphy , data overload stops individual targeting

[Zooheekock]

Cash is coins and notes. Direct debit is a way of shuffling around credit and debt. One is physical. One is digital. You can translate between the two (when you go to an atm, for example) but they are different.

data overload stops individual targeting

Not any more. Have you read about the new NSA domestic spying data centre in Utah? It's fucking enormous. Obviously, a lot of what is said is speculation but it looks a lot like the scale of the data-mining which will be available will be staggering.

[Mid]

yes and it's a minor point which I though I'd covered by utilising the adjective physical .

staggering.

is what the actual amount of data would be IF 300 million individuals are to be profiled individually and the resultant data would be useless because it would be out of date as soon as compiled .

the only way it will work is to utilise groups and the only advantage is speed of complication , building individual dossiers on each and very one of us is a pipe dream

[pseudolus]

^ Indeed - apparently, when you add all the "virtual" made up money in the US, they are in debt to the tune of 40-50 times their GDP. It's just that that is all craftily tucked away in the annals of the un audited Fed.

[DrAndy]

anyway, so we can all agree the OP has made a serious mistake in the title and first post bracketing the US and UK

the UK does not have food stamps

the Uk does not restrict you growing your own veggies, or even having your own goat for milk

selling things raises a different problem though

[misskit]

^ Its now being made up as part of the wages. 30% odd of the US public gets less in cash than they need to live. It is being replaced with a food ration. It's nothing about the stamps or what have you - it's government rationing food and taking away choice. Where can you spend the food stamps?? Any where? Government approved places? Only places that accept credit cards? Can you go to the farmers market and use it?

You can use food stamps anywhere, including farmers markets. It is more difficult to use cash than to use a card now in America. Oh, and you can't use SNAP cards in liquor stores, though someone in here claimed you could use them in a casino.

I know the FIAT money system is fake and built on a lie, but at least right now, if you are out of favour with the state, you can still have bit of cash in your pocket and buy a meal / bottle of water. Lose money from the equation, and suddenly without the government assigned / bank assigned card, you are going to starve. i.e., you don't pay your credit card bill, the bank just takes it from your Credits card and you have no money to pay your food bill. you don't eat.

A little cash in your pocket isn't going to keep one going long when it comes to food. You've got to stockpile!

If the government really wanted to cut one off, they could just freeze one's bank accounts. Poor or rich.

Are you a survivalist?

[AntRobertson]

I honestly don't see the connection between food stamps or what have you, which are a form of social welfare, and a concerted drive to a 'cashless society'. Seems a tenuous link at best.

What about credit cards, mobile and Internet banking and shopping etc. - those are what constitute movement toward cashless transactions.