Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 34
  1. #1
    たのむよ。
    The Gentleman Scamp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Online
    03-01-2017 @ 04:09 PM
    Location
    もうがまんできない!
    Posts
    9,754

    Richard Dawkins is God

    How's that for an ironic title.

    Excellent read by the way, the best non fiction I have laid eyes upon.
    I am of course speaking of The God Delusion, which I hope will make many 'see the light' so to speak. Unfortunately I fear that anyone who fears God wouldn't dare to pick it up as surely it must be the work of Satan, not to mention the statistical fact that anyone intelligent enough to get through the book is unlikely to be religious anyway - thus lies the paradox.

    Contains an interesting fact about seppo's, that being that they would soner elect a homosexual, female or black president than one who is an athiest.
    "I'm an outsider by choice, but not truly. It's the unpleasantness of the system that keeps me out. I'd rather be in, in a good system. That's where my discontent comes from: being forced to choose to stay outside.
    My advice: Just keep movin' straight ahead. Every now and then you find yourself in a different place."

    George Carlin

  2. #2
    watterinja
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    Unfortunately I fear that anyone who fears God wouldn't dare to pick it up as surely it must be the work of Satan, not to mention the statistical fact that anyone intelligent enough to get through the book is unlikely to be religious anyway - thus lies the paradox.
    My, my - aren't we arrogant & conceited?

    Dawkins is a fool of the first order. Not all arrogant rhetoric is the truth.

  3. #3
    Thailand Expat Boon Mee's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Last Online
    13-09-2019 @ 04:18 PM
    Location
    Samui
    Posts
    44,721
    Quote Originally Posted by watterinja View Post
    My, my - aren't we arrogant & conceited?
    That's our Scamp!

  4. #4
    たのむよ。
    The Gentleman Scamp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Online
    03-01-2017 @ 04:09 PM
    Location
    もうがまんできない!
    Posts
    9,754
    Quote Originally Posted by watterinja View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    Unfortunately I fear that anyone who fears God wouldn't dare to pick it up as surely it must be the work of Satan, not to mention the statistical fact that anyone intelligent enough to get through the book is unlikely to be religious anyway - thus lies the paradox.
    My, my - aren't we arrogant & conceited?

    Dawkins is a fool of the first order. Not all arrogant rhetoric is the truth.
    So he's wrong is he? ..There really is a God and he made eve from Adam's rib and he made the universe in seven days and his son was the baby Jesus meek and mild who we should be eternally grateful for because he died on a cross - that what you're saying?

    You must be thick as pigshit, if not thicker!

  5. #5
    Thailand Expat Boon Mee's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Last Online
    13-09-2019 @ 04:18 PM
    Location
    Samui
    Posts
    44,721
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    You must be thick as pigshit, if not thicker!
    Easy there, Scamp.
    Why don't you expand on your paradigm that septics won't elect an atheist?

  6. #6
    Thailand Expat
    keda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Last Online
    17-12-2010 @ 12:06 PM
    Posts
    9,831
    Let's get this right; are you saying it's better to have a black HIV, autistic gay schizo Hispanic woman President with a wooden leg and crabs, than one who doesn't believe Jesus was born of Holy wedlock?

  7. #7
    Thailand Expat Boon Mee's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Last Online
    13-09-2019 @ 04:18 PM
    Location
    Samui
    Posts
    44,721
    Quote Originally Posted by keda View Post
    Let's get this right; are you saying it's better to have a black HIV, autistic gay schizo Hispanic woman President with a wooden leg and crabs, than one who doesn't believe Jesus was born of Holy wedlock?
    That seems to be the premise of Scamp's book...

  8. #8
    Thailand Expat
    Marmite the Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    08-09-2014 @ 10:43 AM
    Location
    Simian Islands
    Posts
    34,827
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp
    anyone intelligent enough to get through the book is unlikely to be religious anyway
    Agreed.

  9. #9
    Thailand Expat
    GooMaiRoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Last Online
    28-04-2016 @ 09:27 AM
    Posts
    1,132
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    anyone intelligent enough to get through the book is unlikely to be religious anyway - thus lies the paradox.
    I always felt that the three most arrogant, intolerant and toxic religions of modern times are 1.) evangelical Christianity 2.) Islam and 3.) Atheism. Posts like yours demonstrate this point. Most of the West's greatest thinkers from the Golden Age and Age of Enlightenment believed in a higher intelligence. So do almost all modern Asians, because it's intuitive. You might be shocked that I actually understood one of Dawkin's recent talks that I saw on youtube.com. He spent 45 minutes doing his own 'straw man ' routine, poking holes at the literal interpretations of the Bible. Sophomoric stuff. Atheists can be as close-minded and defensive as the most ardent Jihadi or Christian Bushbot.

  10. #10
    watterinja
    Guest
    ^ Excellent post. The old 'straw man' trick indeed.

  11. #11
    たのむよ。
    The Gentleman Scamp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Online
    03-01-2017 @ 04:09 PM
    Location
    もうがまんできない!
    Posts
    9,754
    Quote Originally Posted by floorpotato View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    anyone intelligent enough to get through the book is unlikely to be religious anyway - thus lies the paradox.
    I always felt that the three most arrogant, intolerant and toxic religions of modern times are 1.) evangelical Christianity 2.) Islam and 3.) Atheism. Posts like yours demonstrate this point. Most of the West's greatest thinkers from the Golden Age and Age of Enlightenment believed in a higher intelligence. So do almost all modern Asians, because it's intuitive. You might be shocked that I actually understood one of Dawkin's recent talks that I saw on youtube.com. He spent 45 minutes doing his own 'straw man ' routine, poking holes at the literal interpretations of the Bible. Sophomoric stuff. Atheists can be as close-minded and defensive as the most ardent Jihadi or Christian Bushbot.
    Well I'm inclined to agree with you there, but I never said I was an athiest, neither am I am agnostic, I simply don't know.

    I would totally agree that somebody who says "there's absolutely nothing when you die" is just as arrogant as somebody who is adamant that there is, and personally I like to hope that there is a 'next level' whereby everything we ever wanted to know will be explained, though it is so far from our comprehension it is a waste of time to live your life trying to figure out what it is.

    There was a post a few weeks back when somebody said that the foetus has all the answers but the trauma of childbirth causes it to lapse into complete ignorance so we have to start from scratch.

    This ties in perfectly with an NDE a Canadian woman I know on Samui had 3 years ago when she had a car accident at 22yrs old.

    So I live in hope but I don't gamble my life on the premise of a god as such.

  12. #12
    Bounced
    Frankenstein's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Last Online
    13-10-2016 @ 10:42 AM
    Location
    The land of milking honeys
    Posts
    3,292
    The only real-life account I have of a near death experience described no tunnels, levitation or anything.

    I asked him, and he said 'There was nothing. Then I woke up again.'

    Some theorize that you experience what you believe in. Rowan Atkinson as the Devil says 'The Jews were right. Sorry. It's downstairs for you.'

    I don't worry too much about this, as I know I will get there sooner or later, and the speculation about some kind of afterlife will just be speculation, as it has been since the beginning of mankind.
    Last edited by Frankenstein; 23-03-2007 at 08:35 PM.
    Freedom does not chew bubblegum

  13. #13
    Thailand Expat
    sabang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Online
    04-09-2019 @ 05:06 AM
    Location
    BackinOz
    Posts
    30,807
    An interesting thing about religion is that every race and culture that I know of in human history had a sort of religious belief, be it animistic, monotheistic or whatever. Ditto spirits and ghosts.
    Whether this is anecdotal evidence of the existence of some form of supernatural presence, or the manifestation of a psychological need within ourself to explain or rationalise the incomprehensible (creation, existence, life & death etc) is a ponderous thought.

  14. #14
    I am in Jail
    stroller's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Last Online
    12-03-2019 @ 09:53 AM
    Location
    out of range
    Posts
    23,080
    I just want to point out that atheism isn't a religion, since there is no god to worship.
    In its simplest form it is just a non-belief.

    "Calling Atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color."
    -- Don Hirschberg

  15. #15
    たのむよ。
    The Gentleman Scamp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Online
    03-01-2017 @ 04:09 PM
    Location
    もうがまんできない!
    Posts
    9,754
    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    An interesting thing about religion is that every race and culture that I know of in human history had a sort of religious belief, be it animistic, monotheistic or whatever. Ditto spirits and ghosts.
    Whether this is anecdotal evidence of the existence of some form of supernatural presence, or the manifestation of a psychological need within ourself to explain or rationalise the incomprehensible (creation, existence, life & death etc) is a ponderous thought.
    Perhaps it just comes down to greed and the fact that Earth is not enough for us. We have to rape and pillage it and we have to know everything which we don't, so we make it up.

  16. #16
    Thailand Expat
    GooMaiRoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Last Online
    28-04-2016 @ 09:27 AM
    Posts
    1,132
    Quote Originally Posted by stroller View Post
    I just want to point out that atheism isn't a religion, since there is no god to worship.In its simplest form it is just a non-belief.
    "Calling Atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color."Don Hirschberg
    Religion can be thought of as set of beliefs concerning the nature and purpose of the universe, usually involving some moral element and superhuman force. Buddhism has no god to worship. I must admit that I stretched the definition for rhetorical purposes. In my defense, many hard-core Darwinists and atheists do exhibit aspects of religion. Their all-encompassing explanation of the universe seems to give them a sense of certainty and purpose. Many also favor eugenics (hence the moral element of their mindset). Atheists, as with religious fanatics, can be very defensive people who go off on you if you question them, although I thought Gentleman Scamp clarified his position in a very thoughtful manner.

  17. #17
    Thailand Expat
    William's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Online
    19-05-2013 @ 06:37 AM
    Location
    In jail
    Posts
    5,822
    Quote Originally Posted by floorpotato View Post
    Most of the West's greatest thinkers from the Golden Age and Age of Enlightenment believed in a higher intelligence. So do almost all modern Asians, because it's intuitive.
    Actually, this not right. [ex Indonesia] Most Asians do not believe in a higher being.

  18. #18
    Thailand Expat
    William's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Online
    19-05-2013 @ 06:37 AM
    Location
    In jail
    Posts
    5,822
    Quote Originally Posted by floorpotato View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by stroller View Post
    I just want to point out that atheism isn't a religion, since there is no god to worship.In its simplest form it is just a non-belief.
    "Calling Atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color."Don Hirschberg
    Religion can be thought of as set of beliefs concerning the nature and purpose of the universe, usually involving some moral element and superhuman force. Buddhism has no god to worship. I must admit that I stretched the definition for rhetorical purposes. In my defense, many hard-core Darwinists and atheists do exhibit aspects of religion. Their all-encompassing explanation of the universe seems to give them a sense of certainty and purpose. Many also favor eugenics (hence the moral element of their mindset). Atheists, as with religious fanatics, can be very defensive people who go off on you if you question them, although I thought Gentleman Scamp clarified his position in a very thoughtful manner.
    In order to be "moral" one needs to believe in something superhuman force?

    For the record, while I believe in mankind, I'm a complete atheists. But please feel free to question me

  19. #19
    befuddled
    danbo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Online
    10-08-2008 @ 10:57 PM
    Location
    Hatty Town
    Posts
    3,452
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    I simply don't know.
    So where is your certainty coming from? Mr Dawkins certainly believes that he knows. I'm confused. Do you agree with him that there isn't a God?
    Last edited by danbo; 23-05-2007 at 03:48 AM. Reason: I added some bits

  20. #20
    befuddled
    danbo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Online
    10-08-2008 @ 10:57 PM
    Location
    Hatty Town
    Posts
    3,452
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gentleman Scamp View Post
    So he's wrong is he? ..There really is a God and he made eve from Adam's rib and he made the universe in seven days....
    Arguments such as this merely attack literal interpretations of the Bible. To dismiss the concept of a creator and a meaning to life beyond the material world because science is able to 'prove' the Bible inaccurate is just plain silly.
    Last edited by danbo; 23-05-2007 at 03:54 AM. Reason: I added some more bits....I'm pretty bored if you must know....I wish I had a hobby.

  21. #21
    befuddled
    danbo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Online
    10-08-2008 @ 10:57 PM
    Location
    Hatty Town
    Posts
    3,452
    Quote Originally Posted by stroller View Post
    I just want to point out that atheism isn't a religion, since there is no god to worship.
    In its simplest form it is just a non-belief.
    I would say that there is a difference between a) not believing that there is a God and b) believing that there isn't a God? The latter does strike me as a viewpoint that could be called a belief system - a religion if you like.

  22. #22
    befuddled
    danbo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Online
    10-08-2008 @ 10:57 PM
    Location
    Hatty Town
    Posts
    3,452
    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    An interesting thing about religion is that every race and culture that I know of in human history had a sort of religious belief, be it animistic, monotheistic or whatever. Ditto spirits and ghosts.
    Whether this is anecdotal evidence of the existence of some form of supernatural presence, or the manifestation of a psychological need within ourself to explain or rationalise the incomprehensible (creation, existence, life & death etc) is a ponderous thought.
    This could well be the case - nothing more than a by-product of consciousness and awareness of 'self'....Or it could all be true - I'm hedging my bets.

  23. #23
    たのむよ。
    The Gentleman Scamp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Online
    03-01-2017 @ 04:09 PM
    Location
    もうがまんできない!
    Posts
    9,754
    believing that there isn't a God? The latter does strike me as a viewpoint that could be called a belief system - a religion if you like.
    If somebody said to me - 'There's nothing after you die, fact' I would think that just as arrogant as somebody who was adamant there was a God and stated it as if it were fact.

    If somebody said to my children 'If you do something bad God will send you to hell where you will burn and scream forever' - then I would consider it child abuse and take whatever action I could against the cnut, be it a court case or a hammer and a bottle of kettle descaler.

  24. #24
    Thailand Expat
    keda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Last Online
    17-12-2010 @ 12:06 PM
    Posts
    9,831
    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by floorpotato View Post
    Most of the West's greatest thinkers from the Golden Age and Age of Enlightenment believed in a higher intelligence. So do almost all modern Asians, because it's intuitive.
    Actually, this not right. [ex Indonesia] Most Asians do not believe in a higher being.
    That's logical, can't be anything higher than Asians.

  25. #25
    I don't know barbaro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    on pacific ocean, south america
    Posts
    21,406
    Thanks Gentleman Scamp, I very well may order this book.


Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •