Thread: Gouging - Rugby

Below is an article from Brain Moore in the Telegraph on the subject of gouging.
According to the article it is making a comeback in the sport.
Back in the day I recall Michel Palmie the French lock had a reputation for this and other nefarious activities.

It should be stamped out immediately, but not perhaps in the way described in the article as used by John Hopoate, an Aussie Rugby League player who apparently
preferred to get his retaliation in first by inserting one of his fingers up the opponents anus.

A relative of a well know CD spinner perhaps?

Gouging is cynical, and plain cowardly - Telegraph

Gouging is cynical, and plain cowardly

In the uber-violent world that was French club rugby in the late 1980s there was a requirement for most front row players to wear a cricket box.



By Brian Moore
Last Updated: 10:19AM GMT 28 Jan 2009

Up for it: Brian Moore in action against the Soviet Union in 1991 Photo: GETTY IMAGES


They weren't afraid of one unexpectedly rearing up off a length, rather that the opposite hooker was about to swing on his props and plant both feet on their crown jewels.
This was not the only manifestation of foul play that ran through the French game. Gouging has been an ever-present, but I remember one game when, as a spectator, I saw the whole menu used.
Agen were playing Valence d'Agen, their bitter local rivals and there was trouble from the first ball. At the line-out, Philippe Sella drove the ball forward at centre. The Agen forwards drove over him and the ball was then moved away. Three opposition forwards held Sella down and when everyone else had gone proceeded to give him a hiding.
When the Agen forwards realised their deified captain was in trouble they turned and ran to help. The first player to arrive launched a two-footed drop-kick into the jaw of one of the assailants. There then followed a pitched battle; none of your handbags-at-dawn; a fully blown fight using feet, elbows, heads and the usual fists.
The referee dismissed the drop-kicker, but was helpless for the rest of the half as 10 all-out brawls took place. At one point the referee sin-binned two forwards from each side, leaving five and six others, respectively, to play on. When the 10-minute suspensions were up and the four players returned, two of them started scrapping immediately. They were both dismissed, but resumed fighting in the tunnel and had to be separated by police.
To its great credit the French RU used swingeing bans to stop the violence which had spread to the national side.
These were the days when you could ruck players from the breakdown and stop them killing the ball. Nobody has ever, as far as I'm aware, explained why this practice was so wrong it had to be shunned in favour of a system which too often produces slow ball.
It may because, as with most things, a small number of players took this chance to dish out pain in general.
Later in my career, whenever I played against Wales, I would wear a 'reverse' shinpad. This protected against the then penchant for treading on a player's calf while ostensibly only rucking him away from the ball. This target was selected because if the foot was planted effectively there was nothing a player could do. His calf would swell, then seize and eventually he'd have to leave the field.
Gouging has gone in and out of 'favour' but was prevalent in the late 80s and early 90s. Many times against France I suffered, some times so blatantly it can clearly be seen on camera.
The increased number of cameras has led to the decline in foul play at top level and rightly so. Kicks, knees, elbows and punches are invariably spotted by touch judges; where not, the operation of a post-fact citing system allows retrospective punishment.
But gouging has made an unwelcome return in recent months. The latest incarnation involves an allegation against Leicester prop Julian White on a Welsh opponent from Cardiff on Saturday. If proven, White faces and should be given a lengthy ban.
I think the reason for a raised number of gouging allegations is that with most other things being caught, it remains one of few acts of foul play that is difficult to spot.
However, of all acts, gouging is the most cynical, clinical, callous and cowardly. Further, it is the one which can leave irreparable damage to the most important of the five senses. Anything which makes its presence less likely should be used. Mind you, if they feel weaponless, players could try the perversely premeditated foul play of Australian Rugby League's John Hopoate.
After one game three North Queensland players claimed that during tackles Hopoate had tried to ram a finger up their anus in an attempt to make a quick 'play-the-ball'. Once this claim was public several of Hopoate's previous opponents came forward saying this had happened to them, but they had been too embarrassed to mention it.
The hearing before the NRL judiciary is available on the net but I warn you not read this while holding a hot drink, or any similar substance which, if spilt, might cause injury. If you can desist from convulsing for a few seconds you will see that Hopoate's case, presented by a QC no less, was that he had been merely trying to administer that favourite schoolboy pranks, the 'wedgie'. Quite why that was appropriate for a first-grade game is not clear.
Hopoate was officially found guilty of 'unsportsmanlike interference'. As one witness said: "I was disgusted. I know it's a tough game, but there's no room for that."

Originally Posted by Troubled

In the uber-violent world that was French club rugby in the late 1980s there was a requirement for most front row players to wear a cricket box.

Fvck the old christmas hold, hand full of nuts....... awwwwwwwww.

I was asked to play hooker once and as a wring in with blokes a lot older than me!

The coach warned me that if the opposition put their hands anywhere near my face in a scrum then bite their hands.

First scrum one bloke stuck his fingers in my mouth and pulled my face and so I could not see the ball being fed into the scrum (on our feed) and we lost that tight head.

My tight head asked me what had happened (why I didn't strike) and I told him their open head prop had ripped my face.

Next scrum our feed and sure enough the same thing happened and I bit him and which erupted in a bit of a shoving match.

Next thing I knew their tight head prop was on the ground after being head butted, the referee blew everything up and gave a penalty to the opposing side (for the head butt) but he wasn't sure who the culprit was.

Next scrum no problem, we won the game easy and these type of incidents do put teams off and that's why people use them.

Not really needed and gouging is one of the lowest forms of intimidation in the game! Being stomped on is not nice either but if you end up on the wrong side of a ruck impeeding the ball movement your going to get spiked!

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

but if you end up on the wrong side of a ruck impeeding the ball movement your going to get spiked!

Part and parcel of the game then.....

Originally Posted by Thai Pom

Part and parcel of the game then.....

If you unfortunately find yourself in this position once then it is unfair to be danced on.

But you see some blokes everytime there is a ruck close to the opponents line they manage to get in the way and hold up the ball.

These blokes deserve to get raked and you see most referees will allow it as long as it is not on the head!

Buck Shelford became an unfortunate victim of the French rucking techniques

Roughly 20 minutes into the match, he was caught at the bottom of a rather aggressive ruck, and an errant French boot found its way into Shelford's groin, somehow ripping his scrotum and leaving one testicle hanging free. He also lost four teeth in the process. Incredibly, after discovering the injury to his scrotum, he calmly asked the physio to stitch up the tear and returned to the field before a blow to his head left him concussed. He was substituted and watched the remainder of the game from the grandstand where he witnessed the All Blacks lose 16–3. To this day Shelford has no memory of the game.[2]

I don't ever want to have a testicle 'hanging free'.

I played a bit at not a very high level in France in the late 70's - It could be brutal.

Even then France had a league system - every match counted

Originally Posted by Thai Pom

Part and parcel of the game then.....

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

These blokes deserve to get raked

As I said,,,,