Musicians and drugs

[stroller]

A sort of tired subject, but I've been wondering, are rock musicians more prone to drug abuse than other humans?
Most of my fav musicians are addicted to something or other, many are dead.

Starting with Janis Joplin, Jimi Hendrix, Jim Morrison, and more recently, sort of, Nirvana's Kurt Cobain, Alice-in Chains Lane Staley, Monster Magnet's Dave Wyndorf survived an overdose last year, but they haven't played since.
Lemmi seems to hold it together, Lou Reed is an old meth fart, Aerosmith's Mr.Tyler and Keith Richard look like the living dead.

Oh, and that perky lead singer of Stone Temple Pilots.
Ministry's Al Jourgensen is alive and kicking after kicking the habit, I think.
Megadeath's Dave Mustaine? A new album due, all clean for a few months again?

And that's just a few examples...
What's wrong with these guys???

[friscofrankie]

Wouldn't it be easier to list the artists that didn't use or drink heavily?
I think it's fairly common for creative people to try altering their consciousness. It's not just musicians; writers, painters, sculptors & poets all have such a high incidence of substance abuse it almost universal. For some success is a death sentence they have to omuch money not enough desire to control their beast. What drives people like that to create to work with such intensity?

Creative people usually are just a bit more intense, willing to step out of normality, walk on the edge. Usually they are eager to do so. Not sure if that slight touch of insanity comes out of the creativity and mental activity or if the creativity comes from the craziness. They have always seemed to go hand in hand though.

[Frankenstein]

The creativity must be there from the start, far too many kids think they'll make better music if they drop acid, but that's just bullshit, if they sounded like shit before taking the drugs they won't sound better afterwards.

Already talented people sometimes get the push they need to explore something new. Heard an old musician theorize that hallucinogenics will make you put out your best material in one burst, but deplete your creativity, so you may make one or two fantastic album, but then the creativity dies. If you hadn't taken any, your creative reserve would be spread out over time instead.

Not sure I agree with what he said though, just thought it was an interesting thought.

[friscofrankie]

I don't think drugs enhance creativity at all. They may help break down some inhibitions in exhibiting one's creativity. What I was trying to say is the willingness to try "adventurous behavior" (that touch of craziness) seems to be a partner with creativity.

Creative people seem to have higher incidence of relationship problems, dependency problems, "adjustment" problems. They don't seem to integrate into society's idea of normality. Drug use is only one example. For want of a better word let's call it "neurosis" does this "neurosis" stem from their innate creativity? Or does the creativity stem from their innate "neurosis?"

[stroller]

Creative people seem to have higher incidence of relationship problems, dependency problems, "adjustment" problems. They don't seem to integrate into society's idea of normality.

That's true.
But what role do drugs play in this? Overindulgence will create all the undesirable side-effects without the creative genious, but are creative peope less creative without drugs?
Thinking of music specifically, there is something instantaneous about music which makes it different from other art forms. Are drugs essential to 'create' the intensity of a live concert? Well, I've seen guys fukc up badly while under the influence and not even realising it, alcohol and speed are notorious for this, but it doesn't kill anyone quickly.

[stroller]

Heroin seems to be the one to avoid, it does seem to leave a trail of deaths.

Bands like Hawkwind and Greatful dead are still going, they'd never have made anything worthwhile without the odd acidtab or two, would they?

[stroller]

There are entire areas of the arts dedicated to drugs, wouldn't make much sense without.
Literature and painting seem to be more about the slow ones, you can be slopped out on opium and take your time, or be blotto on alc and still hit keys on the typewriter.

Well it's in music as well, Alice-in-chains last album was very bass-heroin.

Sisters of Mercy is speed.

[friscofrankie]

Standing in front of 1000 people, let alone 20,000 or more, can be an intimidating experience. I really don't think drugs enhance their "creativity' at all. But it sure does Loosen 'em up a bit. Rock concerts have always been rife with alcohol and drugs of every kind. Can't remember being to one straight. Ever. It's a fuckin party!

We go home get some rest come down, wait for the nest concert. The show people? They get on the bus or plane, grab quick nap, wake up in some other city, get ready to do it all over again, tours go on for months.

Intense party damn near every night no time to recharge. No time to come down. "Gimme another line I gotta fuckin show in ten minutes, man. Make it a fat one." Reds, 'Ludes or valium to crash. Crank, coke or biphetimine-20s to get goin'. Half a bottle of old crow to get loose in between. Maybe a nice mellow hit of smack to ease the fuckin nerves. Fuckin burnt out, still high on six kinds of intoxicants can make for a loose and intense show. Seen some great concerts where you know the dudes on stage were fuckin wasted, fried, maybe two shows from a crash.

I don't think drugs are essential. They are part of the scene. They are something that these people use. Get on that fuckin schedule with enough money to kill yourself, easy to get too far gone. Hard not to. tehn theres all the parties between, new people, plenty of everything. Who wants to rest when the party's going so goddam strong?

I have partied long and hard, running around making thngs happen, no voice, spun like fuckin 600 hp top. Days. Weeks. Damn near did a Jimi one night. Burnt out, ate a hand full of reds to crash, lily f-40s. My partners were in the other room snortin coke. I stared pukin. Funny thing, I remember this chick comes in, turns me over as I was chokin' on my own puke. slappin the shit outta me forcing me to lay on my side. I ain't no fuckin rock star going for months on end without a fuckin break. Doubt I woulda made it even if I was just a fuckin Roadie.

That kind of intensity, and a strong partiality to drugs. Takes a lot of self-discipline to control. Most of 'em need to come pretty close to going over the edge before they learn it, if at all. Recreational drugs are alright, but they ain't fuel.

[stroller]

Stroller's theory of ethereal vibrations manifesting in matter: Drugs are the catalysts, spirits which wander between the worlds, living entities which can make and break the feeble humans.

Some don't care about humans, others are benevolent, some devour the host.

Glad I slayed that fekking dragon from some Chinese mountain, ain't no rockstar either.

[friscofrankie]

Greatful dead

anything worthwhile

never did see what people saw in the dead. I used to catch a free concert in Provo park now and then. Acid is the one drug I think might have had some influence on creativity, other than a inhibition inhibitor
Acid though not somethng you can get too far into, Eat it a couple times a week it loses it's punch by the third time. Acid and heroin now...
wow.
When I write A few beers seems to lubricate the process. Writing on Opiates... can I get back to you on that?

[stroller]

never did see what people saw in the dead.

Nor me, just being fair and including a group from across the pond.
Hawkwind kicked ass, though.

No, that's not fair, lot's groups from the States, fukcing West coast psychedelic, from Damon Edge to Suicidal Tendencies and lots I haven't even heard about, I'm sure.

[Frankenstein]

Casey Jones by the Grateful Dead is a great song but I agree a lot of their other stuff is mediocre. Check it out.

[sabang]

Some historical druggies-
Most of the great romantic poets were opium heads. Byron, Keats, both Shelleys, not sure about Wordsworth.
Louis Armstrong was a well known Stoner, pretty much a constant smoker- yes, he didn't just sound it, he was permanently stoned.
After WW2, jazz became more experimental and introspective- the bebop era. Heroin addiction was almost mandatory to these blokes. Bird Parker, Thelenious Monk, Stan Getz, Miles Davis, Dizzy Gillespie. Dave Brubeck was about the only one with a clean head actually.
In their early days Pink Floyd were massive acid heads. Their early bandleader, Syd Barrett, burnt out on it and was never the same again.
Freud was a druggie, as was Jung.
Jackson Pollock was on all round substance abuser, alkie most of all.
The Beat Generation- Kesey, Bukowski, Ginsberg, alkies and druggies.
William Burroughs- legendary.

[Frankenstein]

Stroller's theory of ethereal vibrations manifesting in matter: Drugs are the catalysts, spirits which wander between the worlds, living entities which can make and break the feeble humans.

Some don't care about humans, others are benevolent, some devour the host.

Glad I slayed that fekking dragon from some Chinese mountain, ain't no rockstar either.

Can I have some of that shit too, please?

[NickA]

Maybe it's just because they can - they have the time and money to take it to extremes and people around them who encourage them to do so.

Also, playing the same songs every night must get pretty boring, but you still need to look excited to please the crowd.

[friscofrankie]

Some historical druggies-
Most of the great romantic poets were opium heads. Byron, Keats, both Shelleys, not sure about Wordsworth.
Louis Armstrong was a well known Stoner, pretty much a constant smoker- yes, he didn't just sound it, he was permanently stoned.
After WW2, jazz became more experimental and introspective- the bebop era. Heroin addiction was almost mandatory to these blokes. Bird Parker, Thelenious Monk, Stan Getz, Miles Davis, Dizzy Gillespie. Dave Brubeck was about the only one with a clean head actually.
In their early days Pink Floyd were massive acid heads. Their early bandleader, Syd Barrett, burnt out on it and was never the same again.
Freud was a druggie, as was Jung.
Jackson Pollock was on all round substance abuser, alkie most of all.
The Beat Generation- Kesey, Bukowski, Ginsberg, alkies and druggies.
William Burroughs- legendary.

Tip of the iceberg man.
be interesting pick an artist from what ever discipline. From whatever period in history. Look into their past their personal lives. The greater the artist the greater their use/abuse?
from Edgar Allen Poe to Johnny Cash (fuckin smiley over there ->)
Ftizgerald, Hemmingway.
Go to the library, pick one scratch the surfaces you chances of finding a boozer or druggie are pretty damn good.

[Marmite the Dog]

Also, playing the same songs every night must get pretty boring, but you still need to look excited to please the crowd.

It could do, but I always thought the best drug was a good crowd.

A hard working band who (apart from beer) seem to be drug free are Iron Maiden. Their tours used to last years.

[NickA]

^Can you imagine what it's like being in the Stones and still having to play Satis-bloody-faction....fek me, I wouldn't want to do that job no matter how much they got paid.

I would only do freeform blues jam sessions to small crowds of super-rich pseudo-intellectual beatniks if I could play music, but i can't.

I do like to jam though, which involves playing the guitar randomly and saves the need to remember songs or know keys or tune the guitar or play anything that sounds nice - just hit the strings really.

[Marmite the Dog]

Ido like to jam though, which involves playing the guitar randomly and saves the need to remember songs or know keys or tune the guitar or play anything that sounds nice - just hit the strings really.

Such a pro!

[NickA]

I can't even be bothered with the feking things over here, the bloody strings rust up all the time.

[Frankenstein]

On the same day.