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  1. #1
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    Perfect cheese sauce

    1 litre quality chicken stock (i get mine from the market)
    600ml white wine
    240g grated cheese (Parmigiano)
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    40g cream cheese
    Knob of butter
    First reduce your chicken stock to 400ml in a small pot (if you do it in a large pot you’ll be cleaning burnt stock off the sides for weeks).Cut the hard side of the cheese and put into chicken stock. In a separate, even smaller pot, reduce the white wine to 60ml.make sure it is still warm when you continue to the next step
    Add the reduced wine to the reduced stock. Mix the grated cheese and cornflour then stir into pot turn off heat keep stirring till melted , then when that was melted I added the cream cheese, . Finally stir in the knob of butter

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    600ml white wine
    sacrilege

  3. #3
    The cold, wet one
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    What's wrong with the standard bechamel or white sauce with cheese? Melted butter, stir in flour, cook out for a couple of mins, gradually whisk in milk - letting it thicken each time, when the right consistency add seasoning, grated cheese and a pinch of cayenne (or not, according to taste). Simples.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    equations goop. No chef other than stir fry would use cornflour. Bechamel as NR says with the cheese folded in is the way to go.

  5. #5
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    Agree, cornflour is a fuckup fixer, not a planned ingredient.

  6. #6
    Pronce. PH said so AGAIN!
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    Why bother reducing the two liquids in separate pots? Mix them and reduce them together, the result will be the same.

    Why mix cornflower into the cheese? The result will be little lumps of cornflower in your sauce?

    NR got it right, make a basic white sauce and then you have a canvas on which to paint. Her only point I would quibble with is cooking out the roux, it is better to put into an oven, stir occasionally and remove when it is the colour that is required.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by quimbian corholla
    Her only point I would quibble with is cooking out the roux, it is better to put into an oven, stir occasionally and remove when it is the colour that is required.
    You cant watch it. You are not from Louisiana.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aging one View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    equations goop. No chef other than stir fry would use cornflour. Bechamel as NR says with the cheese folded in is the way to go.
    Yep. Still basic and even modified classic technique.

  9. #9
    Pronce. PH said so AGAIN!
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    Quote Originally Posted by aging one
    You cant watch it. You are not from Louisiana.
    LOL.

  10. #10
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    All chefs use corn starch.

    This sauce, as Quimbian points out, is basically flawed in preparation if we are assuming it is a cheese sauce used for common or garden uses such as lasagne etc, although the ingredients will combine to make something interesting. With the wine and stock though, as well as the cream cheese, it sounds as if this is a fondue-esqe type of sauce. The starch of the corn flour begins to break down as well, meaning that the sauce will remain runny for longer as opposed to a roux based sauce which, left in the open on its own, is easier to slice than pour. This is why corn flour would be used.

    The reduction of the cooking liquor in separate pans is because the wine is reduced to 10% and the stock to 40% of volume. If they are being this precise it must be for a reason.

    You can add corn flour straight to a hot pot if it has been mixed with the cheese. The reason is that it coats the cheese gratings and therefore the smaller particles are immediately absorbed into the hot liquid. If you just dumped it in without mixing it well into the grated cheese, the outside to absorb and thicken before the rest could dissipate making lumps. There would be no lumps with this method.

    I would make a few changes to the ingredients, but more for personal taste. As a dipping sauce though, it sounds not too bad. Better then shop bought shit. I might try it as a dip and see what happens.

  11. #11
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    Seems a bit complicated for just a cheese sauce. I go with NR's way too.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    Knob of butter
    You can get away with margarine at a pinch!


  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by November Rain View Post
    What's wrong with the standard bechamel or white sauce with cheese? Melted butter, stir in flour, cook out for a couple of mins, gradually whisk in milk - letting it thicken each time, when the right consistency add seasoning, grated cheese and a pinch of cayenne (or not, according to taste). Simples.
    Not to mention 600m of wine and a litre of chicken stock.
    how much cheese sauce are we trying to make here?

  14. #14
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    Read.

    You've got to reduce it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    1 litre quality chicken stock (i get mine from the market)
    600ml white wine
    240g grated cheese (Parmigiano)
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    40g cream cheese
    Knob of butter
    Add schnapps, kirsch or some other white spirit to that, and it's pretty much a Swiss fondue dip. The milder bechamel based sauces just aren't cheesy enough for my liking, more like a flour sauce.

  16. #16
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    That is no way a fondue!!! Have you ever even eaten a fondue?

    Fondue is melted cheese, only cheese with wine and kirsch added.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by patsycat View Post
    That is no way a fondue!!! Have you ever even eaten a fondue?

    Fondue is melted cheese, only cheese with wine and kirsch added.
    It's texture and taste, if a little chickeny, will be quite similar and considerably less fattening.

  18. #18
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    No, no ,no!!

    Fondue is fondue, cheese sauce is cheese sauce.

    Puleeze, they should have some sort of banned stamp at the Swiss border for people who think fondue is a f-ing cheese sauce.

  19. #19
    Pronce. PH said so AGAIN!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilbert
    The reduction of the cooking liquor in separate pans is because the wine is reduced to 10% and the stock to 40% of volume. If they are being this precise it must be for a reason.
    I think that unless they are starting with an extremely dilute stock (more like a broth) then by the time all the other ingredients are added it would not make much of a difference to the taste

    Anyway why not reduce the wine first, then add the stock and reduce as required?

    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    1 litre quality chicken stock (i get mine from the market)
    600ml white wine
    Let's do the maths!

    600ml wine x .1= 60ml
    1l stock x .4 = 400ml

    So, circa 460ml of liquid. Into that we add

    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    240g grated cheese (Parmigiano)
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    40g cream cheese
    Knob of butter
    Unless very carefully handled that is going to split.

    Much better to finish with the liquids, take a bit out to mix with the starch, stir it back to the pot and bring it back up to the boil until the starch does its thing.

    Cool it a bit and then gradually mix in the cheeses, butter and whatever else, the cornstarch will hold it together at that point. It is still way too much starch though unless the sauce needs to be carved or something.

    I still think it is a shitty recipe.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by aging one View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    equations goop. No chef other than stir fry would use cornflour. Bechamel as NR says with the cheese folded in is the way to go.
    Waaah!

    No seriously Aging One, I've read quite a few of your threads.

    I never felt the compulsion to criticize you.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by patsycat View Post
    No, no ,no!!

    Fondue is fondue, cheese sauce is cheese sauce.

    Puleeze, they should have some sort of banned stamp at the Swiss border for people who think fondue is a f-ing cheese sauce.
    I never said it was. Just that it would be similar in taste and texture.

    Besides, who would want to go to Switzerland anyway?

  22. #22
    The cold, wet one
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaywalker0112 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by aging one View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by tommy1978
    40g cornflour mix this with grated cheese
    equations goop. No chef other than stir fry would use cornflour. Bechamel as NR says with the cheese folded in is the way to go.
    Waaah!

    No seriously Aging One, I've read quite a few of your threads.

    I never felt the compulsion to criticize you.
    Darling, no offence meant but you made a curry with tomato soup. Sorry, sweetie, but AO (and even I) would know food better than that.

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