Thread: Thai elections 2011-Thai PM sets stage for tough election

Originally Posted by tomta

Yes, what reign of tolerance, patience and respect it has been. Pity about those people who run into bullets though.

I agree on the tolerance part. The UDD leadership should be jailed.

But I'm not sure that the running into bullets part was a pity. Why was that a pity? A few of them were innocent, sure. But a majority were not and chose to run into the bullets. So why a pity? Pity they died. And a pity they can't live to regret their useless misstakes.

A pity it was, as well, that it wasn't the UDD leadership that got shot.

They should have been shot when they pulled their knickers down on that last day of the siege.

Just giving up like that - after parading victims aound town, letting their supporters get raped for weeks by army snipers, and acting all tough and instigating - is not a pity however. It's normal behaviour among gay shamsters.

Funny thing is that even a few farangs believed them. Surely none on this board however.

Yes, it was a piss poor act by the not so herioc leaders. Walking off stage, leaving their loyal suppporters to the fend for themselves.

Now they are rewarded and get to run for parliament, which they claim as their right.

Mr T is even claiming he can't give up because of those that died for him.

Originally Posted by NoBuzz

The UDD leadership should be jailed.

As opposed to the Coup conspirators (guilty of a capital crime) and bent judiciary? Or those army folk that were shooting unarmed people (including paramedics) in a Wat?

Yes, they should all be jailed too, right back to the crooked judges who let Thaksin off on his assets case.

The PAD was stupid, they should have pushed for an investigation on the Shin sale, as Thakki breached the constitution.

Instead they pushed for his resignation, giving him the opportunity to portray himself as champion of democracy. The coup made it worse, now he pretends to be a reborn Che Guevara.

Originally Posted by sabang

Or those army folk that were shooting unarmed people (including paramedics) in a Wat?

these were reds shooting at each other actually, get your facts straight, thank you

^ If you believe that you are raving nuts- if not, a liar. Up to you.

Originally Posted by Buksida

The PAD was stupid, they should have pushed for an investigation on the Shin sale, as Thakki breached the constitution.

actually they did in the beginning, but Thaksin has his hand on all the judicial institutions and legal cases were being thrown out, even had the head of tax department declaring the offshore transactions being legal, while it was blatantly not. Complete disgrace.

amazing that our red friends are bitching about the current judicial process today while it was the same under their favorite fascist leader

Originally Posted by sabang

^ If you believe that you are raving nuts- if not, a liar. Up to you.

says who ? you ?

Yes, they should all be jailed too, right back to the crooked judges who let Thaksin off on his assets case.

The PAD was stupid, they should have pushed for an investigation on the Shin sale, as Thakki breached the constitution.

Instead they pushed for his resignation, giving him the opportunity to portray himself as champion of democracy. The coup made it worse, now he pretends to be a reborn Che Guevara.

Originally Posted by Buksida

Walking off stage, leaving their loyal suppporters to the fend for themselves.

they did a runner, like you expect a Thai to do after an accident

they are scums, and showing support to any of those guys speak volume about the morale compass of their educated followers

problem with polls is they can reverse in the last minute,

happens all the time, sometimes having a strong lead too early and for too long might translate into a loss eventually

Bangkok Post : 'Beastly' posters vex vets

'Beastly' posters vex vets

VOTE-NO PLACARDS DISPARAGE ANIMALS WITH COMPARISON TO POLITICIANS, SAYS SEMINAR

• Published: 12/06/2011 at 12:00 AM
• Newspaper section: News

When it comes to Thai politics, it might be a jungle out there, but there's no need to pull innocent animals into the fray.


WILD KINGDOM: Members of the For Heaven and Earth Party wear various animal masks to encourage voters on Silom Road to ‘vote no’ in the July 3 general election.

That was the message at a seminar held by the Thai Veterinary Medical Association focusing on the use of animals by the For Heaven and Earth Party in posters promoting the group's "no vote" campaign.

For Heaven and Earth, the political offshoot of the Santi Asoke Buddhist Sect and the People's Alliance for Democracy, has put up placards throughout the city featuring buffalo, monkeys, dogs and monitor lizards wearing suits, with the accompanying text reading "Don't let animals into parliament."

Speakers at yesterday's seminar, "The Political Story of Animals", organised by the Thai Veterinary Medical Association at Dusit Zoo, took umbrage at the comparison.

Nantarika Chansue, of Chulalongkorn University's faculty of veterinary science, said that while the ads feature pictures of fierce dogs and monitor lizards to connote aggression and greed in politicians, these animals were incapable of lying.

The same could not be said of the mammals in parliament, Ms Nantarika added.

Equating slow-working politicians with tortoises was also off the mark, she said, as some of the species can swim fast.

Achariya Sailasutr, president of the Thai Veterinary Medical Association, said the campaign might mislead children on the nature of these animals.

However, she did concede that some similarities between the animals on the placards and their parliamentary counterparts were too strong to deny.

The eel comparison was spot on, she said, as it is a slippery creature and sometimes bites. Remembering these traits might teach people to remain cautious around politicians.

Ms Achariya said that the ideal outcome of the poster campaign would be for political parties to pay more attention to animal welfare issues.

Alongkorn Ma-hannop, the veterinarian for the Bureau of the Royal Household, said none of the parties contesting the election has stated a policy covering animal protection issues.

Whoever forms the next government, conservation of the environment and animals should be made a priority, especially as one of the country's icons is the elephant.

He said a law should be enacted to protect elephants as the illegal trade of the animal and ivory remains a threat to the species in the wild, he said.

The cost of young, live wild elephants ranges from 800,000 baht to one million baht each in Thailand, with the price sharply rising when they are smuggled overseas.

Bangkok Post : Facebook quip haunts PM

Facebook quip haunts PM

CHUMPOL, ABHISIT IN DISPUTE OVER COALITION 'THIEVES'

• Published: 12/06/2011 at 12:00 AM
• Newspaper section: News

Democrat leader Abhisit Vejjajiva's comments likening some of his coalition partners to thieves are causing him more headaches.


ON THE NOSE: Pheu Thai Party list candidate Yingluck Shinawatra smells a giant water bug as she campaigns at a fresh market in Ratchaburi municipality.

Chartthaipattana Party leader Chumpol Silpa-archa, who earlier last week criticised Mr Abhisit for making "ill-judged" Facebook comments about the coalition, yesterday stepped up his attack.

He insisted Mr Abhisit was being derogatory about the parties which helped keep his government in office.

Mr Abhisit referred to parties in his coalition that were formerly part of the People Power Party, aligned to deposed prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

They switched allegiance to help the Democrat Party take office, which sowed distrust on both sides.

Mr Abhisit said some people still distrusted those parties, which had given rise to claims that he was prepared to work with anyone for the sake of taking office. "Some even claim that I am rowing the boat for thieves," he said.

Mr Chumpol said yesterday that he believed Mr Abhisit was trying to suggest the Democrat Party was better than other parties.

"His arrogant attitude puts other coalition parties in a bad light," he said.

Earlier, Mr Chumpol said he was unhappy to learn that Mr Abhisit had posted a Facebook comment suggesting he had picked Chartthaipattana and other parties to join the Democrat-led coalition because he had no other choice.

Mr Abhisit said yesterday that Mr Chumpol might not have actually read his Facebook comments and might have misunderstood him. He would clear up the rift with Mr Chumpol at the cabinet meeting on Tuesday.

Mr Chumpol responded by saying that he understood exactly what was intended, and that Mr Abhisit should have been more discreet.

Originally Posted by DroversDog

Originally Posted by SteveCM

He said he was willing to speak to people of all political stripes but that everyone must abide by the law.

The problem here is Mark is talking about the current Thai judicial system that bends to Prem's version of the law. The sooner that Thailand rid itself of the meddling eunuch the better.

I wonder how many of bad decisions we have seen Mark make were handed to him from Prem. Most or all?

Bangkok Post : Do we remember the burning of Thailand?

COMMENTARY

Do we remember the burning of Thailand?

• Published: 12/06/2011 at 12:00 AM
• Newspaper section: News

Many people have expressed bewilderment. How is it that Pheu Thai Party's popularity is at a high? How is it that they are leading the Democrat Party in poll after poll? Sure, Yingluck Shinawatra is a hot item right now, but that can't be the sole reason, can it?

Could it be the genius of the Thaksin Shinawatra political machine? Could it be the ineptitude of the Abhisit Vejjajiva political machine? Could it be the naivete of the voting public?
Most likely, it's a combination of all of these.

It was only a little over a year ago that the whole world saw the tragic inferno burning all over the news; the footage of raving lunatics setting fire to Bangkok and city halls in the provinces. We can still watch the videos online today.

Of course, no one has been found guilty of any crimes, as yet. Then again, let's face it, no one is ever likely to be found guilty of anything. It's the way Thailand works.

However, one would have thought, the footage of the ''Thailand Inferno'' would have spelled the end of the Thaksin Shinawatra political machine.

Think about the ramifications: There's a group of people who were willing to burn the country down to the ground to further their political agenda. This was a heinous and treasonous crime.

I don't need the court to tell me who's guilty or not. I was there, listening to the speeches on the stage. I was there, interviewing the red shirts on the streets. I was there, on the back of a motorbike weaving through the smoke and ruins _ passing cheering and taunting thugs screaming out vengeance and satisfaction.

Days, weeks and months before May 19, 2010, the words from the red stage, from the red leaders and supporters were prophetic: ''Move in on us, and we'll burn the country down.''

Only three nights before May 19, 2010, I walked around the ''red occupation zone'' at Ratchaprasong, interviewing people. One red shirt woman was pointing and screaming at me with anger and venom, telling me to go and warn everyone out there: ''You move in on us, we'll burn the country down. You just wait. You just watch. You will see.''

I only half-believed her, for it wasn't an easy thing to swallow that we Thais could be so callous, so vengeful and so destructive as to burn our own country down. But then, I learned early in life never to underestimate the evil that men (and women) are capable of.

Here we are today, Sunday June 12, 2011. How many of us actually remember the burning of Thailand? How many of us still talk about it? Is the atrocity still alive and vibrant in the consciousness of the Thai Kingdom?

From what I've observed, most people have pretty much forgotten.

But this I will tell you. Go to red rallies, listen to red media and take heed of red leaders and politicians _ they never stop reminding their supporters of the killing of ''innocent'' civilians by government troops. They never cease to remind the world of the Japanese cameraman who was shot down. They never pull back on branding the Abhisit government as ''murderers''.

The images of tanks and troops shooting their way in _ locked and loaded, full metal jackets _ are still very alive and vivid in the red consciousness.

It's the belief and the passion, fueled by strong finances, that keeps the movement alive and ever expanding.

Some people may not like this red tactic. But what does it matter? At the end of the day, he who laughs is he who wins _ and Thaksin is winning.

Some people may say Abhisit is a gentleman. He wouldn't stoop so low as to use the tragic burning of Bangkok to win votes. But what does it matter? At the end of the day, he who rules the country is he who wins _ and Thaksin is winning.

Some people may say the Democrats want reconciliation, and such tactics can only lead to the opposite of reconciliation. But is anyone actually naive enough to think any of this is about reconciliation? No, it's not. It never has been.

Where are all those reconciliation committees with their big budgets now? Where is Anand Panyarachun?

Where is Kanit na Nakorn?

I don't know where they are, but I wouldn't mind speculating that they are still wondering in frustration why the very Democrats who appointed them to lead these reconciliation committees never listen to any of their recommendations.

It's not about reconciliation _ it never has been. For the establishment, it's about preventing Thaksin from returning to rule Thailand _ no ''ifs'', ''ands'' or ''buts''. For Thaksin, it's about returning to rule Thailand _ no ''ifs'', ''ands'', or ''buts''.

Anyone who says anything else is just repeating political propaganda. And we know both sides are willing to kill, bomb and burn to achieve their goals.

So why is it then that the Democrat Party has not used the burning of Thailand as a campaign booster? It would be a most effective propaganda tool to win votes.

There may be a host of reasons, but let's cut through the facade and recognise this: Thaksin Shinawatra was the most capable prime minister we have ever had. Abhisit Vejjajiva was/is potentially the most capable prime minister. But if the latter doesn't have the stomach for ''real politik'', he will be his own undoing.

Politics is made of stern stuff. It takes cojones. This isn't the Boy Scouts.

But perhaps the Democrats aren't pulling out the ''Thailand Inferno'' card because they know they don't need to. Because they know they already have the Winning Hand, backed up by a ''third hand''. So let Pheu Thai bark and bluff; at the end of the day, it won't matter.

Follow this logic. The small and medium parties have made their stances clear. They will form a coalition government with whoever wins the majority of votes. But is this just political mumbo jumbo? Are they simply propagandising their walk on the ''middle path'' to appeal to voters?

Consider this: First, in the note posted recently on his Facebook page titled ''From the heart of Abhisit to the people of Thailand'', the prime minister expressed many things, including his sadness that he had no choice but to form a coalition government with other political parties. That he couldn't stop corruption by these parties, but he had tried his best. This was his excuse as to why his government was plagued with so much corruption.

To which the leader of the Chartthaipattana Party, Chumpol Silapa-archa, reacted none too nicely. He said, ''It's not that Chartthaipattana wanted to join the government. If we weren't forced to, we wouldn't have ... we had to join.''

Second, I have written before about a conversation with the late Pairoj Suwanchawee of the famed ''Three Ps'' political faction. It was only a few months before his death that he explained how the Democrats are a shoo-in to form the next government, come what may. He told of how when the time comes to form a coalition government, a hand would knock on the door of all the political leaders and a voice would tell them to go with the Democrats, not Pheu Thai. In such a case, Pairoj said, ''You don't say no, you just don't.'' That's the Winning Hand, with the ace on top.

If this scenario holds, would the country be torn apart in civil war? No, of course not. We Thais are many things, among them pragmatic and resilient.

It's never doom and gloom in the Kingdom of Thailand. At the end of the day, if things seem to get out of hand, key people on all sides will stop and say, ''Wait a second, this is bad for business.''

Ladies and gentlemen, Thailand is far from ideal, but in general, life is good here, and business is good here. No matter who wins this game, it's unlikely that the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse will ride into town.

So while on July 3 we may be faced with a choice between Tweedledum and Tweedledee, it need not be always like this. The future is full of endless possibilities and we'll get there one day, to walk among the gods, to achieve the ideals. But first, everything starts with a belief. Never lose hope, and don't neglect to turn that hope into action.

Voranai Vanijaka

Bangkok Post : Interesting times don't have to end badly

EDITORIAL

Interesting times don't have to end badly

• Published: 12/06/2011 at 12:00 AM
• Newspaper section: News

For anyone not aware that Thailand may be in for some interesting times in the coming weeks, yesterday's front page news should have served as an eye opener. The headline of the lead story on the front page of the Bangkok Post read ''Sanan warns of civil war if rifts persist'', and below that was an article titled ''Prayuth gives nod to target Pheu Thai''.



The first headline refers to Sanan Kachornprasart, a long-time fixture in Thai politics and currently a deputy prime minister in the Abhisit Vejjajiva government and chief adviser to the Chartthaipattana Party, while the second headline refers to army chief Prayuth Chan-ocha. Obviously, Gen Prayuth is not literally encouraging the targeting of Pheu Thai Party members. According to an unnamed military source, Gen Prayuth has encouraged all army officers to counter allegations and criticisms of the military coming from the party.

In most countries a war of words between the military and a major political party, especially right before an election, would be considered highly unusual, but so would the events that set off the war of words. Pheu Thai is upset because it feels the army's special 350 drug task force is intentionally operating in areas which have a high percentage of its supporters, to intimidate them. On May 23, Pheu Thai candidate and former MP Pairoj Isarasereepong and some aides allegedly interfered with three members of the military task force who were conducting a search for drugs in Bangkok's Nong Chok district. ''If three soldiers encountered such a problem in their community, I will send 50 soldiers ... If 50 soldiers can't stop them, then I will send 100 soldiers.''

What is really surprising about all of this is that more of the country's political leaders aren't concerned about the military taking it upon itself to launch a drug suppression operation inside populated areas. Regardless of whether there is a political motivation behind the operation and timing of this drug task force, there are plenty of legitimate questions to ask about armed soldiers going on drug searches in any community in the country, be it red, yellow or purple. It might be logical to use the armed forces to patrol border areas for drug traffickers, but within the country drug suppression is best left to police and narcotics units with special training who are acting on specific information.

Then there is the item at the top of yesterday's front page. Maj Gen Sanan may have his own reasons for warning of possible violence and even civil war before or after the general election, as he has branded himself as the reconciliation alternative in a long-shot bid to become prime minister if neither major party is able to form the government. However, the sobering fact is that he is far from alone in his predictions of serious trouble.

Last week Reuters ran a special report on ''red shirt villages'' in the Northeast. The report quoted red shirt leader Natthawut Saikua as saying at a recent rally in Udon Thani: ''If Pheu Thai wins and they don't let us form a government ... Brothers and sisters, you come out. Attack. Attack. Let's get this over with and finish the fight.'' There is no excuse for this kind of incendiary talk, although there may well be those on the other side of the political divide who are less publicly urging strong action if their side doesn't come out on top. The die-hard yellow shirts are refusing to participate in the general election, just as they and the Democrats did back in February 2006 when Thaksin Shinawatra dissolved parliament and called a snap election. It could be argued that is when Thailand slipped off the road to democracy.

It might also be argued that without a real reconciliation process underway this election has been called prematurely. Mr Abhisit may not have had much choice since the longer he delayed, the more open he was to criticism that he was clinging to power. In any case, by law he would have had to dissolve parliament by the end of this year. The Truth for Reconciliation Commission appointed by the Democrat-led government has been accused of being biased and toothless, but on the other hand it's probably unrealistic to expect any commission to bring about reconciliation. That has to come from the people.

And the funny thing is that the majority of Thais have no problem with reconciliation. They don't identify with either group, at least not to the point of committing violence on the behalf of one. They are ready to move on to better things, and they're hoping for a government that will lead the way.

^^

Originally Posted by [B]Voranai Vanijaka[/B]

I don't need the court to tell me who's guilty or not.

.....

https://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordp...2%80%99s-fury/

June 11, 2011 · 12:40 pm

Prayuth’s fury


In an astonishing display of fury that seemed to descend into a testosterone-laced comparison of size and power, Army boss and royalist-in-chief General Prayuth Chan-ocha has lashed out at the Puea Thai Party and red shirts. He seems to be joining the throng of establishment figures who are deeply concerned that Puea Thai might pull off an election victory. He has plenty of reasons for not wanting this. Not least, Prayuth has been responsible for ensuring that Puea Thai does not win. If they do, his political position is challenged and his pro-Democrat Party actions, with huge budgets, are demonstrated to have failed.

There are several reports of Prayuth’s recent concerns and outbursts. The first is from Reuters and suggests a generalized astonishment on Prayuth’s part. The report has Prayuth commenting on a “military inquiry by the 2nd Army Region into some 200 ‘Red Shirt villages…’.” Reuters says there are more than 320 such villages. While the army investigation said these villagers were only demonstrating loyalty to red shirt causes, Prayuth is not sure. He admits that declaring loyalty to red shirts is not illegal but asks “whether this is an appropriate thing to do. … [i]t has raised questions about the social implications in the country from assigning colours to villages…”.

What is in Prayuth’s mind is the monarchy: “Thailand, and Thais should have only one colour — the colour of our national flag signifying the nation, religion and monarchy…”. Perhaps he also remembers the “liberated zones” of the counterinsurgency period? Prayuth’s royalist hackles are clearly raised by this “provocation.” But he’s not sounding rabid at this point.

The second and third reports are from The Nation and the Bangkok Post, and show a furious Prayuth frothing about perceived provocations to the military.

The story relates to a previous Puea Thai Party complaint that the military was threatening potential voters and red shirts by conducting a high-profile anti-drugs campaign that was focused almost entirely in areas where red shirts are strong in and around Bangkok. This complaint was dismissed by the army, which said the campaign would continue.

Over the past few days, a war of words developed between Puea Thai candidate Pairoj Isarasereepong and the Army Spokesman Colonel Sansern Kaewkamnerd, who is hated by many red shirts as the “face” of regime propaganda during the events and killings of March-May 2010. Sansern is the one who repeatedly says that the military killed no one in those dark days, so his capacity for the truth is restricted.

After Pairoj complained again about military intimidation, Sansern accused the candidate and his aides of “intimidating three military members of the government’s Task Force 315 anti-drug unit in a search at Sap Charoen estate in Nong Chok district on May 23.” The area is described in The Nation as a “red zone,” and at the time had “red clothes hanging out to dry outside many homes.”

Sansern accused Pairoj’s team of “surrounding” the army patrol, swearing at the soldiers, threatening them and of using weapons to threaten the soldiers. Pairoj disagrees and filed defamation complaints against Sansern. He claims local residents complained of the military’s presence. He further claims that the Nong Chok police chief was present when he confronted three members of the army task force.

These events sent Prayuth into a rage of the spotty teenage variety. He was wonderfully direct: “Who are you? How dare you intimidate our officers? I won’t allow them to do so. If three soldiers encountered such a problem in their community, I will send 50 soldiers…. Let’s see if they dare to surround our soldiers again. If 50 soldiers can’t stop them, then I will send 100 soldiers there.…”. In fact, this “mine is bigger than yours” approach is the same “military logic” that has been seen in repeated border clashes with Cambodia.

The general’s frustration boiled: “Lately, I’ve tried to keep my mouth shut and tried to build a good atmosphere for the election, so everybody would be happy with the election. People can advertise whatever they want. But you have made allegations against soldiers, you have bullied soldiers. I can’t allow it.”

Prayuth has never been a quiet political campaigner, but the olive branch recently offered by Puea Thai, with Yingluck Shinawatra saying “she was ready to call on Prayuth and seek his advice…” is now broken and trampled. Of course, Prayuth denies any animosity towards Puea Thai. His track record, though, is one of anti-red shirt, anti-Puea Thai and anti-Thaksin Shinawatra activism. In this outburst he warned that “law-breakers” would be charged and imprisoned. He made this anti-red shirt when he added “you will be punished and then you will complain about injustice…”.

Prayuth doesn’t change and this exchange is a precursor of what can be expected if Puea Thai, which has always been the underdog given all the election fixing that has gone on, happens to do well in the election.

Originally Posted by Mid

^^

Originally Posted by [B]Voranai Vanijaka[/B]

I don't need the court to tell me who's guilty or not.

.....

Good one.

Originally Posted by Mid

^^



I don't need the court to tell me who's guilty or not.



.....

Likewise, I know who torched the area around my neighbourhood.

Interesting...I wonder if Robert Amsterdam reads this column.

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

Days, weeks and months before May 19, 2010, the words from the red stage, from the red leaders and supporters were prophetic: ''Move in on us, and we'll burn the country down.''

Only three nights before May 19, 2010, I walked around the ''red occupation zone'' at Ratchaprasong, interviewing people. One red shirt woman was pointing and screaming at me with anger and venom, telling me to go and warn everyone out there: ''You move in on us, we'll burn the country down. You just wait. You just watch. You will see.''

Voranai Vanijaka

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

So while on July 3 we may be faced with a choice between Tweedledum and Tweedledee

Voranai Vanijaka

Yep, been saying the same thing myself.

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

Likewise, I know who torched the area around my neighbourhood.

Originally Posted by Mid

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

Likewise, I know who torched the area around my neighbourhood.

Meaning Mid?

Are you still going to try to deny it?

The many buildings around Soi Rangnam weren't all burnt on one day. Certainly the mall burnings on the evening of the 19th were the worst incidents, but several places had been torched prior to this. All the while the area was occupied by the red shirts.

People seem to forget these facts, re-frame the past so it agrees with their opinions. Ignore the reality.

Don't believe all the Pheu Thai/Thaksin/Amsterdam propaganda that is fed to you. Whilst some of it is true, some of it is also false. You should re-read the HRW report again perhaps Descent into Chaos | Human Rights Watch

mid lives in Disneyland and watch the Cartoon Network for his source of information,