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  1. #1
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    Changes, Changes and More Changes, When Will It End??

    Last weeks I made a visa run to Vientianne to obtain a 1 year, multiple entry, non-Immigrant O Visa using married to a Thai national as grounds. Since I had not obtained one since early 2013, I was surprised to hear there are no more multiple entry visas for the non-Immigrant O status. I wound up having to obtain a 90 O-Visa, single entry.

    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015? Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations? Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?

    I have a 3 & 1/2 year old son that is Thai/American and would like to know some things to be able and plan his future. Will I be forced to go back and live in the US?

    Does anyone really know the answer to my questions? Any insight would be much appreciated.

  2. #2
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    Why not just do the extension here? very easy if you can comply with the income/money rules.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers View Post
    Last weeks I made a visa run to Vientianne to obtain a 1 year, multiple entry, non-Immigrant O Visa using married to a Thai national as grounds. Since I had not obtained one since early 2013, I was surprised to hear there are no more multiple entry visas for the non-Immigrant O status. I wound up having to obtain a 90 O-Visa, single entry.

    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015? Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations? Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?

    I have a 3 & 1/2 year old son that is Thai/American and would like to know some things to be able and plan his future. Will I be forced to go back and live in the US?

    Does anyone really know the answer to my questions? Any insight would be much appreciated.
    perhaps the change is only for Vientiane..most immigration offices are somewhat a law unto themselves...

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers
    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015?
    No.

    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers
    Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations?
    No.

    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers
    Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?
    About the same unless you are a citizen of an ASEAN nation.

  5. #5
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    if u have a Thai child why not just do ur extension in country? its quite easy an less paperwork than for a marriage extension.
    I did that for years

  6. #6
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    There have been reports that Vientiane and even Phnom Penh are cracking down on handing out year long multi-entry Non-Immigrant Type-O visas without a LOT more documentation than previously required.

    You woulda done better going to Savannakhet Lao rather than Vientiane. Right now the Thai consulate there has the most lax interpretation of the rules in all of S/E Asia and you'da got what you were lookin' for.

    Even a brief Google shows forums about visas for Thailand littered with posters relating successful stories in Savannakhet and ones about people who were denied a multi-entry visas in Vientiane/Phnom Penh.

    I too hafta wonder why you don't get a yearly extension of stay based on either marriage to a thai national or having a half-thai child.

    If you have the KorRor2 & 3 and are legally married as opposed to having just done the dog-n-pony-show thai wedding party, show 40K baht in verifiable monthly income or 400K baht in the bank for 2 months prior to your application for a yearly extension of stay; you can get extensions for a year at a time.

    True the "married to a thai national" only gets you an additional 30 days when you first apply. That's supposed to be so Immigrations can come to your house and see if you're really married, but after that you go back to Immigrations and get the rest of the year permission to stay stamped into your passport.

    If you just got a 90 day single entry; start seasoning your 400K baht now or start rounding up your documentation showing you get 40K from abroad every month, and then go apply when you have 30 days or less left on your permission to stay stamp. It's not rocket science....

    Conversely, unless I'm mistaken; for supporting a half-thai child I think you need 500K in the bank for 30 days prior to the application for extension.

    One last thing, if you're 50, why not just go for the yearly extension of stay based on what's called a "retirement extension"?

    There have been reports that even the Honorary Thai Consulates in the US, which were previously "soft touches" when it came to handing out those year long multi-entry Non-Immigrant Type-O visas have really tightened up.

    As far as your other questions;
    America isn't part of AEC, so I can't see why ANY rules concerning "white people" who're married to thais or have half-thai kids would change just because the AEC starts..

    Just wondering why you'd fall back on the "will I be forced to go back and live in the US" song-n-dance.. No one's forcin' you to live here either, follow the rules as the thais wrote them and you can stay here year by year just fine.

    Good Luck. .
    "Whoever said `Money can`t buy you love or joy` obviously was not making enough money." <- quote by Gene $immon$ of the rock group KISS

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by mykthemin View Post
    Why not just do the extension here? very easy if you can comply with the income/money rules.
    Yes, this is a possibility. The drawback is that you do have to show monetary support and I was told it is 800,000 baht in a Thai bank for at least 3 months. My understanding has always been that a married visa only required 400,000 or equivalent monthly income. I keep hearing different things from different people and it would probably depend on the immigration officer I speak to in Udon. They have not been very helpful in the past.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by crepitas View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers View Post
    Last weeks I made a visa run to Vientianne to obtain a 1 year, multiple entry, non-Immigrant O Visa using married to a Thai national as grounds. Since I had not obtained one since early 2013, I was surprised to hear there are no more multiple entry visas for the non-Immigrant O status. I wound up having to obtain a 90 O-Visa, single entry.

    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015? Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations? Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?

    I have a 3 & 1/2 year old son that is Thai/American and would like to know some things to be able and plan his future. Will I be forced to go back and live in the US?

    Does anyone really know the answer to my questions? Any insight would be much appreciated.
    perhaps the change is only for Vientiane..most immigration offices are somewhat a law unto themselves...
    I agree with this and it is what causes a lot of heartburn for all of us. What one office does, another will not do. Even in the same office, the police seem to have a different explanation for the same question. I will just see how things go and keep going to Vientianne every 3 months until something else changes.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phuketrichard View Post
    if u have a Thai child why not just do ur extension in country? its quite easy an less paperwork than for a marriage extension.
    I did that for years

    I will try this next time I need a more time to see if anything is different.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by toddaniels View Post
    There have been reports that Vientiane and even Phnom Penh are cracking down on handing out year long multi-entry Non-Immigrant Type-O visas without a LOT more documentation than previously required.

    You woulda done better going to Savannakhet Lao rather than Vientiane. Right now the Thai consulate there has the most lax interpretation of the rules in all of S/E Asia and you'da got what you were lookin' for.

    Even a brief Google shows forums about visas for Thailand littered with posters relating successful stories in Savannakhet and ones about people who were denied a multi-entry visas in Vientiane/Phnom Penh.

    I too hafta wonder why you don't get a yearly extension of stay based on either marriage to a thai national or having a half-thai child.

    If you have the KorRor2 & 3 and are legally married as opposed to having just done the dog-n-pony-show thai wedding party, show 40K baht in verifiable monthly income or 400K baht in the bank for 2 months prior to your application for a yearly extension of stay; you can get extensions for a year at a time.

    True the "married to a thai national" only gets you an additional 30 days when you first apply. That's supposed to be so Immigrations can come to your house and see if you're really married, but after that you go back to Immigrations and get the rest of the year permission to stay stamped into your passport.

    If you just got a 90 day single entry; start seasoning your 400K baht now or start rounding up your documentation showing you get 40K from abroad every month, and then go apply when you have 30 days or less left on your permission to stay stamp. It's not rocket science....

    Conversely, unless I'm mistaken; for supporting a half-thai child I think you need 500K in the bank for 30 days prior to the application for extension.

    One last thing, if you're 50, why not just go for the yearly extension of stay based on what's called a "retirement extension"?

    There have been reports that even the Honorary Thai Consulates in the US, which were previously "soft touches" when it came to handing out those year long multi-entry Non-Immigrant Type-O visas have really tightened up.

    As far as your other questions;
    America isn't part of AEC, so I can't see why ANY rules concerning "white people" who're married to thais or have half-thai kids would change just because the AEC starts..

    Just wondering why you'd fall back on the "will I be forced to go back and live in the US" song-n-dance.. No one's forcin' you to live here either, follow the rules as the thais wrote them and you can stay here year by year just fine.

    Good Luck. .

    Some good points. I do agree with what you say, it is just trying to convince some of the "less friendly" immigration officers of the written regulations. I asked Udon if I already had an O visa, would they give me a year extension. They said NO, ONLY 7 DAYS. Do I debate this with them or just go to another office. I thought I was restricted to the closest office to my Thai address, which is Udon.

    There are a lot of people who state, "just follow the rules" and everything will be easy. Maybe easy for you, but not so easy for others. I am able to apply in the US, when I am there and have found this to be easier than trying other countries. My statement about living back in the US is out of frustration and I would live in several other countries with easier visa requirements such as Brazil, Panama or several other latin American countries before residing back in the US.

    If things are clearly stated, as you claim, then why are the regulations not always followed as written?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers View Post
    Last weeks I made a visa run to Vientianne to obtain a 1 year, multiple entry, non-Immigrant O Visa using married to a Thai national as grounds. Since I had not obtained one since early 2013, I was surprised to hear there are no more multiple entry visas for the non-Immigrant O status. I wound up having to obtain a 90 O-Visa, single entry.

    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015? Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations? Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?

    I have a 3 & 1/2 year old son that is Thai/American and would like to know some things to be able and plan his future. Will I be forced to go back and live in the US?

    Does anyone really know the answer to my questions? Any insight would be much appreciated.
    Same thing happened to me getting a family non-o (kids - i'm not married). Chaeng wattana head office told me what to take to vientienne. When I got there they said they didn't give them out. I said "but bangkok said.." they said "this is vientienne - not bangkok"

    Always good to see good communication and correlation between different branches of the same office

    1: Get a double entry tourist visa (3 months validity) take first 60 days then extend in chaeng wattana or in country somewhere for 30 days. Then use second entry few days before 3 months is up. After 60 days go to immigration again and extend for 60 days (based on kids/wife).

    That'll get you 7 months in all.

    2: Get a VOA (1 month) day before it lapses, get a 60 day extention at immigration.

    That'll get you 3 months.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert Shagnastier View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers View Post
    Last weeks I made a visa run to Vientianne to obtain a 1 year, multiple entry, non-Immigrant O Visa using married to a Thai national as grounds. Since I had not obtained one since early 2013, I was surprised to hear there are no more multiple entry visas for the non-Immigrant O status. I wound up having to obtain a 90 O-Visa, single entry.

    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015? Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations? Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?

    I have a 3 & 1/2 year old son that is Thai/American and would like to know some things to be able and plan his future. Will I be forced to go back and live in the US?

    Does anyone really know the answer to my questions? Any insight would be much appreciated.
    Same thing happened to me getting a family non-o (kids - i'm not married). Chaeng wattana head office told me what to take to vientienne. When I got there they said they didn't give them out. I said "but bangkok said.." they said "this is vientienne - not bangkok"

    Always good to see good communication and correlation between different branches of the same office

    1: Get a double entry tourist visa (3 months validity) take first 60 days then extend in chaeng wattana or in country somewhere for 30 days. Then use second entry few days before 3 months is up. After 60 days go to immigration again and extend for 60 days (based on kids/wife).

    That'll get you 7 months in all.

    2: Get a VOA (1 month) day before it lapses, get a 60 day extention at immigration.

    That'll get you 3 months.
    I tried #2 while I still had a few day on my VOA in Udon Thani and was told they would only give me a 7 day extension for 1900 baht. That was what prompted my quick trip to Vientianne the first time where I got a 30 day stamp at the border when I reentered Thailand. Another change that took place since the last time I visited immigration. No consistency is what I am frustrated about while just trying to find the most practical way to stay in Thailand long term

  13. #13
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    just get a single non immigrant O cause of child/ (Wife) put 500,000 ( 400,000) in the bank an than get ur 1 year extension in country, Its not hard Here in phuket the chld one is easier than the marriage while the Retirement extension is the easiest of all.

    Penang will give u a single non O if u take child's BC (as long as ur name is ur child's last name) or all ur marriage papers
    Use Mingood hotel ( Arthur) and he will do it all for u.
    Last edited by Phuketrichard; 29-01-2014 at 10:41 AM.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol or insanity, but they've always worked for me" HST

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  14. #14
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    Thanks Richard. I may just try for an O using a Thai Child as cause for the visa. I just wonder if immigration will say I need a married visa since I have a Thai wife? Never really know what they will do until you speak to them face to face and that could change on any given day.

    Cheers.

  15. #15
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    nope, i had mine and was not married but I have sole custody of my daughter.

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    [QUOTE="Albert Shagnastier"] "but bangkok said.." they said "this is vientienne - not bangkok"

    had similar hassles,,, told them i had health issues and wasn't going to do return trips to bangkok. Give it to me or else i'll go teach in Cambodia.
    I got my visa.

    Doing it their way helps the economy,,, extra dosh for the buses, hotels and restaurants etc.

  17. #17
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    ^
    I have yet to push back any time I have been told an interpretation of the visa regulations. Maybe I need to be a little more assertive and I will get what I want.

    .....or not.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickschoppers View Post
    Last weeks I made a visa run to Vientianne to obtain a 1 year, multiple entry, non-Immigrant O Visa using married to a Thai national as grounds. Since I had not obtained one since early 2013, I was surprised to hear there are no more multiple entry visas for the non-Immigrant O status. I wound up having to obtain a 90 O-Visa, single entry.

    Will these changes end once ASEAN takes over in 2015? Will all the countries be committed to a single system and a pledge by each to abide by the new regulations? Will Thailand's requirement be easier than now, or harder?

    I have a 3 & 1/2 year old son that is Thai/American and would like to know some things to be able and plan his future. Will I be forced to go back and live in the US?

    Does anyone really know the answer to my questions? Any insight would be much appreciated.
    I recently received another extension of my Non Immigrant O Visa based on Retirement at the Immigration office in Ayutthaya. Bought the Multi-Entry stamp too. All straight-forward affair that took ~1/2 hour. Bank Letter showing 800K THB. Updated Bank Book showing that balance on the day I applied for the extension. TM7 & TM8 with passport photos. Even brought along my Yellow Book for added ammo if necessary which it wasn't.
    A Deplorable Bitter Clinger

  19. #19
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    Maybe I need to be a little more assertive and I will get what I want.
    that is unlikely to work. thai civil servants dont take kindly to assertiveness from those below them in the pecking order here, and as foreigners, we are definitely below them, as are most thais too.

    there are ways around everything in this country, and to find that way, it is best to abandon the in your face western confrontational approach when up against those who hold the aces and apply the rules. the rules here are vague at the best of times and enforced according to the whim of the officer on the day in question. it doesnt matter one jot what the rules say, if the officer for whatever reason want to make things difficult, he can.

    likewise, if he wants to make things easy, he can too.

    immigration officers mostly like to help believe it or not, and help with a situation can often be obtained by enquiring about additional services available and the service charges for those services.

    only last week, two friends, with some friendly negotiations, managed to changed their visa status from 30 day tourist to non immig, with a one year stay. all in one visit. no border runs, no paperwork whatsoever. the rules stated that a border run, a bank letter, and a letter from their embassy were necessary. this was after being bluntly refused anything more than a 7 day extension at first.

    anything is possible.

  20. #20
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    [QUOTE="rickschoppers"] Maybe I need to be a little more assertive and I will get what I want.

    as you walk into the visa room,, to the right is another room with a big wooden table
    where the top decision making man hangs out.
    I told him my story and after a phone call he came back and muttered something about changing rules and allowed me my visa.

    Quote Originally Posted by taxexile
    that is unlikely to work.
    worked for me as my evidence was visible to the top man.

  21. #21
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    Then count yourself very lucky indeed Billy that you were able to see the top man
    as you call him .....I would chalk it down to a one off but be careful next time as they've now marked your card.

  22. #22
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    Again, it is a little frustrating to be at the mercy of the moods all immigration officers are in. Sometimes, I think they do not like the way I look and will make things more difficult. Other times, no problem.

    I guess the best thing is to take a shower before visiting an immigration office, smile and talk softly when explaining your situation. When this fails, you can always resort to the international solution......MONEY.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamiejambos
    as they've now marked your card.
    no chance of me going back there.

    getting angry or raising your voice most definitely won't do but showing a genuine argument can work as it did with me.
    how one presents oneself maybe helps also. gotta play the game. as they play the game for whatever reason and i guess MONEY talks also.
    they're a law onto themselves as many know.
    so have a plan B ready

  24. #24
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    First, while this may sound like an "anti-thai" or a "thai bashing" rant it is most definitely NOT. I've chosen to live the last 9+ years of my life here surrounded by the thaiz and I totally accept the abberatant behavior exhibited by these people pawned off to foreigners as "thai culture".

    taxexile;
    It is hardly new news that foreigners can go from a 30 day visa exempt to a single entry Non-O, to a yearly extension of stay based on retirement inside the country. Up until a year ago you could do that at Bangkok Immigrations any day of the week with the proper documentation, copies, etc.

    Now in Bangkok the applications for the in-country Non-0 are taken under consideration for 2 weeks before you go back and get the visa stamped into your passport, then after 60 more days you go out and apply for the yearly extension of stay. With every foreigner I've shepherded thru the process my experience has been IF they accept the application the two weeks is just a formality, as I've never had someone who's money and application was accepted denied a visa.

    Unless I'm mistaken; Jomtien, maybe Chiang Mai & Phuket all still do the "one stop switch over" from either a tourist visa or a visa exempt stamp to a year long extension of stay.

    That bull-shit mindset of "enquiring about additional services available and the service charges for those services" is doing nothing to make these people follow the Immigration rules as they're written and instead is just feeding the greed of some less than honest officials.

    There is an Immigrations hotline for a reason. USE IT! While I now exclusively only shepherd foreigners thru the visa process here in Bangkok; I used to go almost anywhere in the country to do it. I've had to call the hotline twice when I shepherded foreigners up country at various Immigrations offices which didn't want to play by the rules as they're written. In both situations a person from the head Immigrations office in Bangkok called the office I was waiting in within a couple of minutes and straightened the situation out.

    I called the hotline because I didn't give a rat's ass if the Immigrations officials I was dealing with in Nakhon Nowhere were happy or not about the phone call they received; I just wanted the rules to be the rules. period!

    The comment by "jamiejambos" of "they've now marked your card" is just another sheep like sock puppet foreigner mentality that we shouldn't "rock the boat" with these people.. If they're wrong, rock the boat!

    In the HUNDREDS of times I've been to the Immigrations office here in Bangkok, first at the old office at Soi Suan Plu, then the new government complex at Chaengwattana and now due to the protests, both at Lad Prao & Major Hollywood Suksawat, I've never ever had an officer "make things more difficult" or "make things easier". To a person they just follow the rules as they are written. I think that's why I just "do" Bangkok. I take a dim view of any thai who is under the illusion they have some modicum of control over my life here.

    Remember first and foremost IF you ask a thai (as in any thai in this entire pissant country) a question they don't know the answer to; 99.999% of the time they're gonna parrot "CANNOT!".. Not because what you're asking can't be done; but because they don't know how to do it. They can't risk looking stupid (aka; losing face) by telling you they don't know or by asking someone else. It takes some crafty thai language skills to back a thai into a corner where the only face saving way out is for them to do what you want or go ask someone who might know the actual answer, but it certainly can be done.

    The anecdote related by "billy the kid" shows the "face saving technique" employed by the "thai in charge". There haven't been ANY immigration regulation changes in a while now which affect yearly extensions of stay. The official just needed to not come off looking like the dumb half-wit he was is all.

    Stand up for your rights, because we most definitely have them here, and for christ-sakes stop kowtowing to some thai in a oh-so-tight fancy-smancy uniform because your thai significant other does. Don't let the incredible fear, awe, lip-service respect, your run-o-the-mill-thai exhibits with ANY thai person in a uniform become contagious!

    Good luck. . . . . Sorry that was long...

  25. #25
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    ^
    While I definitely agree with your comment about being told "CANNOT" when the Thai does not know how to do something, I have to question your comment about the one year extension available in Chiang Mai.

    My last trip to Vientiane, we shared a van with a business lady from Chiang Mai. She own and ran, what seemed, a reputable cosmetic business and had been doing so for 13 years. For most of those years she was able to just obtain a multiple entry visa in Chiang Mai, but she stated as of last November, she had to take a trip to Vientiane every 3 months to obtain an O visa. Is this a case of the local immigration office not knowing the rules, or have they truly changed recently?

    Todd, since you have always done your visa business in Bangkok, is there a possibility that they do things a little different there? Also, it has always been my understanding that one had to use the immigration office in their jurisdiction. In my case that is the office in Udon Thani. Am I able to go to Bangkok for visa extensions? A lot of questions, I know, but things are still not perfectly clear to me since I have been told different stories by different immigration officers.

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