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  1. #351
    Guest Member S Landreth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    Considering faltering HC reform is Obama's main (perhaps only) real achievement, it's a bit of a shame for him that it's of no real net benefit to him at the Ballot box.
    Obama doesn’t need much help. He’ll breeze on in (for another 4 years) because the Republicans have got nothing to offer (or anyone for Obama to run against) and are such fuck-ups. The majority of Americans know it and will not allow a Republican to set foot in the White House (as a president) for years to come.

    Pity really, I would have liked to see Obama fight for his next term in office.
    Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

  2. #352
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabang
    At 17.9% of GDP US health care spending is outrageously high, and it has to come down significantly for the nation to compete internationally.
    Great point the robots on the right have no problem globalizing American industry so why not health care? Opps that would take money out of their corporate handlers hands...

  3. #353
    Member spudge's Avatar
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    The GOP is going to come to regret ever labelling it "Obamacare". By the middle of next year they will be braying about how similar it is to the Republican alternative to Hillarycare and trying to claim credit for it.

  4. #354
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    ^ and that shows why they should never be allowed to run a country. They are knee jerk corporate boardroom reactionaries. It is simple as a repubtard. It is all consume consume consume.

  5. #355
    Guest Member S Landreth's Avatar
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    On Friday, the Obama administration announced that soon women won’t have to pay out of pocket for birth control: starting August 1st, many insurance plans nationwide will be required to fully cover contraception without co-pays or deductibles. Thanks to the Affordable Care Act, more women can make health care decisions based on what's best for them—not their insurance company—all while saving hundreds of dollars every year.

    link: Big News on Birth Control — Blog — Barack Obama

  6. #356
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    Boon Mee's Avatar
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    What an unexpected surprise this is, eh?

    Poll: Most Say High Court Should Reject Health Insurance Mandate.

    “A new poll from the Kaiser Family Foundation shows that more than half of Americans say the Supreme Court should rule that the health overhaul law’s requirement to have health insurance or pay a fine is unconstitutional. The poll by the nonpartisan foundation found that 54% of those surveyed said the Supreme Court should rule against the mandate while only 17% said the court should uphold it and 29% either didn’t know or didn’t answer.”

  7. #357
    Member spudge's Avatar
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    Are you arguing that SCOTUS should now issue decisions based on opinion polls?

  8. #358
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    ^
    Last we checked, it's still a Democracy and if most folks are against Obamacare, as it seems right now, dump it.

    Kinda like dumping that other piece of wrong-headed, bad legislation while back called Prohibition...

  9. #359
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    The chart below has been posted in past and here again for your viewing pleasure. A quite graphic reminder that sometimes doing nothing is better than 'something', eh?


  10. #360
    Guest Member S Landreth's Avatar
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    “The thing about health is, while you have it, you don’t think about it.”

    Back in her freshman year of college, Emily developed a rare and debilitating disease called Behcet’s—but thanks to the Affordable Care Act, she no longer has to worry about losing her coverage when she graduates.



    Watch her story: https://my.barackobama.com/page/share/aca-emilys-story

  11. #361
    euston has flown

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    Given that some 40% of americans choose not to have or cannor aford health insurance, in a country where medical bills are the primary cause of family banckupsy and dispite spending multiples more of your gdp on health case your life expectency is little different to that of europe with its death pannels. Why is it that so many of you are frightened of universal health care, why dont you see that you have all been taken for a ride by the entire health industry..... Who lets face it have the most the loose from this?

    Just as an asside, i read this artical a few weeks ago why doctors die differently. it turns out that many of these things that doctors do to save your life are things they would rather not have themselves.

  12. #362
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Fox News and The Washington Post are both saying that ObamaCare will cost double what was originally planned. Here is an explanation why this isn't the case.


    No, Obamacare's Cost Didn't Just Double. Sigh.

    Sorting through the deceptive attacks on health care reform gets old, even for me. But on Wednesday the Republicans and their allies made a claim so obviously misleading that they, and the media outlets parroting them, must have known they spreading false information.

    The basis for the claim is the Congressional Budget Office’s latest projections for the Affordable Care Act, which critics (and I!) like to call Obamacare. When Congress first passed the law, in the spring of 2010, CBO made official estimates of how much the law would cost, how many people would get insurance as a result, and so on. It updated that estimate one year later and has, now, updated it one more time.

    The CBO distributed its report in the morning and, by 11 a.m., Republican offices on Capitol Hill were spitting out press releases about it. According to the Republicans, CBO had discovered that Obamacare was going to cost $1.76 trillion over the next ten years. “The CBO’s revised cost estimate indicates that this massive government intrusion into America’s health care system will be far more costly than was originally claimed,” Tom Price, chairman of the House Republican Policy Committee, said. Within a few hours, both Fox News and the Washington Times were carrying online stories making the same claim. According to the Fox News account, CBO was “showing that the bill is substantially more expensive – twice as much as the original $900 billion price tag.”[at]

    If CBO had truly determined that health care reform’s cost will be twice the original estimates, it would be huge news. But CBO said nothing of the sort.

    To figure out the cost of health care reform, CBO looks at each of the law’s component parts and, for accounting purposes, groups them into different categories. It calls one category “gross cost of coverage expansions” – that’s the amount of money the federal government will spend to help people get insurance, mostly by offering Medicaid to more people or giving people subsidies they can use to help offset the cost of private insurance. Last year, CBO estimated that the gross cost of coverage expansion from 2012 through 2021 would be $1.445 trillion. Now CBO thinks the gross cost will be $1.496 trillion. The number shifted, in part, because the CBO has changed its projections for economic growth. (MSNBC's Tom Curry has a nice explanation of this.)[at]But, in the context of such a large a budget projection, that’s barely any difference at all.

    In the this latest estimate, CBO extends its projection out one more year, to capture the expenses from 2012 to 2022, in order to capture a full decade. In 2022, CBO says, the gross cost of coverage expansion will be $265 billion. Add that to the $1.496 and you get (with rounding) the $1.76 trillion – the one in the press releases and the Fox story.

    But there is nothing new or surprising about this. It’s only slightly more money than the previous year’s outlays. The ten-year number seems to jump only because the time frame for the estimate has moved, dropping one year, 2011, and adding another, 2022. Obamacare has virtually no outlays in 2011, because the Medicaid expansion and subsidies don’t start up until 2014, which means the shifting time frame drops a year of no implementation and adds one of full implementation.

    Still, doesn’t that just validate what the law’s critics have always said, that the administration was playing games to hide the program’s true impact on the deficit? Hardly. Remember, this is just the raw cost of expanding insurance coverage we’re talking about here – in other words, the money the federal government is sending out the door. The new law also calls for new revenue, in the form of taxes and penalties. It also reduces spending, mostly through Medicare, to help offset the cost of the coverage expansion. When the Affordable Care Act became law, CBO estimated that the net result of all these changes, taken together, would be to reduce the deficit. Now, with this revised estimate, CBO has decided the law will reduce the deficit by even more money.

    Yes, you read that right: The real news of the CBO estimate is that, according to its models, health care reform is going to save even more taxpayer dollars than previously thought.

    http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-coh...uble-price-fox

  13. #363
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    I can only imagine what it must have been like in the USA when the civil rights stuff was going on.

  14. #364
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    (^Shhhh. I am just old enough to remember.)

  15. #365
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabang
    I can only imagine what it must have been like in the USA when the civil rights stuff was going on.
    Honestly, all the issues the Republcans have come up with are rehashed '60s stuff. Those who were on the "losing side" of civil and women's rights are trying now to get back what they lost. Their love of patriarchal society and scorn for women and people of color having any power is barely hidden.

  16. #366
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    The CBO released new projections from 2013 extending through 2022, and the results are as critics expected: the ten-year cost of the law’s core provisions to expand health insurance coverage has now ballooned to $1.76 trillion.

    Imagine that...

    Obamacare Is Going To Cost Double What Obama Said

    Think most objective readers will opt for Business Insider's judgement over some Lefty Blog...

  17. #367
    Thailand Expat misskit's Avatar
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    ^ Guess you missed my post above #362.

    Quote Originally Posted by misskit
    Yes, you read that right: The real news of the CBO estimate is that, according to its models, health care reform is going to save even more taxpayer dollars than previously thought.

  18. #368
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskit View Post
    ^ Guess you missed my post above #362.

    Quote Originally Posted by misskit
    Yes, you read that right: The real news of the CBO estimate is that, according to its models, health care reform is going to save even more taxpayer dollars than previously thought.
    Nope - was editing when you posted last.

    Moot point anyhow as the Supremes will toss out this horrible piece of legislation as unconstitutional.

  19. #369
    Member gwargamel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boon Mee
    the Supremes will toss out this horrible piece of legislation as unconstitutional.
    Dream on..Just like you will have a repub in the white house next year.

  20. #370
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    Health Care legislation has passed, and there is nothing your trivial law suits will do to stop it. I offer my commiserations, now that HC costs as a percentage of your GDP will incrementally go down.

    You are right kitty- the same types arguing against this were vehemently arguing against civil rights reform, and before that giving women the vote. Just like them, they have lost. Welcome to the modern world, even if you do not know how to enjoy it.
    probes Aliens

  21. #371
    Guest Member S Landreth's Avatar
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    Stacy Lihn's daughter, Zoe was diagnosed with a congenital heart defect. Before the Affordable Care Act, insurance companies could set a lifetime cap to a person's coverage. By the time Zoe was six-months-old, she was already halfway to her lifetime cap. But because the Affordable Care Act prohibits health plans from putting a lifetime dollar limit on most benefits, Zoe can now live a life without limits.

    full video (listen at 1:52 & 2:27): http://www.barackobama.com/lihn-family

  22. #372
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    An Inconvienent Truth:



    Only Monte Python could imagine a world in which auto insurance really resembles ObamaCare, but Eric Scheiner produces a stellar effort:

    Can you imagine if buying car insurance was actually similar to what's in Obamacare? It would be like absurdist theater. The Right Views, Right Now | CNSNews.com...

  23. #373
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    More revelations that Obama outright lied:

    President Barack Obama promised over and over during the health care debate that “if you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan.”

    It turns out that, for a lot of people, that isn’t true.

    A Congressional Budget Office report issued this week says that 3 to 5 million people could move from employer-based health care plans to government-based programs as the Affordable Care Act takes effect. And in the worst-case scenario, it could be as many as 20 million.

    For Obama, it’s an inconvenient truth at a really inconvenient time — coming less than two weeks before the Supreme Court begins oral arguments on the law and just as the administration touts the law’s early benefits on its second anniversary.

    And it’s not the only hard truth Obama and the law’s supporters are facing. No matter what they said about rising health care costs, those costs aren’t actually going to go down under health care reform."

    Four hard truths of health care reform - POLITICO.com Print View

    Would have been nice if all that was pointed out before they voted on this piece of crap bill, eh?

  24. #374
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    Charles Krauthammer disputed Jay Carney's explanation today on why Obamacare is so unpopular in America today. Jay Carney insisted that it was because of the advertising spent against the Democrat's bill. Krauthammer countered, "That's nonsense. It's not the advertising, it's the dogfood."

    “That’s nonsense. It’s not the advertising, it’s the dogfood. Anytime someone has a lick of it they don’t like it.”

    Accurate portrail or what?

  25. #375
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    Kinda quiet on this thread? Run out of arguments for how great Obamacare is?

    Well, it's time to give y'all another reason why it isn't so great: It will kill more jobs.

    "Claims that Obamacare includes “death panels” sparked the ire of supporters of the law, who called the claim outrageous, but now — as Obamacare turns 2 years old — the Congressional Budget Office admits the law itself is going to kill the jobs of 800,000 Americans.

    At a recent House Budget Committee hearing, CBO Director Douglas Elmendorf confirmed as much, saying that indeed “there would be a reduction of 800,000 workers."

    Source

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